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Please help, I need to rescind in 7 days, is this a good deal?, Wyndham VIP silver questions

mchaney1

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We went on an owner update July 4th (really just to get a cheap weekend trip to NYC over the holiday). We ended up buying more CWA points and am not sure if we should rescind. Here is are situation and I would love any feedback.

We have owned a mere 77,000 points every year since 2000 and have done very well with these points. We started as Fairfield owners than we were bought out by Wyndham. We are affiliated with II and have always transferred a 1 bedroom week into II almost every year and have been able to go pretty much wherever we wanted. Hawaii, Palm Beach, Aruba, etc. We only used Wyndham resorts once (Bonnett Creek) because we really don't have enough points to use anything in the Wyndham inventory. Over the last 20 years, this has been fine with us!

We also own a 2 BR week at Mountainside Villas in Massanuten that is a FIXED week (we like this week this because it is the same week #33 each year and drivable). We NEVER trade it because we go each year. However now our boys are going into high school and the week is toward middle of August and we realize we won't be able to use if for a while due to high school sports starting in middle of August. So we just bought a resale 2 BR week in Mountainside Villas(week #25) which we will be able to use in June and we were thinking of renting out the August week until we can use it when the kids are older. We like it that much and again it is easy, enjoyable and drivable from Maryland.

So that is the background....

We own 77, 000 CWA points (Williamsburg Governor's Green)
TWO - 2 BEDROOM weeks Mountainside Villas


We thought we were living large UNTIL we went to this presentation on the 4th of July....when the sales people basically laughed at us and told us we were not using our membership well at all.....they told us for an additional 64, 000 CWA points we could PIC both units (doing one at the presentation and one on the "back-end") then we would be SILVER VIP members.

We would have total 449.000 points:
141,000 CWA points
308,000 PIP plus points (154, 000 for each 2 bedroom).

This cost us $13,700 for the points but now we have an additional $600 or so in maintenance fees PLUS I think it will be about $240 a year to put the PIC units in the program. Also, it is 89 dollars for each unit to place it into Wyndham if we don't want to use them at Mountainside/massanuten. We thought we could use the extra points to go to Wyndham hotels but learned that is costs $59 each reservation plus the points and this seems like a lot. We feel like we are spending a lot of money and not sure if the benefit is worth it.

So when my DH and I came home, we thought we made a mistake. I have the rescission letter written but before sending it I thought I would get some feedback from this group. TUG is great and people here have SO much insight.

Is this a good deal or should we rescind? Is VIP Silver worth it? All I can see is that we can upgrade units (if available) closer to the check-in...we seldom use guest certificates.

Before the presentation our yearly fees were approximately:

1800 dollars for maintenance fees yearly

After the presentation: We are looking at 2640 in fees yearly plus the $13K payment.

Thanks is ADVANCE for any advice you can share. I think I need to send my letter out within 7 business days.
 

Karen G

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Once owned these: FirstFairway@Walden X 2; Lawai Beach; ManhattanClub; PuebloBonitoRose; 4 South Africa--now timeshare-free
The mere fact that you are questioning your purchase and wondering if you got a good deal is reason enough to rescind while you still can.
Rescind, do more research, and if you really believe it's a good deal it will still be there later. But, if you don't exercise your right of rescission, you'll own it and you'll be stuck with higher maintenance fees and a $13K debt that may not be in your best interest.
 

Cyrus24

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This is a tough one, except on the surface I'd say rescind and then think about PIC for VIP via Telesales. Those of us who are VIP with PIC's generally chose to be where we are. PIC Plus (not Express) is a good program. You do not have to deposit to Wyndham every year, only in the years you want the Wyndham Points. So the questions to ask yourself will be 'how important is VIP to you?' and 'can you handle the extra MF's?' and 'was this for PIC Plus or PIC Express?' and 'do you want to go for the best pricing?'. My gut suggests that you can handle the MF's and that you would get some benefit from VIP. If they signed you up for PIC Express, rescind, immediately. Of course, do think about better deals from Telesales.

If you look for comments from Richelle, you will also see that buying from Telesales will generally get you the best deal.

But, you really have to think those points through. If you don't want to process it all right now, go with your gut and rescind.
 

