Temporary 50% reduction in the Hilton Honors Points conversion ratios [REDUCTION LIFTED A/O JAN 1, 2021] [MERGED]

[PigsDad]

No one forced you to buy an HGVC timeshare, and if you are unhappy then sell it. Life is too short to go around being unhappy all the time.

Wise words.

Kurt

 

[traveling]

My contract specifically states that Honors benefits and point conversions are subject to change. Nothing in the contract says any rationale, flimsy or otherwise, need be provided.

Your contract probably says the same.

Speak up all you want, but you likely have no legal leg to stand on. You lost no right to "fully convert" your points because under the contract the conversion rate is subject to change.

Make sure you read and understand a contract before signing it. Doing so will save you a lot of grief.

No one forced you to buy an HGVC timeshare, and if you are unhappy then sell it. Life is too short to go around being unhappy all the time.

-- Once again, Yes, I read the contract and fine print and would not sign anything without fully understanding it. I do not plan to sue and know I have no legal leg to stand on.
-- There will be times when speaking up about things you feel are incorrect is the right thing to do, even if it may seem like tilting at windmills. Just because companies or individuals can, doesn't mean they should. It goes to integrity and honesty, which does not need any more discussion here.
-- I agree that we only have so many moments in our mortal life and that is why I'm done with this topic. I'm not unhappy about all this. I made my point--here and to management.

 

[MPrince]

I don't understand the logic of complaining that a party to a contract exercised a right under that contract.

 

[GT75]

I think that the problem for owners is remembering the “great” selling points from the developers TS salesperson. The 50/1 ratio at bHC is one of those selling points. Another point use to also be the Open Season (OS) rates. These are just two examples. Yes, it is in the paperwork that the club rules can be changed.

 

[traveling]

I don't understand the logic of complaining that a party to a contract exercised a right under that contract.

-- The logic is that today I received a call from Stan Soroka, HGV Executive VP and Chief Customer Officer, in response to my email to HGV. He was the author of the August 21 message that informed us of the conversion rate change.
-- He was very personable. We had a great conversation. He explained in much greater detail the corporate thinking behind all the changes affecting owners. I understood the difficult decisions and careful planning that went into every decision and now realize this conversion change, for one year, was right--when looking at the big picture and when looking at everything that was done, in perspective. There was nothing sinister--just a corporation doing what they could to respond to a global pandemic while also protecting and responding to owner concerns.
-- All I ever sought was a little more understanding as to the thinking behind this decision to change the conversion ratio. My mistake was going to this group instead of to the corporation that made the decision. Always better to get information first hand.
-- The bottom line is that HGV felt saving points for free and then doubling up those points with next year's points would make more owners happy, although costing HGV more money, than cutting the conversion rate. Owners could then go to better places with double the points available. From the majority of the discussions in the group, it sounds like they made the right decision.
-- I'm happy because Stan called in response to my email with logical explanations. Everyone else is happy because they got to save points for free.

 

[jabberwocky]

I’m impressed that they called you.

Thanks for having the guts to come back and provide this update. I think this goes to show how well HGVC has been responding to a very difficult situation. On the whole they have done the right things for the vast majority of owners and aren’t trying to screw anyone over (salespeople excepted).

The worst possible outcome would be for them to be put in a weak cash position and then being bought out by a less reputable outfit (Diamond anyone?). I’d much rather be part of a strong system than a weak one.

 

[traveling]

I’m impressed that they called you.

Thanks for having the guts to come back and provide this update. I think this goes to show how well HGVC has been responding to a very difficult situation. On the whole they have done the right things for the vast majority of owners and aren’t trying to screw anyone over (salespeople excepted).

The worst possible outcome would be for them to be put in a weak cash position and then being bought out by a less reputable outfit (Diamond anyone?). I’d much rather be part of a strong system than a weak one.

