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On airplane now, large woman spilling onto me!

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jlr10

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Probably the only thing that's hard is coming to terms with the reality of it all- exactly how few calories it takes to really run a body is eye-opening, along with how much exercise it takes to really burn it.
This is a valid point. On a doctor monitored weight program I found out: At my height (5 feet nothing) and metabolism I have to work out 2 hours per day 7 days a week and consume 1200 or less to maintain being 40 pounds over weight. If I want to reach chart ideas I have to eat less than 1000 calories a day. Yes, I can go on an extream diet and lose weight but keeping the caloric intake on less than what most people would find hard to do, on a daily basis is hard. Which is why my weight goes up and down. Don't judge anyone on their weight unless that person is yourself, since you don't know their story.

As for OP, as she pointed out, her problem was not the weight but rather the sense of entitlement the person beside her had with regards to personal space and attitude. It would have been the same issue if it was a tall skinny person who kept jabbing her in the ribs with total disregard. Definately a valid point. Very glad to see that the seats on first class gave her a much deserved break!
 

Rose Pink

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But it is incumbent on the consumer to know when to stop.
Agreed. But without education, many of them don't understand when to stop. Having taken hundreds, maybe thousands, of diet histories over the decades I can tell you people simply do not understand what they are eating or how much they are eating. Food as drug is a relatively new development in brain chemistry and obesity studies.

The bottom line is that the consumer is the one who is responsible but the consumer cannot make wise choices without good information.

Each year the schools host a Red Ribbon Week to get the children educated about drugs and have them pledge not to take drugs. I think certain foods should be added to that list.

... my doctor absolutely put his foot down in year 3 of his telling me to lose weight, for some reason I finally did about a year ago.
It's been suggested that physicians need to be more pro-active in discussing obesity with their patients and even writing a prescription to lose weight. The doctor's office is no place to be polite about avoiding discussing someone's fatness. Kudos to your doc!

...food policy in America for some reason favors unhealthy foods over healthy ones, this is a real failing of a government IMO. In part, this is because so many normal weight-people apply the value judgement to the overweight person- he/she is fat because lazy, with no self-control +/- maybe stupid- so reversing some of these food policy mistakes becomes difficult because skinny folks decide they are skinny through better virtue, they oppose changes to food policy that might be very helpful to the overall health of the American public.
Perhaps, but the bigger player is dollars. Billions and billions are made on junk foods by the corporations who make them and those who sell them retail or in school vending machines. Unfortunately, billions and billions are being spent on the other end of this including the billions spent on weight reduction, diabetes, cancer, etc.


So I really do have a good deal of sympathy to my obese neighbor on the plane vis a vis her obesity itself. My only issue was that she was pretty rude and clueless about her impact on others.

H
It certainly seems that she was rude and/or clueless but there is also another explanation. She could be one of those extremely shy people who simply freeze up when confronted by a stranger. I was so shy as a child/teen that at times I could not return a smile or a hello. People thought I was conceited or stuck up. I wasn't. I just could not speak. It is the way some people's brains are wired. Just as some people are extroverts and some are introverts. Shyness is built it. Through the years I have learned to overcome it but at times it still rears it's miserable head. While I've learned behaviors to help me function in public, the shyness is still hard-wired in me.
So, the woman sharing your seat space may have been pathologically shy. If so, she may be self-medicating with food. Not a good idea and hopefully, she'll get a clue as to how to overcome that.
 

pacodemountainside

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Madison Avenue has been manipulating us since the day of the great flood. Still good reading today when scrunched on an air plane!


Vance Packard (May 22, 1914 – December 12, 1996) was an American journalist, social critic and author.

In 1957, The Hidden Persuaders was published and received national attention. The book launched Packard's career as a social critic and full-time lecturer and book author. In 1961 he was named a Distinguished Alumnus of Penn State University. He died in 1996 at the Martha's Vineyard Hospital in Massachusetts.


"The Hidden Persuaders" redirects here. For the 2011 British film, see The Hidden Persuaders (film).

