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Sapphire Resorts - Upgrading Membership to Ownership

TrailTraveler

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I bought into Sapphire's Right-to-use level 12 months ago. Now they are offering me Full/Ownership level:

$7000.00 additional buy-in
35,000 biennial credits
This amount of credits gives 7 weeks every two years
$2152 biennial dues, so $1076 per year
I'm not sure yet what I would 'own' with this plan

The owner credits seem to have much higher value than right-to-use points. For example, 1 week at the Jockey club for the right-to-use would cost 20,000 to 30,000 credits - almost all of my 33,000 credits I get in the 3-year triennial. One week at ANY Sapphire or RCI property with the Ownership level costs 4950 credits. So it appears (and they confirm) that 7 weeks of actual vacation can be had with the 35,000 credits, no matter where I want to go. Actually, when I do the math, it looks like 7.63 weeks.

They also say that Owners get privileged booking, meaning no blackouts, way better availability even after dates are open to the 'public'. Properties are "held for you", not "from you".

This sounds TOO good to be true. Does anyone else have experience with this Sapphire plan?
 

rickandcindy23

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I would never fall for that. It's a club and not worth the $$ you are paying for it. A lot of really average and below average legacy timeshares in that system. Doesn't appeal to me at all.

Someone has to pay the maintenance fees, so what are they?
 

gravityrules

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I would never fall for that. It's a club and not worth the $$ you are paying for it. A lot of really average and below average legacy timeshares in that system. Doesn't appeal to me at all.

Someone has to pay the maintenance fees, so what are they?

Discussion point .. what characteristics make a timeshare average?
 

TrailTraveler

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Yep... as suspected, the "upgrade" wasn't worth it. It is a clever scheme to get current members to pay $7000 for the right to pay a higher annual fee for additional credits - and anyone that has poked around on the TUG site at all, knows that this right can be had for $1.00 "upgrade fee" right now. There are no other benefits such as preferred booking or the ability to book the Sapphire properties for only 2490 credits. The Sapphire properties are still subject to their points matrix. And depending when/where you want to go, it takes typically 20,000 credits to book, not the 4950 points we were told. Unfortunately, the contract says it is the only agreement - no verbal promises are valid.

The salesperson mentioned often that we would be 'owners' of something with the upgraded plan. The contract that the closer 'ran us through quickly' still stipulates a 'right-to-use' membership.

Our upgrade cancellation is in the mail today. We plan to get the most out of our triennial membership that is a year old.
 

rickandcindy23

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Discussion point .. what characteristics make a timeshare average?
Average, not in a system that has internal exchanges, legacy, older resorts.
 

kckaren21

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Yep... as suspected, the "upgrade" wasn't worth it. It is a clever scheme to get current members to pay $7000 for the right to pay a higher annual fee for additional credits - and anyone that has poked around on the TUG site at all, knows that this right can be had for $1.00 "upgrade fee" right now. There are no other benefits such as preferred booking or the ability to book the Sapphire properties for only 2490 credits. The Sapphire properties are still subject to their points matrix. And depending when/where you want to go, it takes typically 20,000 credits to book, not the 4950 points we were told. Unfortunately, the contract says it is the only agreement - no verbal promises are valid.

The salesperson mentioned often that we would be 'owners' of something with the upgraded plan. The contract that the closer 'ran us through quickly' still stipulates a 'right-to-use' membership.

Our upgrade cancellation is in the mail today. We plan to get the most out of our triennial membership that is a year old.
I just got out of their TS presentation at Jockey Club, and they said there was NO upgrade, they 'wd not try to sell us anything else' bc our access was 'Unlimited', so it's amusing that they are telling you something else. It just goes to prove that old adage: "How do you tell when a TS salesman is lying? Their lips are moving!"

The "unlimited" aspect is the ability to buy as many getaways on RCI as you want, as can every other member of RCI.

It sounded like you DO get free RCI membership for life from Sapphire membership, is that your experience? For the buy-in price (my term) of $5995 + annual fees of $492 (they started at $9995) I could get 24,000 points every 3 years, which would get me "1-4 weeks" at Sapphire properties, plus the ability to rent their properties "unlimited", but didn't note the prices as being particularly good. You make it sound like you get ONE good week with those points, tho.

They said the annual fee of $492 was NOT a maintenance fee (like other TS), so I asked how then do they pay for maintenance, staff, insurance, etc for the properties? They had no answer. I pointed out that the 3 years of "not-maintenance-fees" would be almost $1500, to get 1-4 weeks in their properties, or $250-1500 per week... They were not impressed with my math skills.

