• The TUGBBS forums are completely free and open to the public and exist as the absolute best place for owners to get help and advice about their timeshares for more than 30 years!

    Join Tens of Thousands of other Owners just like you here to get any and all Timeshare questions answered 24 hours a day!
  • TUG started 30 years ago in October 1993 as a group of regular Timeshare owners just like you!

    Read about our 30th anniversary: Happy 30th Birthday TUG!
  • TUG has a YouTube Channel to produce weekly short informative videos on popular Timeshare topics!

    Free memberships for every 50 subscribers!

    Visit TUG on Youtube!
  • TUG has now saved timeshare owners more than $21,000,000 dollars just by finding us in time to rescind a new Timeshare purchase! A truly incredible milestone!

    Read more here: TUG saves owners more than $21 Million dollars
  • Sign up to get the TUG Newsletter for free!

    60,000+ subscribing owners! A weekly recap of the best Timeshare resort reviews and the most popular topics discussed by owners!
  • Our official "end my sales presentation early" T-shirts are available again! Also come with the option for a free membership extension with purchase to offset the cost!

    All T-shirt options here!
  • A few of the most common links here on the forums for newbies and guests!

The Kierland Villas sales pitch

Publisher1953

newbie
Joined
Nov 17, 2015
Messages
3
Reaction score
0
Points
0
Location
Ottawa Canada
We took up the offer for four nights for $349 at Westin Kierland Villas. Added to that, the $75 resort credit and $100 gift card (in lieu of Starwood points), and the free bottle of champagne they threw in on check-in, and the deal has been pretty good.

Of course, we also had to accept the mandatory sales interview process, which as I count it through the process involved three separate individuals, trying to get into our "mind" and then of course buy into the plan.

We (wife and I) had agreed that we weren't going to be rushed into anything here, and as I expected, the process moved along to the final "offer" on close, -- "The Westin Kierland Villas Explorer Program" at $1944 for a return four night visit and 50,000 spg points. That's not too bad a deal, I think, (assuming we want to come back here) allowing for direct transfer to airline points, for example, which would buy me an Air Canada business class ticket in NA. However, it certainly isn't a super great deal -- nothing like the deal we had on check-in, and I suppose, "might" be available again if we wait a year or two and then receive another sales offer.

However, I enjoyed the way the salesperson played around with my objections. "There's an active resale market -- why shouldn't I buy -- or rent -- units as I need them?" I said.

The sales rep asserted that resale rentals points would not be transferrable, and I suppose that is true, to the extent of the SPG "Hotel" points that are thrown into the package for full-paying users, but as I read it here, this is a "Mandatory" resort, meaning that the resort point allocations could indeed be used anywhere in the system (including the international brokerage options) and it seems there are many Westin Kierland Villas units/weeks on offer resale at much lower cost than we would pay if we purchased directly.

This leads to a few questions:

Is the "Explorer" program really worth signing up for or, is it, as I perceive, a marginal value?

If we buy resale in Westin Kierland, do I need to be aware of restrictions/limitations -- or am I looking at the number of vacation unit "points" available and should I simply focus on the most points for resale dollar? I see some units have fixed weeks and others are floating -- assuming we don't want to stay here that often, and simply wish to use the Starwood resort points for other options, is there a reasonable price per point or other considerations to follow?

I've read other posts on this forum, but don't claim to be an expert here, other than to have enough prudence not to buy what the sales reps are pitching.
 
Last edited:

DavidnRobin

TUG Member
Joined
Dec 20, 2005
Messages
11,822
Reaction score
2,237
Points
698
Location
San Francisco Bay Area
Resorts Owned
WKORV OFD (Maui)
WPORV (Kauai)
WSJ-VGV (St. John)
WKV (Scottsdale)
If you plan to buy WKV - buy resale Plat. I own 2 WKV VOIs (81K SOs), and they have paid for themselves just renting alone.

If you do plan to buy a week (or points) from SVO/VSE - then ExpPkg has value, but you should buy resale (w/ high SOs) first and then requal the SVO-VSE purchase. This approach has vale if want to get to 5*... this is a benefit to only people (few) meeting specific criteria, and lots of disposable income.

With the changes in SVO and SW - I would not advise this approach even if you did fall into the one-of-the-few category.

If you can't understand what I just wrote - do much more research before buying anything.