Vance Packard's book The Hidden Persuaders, about media manipulation in the 1950s, sold more than a million copies.
In The Hidden Persuaders, first published in 1957, Packard explores the use of consumer motivational research and other psychological techniques, including depth psychology and subliminal tactics, by advertisers to manipulate expectations and induce desire for products, particularly in the American postwar era. He identified eight "compelling needs" that advertisers promise products will fulfill. According to Packard these needs are so strong that people are compelled to buy products to satisfy them. The book also explores the manipulative techniques of promoting politicians to the electorate. The book questions the morality of using these techniques.
 

heathpack

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Agreed. But without education, many of them don't understand when to stop. Having taken hundreds, maybe thousands, of diet histories over the decades I can tell you people simply do not understand what they are eating or how much they are eating. Food as drug is a relatively new development in brain chemistry and obesity studies.

The bottom line is that the consumer is the one who is responsible but the consumer cannot make wise choices without good information.

Each year the schools host a Red Ribbon Week to get the children educated about drugs and have them pledge not to take drugs. I think certain foods should be added to that list.


It's been suggested that physicians need to be more pro-active in discussing obesity with their patients and even writing a prescription to lose weight. The doctor's office is no place to be polite about avoiding discussing someone's fatness. Kudos to your doc!


Perhaps, but the bigger player is dollars. Billions and billions are made on junk foods by the corporations who make them and those who sell them retail or in school vending machines. Unfortunately, billions and billions are being spent on the other end of this including the billions spent on weight reduction, diabetes, cancer, etc.



It certainly seems that she was rude and/or clueless but there is also another explanation. She could be one of those extremely shy people who simply freeze up when confronted by a stranger. I was so shy as a child/teen that at times I could not return a smile or a hello. People thought I was conceited or stuck up. I wasn't. I just could not speak. It is the way some people's brains are wired. Just as some people are extroverts and some are introverts. Shyness is built it. Through the years I have learned to overcome it but at times it still rears it's miserable head. While I've learned behaviors to help me function in public, the shyness is still hard-wired in me.
So, the woman sharing your seat space may have been pathologically shy. If so, she may be self-medicating with food. Not a good idea and hopefully, she'll get a clue as to how to overcome that.
Food policy drives the dollars. For example- we- you & I and every US taxpayer- heavily subsidize the production of corn. Which becomes corn-fed beef and HFCS. HFCS is way cheaper than traditional cane sugar, therefore junk foods become cheaper to make and therefore easier to sell at an attractive price. Our government could choose instead to more heavily subsidize say raspberry production or provide serious tax breaks for farmers raising beef on pasture for its entire lifespan. But instead of giving the break to the lady on the plane who'd maybe prefer a pint of raspberries over the family sized kit kat bar that she actually ate, we set up our food policy such that the raspberries are $5 but the kit kat is $2.

Maybe that is not the best example, part of the cost of raspberries are their extreme perishability. But you see what I'm saying. It's as if food policy subsidized the production of rum and then we as a nation wondered why everyone was drunk all the time.

H
 

MOXJO7282

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This is a valid point. On a doctor monitored weight program I found out: At my height (5 feet nothing) and metabolism I have to work out 2 hours per day 7 days a week and consume 1200 or less to maintain being 40 pounds over weight.
Unless you have some other health issues in play this is not true. Trust me if you're just overweight because of overeating and lack of exercise if you follow what you suggest above you will lose weight rapidly. You won't be able to work out 2 hours a day if you're 40 lbs overweight but you can target that to build up to. And 1200 calories a day is very few, especially if youre working out with vigor.

This is one of the prominent excuses people use, along with "working out will make me eat more so I don't do it" If you have a health issue that makes your metabolism that slow that is a different story but for most people its just bad choices of what they're eating or the lack of any exercise.


The problem I see is people are just too darn sedentary. Technology has made it so easy to be. I bet if you asked 10 people if they worked out vigorously regularly let's say 4 times a week, it would be 3 out of 10. 3 more might get moderate activity and the other 4 would get none. If you don't exercise regularly you will not be healthy, unless you eat and drink like a teetotaller. I'm going to try to research that and get back with stats.

