Prices really are crazy

[mistalong]

I've been reading posts lately about the resale prices, so I was bored and I just pulled up ebay and sorted by time ending soonest. So when I started watching it was a 105K contract CONVERTED and the price 20 minutes ago was $15.50. Then 20 minutes later THIS!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/105-000-WYN...938?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1a029a08da

You guys are not kidding. Prices have definitely changed.

 

[ronparise]

Add the closing costs and still come in under a penny a point. Actually pretty damn good in today's market

 

[uscav8r]

A 256k Canterbury just went for $3351. That is a smoking price in a world where a 336k CWA contract is going for $6200...

 

[CO skier]

pssst ... there is a 154,000 point contract with reasonable MF for $1.00 in the TUG Marketplace for anyone who wants to save a few hundred bucks and avoid the EBay bidding fever.

 

[CO skier]

Jya-Ning

Complete list, close at 7/1/2006 to 7/8/2006

154K EY- Williamsburg at Patriots Place - $3,080 - closing $399,
154k EOY - Destin at Majestic Sun - $2,225 - closing $399
77k EY - Star Island $1,000 - $399
154k EY - Las Vegas at Grand Desert - $3,350 - $399
77k EY - Fort Lauderdale Fairways of Palm Aire - $610 - $345
154k EY - Plantation - $2,176.01 - $358
84k EY - Westwinds - $1,050.01 - $358
105k EY - Bay (Cliffside Lodge III) - $1,550 - $375
77k EY - Pagosa - $800 - $375
91k EY - Williamsburg at Patiorts' Place - $1,155 - $375
105K EY - Harbour - $1,600 - $399
259k EY - Pagosa - $4,650 - $385
105k EY - Fairways of Palm Aire - $1,691 - $350
126k EY - Nashville - $2,501.50 - $375
77k EY - Mexico (expired 2019) - $355 - $395
90k EY - Mexico (expired 2020) - $405 - $395
105k EY - Smoky Mountains (with 105k from 2005) - $2,288.21 - $385
105k EOY - Grand Desert (buy it now) - $1,500 - $399
126k EY - Sedona (buy it now) - $2,500 - $399
105k EY - Mountains, Maple Ridge - $1,136 - $375
175k EY - Fairways Palm Aire - $2,626 - $399
203 EY - Fairways Palm Aire - $3,853 - $350
105k EY - Cypress Palms - $1,335 - $475
154k EY - Sea Gardens Beach and Tennis - $2,726 - $385.00
105k EOY - Ocean Ridge II - $710 - $230

_______________________________________________________________

By today's standards, those prices 9 years ago were crazy. Maybe they will get there, again, before the next recession sends everything back to $1.00.


ETA: Regarding the current listing of 154,000 Every Year points for $1.00 in the TUG Marketplace mentioned in the previous post, it is interesting to note that 126,000 EY at the same resort sold for $2,500 in 2006 on EBay. That is something to think about regarding "crazy" prices versus today's prices of $1.00 for more points.

Nonetheless, if someone overpaid by $2,500 in 2006 versus today's prices (who can know what the future holds), and they used their points these last 9 years, that is only about a $250 premium per year, which is still not too bad.

 

[ronparise]

Interesting history lesson... Thanks for sharing that

 

[CO skier]

Interesting history lesson... Thanks for sharing that

That is not even the tip of the iceberg for what Jya-Ning compiled back in the day.

The EBay pricing history is probably more valuable now, for its historical comparative pricing perspective, than what it was in 2006 for actual value.

There is much similar 2006 EBay sales history documented by Jya-Ning. Anyone is welcome to PM me for relevant posts. It would provide a most interesting perspective as we emerge from the Club Wyndham pricing depression.

No one in 2006, when prices were clearly on the decline, envisioned contracts selling at $1.00. That is what I find most interesting.

No one had a crystal ball revealing the future -- up or down.

 

[Ty1on]

I've been reading posts lately about the resale prices, so I was bored and I just pulled up ebay and sorted by time ending soonest. So when I started watching it was a 105K contract CONVERTED and the price 20 minutes ago was $15.50. Then 20 minutes later THIS!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/105-000-WYN...938?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1a029a08da

You guys are not kidding. Prices have definitely changed.

Snipers gonna snipe

 

[vacationhopeful]

I figured YEARS ago (not 2006 but back a ways) that buying Fixed Week TS Snowbird weeks in South Florida was a good bet.

