• The TUGBBS forums are completely free and open to the public and exist as the absolute best place for owners to get help and advice about their timeshares for more than 30 years!

    Join Tens of Thousands of other Owners just like you here to get any and all Timeshare questions answered 24 hours a day!
  • TUG started 30 years ago in October 1993 as a group of regular Timeshare owners just like you!

    Read about our 30th anniversary: Happy 30th Birthday TUG!
  • TUG has a YouTube Channel to produce weekly short informative videos on popular Timeshare topics!

    Free memberships for every 50 subscribers!

    Visit TUG on Youtube!
  • TUG has now saved timeshare owners more than $21,000,000 dollars just by finding us in time to rescind a new Timeshare purchase! A truly incredible milestone!

    Read more here: TUG saves owners more than $21 Million dollars
  • Sign up to get the TUG Newsletter for free!

    60,000+ subscribing owners! A weekly recap of the best Timeshare resort reviews and the most popular topics discussed by owners!
  • Our official "end my sales presentation early" T-shirts are available again! Also come with the option for a free membership extension with purchase to offset the cost!

    All T-shirt options here!
  • A few of the most common links here on the forums for newbies and guests!

Shell to Wyndham Presentation

rickandcindy23

TUG Review Crew: Elite
TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
31,898
Reaction score
9,001
Points
1,049
Location
The Centennial State
Resorts Owned
Wyndham Founder; Disney OKW & SSR; Marriott's Willow Ridge,Shadow Ridge,Grand Chateau;Val Chatelle; Hono Koa OF (3); SBR(LOTS), SDO a few; Grand Palms; WKORV-OF (2),Westin Desert Willow.
When I say we just bought, it was last week, so it is too late to rescind.
So you were not able to rescind (you should have tried anyway), and you think your best move at this point is to keep the very expensive Wyndham points and get rid of Shell? I think that is the absolute worst decision you could make.

Your entire reasoning makes no sense. Shell "as is" happens to be a much better product than the 84K points. 84K points are pretty worthless. What are you thinking with this decision?
 

HitchHiker71

Moderator
Joined
Jun 29, 2018
Messages
4,169
Reaction score
3,694
Points
549
Location
The First State
Resorts Owned
Outer Banks Beach Club I (PIC Plus)
Colonies at Williamsburg (PIC Plus)
CWA VIP Gold (718k EY)
National Harbor Resale (689k)
So you were not able to rescind (you should have tried anyway), and you think your best move at this point is to keep the very expensive Wyndham points and get rid of Shell? I think that is the absolute worst decision you could make.

Your entire reasoning makes no sense. Shell "as is" happens to be a much better product than the 84K points. 84K points are pretty worthless. What are you thinking with this decision?

He should have way more than 84k CWA points with a 40:1 conversion. He would have 17k*40=680k CWA + 84k CWA purchased points - or 764k CWA points annually. Permanent VIPG - and if any bonus points were included in the deal - he'd have two years of VIPP as well.
 

rickandcindy23

TUG Review Crew: Elite
TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
31,898
Reaction score
9,001
Points
1,049
Location
The Centennial State
Resorts Owned
Wyndham Founder; Disney OKW & SSR; Marriott's Willow Ridge,Shadow Ridge,Grand Chateau;Val Chatelle; Hono Koa OF (3); SBR(LOTS), SDO a few; Grand Palms; WKORV-OF (2),Westin Desert Willow.
He should have way more than 84k CWA points with a 40:1 conversion. He would have 17k*40=680k CWA + 84k CWA purchased points - or 764k CWA points annually. Permanent VIPG - and if any bonus points were included in the deal - he'd have two years of VIPP as well.
Yes, so very odd that he wants to give back Shell. I am obviously missing something.

I rent my Shell to others for cost. I rent all of my 25,300 points every year for cost. One ad on Redweek does it for me.
 

HitchHiker71

Moderator
Joined
Jun 29, 2018
Messages
4,169
Reaction score
3,694
Points
549
Location
The First State
Resorts Owned
Outer Banks Beach Club I (PIC Plus)
Colonies at Williamsburg (PIC Plus)
CWA VIP Gold (718k EY)
National Harbor Resale (689k)
Yes, so very odd that he wants to give back Shell. I am obviously missing something.

