Our westgate experiences have been good

[mikeben]

I am providing some of our experiences with Westgate that will go counter to many of the general trends of thought on the matter here on the forum. We have owned at Park City for over 3 years and have had wonderful experiences. Although we have not exchanged into other resorts at westgate yet we have maximized our investment. First the PC resort is truly the very best ski resort anywhere and we've been to most. When we can't use it we have rented a ski week out(usually sundance wk) for $3k-$5k week and that pays for all our other vacations and some of our investment in PC. Otherwise we can give them our ski week and we get 2 2bdrm or 4 1 bdrm or any combo we want to use either in II or westgate (thru the developer buy only). We have gone on 2 or 3 vacations per year in great II resorts for just one maintenance fee.

Regarding their sales practices...couldn't agree more with everyone...we kept negotiating and got everything in writing before signing...including the 4 for 1 wk exchange! Do your homework, ask LOTS of questions, get in writing what is important to you...After the purchase, the people we have dealt with have been great even if they are a little unorganized in booking reservations. The key is buying value, location and a desirable place. That being said, I would advise those looking to purchase to buy resale (unless you can maximixe the 4 for 1 exchanges) now that it is available or go to a program like Hyatt and go with ppoints (our next purchase will by Hyatt). A happy westgater (and yes we hate dave siegel too!)

 

[Steamboat Bill]

Ahhhh....at least I am no longer alone in my praise of Westgate (limited to Park City).

And I see we are practically neighbors.

 

[vinwarlock]

I'm also very happy with Westgate we own at Westgate Smokie mountain resort for three years now and we just traded into Disney old key west for this December with one of our last years room we own two one bedroom deluxe

 

[JLB]

Wow! The numbers are adding up. 3.

I bet b4 this thread is done it will get all the way up to 10, maybe 20.

The 3 who did not get groped, flashed, pinned against the wall, or propositioned into prostitution.

Yes, that might be a new trend. Let me go put it on the scale, to see how it balances. . . Whoops, no, not enough.

Glad to hear your happy, tho. I guess that's what important, individual happiness, regardless of what's happening to others.

 

[mrsstats]

I dont often post on here but do read the boards every day. Just wanted to say I purchased resale from WVV and have been very happy. We trade within Westgate and have had no problems getting what we want, when we want.

 

[JLB]

4, and counting.

Not bad, out of what, a couple hundred thousand?

 

[JLB]

It's been said that the flow of these discussions provides a balance.

Well, here's some balance:

http://employment.law360.com/Members/ViewArticlePortion.aspx?Id=48367&ReturnUrl=../s
ecure%2fViewArticle.aspx%3fId%3d48367

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/local/orange/orl-bk-siegel022108,0,2265122.story?track=r
ss
http://www.orlandoweekly.com/features/story.asp?id=1599
http://www.websupp.com/data/MDFL/6:04-cv-01542-114-MDFL.pdf
http://www.wgowners.net/forums/index.php?showforum=61
http://www.timeshareowners.info/forums/index.php?act=Print&client=printer&f=61&t=68

http://www.complaints.com/directory/2005/april/7/24.htm

http://www.orlando.bbb.org/codbrep.html?ID=101774&cons=y

http://www.ripoffreport.com/searchresults.asp?q1=ALL&q2=&q3=&q4=&q5=&q7=&q6=westga
te%20resorts&searchtype=0

http://www.ripoffreport.com/reports/0/265/RipOff0265445.htm

http://www.5dca.org/Opinions/Opin2001/073001/5D00-3321.op.pdf

http://goliath.ecnext.com/coms2/gi_0199-5926792/Bluegreen-Corporation-Settles-Litigation-with
.html

http://www.myflorida.com/dbpr/lsc/arbitration/final_order_indexes/regular/allorders/2003071426.
pdf

http://www.websupp.com/data/MDFL/6:04-cv-01542-114-MDFL.pdf

http://199.250.30.53/fchr/layout/set/print/complaints__1/final_orders/final_orders_2003/fchr_ord
er_no_03_088

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/orl-harass2108feb21,0,2466938.story

http://www.cfnews13.com/News/Local/2008/2/20/former_employee_wins_sexual_harassment_la
wsuit.html

