Penn State

[am1]

What a horrible situation. I do not understand how anyone could be interested in those acts. Or not better report what happened. It is hard to think of how many times these are not reported at all.

It is sad that students are protesting Paterno being fired and not about university officials covering it up.

How was Sandusky still allowed access to campus?

How much jail time is he going to face for his crimes?


Its crazy how one bad decision can ruin a legacy but I think it has to be done. Anything to stop abuse in the future is needed. Hopefully the next Joe Pa in the situation will do a better job of reporting it.

 

[Elan]

Absolutely disgusting. I read the 23 page grand jury indictment yesterday.

How McQueary didn't also lose his job is beyond me. They all should have civil suits brought against them.

I also found it bizarre that the outcry over Paterno's firing was more extreme than that over the abuse and cover-up. Sad commentary, IMO.

 

[lvhmbh]

Where did you find the 23 page GJ indictment? Interested in reading.

 

[SueDonJ]

I'm finding it difficult to write a post here that can't be seen as delving into the "social commentary" stuff that's taboo on TUG. The whole sordid mess is despicable and every person who knew even the slightest detail must now be held accountable. It's stunning to me how much the culture surrounding the football program at Penn State mimics the culture that was at play and allowed the Boston pedophile priest scandal to flourish years ago. Hopefully, eventually, that culture will be eradicated at every institution where it exists.

 

[Elan]

Where did you find the 23 page GJ indictment? Interested in reading.

I don't remember. I just Googled it.

Be forewarned, it's quite disturbing.

 

[SueDonJ]

Where did you find the 23 page GJ indictment? Interested in reading.

It's everywhere all over the web, but a little bit difficult to find it by itself without biased commentary. This link should take you to the document.

 

[Passepartout]

This IS absolutely disgusting. That it went on for over a dozen years with everyone holding the institution's and it's leaders 'reputation' higher than the well-being of trusting children is even more disgusting.

This, however is not either the first, nor anywhere close to the worst of these offenses. TUG rules prevent me from shouting my disgust over abuses to hundreds- not just single digits- of youths abused by authority figures of a certain Roman institution- who were simply moved around to hide their actions, and none of the leaders of which are residing in prison.

Until the attitudes of people change and no authority is seen as being above the law, and every offender is held responsible for his/her actions offenses against 'weaker' or more defenseless people will continue.

Somehow the Moorish or old Chinese custom of having eunuchs in authority or care-taking positions over wives, children and the vulnerable doesn't seem so over the top. (not REALLY seriously advocating this)

Jim

 

[JanT]

I am absolutely appalled by this whole mess. Every one of them should be held accountable and punished. They KNEW what was going on and did nothing.

And I agree - it is quite disturbing to see these college students protesting the firing of Paterno. He, too KNEW what was happening and did nothing to stop it. WTHeck????? What is wrong with our society?

 

[ace2000]

Absolutely disgusting. I read the 23 page grand jury indictment yesterday.

How McQueary didn't also lose his job is beyond me. They all should have civil suits brought against them.

I also found it bizarre that the outcry over Paterno's firing was more extreme than that over the abuse and cover-up. Sad commentary, IMO.

I've thought both ways about McQueary. On one hand, he is the one that originally told Paterno about the incident (that took some courage). He also is the one that told truthful testimony to the Grand Jury. Without his testimony, you have nothing on the Penn State administration, because they tried to say that they were just told it was some kind of 'horseplay'.

Yet on the other hand, he had to have known that Penn State tried to sweep it under the rug, even after he came forward. We also know that he got promoted from just being a GA to assistant coach at some point after he came forward to Paterno.

I don't know, in the end I have to admire his courage. He could have lied to the Grand Jury just like the other two administrators, that got convicted for perjury. He had to have known that his truthful testimony could potentially bring down the whole Penn State football program.

If I've missed anything here, please let me know.

 

[ace2000]

Actually the more I think about it and to my limited knowlege... if you don't have McQueary there really is no case at all against the Penn St. adminstration (and Paterno as well).

It appears he's the only one telling the truth and I see him as kind of the whistleblower in the whole episode.

 

[SueDonJ]

Yep, McQueary is invaluable in making the case. On the one hand I can't imagine actually being an eyewitness to that monster in action and NOT interfering in some way to stop it while it's happening, but I do have some idea of how a culture develops to the point where one man is God in a system and all others kowtow to his authority. That was Joe Paterno just as certainly as it was Cardinal Bernard Law in Boston. So on the other hand, I can understand why McQueary's first inclination was to ask his dad for help in reporting what he'd seen to Joe Paterno, and why he felt powerless to take it upon himself to buck the establishment and go to the authorities on his own. But still, he needs to be gone from that campus along with every other person who had any knowledge of what was going on. Nothing short of a completely cleaned house will bring dignity back to that university and, if it's even possible, salvage that football program.

 

[Passepartout]

Actually the more I think about it and to my limited knowlege... if you don't have McQueary there really is no case at all.

This and the DA who was on the verge of bringing up charges disappeared in '05 without a trace, his laptop with crushed hard drive fished out of the Susquehanna. He was just declared dead this year. No suspects. Curious, no?

Jim

 

[brigechols]

Penn State should also fire McQueary. He was 28 years old at the when he witnessed the alleged rape of a 10 or 11 year old boy - old enough to know that what he witnessed was a horrific act. He displayed a lack of judgment by not immediately contacting the authorites. McQueary's dad also displayed a callous disregard for the victim by directing his son to call Joe Pa rather than the authorities. Even at the age of 28, it would have been an opportune moment for the parent to teach his son that it is best to do the right thing and report criminal activity to the proper authorities. As a mother, I cannot imagine witnessing an assault on a child and not stopping it or failing to report it to the police.