I rent my Shell to others for cost. I rent all of my 25,300 points every year for cost. One ad on Redweek does it for me.

I'm assuming it was a conversion deal, but I could be wrong just to be 100% clear - he has not confirmed one way or the other. I guess it's possible he could have kept his Shell points and simply purchased 84k CWA points straight up with no actual conversion - but from his original post that's not the sense I got from him.
 

ausman

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
1,768
Reaction score
187
Points
423
Location
New England
I get the opposite sense that there, was so far, no conversion involved and he/she now wants to dump both Shell and the 84K Wyndham points.

Snipping lots of the original message ( Bolded is mine}:

.....We just bought the 84,000 Wyndham points ($19,000) to get the benefit of both systems with the thought of converting to Wyndham points. Of course that decision has not been made.

If I convert my points will we be able to go to the Vino Bello?

I am wondering if I want to convert.

The second factor in the decision - If I convert, I.............. Maybe I convert to Wyndham and in a year or so try to use the Ovation program to get out of everything.
 
Joined
Aug 24, 2019
Messages
14
Reaction score
8
Points
14
Resorts Owned
Shell Vacations Wyndham
The 84,000 wyndham points we purchased were to facilitate converting the Shell points to Wyndham (680 +84). You all know the deal. The B.S. that we were given was that we would have difficulty getting into Shell properties with all of the conversions to Wyndham from Shell. I now believe that not to be true, in fact just the opposite. I don't fully understand how CWA gets access to Shell rooms but it seems like it is going to be a longer process. I understand that they are no longer selling Shell points. We have enjoyed our Shell points but I did not fully understand CWA until we got into our Wyndham account, too late to rescind. It wasn't what we were led to believe. It seems that Shell was more straight forward than Wyndham. I also got a lot of information from this website. It is a relief to our family that they would not have to deal with this if circumstances required that. I know the 84,000 points without a conversion are worthless, but it will take time to get out of them. We have a series of reasons why we don't want to either rent or stick around too long and take the chance that they drop the "take back" program. After discussion with the family, we have decided to take our lumps and exit. We can't do anything about "spent money", but we can do something about future MF's. We will use the remainder of this years Shell points, ending in February, and start the exit program. Hopefully, by the end of next year, we will be out of Shell and Wyndham. This all may not make sense to some of you but it does to us. I am sure that some of you feel more comfortable renting points than we do so that option has been discarded. Also, we don't need timeshare points to travel and believe we will have more options for travel without the burden of trying to figure out how to use timeshare points. I thank you for all of the information that you all have shared. This forum has been very helpful in understanding how Wyndham works. Let's see how this all works out.
 

Richelle

TUG Review Crew
TUG Member
Joined
Oct 26, 2015
Messages
2,675
Reaction score
2,064
Points
348
Location
Location, Location.
Resorts Owned
Wyndham National Harbor
Wyndham Canterbury
Wyndham Atlanta
Bay Club of Sandestin
Williamsburg Plantation
The 84,000 wyndham points we purchased were to facilitate converting the Shell points to Wyndham (680 +84). You all know the deal. The B.S. that we were given was that we would have difficulty getting into Shell properties with all of the conversions to Wyndham from Shell. I now believe that not to be true, in fact just the opposite. I don't fully understand how CWA gets access to Shell rooms but it seems like it is going to be a longer process. I understand that they are no longer selling Shell points. We have enjoyed our Shell points but I did not fully understand CWA until we got into our Wyndham account, too late to rescind. It wasn't what we were led to believe. It seems that Shell was more straight forward than Wyndham. I also got a lot of information from this website. It is a relief to our family that they would not have to deal with this if circumstances required that. I know the 84,000 points without a conversion are worthless, but it will take time to get out of them. We have a series of reasons why we don't want to either rent or stick around too long and take the chance that they drop the "take back" program. After discussion with the family, we have decided to take our lumps and exit. We can't do anything about "spent money", but we can do something about future MF's. We will use the remainder of this years Shell points, ending in February, and start the exit program. Hopefully, by the end of next year, we will be out of Shell and Wyndham. This all may not make sense to some of you but it does to us. I am sure that some of you feel more comfortable renting points than we do so that option has been discarded. Also, we don't need timeshare points to travel and believe we will have more options for travel without the burden of trying to figure out how to use timeshare points. I thank you for all of the information that you all have shared. This forum has been very helpful in understanding how Wyndham works. Let's see how this all works out.