-- I agree. Before contacting HGV Management, I thoroughly reviewed HGV financials at https://investors.hgv.com. this included stock prices over the last year, quarterly calls with shareholders and and specifically what HGV has done or plans to do in response to the pandemic, as it applies to owners.
-- Mr Soroka answered all my questions and concerns and provided a look into future actions. His openness and willingness to discuss these issues of concern convinced me that we are in good hands with HGV management and that HGV is moving through the pandemic well, as their rising stock prices show. Investors are cautiously optimistic. I consider this a very small sacrifice on our part to ensure the long term viability of HGV.
-- They are planning for more expansion and will be announcing those soon. Their third quarter call transcript with investors should be available on their investor website by the end of this month.

 

[DazedandConfused]

-- All I ever sought was a little more understanding as to the thinking behind this decision to change the conversion ratio. My mistake was going to this group instead of to the corporation that made the decision. Always better to get information first hand.
-- The bottom line is that HGV felt saving points for free and then doubling up those points with next year's points would make more owners happy, although costing HGV more money, than cutting the conversion rate. Owners could then go to better places with double the points available. From the majority of the discussions in the group, it sounds like they made the right decision.
-- I'm happy because Stan called in response to my email with logical explanations. Everyone else is happy because they got to save points for free.

The logic is that Stan nor HGVC has the time or bandwidth to call every member, so forums like TUGbbs are valuable resources for members to share information.

DVC and HGVC handled the covid pandemic about as well as anyone could expect, while a few other timeshares really let their members down.

 

[traveling]

The logic is that Stan nor HGVC has the time or bandwidth to call every member, so forums like TUGbbs are valuable resources for members to share information.

DVC and HGVC handled the covid pandemic about as well as anyone could expect, while a few other timeshares really let their members down.

Of course. The forums have great value. I meant that rather than just complain to the group, I should have tried to get answers from HGV first and then provided the answers to the group.
i would not have wasted so much of the group’s time.
Lesson learned

 

[DazedandConfused]

Am I the only one that thinks HGV totally messed over their HGV owners by suddenly (in a very small Stan Soroka (HGV Executive VP and Chief Customer Officer) August 21 announcement) cutting their HH conversion rate in half for all HGV owners, without exception (even their highest tier Elite Premier members) and without detailed explanation or rationale? Normally I would have expected some consideration for their company's most loyal (highest paying) customers, at the very least, or perhaps.

I re-read your first post and, although I am a Hilton Diamond member, I bought HGVC resale and am not an Elite member. To be totally honest, I would not have had any problem at all if HGVC reserved the full conversion for only Elite, Elite + and elite Premier members as those members are truly their best customers and should have additional perks above any resale member.

Of course. The forums have great value. I meant that rather than just complain to the group, I should have tried to get answers from HGV first and then provided the answers to the group.
i would not have wasted so much of the group’s time.
Lesson learned

Your posts are NOT a waste of time and certainly does add a different perspective. Not everyone on TUG agrees with each other, but most people here respect different opinions and valuations. But I do find that most TUG members are value driven and that is fine with me. I am willing to pay more for more benefits or services I desire (Michelin star restaurants), but not so much on other things (buying from developer for Elite status).

I think most members here originally bought a timeshare from a developer and probably wish they bought resale first. But in the end, most owners are here to learn from others how to maximize their enjoyment and use of their timeshare.

 

[dayooper]

Of course. The forums have great value. I meant that rather than just complain to the group, I should have tried to get answers from HGV first and then provided the answers to the group.
i would not have wasted so much of the group’s time.
Lesson learned

I don't think you wasted anybody's time. It was discussion and discussion is a great thing. We all come to the table with our own experiences and personalities. There are some forum members that though HGVC was too flexible and that will effect availability in the next few years. Everybody will keep pushing their points to the following years. These are all valid points to discuss and you had every right to be not happy with the reduction of a benefit you used. I hope you stick around and become part of the discussion around here.