CPNY

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We went on an owner update July 4th (really just to get a cheap weekend trip to NYC over the holiday). We ended up buying more CWA points and am not sure if we should rescind. Here is are situation and I would love any feedback.

We have owned a mere 77,000 points every year since 2000 and have done very well with these points. We started as Fairfield owners than we were bought out by Wyndham. We are affiliated with II and have always transferred a 1 bedroom week into II almost every year and have been able to go pretty much wherever we wanted. Hawaii, Palm Beach, Aruba, etc. We only used Wyndham resorts once (Bonnett Creek) because we really don't have enough points to use anything in the Wyndham inventory. Over the last 20 years, this has been fine with us!

We also own a 2 BR week at Mountainside Villas in Massanuten that is a FIXED week (we like this week this because it is the same week #33 each year and drivable). We NEVER trade it because we go each year. However now our boys are going into high school and the week is toward middle of August and we realize we won't be able to use if for a while due to high school sports starting in middle of August. So we just bought a resale 2 BR week in Mountainside Villas(week #25) which we will be able to use in June and we were thinking of renting out the August week until we can use it when the kids are older. We like it that much and again it is easy, enjoyable and drivable from Maryland.

So that is the background....

We own 77, 000 CWA points (Williamsburg Governor's Green)
TWO - 2 BEDROOM weeks Mountainside Villas


We thought we were living large UNTIL we went to this presentation on the 4th of July....when the sales people basically laughed at us and told us we were not using our membership well at all.....they told us for an additional 64, 000 CWA points we could PIC both units (doing one at the presentation and one on the "back-end") then we would be SILVER VIP members.

We would have total 449.000 points:
141,000 CWA points
308,000 PIP plus points (154, 000 for each 2 bedroom).

This cost us $13,700 for the points but now we have an additional $600 or so in maintenance fees PLUS I think it will be about $240 a year to put the PIC units in the program. Also, it is 89 dollars for each unit to place it into Wyndham if we don't want to use them at Mountainside/massanuten. We thought we could use the extra points to go to Wyndham hotels but learned that is costs $59 each reservation plus the points and this seems like a lot. We feel like we are spending a lot of money and not sure if the benefit is worth it.

So when my DH and I came home, we thought we made a mistake. I have the rescission letter written but before sending it I thought I would get some feedback from this group. TUG is great and people here have SO much insight.

Is this a good deal or should we rescind? Is VIP Silver worth it? All I can see is that we can upgrade units (if available) closer to the check-in...we seldom use guest certificates.

Before the presentation our yearly fees were approximately:

1800 dollars for maintenance fees yearly

After the presentation: We are looking at 2640 in fees yearly plus the $13K payment.

Thanks is ADVANCE for any advice you can share. I think I need to send my letter out within 7 business days.
Rescind. It’s not even a a question. 2640 yearly fees?! Lordy. It amazes me, they laughed at you that you weren’t using your membership well at all, YET it’s been working for you all these years. Rescind on the fact they told you that you needed more. What a joke. Buy into another program with better resorts. For 2600 yearly fee you can own In Vistana and vacation in Westin’s and Sheraton’s with a low buy in. Or MVC Or HGVC and still exchange in II. you’ll probably get better trades with owning those resorts. These sales people are slime balls
 

mchaney1

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This is a tough one, except on the surface I'd say rescind and then think about PIC for VIP via Telesales. Those of us who are VIP with PIC's generally chose to be where we are. PIC Plus (not Express) is a good program. You do not have to deposit to Wyndham every year, only in the years you want the Wyndham Points. So the questions to ask yourself will be 'how important is VIP to you?' and 'can you handle the extra MF's?' and 'was this for PIC Plus or PIC Express?' and 'do you want to go for the best pricing?'. My gut suggests that you can handle the MF's and that you would get some benefit from VIP. If they signed you up for PIC Express, rescind, immediately. Of course, do think about better deals from Telesales.

If you look for comments from Richelle, you will also see that buying from Telesales will generally get you the best deal.