You may already know this, but just in case, I will mention it. If you financed the 84,000 points, you won’t be able to use Ovations to exit your ownership. You will have to wait until the loan is paid off to use it. Sorry to see you go. Wyndham is not right for everyone. Timeshares in general are not right for everyone. I wish you the best.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

TheHolleys87

TUG Review Crew: Veteran
TUG Member
Joined
May 7, 2015
Messages
2,111
Reaction score
1,540
Points
273
Location
Texas
Resorts Owned
DVC Boardwalk Villas, Kona Coast II
I don't fully understand how CWA gets access to Shell rooms but it seems like it is going to be a longer process.

I believe that CWA gets access to Shell rooms by Shell owners converting their Shell ownership to CWA points, thus taking the Shell inventory out of Shell. The sales people are trying to convince Shell owners that all the other Shell owners are going to convert very rapidly, thus leaving little or no Shell inventory available for Shell owners. However, the fewer Shell owners that do convert, the less availability in CWA and the more remaining in regular Shell inventory. So as you say, it's going to be a longer process - especially if the Shell owners (like us) don't convert.
 

HitchHiker71

Moderator
Joined
Jun 29, 2018
Messages
4,169
Reaction score
3,694
Points
549
Location
The First State
Resorts Owned
Outer Banks Beach Club I (PIC Plus)
Colonies at Williamsburg (PIC Plus)
CWA VIP Gold (718k EY)
National Harbor Resale (689k)
The 84,000 wyndham points we purchased were to facilitate converting the Shell points to Wyndham (680 +84). You all know the deal. The B.S. that we were given was that we would have difficulty getting into Shell properties with all of the conversions to Wyndham from Shell. I now believe that not to be true, in fact just the opposite. I don't fully understand how CWA gets access to Shell rooms but it seems like it is going to be a longer process. I understand that they are no longer selling Shell points. We have enjoyed our Shell points but I did not fully understand CWA until we got into our Wyndham account, too late to rescind. It wasn't what we were led to believe. It seems that Shell was more straight forward than Wyndham. I also got a lot of information from this website. It is a relief to our family that they would not have to deal with this if circumstances required that. I know the 84,000 points without a conversion are worthless, but it will take time to get out of them. We have a series of reasons why we don't want to either rent or stick around too long and take the chance that they drop the "take back" program. After discussion with the family, we have decided to take our lumps and exit. We can't do anything about "spent money", but we can do something about future MF's. We will use the remainder of this years Shell points, ending in February, and start the exit program. Hopefully, by the end of next year, we will be out of Shell and Wyndham. This all may not make sense to some of you but it does to us. I am sure that some of you feel more comfortable renting points than we do so that option has been discarded. Also, we don't need timeshare points to travel and believe we will have more options for travel without the burden of trying to figure out how to use timeshare points. I thank you for all of the information that you all have shared. This forum has been very helpful in understanding how Wyndham works. Let's see how this all works out.

Got it. I'm still not exactly sure, based upon your answer here, whether you actually converted the Shell points, but it sounds like you did since you only have the remaining SVC points to use until February, after which you plan to exit. We can certainly understand the bad taste in your mouth given not much Shell inventory exists in CWA at present. I actually track all CWA inventory in a spreadsheet based upon the POS documents and, at least as of my last updates, I still don't see any Shell inventory listed - but there's probably a delay, measured in months, before the actual inventory is reflected in the POS documentation.