I felt very comfortable with what HGVC did because of the quick action in the reduction/elimination of fees. It was done in good faith to their customers. I know that keeping their best customers happy is in their best interest of their bottom line, but it still felt like they are caring for their actual customers and not just the stockholders. I understood that the HHonors system is based off of two entities and HGVC has no control over what Hilton Hotels does.

 

[GT75]

-- The logic is that today I received a call from Stan Soroka, HGV Executive VP and Chief Customer Officer, in response to my email to HGV. He was the author of the August 21 message that informed us of the conversion rate change.
-- He was very personable. We had a great conversation. He explained in much greater detail the corporate thinking behind all the changes affecting owners. I understood the difficult decisions and careful planning that went into every decision and now realize this conversion change, for one year, was right--when looking at the big picture and when looking at everything that was done, in perspective. There was nothing sinister--just a corporation doing what they could to respond to a global pandemic while also protecting and responding to owner concerns.
-- All I ever sought was a little more understanding as to the thinking behind this decision to change the conversion ratio. My mistake was going to this group instead of to the corporation that made the decision. Always better to get information first hand.
-- The bottom line is that HGV felt saving points for free and then doubling up those points with next year's points would make more owners happy, although costing HGV more money, than cutting the conversion rate. Owners could then go to better places with double the points available. From the majority of the discussions in the group, it sounds like they made the right decision.
-- I'm happy because Stan called in response to my email with logical explanations. Everyone else is happy because they got to save points for free.

I wish that we had found out if HGV is still “for sale”. It appears from the responses which you were provided (and actions taken during investor calls) that it isn’t. Now, to me that could have a much more significant impact on our ownership.

 

[traveling]

I wish that we had found out if HGV is still “for sale”. It appears from the responses which you were provided (and actions taken during investor calls) that it isn’t. Now, to me that could have a much more significant impact on our ownershi

Agree. I did not discuss that specifically with him. The HGV stock was, of course much higher last year (well above $30 when Apollo and others made their buy-out bids) and down at $10 in March back above $20 now. HGV is climbing back up with a good plan and investors are acknowledging that. Last January, Apollo was the last bidder left, after HGV was taking a lot of time to consider. Then, the stock started going down. I think it will be a while before we see Apollo come back again. They have their own issues now and HGV is doing better with good plans ahead.

 

[EyecareHI]

BAIT AND SWITCH
AS A W57th OWNER, 50% Redction in HH points is not what I agreed to when purchasing in NEW YORK with its higher price and maintenance fees.
HGVC is using the pandemic as an a excuse to RIP OFF WEST 57th owners.
Time for a class action against HGVC.

Agree. A 50% reduction in Club Point conversion ratio is brutal. I suspect many that buy higher-end HGVC time-shares tend to use HH points rather than staying at the same location; I usually use mine for international travel rather than staying at the same place year after year.

The bottom line is, this reduction is within the terms that we agreed to when we bought HGVC timeshare(s). There is no recourse but to either bend over or sell, and the latter isn't easy with NYC HGVC timeshares. It also speaks to the possibility of future devaluations of what is really a bad 'financial investment' to start with.

 

[NOLA47]

-- The logic is that today I received a call from Stan Soroka, HGV Executive VP and Chief Customer Officer, in response to my email to HGV. He was the author of the August 21 message that informed us of the conversion rate change.
-- He was very personable. We had a great conversation. He explained in much greater detail the corporate thinking behind all the changes affecting owners. I understood the difficult decisions and careful planning that went into every decision and now realize this conversion change, for one year, was right--when looking at the big picture and when looking at everything that was done, in perspective. There was nothing sinister--just a corporation doing what they could to respond to a global pandemic while also protecting and responding to owner concerns.
-- All I ever sought was a little more understanding as to the thinking behind this decision to change the conversion ratio. My mistake was going to this group instead of to the corporation that made the decision. Always better to get information first hand.
-- The bottom line is that HGV felt saving points for free and then doubling up those points with next year's points would make more owners happy, although costing HGV more money, than cutting the conversion rate. Owners could then go to better places with double the points available. From the majority of the discussions in the group, it sounds like they made the right decision.
-- I'm happy because Stan called in response to my email with logical explanations. Everyone else is happy because they got to save points for free.

