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Scientists Say Turin Shroud Image Created by UltraViolet Lasers

For those who might be interested, there is a replica of the shroud on permanent display in a church in Gibraltar.
 
Good article. National Geographic studied the image and was baffled as well.

I have watched specials on the History Channel, National Geographic, and TBN. They all seem to come to the same conclusion: no technology existed in the history of the shroud that could have made that image.

There are drawings of people holding the shroud many centuries ago, so it's not from recent years. It has a recorded history of many centuries.

It's a fascinating piece of cloth. Watch any of the specials on the various channels and see if it doesn't make you wonder how in the world that image was imposed on the fabric. Amazing. There are forensic experts who also say this person was definitely crucified.
 
According to the last sentence of the article, carbon-dating would date the shroud to the Middle Ages. However, it does not mention the fact that the shroud was in a fire (the edges are scorched), and this fact invalidates the ability of the test to accurately determine its age. IMO, the Shroud of Turin is a miracle left to us as a witness to faith.
 
I will keep it scientific. The sample used for the carbon dating was taken from the edge of the cloth, and the shroud's edge was repaired somewhere around the 13th century with a similar weave to the original. It's different enough under a microscope to prove that the carbon dating was skewed by the new threads.

Of course someone would want the cloth repaired along the edges to keep it intact, if it frayed. We don't know who commissioned the repairs, but we know where it was at that time. There is a history of the cloth's viewing for centuries back. That's also science and history.

The National Geographic and History Channel shows about the shroud have been very interesting.
 
Passepartout said:
I dare ya to keep THIS thread on a scientific footing.

Jim
Click to expand...

who says realities of life only exist in the scientific realm? (you cannot address ANY subject without taking into account the total sum of knowledge, and you therefore cannot exclude other relevant facts.) to the contrary, they do not, and there are little hints along the way, sometimes ignored in spite of the evidence.... p.s. my life has been an ongoing study of the sciences, beginning with biology and chemistry double majors, followed by a doctorate degree. Am I unscientific? Hardly. (Merry Christmas!)
 
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A gentle reminder:

Avoid posting about politics, religion, or contentious social issues
Unless directly related to timesharing, such discussions are prohibited in these forums, including TUG Lounge. We've been down that road before, it was ugly, and we are not going there again.
Click to expand...
 
rickandcindy23 said:
I will keep it scientific. The sample used for the carbon dating was taken from the edge of the cloth, and the shroud's edge was repaired somewhere around the 13th century with a similar weave to the original. It's different enough under a microscope to prove that the carbon dating was skewed by the new threads.
Click to expand...

One would hope, then, that the owner of the shroud would want this issue put to rest by designating an area of the item that contains ONLY the original threads to be tested.

I maintain that the owners have nothing to gain by learning of it's true provenance and origin and age, and by disallowing testing, they are able to perpetuate their purported story surrounding it's origin.

That it has been repaired in the past- albeit some 500-600 years ago- negates the argument that it is of such importance that not even a single thread can be removed for testing.

Test it and put the issue to rest. It's organic- do DNA testing as well. Perhaps even on the stains.

Jim
 
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The Vatican has the cloth, I believe. I think they should take a portion from the middle of the cloth and test it.

Watch the National Geographic and History Channel shows for perspective. They rerun the shows about the Shroud during the holidays and at Easter.

Please keep this scientific, so we can keep the thread open.
 
Hee hee. I'll give odds on this thread being closed before Christmas :D

On that note, Merry Christmas and Happy New Year, everyone!

-Bob
 
Years ago I heard a lecture given by a gentleman from Argonne National Lab who had participated in some of the scientific studies regarding the Shroud. Goining in he was a non believer whose intent was to disprove the origin of the cloth but when all was said and done he came out of the study believing in the authenticity and origin.
 
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This is from a different forum discussing the shroud today.
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“They concluded that the exact shade, texture and depth of the imprints could only be produced with the aid of ultraviolet lasers – technology that was clearly not available in medieval times.”

And: “…in case there was any doubt about the preternatural degree of energy needed to make such distinct marks, the report spells it out: ‘This degree of power cannot be reproduced by any normal UV source built to date.’”