To answer your question as to how CWA obtains inventory access - this is the benefit of the trust structure inherent to CWA. CWA holds Wyndham owned deeds and then each CWA owner owns a portion of the trust itself. Whenever an SVC owner like you signs a deal that converts your SVC points into CWA points - Wyndham takes the deeded SVC ownership interest and moves it into the CWA trust, after which CWA owners should in theory be able to access the inventory. The trick is that SVC owners may have already made reservations using their SVC points - and these reservations are typically still honored - so while CWA owners may "see" the resorts in the searches - especially within the standard SVC booking windows - that inventory is probably already spoken for from existing reservations - so the CWA owners will see no available inventory when searching the SVC resorts in question. Over time - as the existing reservation window passes - inventory may free up somewhat - but that's usually a 10-12 month window from the start each of the conversions.
 
Joined
Aug 24, 2019
Messages
14
Reaction score
8
Points
14
Resorts Owned
Shell Vacations Wyndham
The 84,000 points were paid for, no loan. There was 116,000 bonus points.
First - We have not converted our Shell points to CWA, we bought the 84,000 to have the option to convert and achieve the higher status. Also when we asked if we could convert without buying more points, we were told - NO. I now know that was a lie.
Importantly, There is a separate letter that states, that "upon completion of the system you will have the opportunity to enroll eligible points into the Club Wyndham program". A representative will contact you gaining our approval to enroll". "It is anticipated this will occur in early 2020".
Interestingly, that separate paper also states that once enrolled, "You will still have the ability each year, during a certain advanced reservation window, to use your shell vacation club timeshare for reservations to Shell Vacation resorts" and it goes on to state that we can use them for all of the Wyndham options. So it does look like it is a combination program.
That is what I see on the papers and it is my understanding of the conversion process. So, it is not an automatic conversion.
In that letter there is a $189 processing fee associated with the enrollment. Since we have 4 Shell contracts, that would be almost $800.
The final note states "As we update our systems to support this enrollment, we be sending information concerning the enrollment etc".
Second - Grammarhero's analysis of moving Shell points to Wyndham is what I suspect happens, but what about unsold inventory? Which further suggests that the process of gaining Shell inventory may take some time. It is also not what we were led to believe in the presentation. Half truths are more effective that straight out lies and may help the sales person to sleep better at night.
As I said before, we have been and stayed places that we would not have without the timeshare but with age approaching and children not wanting to assume this contractual burden, it is time to move on.
This website and your willingness to provide knowledge is a big help. I hope that I have contributed to that knowledge base. Thanks for all of your input. I will keep you abreast of what is happening solely for the purpose of helping others to understand the situation they are in. We look forward to getting out of this but we also have enjoyed the places we have stayed.
This is a developing process.
 

rickandcindy23

TUG Review Crew: Elite
TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
31,898
Reaction score
9,001
Points
1,049
Location
The Centennial State
Resorts Owned
Wyndham Founder; Disney OKW & SSR; Marriott's Willow Ridge,Shadow Ridge,Grand Chateau;Val Chatelle; Hono Koa OF (3); SBR(LOTS), SDO a few; Grand Palms; WKORV-OF (2),Westin Desert Willow.
This is really a bad thread for Wyndham sleazebags. They need to know that we have them figured out, and that anyone wanting to convert can find this thread with a Google search. I pray that every Shell owner will just stay away from the presentation.
 
Joined
Aug 24, 2019
Messages
14
Reaction score
8
Points
14
Resorts Owned
Shell Vacations Wyndham
The information I quoted in the above post about the window for using SVC points was found today when I reread the information I was provided. I realize that earlier posts questions I had about using SVC points may have been answered if I had closely read the information. The window option is still not real clear i.e. how that works but just so you know it is in the disclosure.
But - none of this was clearly communicated during the presentation. When they get you in with the premise of providing information - NO! They are there to sell not to help you. If confusion will help the sale, so be it. If information will get in the way of the sale, don't disclose it seems to be the motto..
Of Course you all know that, one finds it all through these posts about timeshare selling.
ONE OTHER THING I FOUND OUT. The 3 year use option is not a part of the SVC ovations program. When I called they said that is a Wyndham option.
 