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=complaints+westgate+resorts&btnG=Search

http://pintmaster.com/20060116/westgate-resorts-is-it-a-scam/

http://www0.epinions.com/trvl-review-6D57-5E9DE16-38F74B4B-prod1/show_~allcom

http://www.complaints.com/directory/2005/june/6/28.htm

http://search.complaints.com/search?btnG=Search+Complaints.com&output=xml_no_dtd&so
rt=date%253AD%253AL%253Ad1&client=complaints&oe=UTF-8&ie=UTF-8&proxystylesheet
=complaints&site=complaints&q=westgate+resorts&x=37&y=11

http://www.complaints.com/directory/2004/november/10/34.htm

http://www.geocities.com/elizsheag/westgate.html

http://www.geocities.com/elizsheag/westgate.html

http://www.geocities.com/elizsheag/westgate/jff.html

http://www.geocities.com/elizsheag/westgate/rebel5k.html

http://www.westgate-pc.blogspot.com/

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/travel/westgate.html

http://en.allexperts.com/q/Time-Shares-1843/Westgate-Resorts.htm

http://www.my3cents.com/search.cgi?criteria=Westgate+Resorts

http://buzz.omgili.com/buzz.search?isBuzz=1&q="Westgate+resorts"&x=23&y=2

http://800notes.com/Phone.aspx/1-888-685-0042/2

http://www.pissedconsumer.com/consumer-reviews/resorts/westgate-resorts-opinions--travel
%11resorts-2002072251971.html

http://forum.powweb.com/showthread.php?t=76636

http://www.floridasupremecourt.org/clerk/briefs/2004/601-800/04-648_JurisIni.pdf

http://199.242.69.70/pls/ds/ds_cases_person?psReportStyle=Display&psCourt=5&psSearchType
=&psHow=contains&psRole=party&pnPersonId=86707&psButton=Submit

http://www.ninthcircuit.org/research/case_query.shtml (Westgate Resorts: 24 cases/Central Florida
Investments: 12 cases)

http://www.seminoleclerk.org/CivilDocket/case_detail_3.jsp?CaseNo=2003CA002964

http://www.seminoleclerk.org/CivilDocket/case_detail_3.jsp?CaseNo=2003CA000348

http://www.osceolaclerkcourt.org/genrlmnu.htm Enter Westgate Resorts, Central Florida Investments
(224 cases), David Siegel (in a 1991 case, he sued OLCC), Westgate Lakes, Westgate Vacation Village, Westgate
Town Center

http://www.courts.mo.gov/casenet/cases/searchCases.do?searchType=name You gotta do a little
looking, but they’re already showing up, or not, in court.

 

[timeos2]

One quick search - over 8,000 unique complaints per Google

Come on Jim - that doesn't even scratch the surface! You'd overwhelm the TUG server if you posted even half of the negatives Google finds about Wastegate. But some will think it doesn't effect them that the operation is about as low class, obnoxious, pushy and borderline illegal as you'll ever find from what I've seen. How they can be ignorant of the facts after all that is beyond me but, since people still buy and some even say fairly good things about them, obviously some still suffer from sun blindness regarding the true nature of Wastegate. They will unfortunately learn too late.

 

[Steamboat Bill]

How they can be ignorant of the facts after all that is beyond me but, since people still buy and some even say fairly good things about them, obviously some still suffer from sun blindness regarding the true nature of Wastegate. They will unfortunately learn too late.

When I bought my Westgate (Park City) I really did not do any research on any other Westgate as I had no intention of ever trading my ski week.

I figure that in 2 more years, my purchase will have paid for itself in "found opportunity" as I have been able to book a 2 bedroom ski week for $950 vs paying $3,000-$5,000 rent that I did before I bought a timeshare.

Perhaps I will sell my ski week in a few years and stick with High country Club (Destination Club) and/or go back to renting. With the new construction and new prices at Park City I EXPECT to make a Profit on the sale of my timeshare.

I am not discounting all the bad press Westgate gets, but it has not affected me in one measurable way as I bought resale and have been very satisfied with each trip I have taken there.

I have to admit, that I get tired of hearing all the BAD things about Westgate and David Siegal, but he deserves whatever punishment he gets.

 

[JLB]

I know John, I restrained myself. Like I said, I was just trying to provide balance, nothing more.

4 satisfied owners. Wow! And here in Timeshare La La Land.

That alone should tell any reasonable person what the feeling is among the general public, the potential victims.

Surprisingly, I mentioned something on the Branson board about letting Mr. S get his foot in the door here, and there wasn't even one reply. Yet, on another thread where someone asked what tours gave the best premiums, There were many extremely anti-timeshare posts, hateful even.

One of the complaints I found on the Internet was from a Grandvista Cedar Ridge owner, which was a wonderful resort b4 Mr. S. It was about the special assessment he made on existing owners, and the midrise (not a popular style here) monument he put up to himself, hanging on the hillside behind Shoji's.

 

[JLB]

FWIW, we were not appreciably affected financially by Mr. S. Two of our two a two/halves weeks we sold for what we paid for them, resale. In those cases it was the previous owner/victim, who saw the light and bailed out at a loss.

We snuck out the back, Jack, just prior to when the owners-bailing-out harassment began--the $150 exit fee, the fake ROFR and the claim on exit commissions. For those who have an ounce of reason, they would know that all the crap heaped on folks leaving was pointing a finger at a problem Mr. S had/has--folks waking up.