Personally - I would recommend to buy where you want to go.
IMO
 
Last edited:

Markus

TUG Member
Joined
Feb 2, 2014
Messages
312
Reaction score
63
Points
238
Location
Ontario, Canada
Resorts Owned
WLR, WKV, WDW
Kierland

I agree with David. I also own at Kierland, a 2 bedroom platinum week worth 148,100 Staroptions per year. As a mandatory week, you can use the Staroptions in the network at other resorts. If you do not intend on converting to SPG points, then resale is the way to go. It is much less expensive, $18K to $20K less than half of the developer cost, if there even is any inventory. The maintenance fees here are also amongst the most reasonable.

Mark
 

Publisher1953

newbie
Joined
Nov 17, 2015
Messages
3
Reaction score
0
Points
0
Location
Ottawa Canada
Checking on AirBNB I discovered a similar unit available for a week's rental for $1350 with plenty of availability in the next several months (and into next year). If I simply want a decent place to stay without tying up capital, less than $200 a night for a really big suite seems okay.

The more I think about it, the less sense it seems to me to buy, unless you know you really want to be here (at this location) on a reasonably regular schedule, and then only at the lowest possible resale price.

Is it rational to think of the "cost per point" (SVO) as the main metric in purchasing resale (the only way we would go now, based on observations here, if we decided to purchase at all) -- or do we have to think about other factors.

Assuming a point is a point, it seems logical that that should be the metric; but are there restrictions on access/availability that make some points worth more than others?
 

YYJMSP

TUG Member
Joined
Apr 2, 2009
Messages
2,533
Reaction score
192
Points
448
Location
BC, Canada
Is it rational to think of the "cost per point" (SVO) as the main metric in purchasing resale (the only way we would go now, based on observations here, if we decided to purchase at all) -- or do we have to think about other factors.

Assuming a point is a point, it seems logical that that should be the metric; but are there restrictions on access/availability that make some points worth more than others?

Make sure you factor in your ongoing commitment to pay MFs every year. It's not just your up-front capital outlay.

They've been going up around 5% year-over-year in USD, but it's really closer to 10% year-over-year in CAD when you factor in the drop in our dollar and the fact that you'll be paying in CAD when all is said and done.
 

DavidnRobin

TUG Member
Joined
Dec 20, 2005
Messages
11,822
Reaction score
2,237
Points
698
Location
San Francisco Bay Area
Resorts Owned
WKORV OFD (Maui)
WPORV (Kauai)
WSJ-VGV (St. John)
WKV (Scottsdale)
Checking on AirBNB I discovered a similar unit available for a week's rental for $1350 with plenty of availability in the next several months (and into next year). If I simply want a decent place to stay without tying up capital, less than $200 a night for a really big suite seems okay.

The more I think about it, the less sense it seems to me to buy, unless you know you really want to be here (at this location) on a reasonably regular schedule, and then only at the lowest possible resale price.

Is it rational to think of the "cost per point" (SVO) as the main metric in purchasing resale (the only way we would go now, based on observations here, if we decided to purchase at all) -- or do we have to think about other factors.

Assuming a point is a point, it seems logical that that should be the metric; but are there restrictions on access/availability that make some points worth more than others?

And here it goes...
My WKV VOIs have paid for themselves (including MFs, taxes, etc).
I am getting around $2150 (real and consistent) - and just had previous renter contact me asking if I had a week (ours rented a few months ago...)

I can also use the SOs to get a 1Bd at WKORV/N and WPORV (and HRA and WSJ) which has significant value - although that may change (I use my TS weeks - or rent). I had planned to use the SOs in the future when i have more spare time, but that might change...

My other SVO VOIs - have lost value over the years (yet gained great vacations), but WKV has held value. BUT, that could change...

I like them all.
YMMV (and will)
Best

PS - the one thing that is truthful coming from SVO sales (and in some ways... the only thing) and that is TSing is an investment in vacationing. I used to always vacation at the last moment (and rarely) - now... snorkeling at Little Lameshur on a regular schedule.
 
Last edited:

Publisher1953

newbie
Joined
Nov 17, 2015
Messages
3
Reaction score
0
Points
0
Location
Ottawa Canada
Thanks for the observations. We enjoyed the freebies (including a really fancy departing dinner using the $100 visa gift card and resort credits) but reason has combined with emotion to say: "No thanks". The hard-nosed rationalist in me concludes the only way I would buy into this place -- or any interval plan -- would be through the resale market, and that seems to be more work than fun (though who said anything worthwhile should be easy!)

I've blogged on the topic.

http://constructionmarketingideas.c...re-where-sales-and-marketing-determine-value/
 
Last edited:
Top