 

[Culli]

Penn State should also fire McQueary. He was 28 years old at the when he witnessed the alleged rape of a 10 or 11 year old boy - old enough to know that what he witnessed was a horrific act. He displayed a lack of judgment by not immediately contacting the authorites. McQueary's dad also displayed a callous disregard for the victim by directing his son to call Joe Pa rather than the authorities. Even at the age of 28, it would have been an opportune moment for the parent to teach his son that it is best to do the right thing and report criminal activity to the proper authorities. As a mother, I cannot imagine witnessing an assault on a child and not stopping it or failing to report it to the police.

I'm absolutely outraged that McQueary DIDN'T STOP IT while he witnessed it. I don't care if its Mike Tyson YOU HAVE TO PROTECT that innocent child. How in the world could someone see that happen and not attempt to stop it!?!?!?! Complete coward in my book, yes I don't know the whole story but I know enough of it to say YOU HAVE to protect an innocent child.

NOBODY INVOLVED in this gets any credit...lack of judgment? WOW that is a complete understatement. I say they throw them into prison with the general population and see what happens to them, including JO PA

 

[pranas]

Most colleges and universities have rules about reporting abuse or crime. Usually, an employee is to call campus security not the local police. This way the administation can "take care" of it their way. A lot of stuff gets "taken care" of or covered up. College administrators are very good at making sure this type of information is not released. Abolish campus police or security and a lot more things would see the light of day but I doubt if most schools would do this voluntarily because it would cause other problems.

 

[ace2000]

He displayed a lack of judgment by not immediately contacting the authorites.

I believe he contacted authorities within 24 hours of the incident. He reported it to Paterno and Paterno reported it to the Vice President who was in charge of campus security. If I was in the same situation, I would have thought that would have been good enough.

However, in hindsight, his error in not following up with the local police turned out to be just as bad a judgement call as Paterno's neglect, if you look at it from the perspective of the kids involved.

I agree, he should be gone also. But not for the same reasons as you feel.

 

[DeniseM]

All school employees are mandated reporters and are required by law to report child abuse DIRECTLY to CPS.

 

[ace2000]

All school employees are mandated reporters and are required by law to report child abuse DIRECTLY to CPS.

Is that true in every state and was it true in 1998? And are you referring to Paterno or McQueary? Not sure if a GA is considered an employee or not.

 

[brigechols]

I believe he contacted authorities within 24 hours of the incident. He reported it to Paterno and Paterno reported it to the Vice President who was in charge of campus security. If I was in the same situation, I would have thought that would have been good enough.

However, in hindsight, his error in not following up with the local police turned out to be just as bad a judgement call as Paterno's neglect, if you look at it from the perspective of the kids involved.

I agree, he should be gone also. But not for the same reasons as you feel.

According to the grand jury report, the graduate assistant reported the alleged rape to his dad and Joe Pa. About ten days later, he was called to a meeting with Curley and Schultz where he described the alleged rape. I don't consider his dad, Joe Pa, Curley, or Schlutz the proper authorities.

 

[ace2000]

According to the grand jury report, the graduate assistant reported the alleged rape to his dad and Joe Pa. About ten days later, he was called to a meeting with Curley and Schultz where he described the alleged rape. I don't consider his dad, Joe Pa, Curley, or Schlutz the proper authorities.

Everyone sees that today in hindsight.

 

[brigechols]

All school employees are mandated reporters and are required by law to report child abuse DIRECTLY to CPS.

There are at least a half-dozen states (Pennsylvania, Virginia, Georgia, Massachusetts, Missouri and South Dakota) where the protocol for staff members of schools is to notify the person in charge in the event of suspected child abuse. That superior is then legally obliged to report to the authorities.

 

[Elan]

Is that true in every state and was it true in 1998? And are you referring to Paterno or McQueary? Not sure if a GA is considered an employee or not.

I believe the Campus Security Act applies here. It's a federal law that requires campus crimes be reported and timely warnings be given to students when a crime has been reported to campus security. Passed in 1990.

I'm not a lawyer, so I may not have interpreted all aspects correctly.

 

[Elan]

According to the grand jury report, the graduate assistant reported the alleged rape to his dad and Joe Pa. About ten days later, he was called to a meeting with Curley and Schultz where he described the alleged rape. I don't consider his dad, Joe Pa, Curley, or Schlutz the proper authorities.

If the VP was in charge of campus security, I would consider that proper reporting. It's then the VP's legal obligation to report the crime to law enforcement. That clearly didn't happen, which is likely why the VP is in deep trouble.

 

[ace2000]

I believe the Campus Security Act applies here. It's a federal law that requires campus crimes be reported and timely warnings be given to students when a crime has been reported to campus security. Passed in 1990.

I'm not a lawyer, so I may not have interpreted all aspects correctly.

You're talking about reported by the school to the local police, right?

 

[Beaglemom3]

This and the DA who was on the verge of bringing up charges disappeared in '05 without a trace, his laptop with crushed hard drive fished out of the Susquehanna. He was just declared dead this year. No suspects. Curious, no?

Jim

Yes, this is chilling and one cannot help but link it to a much larger cover up.

I hope that those who are guilty of these acts and those of not reporting or not following up at Penn State, end up in the State Pen.