But, you really have to think those points through. If you don't want to process it all right now, go with your gut and rescind.
It was PIC Plus, not express. Thanks for your information and help.
 

mchaney1

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This is a tough one, except on the surface I'd say rescind and then think about PIC for VIP via Telesales. Those of us who are VIP with PIC's generally chose to be where we are. PIC Plus (not Express) is a good program. You do not have to deposit to Wyndham every year, only in the years you want the Wyndham Points. So the questions to ask yourself will be 'how important is VIP to you?' and 'can you handle the extra MF's?' and 'was this for PIC Plus or PIC Express?' and 'do you want to go for the best pricing?'. My gut suggests that you can handle the MF's and that you would get some benefit from VIP. If they signed you up for PIC Express, rescind, immediately. Of course, do think about better deals from Telesales.

If you look for comments from Richelle, you will also see that buying from Telesales will generally get you the best deal.

But, you really have to think those points through. If you don't want to process it all right now, go with your gut and rescind.
Also, my husband and I really cannot see the benefits from SILVER VIP, the sales person told us that we will be grandfathered in when the new levels are changing...what are the main benefits of silver...possible upgrade one month before checking in and 25% off points 60 days before...I did not see anything else that stands out as a good benefit. Are we missing something? Again, thanks in advance :)
 

Cyrus24

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I did not see anything else that stands out as a good benefit.
I would rescind. You can research VIP at your leisure. Warning you now, you will get all kinds of comments on VIP. ALL KINDS. :).
 

Passepartout

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You're right. You need more points. The sales weasel are right too. You aren't using them to the maximum. You're also right that VIP is not worth the price.

The to-do list. Write the rescission letter today. You can mail it certified tomorrow. Join TUG. Best $15 you'll ever spend. Shop for resale points in Bargain Deals to add to your stash.

Welcome to TUG!

Jim
 
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silentg

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Sent you a Private Message
 

uscav8r

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Also, my husband and I really cannot see the benefits from SILVER VIP, the sales person told us that we will be grandfathered in when the new levels are changing...what are the main benefits of silver...possible upgrade one month before checking in and 25% off points 60 days before...I did not see anything else that stands out as a good benefit. Are we missing something? Again, thanks in advance :)
The unlimited housekeeping can come in handy if you will do numerous short trips vice just a couple long trips. That benefit will be going away for future Silver owners so you can get grandfathered in now.

$14k isn’t awful, but you can probably get a better deal from Corporate. I am Silver VIP and I use the booking discount and have gotten upgrades at Grand Desert, Old Town Alexandria, Smugglers Notch, Governors Green, and Kingsgate.

IMO, the VIP benefits get enticing at Gold (unlimited Reservation Transactions).

Your current CWA points are too few to do much of anything with. If you don’t care about VIP, you could either sell your original Massanutten week or keep it as an exchanger, and buy more CWA points via resale.

IMO, the real baseline point for a workable amount of points is between 231k and 308k points. I started out with 308k (developer/VIP) and now have 699k (the rest are resale).

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uscav8r

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Rescind. It’s not even a a question. 2640 yearly fees?! Lordy. It amazes me, they laughed at you that you weren’t using your membership well at all, YET it’s been working for you all these years. Rescind on the fact they told you that you needed more. What a joke. Buy into another program with better resorts. For 2600 yearly fee you can own In Vistana and vacation in Westin’s and Sheraton’s with a low buy in. Or MVC Or HGVC and still exchange in II. you’ll probably get better trades with owning those resorts. These sales people are slime balls
The $2640 includes the MF two fixed weeks and is about $840 above what they are paying today. It is not as cut and dried like you portray. One of those weeks is not useful to the OP, and this allows them to get better value out of that week other than a straight RCI exchange.

That $2600 is any of those systems you mentioned gets you one week, maybe slightly more, but definitely not two weeks. Under this case, OP can get up to three weeks.

What you suggest requires the OP to sell their two Massanutten weeks AND the Club Wyndham points (which are too few to do much with as-is).


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CPNY

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The $2640 includes the MF two fixed weeks and is about $840 above what they are paying today. It is not as cut and dried like you portray. One of those weeks is not useful to the OP, and this allows them to get better value out of that week other than a straight RCI exchange.

That $2600 is any of those systems you mentioned gets you one week, maybe slightly more, but definitely not two weeks. Under this case, OP can get up to three weeks.