To paraphrase a joke I heard last night at Presley's, "Does anyone want my dog? He hates WG." "I thought you said he loved WG? "Oh, yeah, he was just a puppy and hadn't opened his eyes, yet!"

$$$ is not the basis of my angst. My basis is just him, the way he is, and the way it permeates throughout the operation. The nickel and diming, cash-cowing to feed his lusts and ego. The 14 years we wasted under his deceit when we could have been enjoying the real timesharing we have had since.

There are those who bring pride to timeshareand then there are those who have created all the hatred of it. If you had to pick one operation that charaterizes why timeshare is so hated, WG would be it.

If I/we can save one other from that, then hurrah for me/us, even if we have to sustain the criticism of those leading folks down the primrose path.

 

[jjlovecub]

I guess I am number 5. I bought at Westgate Lakes probably 10 yrs ago now. Never had a problem (other then buying from them instead of resale). I have always gotten my exchange including a 2bdr in Maui in July and Key West in peak season. I realize I am in the minority - just glad I have avoided everybody else's problems.

 

[Steamboat Bill]

I wonder if we will break into double digits for happy Westgate owners.

One interesting observation - at the hottub, I have never met an unhappy Westgate owner. Perhaps it has something to do with the ski conditions in Utah, whatever. Every owner I have met there is very happy.

 

[LnM]

We bought westgate before we had any idea of the "issues". before research. It wasen't a very bright thing to do with out some sort of looking around to find out what is what but we did and now we are owners. that is that, just like many , many people. now we can make the best of it, or... what?? I am glad that there are people that are happy with them and sad that they obviously have some problems in the timeshare community which I don't fully understand. Is there anywhere that a westgate owner can go to get answers and socialize without the constant criticism? almost every westgate post that I have located on these boards has so far had rude comments and negative connotations associated with it that make a person feel unwelcome and stupid. I don't feel welcome here and am very hesitant to even ask a question. Maybe there should be a statement in the sign up portion that clearly states that westgate owners are not welcome and should post at their own risk. . maybe I can get my 15 bucks back? not likely. anyway keep up the good work of educating the unknowing and helping the (nonwestgateowners)public learn how to use their vacation times to the fullest. .
we are in with westgate and there is nothing we can do about it now. END

 

[timeos2]

Go ahead - ask

We bought westgate before we had any idea of the "issues". before research. It wasen't a very bright thing to do with out some sort of looking around to find out what is what but we did and now we are owners. that is that, just like many , many people. now we can make the best of it, or... what?? I am glad that there are people that are happy with them and sad that they obviously have some problems in the timeshare community which I don't fully understand. Is there anywhere that a westgate owner can go to get answers and socialize without the constant criticism? almost every westgate post that I have located on these boards has so far had rude comments and negative connotations associated with it that make a person feel unwelcome and stupid. I don't feel welcome here and am very hesitant to even ask a question. Maybe there should be a statement in the sign up portion that clearly states that westgate owners are not welcome and should post at their own risk. . maybe I can get my 15 bucks back? not likely. anyway keep up the good work of educating the unknowing and helping the (nonwestgateowners)public learn how to use their vacation times to the fullest. .
we are in with westgate and there is nothing we can do about it now. END

So whats your question? Hopefully no one will bite you if you ask.

 

[Steamboat Bill]

Is there anywhere that a westgate owner can go to get answers and socialize without the constant criticism? almost every westgate post that I have located on these boards has so far had rude comments and negative connotations associated with it that make a person feel unwelcome and stupid. I don't feel welcome here and am very hesitant to even ask a question. Maybe there should be a statement in the sign up portion that clearly states that westgate owners are not welcome and should post at their own risk.

If your questions have anything to do with park City, I am happy to help out...any other location, you may be at risk of entering a feeding frenzy.

 

[JLB]

Exactly our experience at OL. We have never met unhappy owners in the hot tub there, just unhappy exchangers.

Of course, some things are just too obvious to warrant mention. Where else would you be more likely to find happy owners than at the resort itself?

LnM, if WG owners are not welcome here, then that would include Joh and me, he still owning and I/we previous owners.

Granted, most WG owners are not aware of the problems (at WG). Even if some at WG are aware of it, they blame it on everyone else, that everyone else is lesser than them, so they would not appreciate WG.

One interesting observation - at the hottub, I have never met an unhappy Westgate owner.

 

[JLB]

If you really want to feel unwelcome, try here:

http://www.1branson.com/forum/t33963.html

Or better yet, try being me, criticizing timeshares on a timeshare forum and sticking up them on a non-timeshare forum.

My/our (we are not the first and only the tip of the iceberg) comments are intended to report reality. A lot of people come here first to do research (as you implicated you should have). Having been there (bought based on what WG weasels told us), I appreciate your concern.