WHY? Price of condos were HIGHER than most retirees could pay nor who wants a condo sitting empty for 9 months a year. Plus at $1 and free/cheap closing, it was the bargain basement pricing (no $299 transfer fee then... I think it was $49 hedging up to $99).

Rents and resales will increase ... my one sister was born at the TOP of the baby-boomer bubble ... I forecast price rises for another 6-10 years.

Unless South Florida washes back into the ocean & gulf.

PS I am not real interested in Orlando (the Mouse market) or swamp land ... as almost all inquiries want to see the ocean ... will take beach block.

2nd forecast: Those timeshare areas warmer than the Northeastern US below Virginia will be more heavily booked - esp with indoor pools and ocean views. If I own there, I might dump those HOAs as keeping all units heated to 50 degrees is far cheaper than 80 degrees (occupied) (esp as some units can be had for under $35 per night per week for a 1bdr). That is about what a STUDIO unit rents for off the beach in Florida for a week. The newer buildings use heat pumps with backup electrical strip elements to heat. Increase in electric bills, MORE maintenance staff, more housekeepers, more dumpsters, more front end & activities staff ... and MORE wear & tear on furniture.

 

[Bigrob]

I figured YEARS ago (not 2006 but back a ways) that buying Fixed Week TS Snowbird weeks in South Florida was a good bet.

WHY? Price of condos were HIGHER than most retirees could pay nor who wants a condo sitting empty for 9 months a year. Plus at $1 and free/cheap closing, it was the bargain basement pricing (no $299 transfer fee then... I think it was $49 hedging up to $99).

Rents and resales will increase ... my one sister was born at the TOP of the baby-boomer bubble ... I forecast price rises for another 6-10 years.

Unless South Florida washes back into the ocean & gulf.

PS I am not real interested in Orlando (the Mouse market) or swamp land ... as almost all inquiries want to see the ocean ... will take beach block.

2nd forecast: Those timeshare areas warmer than the Northeastern US below Virginia will be more heavily booked - esp with indoor pools and ocean views. If I own there, I might dump those HOAs as keeping all units heated to 50 degrees is far cheaper than 80 degrees (occupied) (esp as some units can be had for under $35 per night per week for a 1bdr). That is about what a STUDIO unit rents for off the beach in Florida for a week. The newer buildings use heat pumps with backup electrical strip elements to heat. Increase in electric bills, MORE maintenance staff, more housekeepers, more dumpsters, more front end & activities staff ... and MORE wear & tear on furniture.

The other thing fixed weeks provide you is protection against further changes to the VIP program, since you are not counting on VIP discounts for your rentals and if anything, degradations in VIP benefits program would further escalate the resale value of prime fixed weeks. It's a nice hedge bet even for those of us with more points-based contracts.

 

[Bigrob]

Jya-Ning

Complete list, close at 7/1/2006 to 7/8/2006

154K EY- Williamsburg at Patriots Place - $3,080 - closing $399,
154k EOY - Destin at Majestic Sun - $2,225 - closing $399
77k EY - Star Island $1,000 - $399
154k EY - Las Vegas at Grand Desert - $3,350 - $399
77k EY - Fort Lauderdale Fairways of Palm Aire - $610 - $345
154k EY - Plantation - $2,176.01 - $358
84k EY - Westwinds - $1,050.01 - $358
105k EY - Bay (Cliffside Lodge III) - $1,550 - $375
77k EY - Pagosa - $800 - $375
91k EY - Williamsburg at Patiorts' Place - $1,155 - $375
105K EY - Harbour - $1,600 - $399
259k EY - Pagosa - $4,650 - $385
105k EY - Fairways of Palm Aire - $1,691 - $350
126k EY - Nashville - $2,501.50 - $375
77k EY - Mexico (expired 2019) - $355 - $395
90k EY - Mexico (expired 2020) - $405 - $395
105k EY - Smoky Mountains (with 105k from 2005) - $2,288.21 - $385
105k EOY - Grand Desert (buy it now) - $1,500 - $399
126k EY - Sedona (buy it now) - $2,500 - $399
105k EY - Mountains, Maple Ridge - $1,136 - $375
175k EY - Fairways Palm Aire - $2,626 - $399
203 EY - Fairways Palm Aire - $3,853 - $350
105k EY - Cypress Palms - $1,335 - $475
154k EY - Sea Gardens Beach and Tennis - $2,726 - $385.00
105k EOY - Ocean Ridge II - $710 - $230

_______________________________________________________________

By today's standards, those prices 9 years ago were crazy. Maybe they will get there, again, before the next recession sends everything back to $1.00.