Last edited:

JohnPaul

TUG Review Crew: Elite
TUG Member
Joined
Apr 28, 2011
Messages
1,649
Reaction score
845
Points
323
Location
Sacramento, CA
Resorts Owned
Vacation Internationale, HGVC - NYC, Worldmark, Shell Vacations, Sedona Pines, RCI Points, Starwood (Avon, CO)
Just had a pretty low pressure update at Vino Bello. Similar offer to San Diego in June BUT resales points do NOT count to status and price was about $2000 more.
 
Joined
Aug 24, 2019
Messages
14
Reaction score
8
Points
14
Resorts Owned
Shell Vacations Wyndham
We started the Shell Ovations program recently. Have been told that we qualify and the process will take 3 to 4 months.
The only question asked was how we found this program. Told them on unspecified internet site.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Aug 24, 2019
Messages
14
Reaction score
8
Points
14
Resorts Owned
Shell Vacations Wyndham
This is a followup to previous posts on using the ovations program for Shell Vacations points. On February 28 I called about surrendering our SVC points (17,000). I was sent an email on March 3 outlining the parameters of the program. On March 17 I received the paperwork needed to complete the program. Deeds were signed, notorized and returned and on March 25 was notified that the deeds had been received and cancellation would occur in about 10 days. We have successfully used the program, it was easy. No cost and we are grateful that Wyndham set up the program. They asked how I found out about the program and I told them online. From their notice: "Third Party Company Assistance: You understand that retaining counsel or third party company to assist with the Ovation program may disqualify your application."
 

TheHolleys87

TUG Review Crew: Veteran
TUG Member
Joined
May 7, 2015
Messages
2,111
Reaction score
1,540
Points
273
Location
Texas
Resorts Owned
DVC Boardwalk Villas, Kona Coast II
This is a followup to previous posts on using the ovations program for Shell Vacations points. On February 28 I called about surrendering our SVC points (17,000). I was sent an email on March 3 outlining the parameters of the program. On March 17 I received the paperwork needed to complete the program. Deeds were signed, notorized and returned and on March 25 was notified that the deeds had been received and cancellation would occur in about 10 days. We have successfully used the program, it was easy. No cost and we are grateful that Wyndham set up the program. They asked how I found out about the program and I told them online. From their notice: "Third Party Company Assistance: You understand that retaining counsel or third party company to assist with the Ovation program may disqualify your application."
Thank you for the update! Something for us to think about, now that I've inherited timeshare weeks from my dad - our Shell points are kind of superfluous.
 

tschwa2

TUG Review Crew: Veteran
TUG Member
Joined
Dec 19, 2008
Messages
16,003
Reaction score
4,676
Points
748
Location
Maryland
Resorts Owned
A few in S and VA, a single resort in NC, MD, PA, and UT, plus Jamaica and the Bahamas
Does any know, If you convert your shell points to wyndham do you have any ARP? If so is it just back into the former shell properties or do they actually take back the shell points and convert you to Access or something else? If you have ARP anywhere is it listed somewhere on the dashboard or contracts?
 

Ty1on

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 10, 2015
Messages
5,119
Reaction score
1,952
Points
348
Does any know, If you convert your shell points to wyndham do you have any ARP? If so is it just back into the former shell properties or do they actually take back the shell points and convert you to Access or something else? If you have ARP anywhere is it listed somewhere on the dashboard or contracts?

As I understand it, you get ARP within your underlying Shell Club (or deeded resort if that's what you converted).
 

Eric B

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 10, 2017
Messages
5,865
Reaction score
5,442
Points
499
Resorts Owned
Vacation Village, Wyndham, WorldMark, Vistana, Vidanta, Flora Farms, HGVC Max, and some independents
Does any know, If you convert your shell points to wyndham do you have any ARP? If so is it just back into the former shell properties or do they actually take back the shell points and convert you to Access or something else? If you have ARP anywhere is it listed somewhere on the dashboard or contracts?

Shell points converted to Wyndham become Club Wyndham Prefer points, I believe. Here's how ARP works for those:



 

tschwa2

TUG Review Crew: Veteran
TUG Member
Joined
Dec 19, 2008
Messages
16,003
Reaction score
4,676
Points
748
Location
Maryland
Resorts Owned
A few in S and VA, a single resort in NC, MD, PA, and UT, plus Jamaica and the Bahamas
Top