I did take a photo of offers for JC points for sale for $1 or free on the TUG website, in case they tried to pressure me, but there was no pressure.

I DO like Jockey Club for its location on the Strip and access to Cosmopolitan Casino and pool. (The rooftop pool is closed right now for renovation, tho). The rooftop pool has a delicious rum drink made with Pineapple Dole Whip, and I'm so disappointed not to get it this time!

The Jockey club room we are in is clean and in good condition, but dated looking.

I got 3 nights free plus 2 lunch tix to Pampas and 4 tix to a comedy show at the Strat, to attend the presentation. Ok trade for my time.
 

CurtiB

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I got sucked into buying a Sapphire Resorts timeshare in the middle of my vacation. By the time we got home, the rescinding period was over. We have already spent a ton of money on this and we are never going to use. it. What is the best, most cost effective way to get out of the contract at this point?
 

Passepartout

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I got sucked into buying a Sapphire Resorts timeshare in the middle of my vacation. By the time we got home, the rescinding period was over. We have already spent a ton of money on this and we are never going to use. it. What is the best, most cost effective way to get out of the contract at this point?
Stop paying. You missed the opportunity to cancel the membership. You will NEVER be reimbursed for what you've already paid. You own nothing and have made the salesweasel's paycheck for the week.

I wish we'd had this conversation BEFORE you went to the presentation, but what's done is done. Hope your vacation was wonderful!

Jim
 

dsmbeloved

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Stop paying. You missed the opportunity to cancel the membership. You will NEVER be reimbursed for what you've already paid. You own nothing and have made the salesweasel's paycheck for the week.

I wish we'd had this conversation BEFORE you went to the presentation, but what's done is done. Hope your vacation was wonderful!

Jim
Jim

They will not sue? What are the repercussions? I've had sapphire for a few years. Almost upgraded and then rescinded after reading this. I'd like to just stop paying annual fee but don't want to get sued and forced to pay 40 years of ~500 per year fee plus legal fees.
 

TUGBrian

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while there is a chance for anyone in this country to be sued for anything at any time, there is virtually no recorded instance of a timeshare suing a customer over defaults.

turn over to a collections agency and all the fun correspondance/calls/etc related to that? yes
hit to your credit? yes

being sued by the timeshare and then them taking efforts to collect on that judgement? I have actually never seen proof that has happened especially since the collateral for the loans taken out is the timeshare itself and in all cases the owners in question are happy to return that item.
 

rickandcindy23

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Your credit will get hit, I guarantee that.
 

Passepartout

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Your credit will get hit, I guarantee that.
On what do you base this guarantee? Maybe it will, maybe not. But either way the OP will not have the TS or the payment obligation.

I maintain that since a negative credit report can be rebutted, a timeshare MF default is not so negatively seen. In fact, it frees up resources that can be spent on other purchases.

Sure, they will get letters and/or calls, but blocking calls and ordering creditors to communicate via USPS usually slows or stops harassment.
 

CurtiB

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Stop paying. You missed the opportunity to cancel the membership. You will NEVER be reimbursed for what you've already paid. You own nothing and have made the salesweasel's paycheck for the week.

I wish we'd had this conversation BEFORE you went to the presentation, but what's done is done. Hope your vacation was wonderful!

Jim
Thank you for the reply, Jim.

Yeah, me too. The problem is, my gf and I were walking around Vegas and we had been drinking. Someone stopped us on the street and offered us a bunch of free stuff, all we had to do was go to a presentation. They took our IDs, sat us down at the table and wouldn't give us our IDs back. We said no 100 times, and finally we agreed bc we wanted to get out of there. We didntreally think about it until we go home from our trip, and realized we were out of the recission period.

Now we dont know what to do. But, per your advice, we have stopped paying. Just hoping they dont sue us and/or mess up our credit since we want to buy a house soon.
 

Passepartout

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Now we dont know what to do. But, per your advice, we have stopped paying. Just hoping they dont sue us and/or mess up our credit since we want to buy a house soon.
As TUGBrian said, it's unlikely that they will sue- and even more unlikely that they'll pursue a judgement and collection, but there's a pretty good chance that you'll see a credit hit. We think about 50 points, but let us know so we can tell others thinking about the consequences of not rescinding in time. As you now know, it really IS important!

Of course, you CAN simply pay the agreed-upon amount you signed up for and them plan on joining TUGgers as timeshare USERS. Your credit is safe and your vacations are largely pre-paid.

Best wishes!
Jim
 
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