Thank you for revisiting your initial post and sharing your conversation with the HGV executive. I appreciate your admitting that after the discussion you had a better understanding and shared it with us. Because I had points to roll over from this year, my plan was to convert my 2021 points. While I was disappointed initially I thought things could have been worse. The pandemic is affecting everyone and everything in some way. I really appreciated the explanation.

 

[Sebastiantheibis]

Thank you for revisiting your initial post and sharing your conversation with the HGV executive. I appreciate your admitting that after the discussion you had a better understanding and shared it with us. Because I had points to roll over from this year, my plan was to convert my 2021 points. While I was disappointed initially I thought things could have been worse. The pandemic is affecting everyone and everything in some way. I really appreciated the explanation.

Thank you
I am so deep into W57th it is ugly especially In these pandemic times

 

[SmithOp]

I suspect many that buy higher-end HGVC time-shares tend to use HH points rather than staying at the same location; I usually use mine for international travel rather than staying at the same place year after year.
.

Don’t agree with this at all, I suspect you are basing it on your own usage but that does not translate to “many”.

We go to Hawaii every year for the past 20 years owning HGV, except for 2020. Perfectly fine going to the same locations with my points.

If I want to stay in a hotel I pay cash, I bought a timeshare because we like vacationing condo style.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro

 

[brp]

Don’t agree with this at all, I suspect you are basing it on your own usage but that does not translate to “many”.

I have a feeling that it could be quite a number of people who do this. Those who don't know how to properly use HGVC and bHC points and what they're for. I fear that there are a lot. We are few.

Cheers.

 

[dayooper]

I have a feeling that it could be quite a number of people who do this. Those who don't know how to properly use HGVC and bHC points and what they're for. I fear that there are a lot. We are few.

Cheers.

I agree with this. I am a member of a couple of FB groups and many there don’t know how to most effectively use their membership and then complain when they don’t get what they want. I try to give suggestions, but many just want to be negative or say it’s too hard to plan. I always try and give a shout out to this forum and many newbies say they will take a look.

 

[NOLA47]

I totally agree that I would prefer the space of a timeshare vacation rental over a hotel. However, I planned to convert them to reward points and have them on hand for those times when a timeshare is not available. I only use the points for high end/pricier hotels. Converting timeshare points to reward points is definitely not a good use of points in my opinion. There are just times when they are good to have available. Not being able to use 2020 points seemed like a good time to stash them.

 

[Talent312]

Many of us, me included, are quick to dismiss complaints saying the poster
is out to lunch. They may be, but couldn't we show a little more empathy to
those who feel wronged or abused by "the man? ... Nah...

.

 

[Sebastiantheibis]

How long do Hilton Honor Points last?
What Facebook groups are recommended for HGVC TS users

 

[Sebastiantheibis]

I have a feeling that it could be quite a number of people who do this. Those who don't know how to properly use HGVC and bHC points and what they're for. I fear that there are a lot. We are few.

Cheers.

How long do Hilton Honor points last?

 

[dayooper]

How long do Hilton Honor Points last?
What Facebook groups are recommended for HGVC TS users

There‘s a couple groups, one that’s for resales. Quite frankly, those groups are OK, but they aren‘t really all that interesting. They are good for pictures of resorts, though. This group has more information than any of the groups. Just do a search and they will show up. There’s a TUG FB group as well.

IIRC, as long as you use the account (use points or make a reservation adding points), the HH points never expire. I remember awhile ago, it was reported that the salesman were pushing the use of HH points, even calling it the vault,

 

[GT75]

There are 3 HGVC FB groups that I know about; regular HGVC owners, elite HGVC owners, and HGVC resales. I use HGVC resales to buy points and the only one which I have actively participate in only for that.