ETA: Regarding the current listing of 154,000 Every Year points for $1.00 in the TUG Marketplace mentioned in the previous post, it is interesting to note that 126,000 EY at the same resort sold for $2,500 in 2006 on EBay. That is something to think about regarding "crazy" prices versus today's prices of $1.00 for more points.

Nonetheless, if someone overpaid by $2,500 in 2006 versus today's prices (who can know what the future holds), and they used their points these last 9 years, that is only about a $250 premium per year, which is still not too bad.

For someone who was not looking at Wyndham (or any other timeshare, for that matter) during that timeframe, these prices are indeed very interesting. I wonder if there is any correlation to the value of these units and the VIP program that was in place at the time (liberal cancellation, no guest confirmation fee, cheap transfer fees, lower VIP thresholds, multiple upgrades allowed, etc.) VIP owners would certainly be more incented to further add to their portfolio under those more liberal guidelines.

It's probably correct to associate most of the deflation in prices to the recession. But erosion in the VIP program benefits could also explain a portion of the dramatic decline as VIP owners either stopped buying or divested altogether amidst numerous lawsuits in the 2008-2009 timeframe.

It's important to note that it really is important to Wyndham that resale prices be as high as possible. The higher the resale market pricing, the lower the differential is between developer and resale prices. If the difference was significantly smaller than it is now, a developer purchase with associated benefits (to the extent that those benefits are not further eroded) starts to make more sense.

 

[mistalong]

So once you factor in all of the properties Wyndham is voluntarily taking back over the next few years, factored in with the few properties that will remain on the resale market at astronomical prices, in the next 5 or 10 years....ladies and gentlemen you may be sitting on a gold mine. Especially for those of you that are megarenters.

IMO I believe the people that are using points managers mainly because they don't travel anymore and couldn't get out of their contract. Eventually they will submit to Ovation when the words gets to them. Then when the points manager properties dry up, and maybe puts them out of business, the megarenters will BOOM!

 

[mistalong]

Heck now I see why sellers are willing to pay the transfer/closing. When people are bidding $700 for 84K at Star Island, why not?!!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/84K-Annual-...703?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item33a5f698c7

 

[mistalong]

J
ETA: Regarding the current listing of 154,000 Every Year points for $1.00 in the TUG Marketplace mentioned in the previous post, it is interesting to note that 126,000 EY at the same resort sold for $2,500 in 2006 on EBay. That is something to think about regarding "crazy" prices versus today's prices of $1.00 for more points.
.

Mind you I paid $90 total for the same 154K contract 2 years ago.

It was all because I came on here. You guys are awesome. What's crazy is I'm starting to see the trend starting with SVC. I just bought a couple of contracts there, and since those prices are starting to rise.

 

[ronparise]

So once you factor in all of the properties Wyndham is voluntarily taking back over the next few years, factored in with the few properties that will remain on the resale market at astronomical prices, in the next 5 or 10 years....ladies and gentlemen you may be sitting on a gold mine. Especially for those of you that are megarenters.

IMO I believe the people that are using points managers mainly because they don't travel anymore and couldn't get out of their contract. Eventually they will submit to Ovation when the words gets to them. Then when the points manager properties dry up, and maybe puts them out of business, the megarenters will BOOM!

So 10,000,000 points at a penny a point = $100,000. nice but those points with the platinum discounts can make 200 weekend reservations.

Do the right weekends and generate $50000 in income (rents-mf=income)

Not worth selling to me.

 

[mistalong]

Amazing!

I've heard of a penny a point, but a dollar a point?!!! Ri-darn-diculous!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/371390865394

 

[Ty1on]

I've heard of a penny a point, but a dollar a point?!!! Ri-darn-diculous!

http://www.ebay.com/itm/371390865394

ummmmm that's a little over a penny a point. $1,565, or 156,500 pennies for 154,000 points.

 

[mistalong]

Yeah stupid me. Little excited but still couldnt believe.

 

[Ty1on]

Yeah stupid me. Little excited but still couldnt believe.

For a buyer who already has Wyndham points, this is a good buy because the MF is relatively low at $4.91/K. The listed MF are much higher because the contract has to pay the $128 minimum Club Fee instead of $.55/K

That may be why a smaller contract went for $10/K