What you suggest requires the OP to sell their two Massanutten weeks AND the Club Wyndham points (which are too few to much with as-is).


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My annual fees in Vistana are 2,700 and I have two 2 bedroom lockouts giving me 4 weeks in top tier resorts during prime summer vacation months, or 3 weeks in a premium one bedroom in Westin in Maui. Sounds to me to be paying all that in maint fee PLUS the buy in, is a waste. Rescind it’s that cut and dry
 

Richelle

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My annual fees in Vistana are 2,700 and I have two 2 bedroom lockouts giving me 4 weeks in top tier resorts during prime summer vacation months, or 3 weeks in a premium one bedroom in Westin in Maui. Sounds to me to be paying all that in maint fee PLUS the buy in, is a waste. Rescind it’s that cut and dry
Whether it’s a waste or not is up to the person who spending the money. Just out of curiosity, what if you want to do a long weekend? Do you have to take full weeks?


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Richelle

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We went on an owner update July 4th (really just to get a cheap weekend trip to NYC over the holiday). We ended up buying more CWA points and am not sure if we should rescind. Here is are situation and I would love any feedback.

We have owned a mere 77,000 points every year since 2000 and have done very well with these points. We started as Fairfield owners than we were bought out by Wyndham. We are affiliated with II and have always transferred a 1 bedroom week into II almost every year and have been able to go pretty much wherever we wanted. Hawaii, Palm Beach, Aruba, etc. We only used Wyndham resorts once (Bonnett Creek) because we really don't have enough points to use anything in the Wyndham inventory. Over the last 20 years, this has been fine with us!

We also own a 2 BR week at Mountainside Villas in Massanuten that is a FIXED week (we like this week this because it is the same week #33 each year and drivable). We NEVER trade it because we go each year. However now our boys are going into high school and the week is toward middle of August and we realize we won't be able to use if for a while due to high school sports starting in middle of August. So we just bought a resale 2 BR week in Mountainside Villas(week #25) which we will be able to use in June and we were thinking of renting out the August week until we can use it when the kids are older. We like it that much and again it is easy, enjoyable and drivable from Maryland.

So that is the background....

We own 77, 000 CWA points (Williamsburg Governor's Green)
TWO - 2 BEDROOM weeks Mountainside Villas


We thought we were living large UNTIL we went to this presentation on the 4th of July....when the sales people basically laughed at us and told us we were not using our membership well at all.....they told us for an additional 64, 000 CWA points we could PIC both units (doing one at the presentation and one on the "back-end") then we would be SILVER VIP members.

We would have total 449.000 points:
141,000 CWA points
308,000 PIP plus points (154, 000 for each 2 bedroom).

This cost us $13,700 for the points but now we have an additional $600 or so in maintenance fees PLUS I think it will be about $240 a year to put the PIC units in the program. Also, it is 89 dollars for each unit to place it into Wyndham if we don't want to use them at Mountainside/massanuten. We thought we could use the extra points to go to Wyndham hotels but learned that is costs $59 each reservation plus the points and this seems like a lot. We feel like we are spending a lot of money and not sure if the benefit is worth it.

So when my DH and I came home, we thought we made a mistake. I have the rescission letter written but before sending it I thought I would get some feedback from this group. TUG is great and people here have SO much insight.

Is this a good deal or should we rescind? Is VIP Silver worth it? All I can see is that we can upgrade units (if available) closer to the check-in...we seldom use guest certificates.

Before the presentation our yearly fees were approximately:

1800 dollars for maintenance fees yearly

After the presentation: We are looking at 2640 in fees yearly plus the $13K payment.

Thanks is ADVANCE for any advice you can share. I think I need to send my letter out within 7 business days.
I’m a big fan of the PIC Plus program because it can get you VIP for a fraction on the cost. Getting in VIP before they make the changes in LATE 2020, would be the best move IF in fact you want VIP. However, I would recommend you rescind right now until you’ve had a chance to think it through. You only have one chance to rescind. There will be many many chances to buy later on. Send the letter. I’d be more then happy to talk to you more about it. If you still want to buy retail, I can put you in touch with a telesales rep. If you wish to add more points by going resale, I can certainly try to help you there are well. For now, send that letter.