*********************************************************
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iVXXZcN8RVI
At about 13 minutes the scientific proof is examined in this documentary. "The video is well done and brings to light a documented history of the Shroud which has not been published."
**********************************************************

Merry Christmas
 
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I have a problem with an item like this being held and controlled by the people that have the most to gain from its authenticity....

I have a living breathing half unicorn half leprechaun, i will only allow a select few to study it and will review all results before i allow them to be released...

Just seems to add questions to the authenticity to me...

plus..

The shroud was first photographed in 1898, 5 years after the invention of the BOUTAN-CHAUFFOUR FLASH BULB - 1893

The first flash bulb was designed by Frenchman Chauffour for use by underwater photographer Louis Boutan. It contained magnesium inside a glass bulb filled with oxygen under pressure. A platinum wire heated by passing an electric current through it ignited the magnesium.

After checking wiki I found that magnesium lights produce harmful amount of UV light.
Click to expand...
 
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Need proof? Open your eyes. Oh yeah, eyes were evolved through billions of years of cosmic dust. :rolleyes:

Please.

Believing that something developed from nothing is suggestive that a 747 jet could be created from a tornado blowing through a junkyard scrap pile. But then again, where did the scrap pile come from?

There, no mention religXXX. Thus, hopefully remains open
 
Believers do not need proof. I am a believer in God, but do not believe the shroud is authentic. No *proof* is necessary. ;)
 
Phydeaux said:
Believers do not need proof. I am a believer in God, but do not believe the shroud is authentic. No *proof* is necessary. ;)
Click to expand...

I don't know if the shroud is truly authentic or not, but i don't believe we can really tie it to one specific person from centuries ago....thousands of people were crucified during that time frame

If anything, its just an old sheet with a burned image on it...and since we need to stay away from specific topics here....that IS all it is for the sake of this forum
 
Research it. There are ties to Leonardo da Vinci. Smart guy.

My disbelief stems from my understanding of the human anatomy; where the hands on average anatomical averages rest when placed as in the shroud rendering, (lay down, try it) fact that gravity causes fluid to trace the path of gravitational pull (stains from the wrist flow proximal toward the elbow, whereas they should trace distal toward the elbow, unless up side down crucifixion)

I could go on, but this thread is as good as locked at this point,

Merry Christmas!

Believe. Believers don't need proof. Proof is in front of your eyes. Or, create a mitral valve for me, could you please? Or would that take several billion years of space big bang dust?
 
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Maybe they were available and this whole "history" thing is a conspiracy to cover that fact up.

Or perhaps there are time travellers changing the past. If the past that was there a year ago is different from the past we now know how could you tell?

A quote from the TV show Doctor Who:

“Everyone’s memory is a mess. Life is a mess. Everyone’s got memories of a holiday they couldn’t have been on, or a party they never went to, or met someone for the first time and felt like they’ve known them all their lives. Time is being rewritten around us, every day. People think their memories are bad, but their memories are fine. The past is really like that.”

- The Doctor


easyrider said:
This is from a different forum discussing the shroud today.
********************************************


“They concluded that the exact shade, texture and depth of the imprints could only be produced with the aid of ultraviolet lasers – technology that was clearly not available in medieval times.”

And: “…in case there was any doubt about the preternatural degree of energy needed to make such distinct marks, the report spells it out: ‘This degree of power cannot be reproduced by any normal UV source built to date.’”

*********************************************************
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iVXXZcN8RVI
At about 13 minutes the scientific proof is examined in this documentary. "The video is well done and brings to light a documented history of the Shroud which has not been published."
**********************************************************

Merry Christmas
Click to expand...
 
persia said:
Maybe they were available and this whole "history" thing is a conspiracy to cover that fact up.

Or perhaps there are time travellers changing the past. If the past that was there a year ago is different from the past we now know how could you tell?
Click to expand...

With our limited understanding of Time, there is no 'Real' proof that it is linear instead of cyclical, its possible that the shroud was from a different time 'cycle'
 
Ridewithme38 said:
With our limited understanding of Time, there is no 'Real' proof that it is linear instead of cyclical, its possible that the shroud was from a different time 'cycle'
Click to expand...

If that's easier to believe for you, Ride. :)

National Geographic and History Channel just present the facts. It's very interesting to watch, and I know a few people who didn't believe in anything they could not see and touch, literally doubting Thomases, but no longer. You don't even have to watch these shows with an open mind.
 
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