I/we certainly do not intend to criticize owners, although I understand how one could feel that way. We are only trying to open eyes, to caution folks, so that they think twice before spending or sending $$$ with/to Mr. S.

If folks want to keep sending $$$, knowing that he is a sleazy, sexist pervert, that's your business.

Is there anywhere that a westgate owner can go to get answers and socialize without the constant criticism? almost every westgate post that I have located on these boards has so far had rude comments and negative connotations associated with it that make a person feel unwelcome and stupid. I don't feel welcome here and am very hesitant to even ask a question.

 

[Steamboat Bill]

If folks want to keep sending $$$, knowing that he is a sleazy, sexist pervert, that's your business.

I am sure this describes many Business owners that you may unwittingly do business with.

 

[merc]

I wonder how many businesses are owned by people that one might find "sleazy"? What has the personality of the owner really got to do with the debate over the nature of a resort? Did people go to Vegas when the mob owned the place? Anyone's grandfather ever drink whisky that Al Capone made money on? Please keep things in perspective and stay with the actual matters of resort management. So far as I know, Mr. Seagal hasn't been put on trial like so many other major business figures have been. I've owned Westgate since 1991 and have never had a sniff of a problem, in fact have always experienced the opposite, very professional and accomodating service, with no unexpected costs or disappointments. I own with other major companies too, and don't find them or their resorts particularly better to deal with than Westgate.

 

[JLB]

6.

I guess our purpose is to take the unwittingly out of the equation.

If the word is now that Mr. S has not been put on trial, then his legal beagles really are good!!!! Yeah, the Orlando Sentinel was quick to purge the story of his conviction, but if it has been totally purged, everyhere, Wow!, that would be amazing.

As for feeling bad about comments, of course the reason for that is that you own something at WG. This forum prohibits personal criticism of others for the opinions they express, and I, for sure, understand that rule and try to abide by it.

Even though this is Timeshare La La Land, that does not mean there won't be things said that make you feel bad if you are not a little thick-skinned. Mostly folks here like to stroke each other's ego and to vindicate our ownerships, but that does not mean we are above reporting the bad.

The fact that WG is a lightning rod of discontent even in TS La La Land, where just about everyone is pro-TS to begin with, should say enough.

I posted all the links for a purpose, to show that it is not just two old dudes on TUG.

 

[JLB]

Seriously, no, I don't expect a stampede of folks heading for the WG exit doors. Even those who desparately want to, aren't.

I expect most folks to try to make do with what they have, as we did for 14 years.

But, if some are on the brink, knowing the truth about the sleaze, which they may have only sensed thusfar, may be enough to push them along.

There is life after WG.

 

[JLB]

Over the years here, a few have accused me of being rhetorical. Of course, they intend that to be demeaning, since there are demeaning meanings of rhetorical.

I intend to be rhetorical sometimes, referring to other meanings:

2. the art or science of all specialized literary uses of language in prose or verse, including the figures of speech.
3. the study of the effective use of language.
4. the ability to use language effectively.
5. the art of prose in general as opposed to verse.
6. the art of making persuasive speeches; oratory.
7. (in classical oratory) the art of influencing the thought and conduct of an audience.

In this case I admit to #7.

Imagination being the cornerstone of Orlando, what Orlando owes its existence to, let me work on yours.

If you are a woman, imagine that you went to a resort and the owner of that resort pursued you sexually. He was 30 years older and disgusting. You spurned his advances, but he wouldn't leave you alone. He continued to pursue you. People started talking about you in a bad way. It got to the point where this man exposed himself to you, pinned you up against a wall and fondled you. He offered you money to have sex with him. His wife tried to proposition you also.

How would you feel about him? About his resort?

If you are a man, and it was your wife, daughter or sister that was the victim, how would you feel about the man? About his resort?

 

[Steamboat Bill]

If you are a woman, imagine that you went to a resort and the owner of that resort pursued you sexually. He was 30 years older and disgusting. You spurned his advances, but he wouldn't leave you alone. He continued to pursue you. People started talking about you in a bad way. It got to the point where this man exposed himself to you, pinned you up against a wall and fondled you. He offered you money to have sex with him. His wife tried to proposition you also.

For a second, I thought your post had to be deleted for bringing "Politics" into a discussion. This sounds like a typical day in Washington DC, Los Angeles, or Las Vegas.

 

[merc]

Can someone help us out here? A bunch of links to blogs isn't that easy to wade through. Can there be a specific list of crimes and convictions provided, names, dates etc? I tried a few of these links, and found nothing in them except what looked like ancient real estate arguments, and something about picketing? Or perhaps don't bother unless we are talking felonies. I don't have time to start worrying about if someone who owns something I use is accused of being sleazy. Sleazy is part of the culture, isn't it? I won't use a Hilton property now, because Paris is a bit off, even went to jail, probably influenced a bunch of young girls the wrong way, and boys too.