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CPNY

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Whether it’s a waste or not is up to the person who spending the money. Just out of curiosity, what if you want to do a long weekend? Do you have to take full weeks?


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Nope to full weeks with my points ownership. At 8 months I can book any length of stay in any room type up to 21 days as long as i have the points. Or I can bank in interval.
 

CPNY

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Whether it’s a waste or not is up to the person who spending the money. Just out of curiosity, what if you want to do a long weekend? Do you have to take full weeks?


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To me it’s a waste if for the last 20 years it’s been working perfectly fine for them. They have 2 two bedroom weeks and enough points for it to work for them........ did they really need to spend another 13K plus an extra 600 per year? When it’s worked for them!? That’s why it’s a waste. It sounds to me that a sales guy talked fast and used the whole “you’re doing it wrong” tactic. Let’s face it, no one wants to be told they are doing it wrong. But it sounds like they were doing it right for 20+ years. The only thing they did wrong was attend a sales presentation and signed on the line.
 

uscav8r

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My annual fees in Vistana are 2,700 and I have two 2 bedroom lockouts giving me 4 weeks in top tier resorts during prime summer vacation months, or 3 weeks in a premium one bedroom in Westin in Maui. Sounds to me to be paying all that in maint fee PLUS the buy in, is a waste. Rescind it’s that cut and dry
Sounds like your week-equivalent is only for a 1BR. My week equivalent is for a 2BR as that is the unit size the OP has.


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CPNY

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Sounds like your week-equivalent is only for a 1BR. My week equivalent is for a 2BR as that is the unit size the OP has.


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No I wouldn’t compare your resorts to the Westin in Maui LOL.
 

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Nope to full weeks with my points ownership. At 8 months I can book any length of stay in any room type up to 21 days as long as i have the points. Or I can bank in interval.
With the points, it makes sense you can book less then A week. Most points systems are way as far as I know. I thought you had weeks. With Wyndham, we can book as little at 3 days 10 months out. Some resorts require full weeks, or at least 5 days, but that’s not a common thing anymore. We can only do two weeks on one reservation but we can book as many consecutive reservations as we want. So if we want 3 or 4 weeks, it’s two separate reservations. That’s how retirees travel for 3-6 months at a time on their points. They can do it at the same resort or bounce around. We can move points forward to the following year (provided they do it by the deadline) or deposit in RCI at the end of our use year.


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CPNY

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With the points, it makes sense you can book less then A week. Most points systems are way as far as I know. I thought you had weeks. With Wyndham, we can book as little at 3 days 10 months out. Some resorts require full weeks, or at least 5 days, but that’s not a common thing anymore. We can only do two weeks on one reservation but we can book as many consecutive reservations as we want. So if we want 3 or 4 weeks, it’s two separate reservations. That’s how retirees travel for 3-6 months at a time on their points. They can do it at the same resort or bounce around. We can move points forward to the following year (provided they do it by the deadline) or deposit in RCI at the end of our use year.


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When you buy into Vistana deeded weeks your week is worth points and at 8 months they float to book whatever you want in network
 

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To me it’s a waste if for the last 20 years it’s been working perfectly fine for them. They have 2 two bedroom weeks and enough points for it to work for them........ did they really need to spend another 13K plus an extra 600 per year? When it’s worked for them!? That’s why it’s a waste. It sounds to me that a sales guy talked fast and used the whole “you’re doing it wrong” tactic. Let’s face it, no one wants to be told they are doing it wrong. But it sounds like they were doing it right for 20+ years. The only thing they did wrong was attend a sales presentation and signed on the line.
Agreed 100%, but it’s still up to them if it’s a waste. It may have worked for 20 years, but they may want something different. They may want to visit resorts, where they can get full weeks at, that they cannot now. What worked for 20 years, may not work for them anymore. It sounds like they wanted other options but are not sure, because of the added cost. So if it’s worth it, depends on whether they think the additional options are worth the extra money. To us it might not, but to them, it might. Them asking us if it’s worth it, really isn’t the best way to make a choice. They are asking us to tell them if it’s worth it to them, and that’s never a good idea. We don’t know their lifestyle, travel needs, personal preferences as far is how and were they want to vacation, and a host of other variables that we cannot are because we are not them. The real question should have been “Would you take this deal if it was you? Is so, why. If not, why?”


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When you buy into Vistana deeded weeks your week is worth points and at 8 months they float to book whatever you want in network
Gotcha. Makes a little more sense now.


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CPNY

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Agreed 100%, but it’s still up to them if it’s a waste. It may have worked for 20 years, but they may want something different. They may want to visit resorts, where they can get full weeks at, that they cannot now. What worked for 20 years, may not work for them anymore. It sounds like they wanted other options but are not sure, because of the added cost. So if it’s worth it, depends on whether they think the additional options are worth the extra money. To us it might not, but to them, it might. Them asking us if it’s worth it, really isn’t the best way to make a choice. They are asking us to tell them if it’s worth it to them, and that’s never a good idea. We don’t know their lifestyle, travel needs, personal preferences as far is how and were they want to vacation, and a host of other variables that we cannot are because we are not them. The real question should have been “Would you take this deal if it was you? Is so, why. If not, why?”


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I think everybody wants more, but do they need more? In my position I was over paying on maint fees and not getting enough, I sold off a unit and am picking up two more and getting more points for less maint fee. So in my case, yes I was doing it wrong also, but just “buying more” isn’t the wise idea. You can maximize and rearrange based on needs and sometimes you may realize you actually need less. Pickup up more than you can get out of isn’t wise either. A week ago there was a post posts by an older gent in his 70’s daughter asking for help on how he can get out because he was oversold every time. Apparently he owed 250K and had more than a million points. Now tell me, do you think these sales people are sitting here trying to help someone figure out how to use their ownership? Once the sales person said you’re using it all wrong is your first clue it’s a crock.

My last update they tri3d selling me more. I laughed and said but I don’t need more! My travel needs and desires have changed, they persisted to tell me how I. An have 8 weeks vacation. They weren’t listening when I said I only get 5 weeks off from work so why would I over pay for 8!? Not to mention more than half of my travel now consists of airbnb which I’m starting to prefer.
 

Richelle

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Richelle

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Bay Club of Sandestin
Margaritaville St. Thomas
Williamsburg Plantation
I think everybody wants more, but do they need more? In my position I was over paying on maint fees and not getting enough, I sold off a unit and am picking up two more and getting more points for less maint fee. So in my case, yes I was doing it wrong also, but just “buying more” isn’t the wise idea. You can maximize and rearrange based on needs and sometimes you may realize you actually need less. Pickup up more than you can get out of isn’t wise either. A week ago there was a post posts by an older gent in his 70’s daughter asking for help on how he can get out because he was oversold every time. Apparently he owed 250K and had more than a million points. Now tell me, do you think these sales people are sitting here trying to help someone figure out how to use their ownership? Once the sales person said you’re using it all wrong is your first clue it’s a crock.

My last update they tri3d selling me more. I laughed and said but I don’t need more! My travel needs and desires have changed, they persisted to tell me how I. An have 8 weeks vacation. They weren’t listening when I said I only get 5 weeks off from work so why would I over pay for 8!? Not to mention more than half of my travel now consists of airbnb which I’m starting to prefer.
I do not disagree with you, that buying more isn’t the only way to maximize your usage and that there are other ways that should be explored. The question is, what do they want to get out of their timeshare? From there, we can offer advice that will get them there. Hopefully not by buying points. However, if they want a four bedroom presidential at Bonnet Creek over Christmas, what they have will not work. What the sales people are trying to get then to buy won’t work either. Those book up fast, so they need ARP for Bonnet Creek. What they have, and what they are selling them, doesn’t get them ARP at Bonnet Creek for the amount of points they need for that presidential. So without knowing exactly what they want (and maybe them not knowing what they want) we cannot assume something will or will not work. I also agree with you that the sales people could care less about their needs. They are in it for a paycheck and have no problem lying to you to get it. They don’t care if you cannot afford it or if you don’t need it. For that reason, I believe they should rescind until they know exactly what they want, and have explored other ways of getting what they want. They might need points, they might not. If they need more points, and want VIP, telesales and PIC Plus are the way to go. If they cannot use VIP, resale is a better way to go.


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