I work out almost every day in one way or another. I'm at the gym lifting weights and running or biking at least 4-5 times a week and then doing vigorous yard work the other days, and actively coach all my son's sports teams.

Now I am still 15lbs over weight even with all that good exercise because I still like to eat rich foods sometimes and indulge in a cocktail or two. I can tell you for sure the way I eat and drink if I didn't exercise so much I'd be one of those in need of 2 airline seats but I have a nice balance I think.

I feel good about myself except for my bald head because although I carry the extra weight my doctors just recently confirmed I am a very healthy 47 yr old, and in fact said I was 10 years younger than my peers health wise, even being a little chubby.

So it comes down to personal effort to keep yourself in reasonable shape. Even the people that now have health issues that make them obese, many got that way because of bad habits when they were young and not something genetic.

This may sound like a simple way to solve it but to be fair anyone who can't fit into a seat and has a legitmate medical reason why they are obese should be able to get a doctor's note to justify, and get a free seat from the airline, otherwise they should buy two seats.
 
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MOXJO7282

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I quickly looked it up. Its actually worst than I thought with less than 50% meeting the guidelines.

"More Americans are exercising regularly, but still fewer than half of us are exercising enough to meet the exercise guidelines for healthy adults, according to a CDC survey"

This sums it up right here. These issues will continue to rise because we are going to continue to get fatter as a nation until more people take personal accountability and do the right thing.

I'm going to the gym right now. However I will be eating eggplant parm later so that is my trade off.
 

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Not true. Can't quote law, but I believe that it is the possession above a certain amount that is illegal vs use. Sale is also illegal.

I know plenty of "imbibers" and not one has ever been arrested for it.
NO STATE HAS MADE THE POSESWION OF POT IN ANY AMOUNT LEGAL WITH THE EXCEPTION OF STATES THAT LEGALIZE MEDICAL MARIJUANA. Possession above a certain amount is considered possession with intent to sell. If your imbiing friends were ever caught and arrested they might very well go to jaio particularly if they are black . Read AND JUSTICE FOR SOME BY GLENN GREENWALD and you will see the actual statistics. Some states make possession below a certain amount a disorderly persons offense which cn e penalized with just a fine and or 6 months in jail. These states, and there are very few f them are probaky in conflict with federal law which des not permit such leniency. Many more states have harsh penalties for possession of a small amount. Whether or not you get arrested and sent to jail depends largely on your skin color. There is much written on this topic based upon verifiable statistics instead of anecdotal evidence.
 
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kenie

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Just to be clear, I am in full agreement with the op that the behaviour of the person sitting beside her was wrong. She was totally inconsiderate of the people sharing the row with her and there is no excuse for that.
 

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Not true. Can't quote law, but I believe that it is the possession above a certain amount that is illegal vs use. Sale is also illegal.

I know plenty of "imbibers" and not one has ever been arrested for it.
One out of every 150 prison inmates is in jail for simple cannabis possession. There are roughly 2.5 million people incarcerated in America, right now. We lead the world in per capita incarceration. (USA! :cheer: USA! :cheer: USA! :cheer: )


But, try as people may to excuse away obesity as an addiction, this is about what happens when someone who can't fit in a seat tries to do so next to you. I haven't heard one good argument why this sort of behavior should be permitted.

Just a lot of smoke and mirrors deflecting the point.
 

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Thinking of diet choices

Sat in an early am diabetic education committee mtg this last week for my facility. The lead person mentioned how no one around the table had the cafeteria biscuits and gravy, meaning good choices at the table. Well the next two late arrive-es had you guessed it biscuits& gravy, they were both seated next to the lead person who had to have noticed... she spoke too soon :D

A coworker mentioned how expensive it is to eat fresh vegetables/fruit as she is trying to make healthier choices. This single coworker is making $70K/year so imagine trying to make healthier choices of lots less income :(

Agree schools making $$$ off of soda machines in schools is bad bad bad, but there they are elementary - high school.
 

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In California it is illegal to sell, or provide carbonated soft drinks at school.
 

fillde

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NO STATE HAS MADE THE POSESWION OF POT IN ANY AMOUNT LEGAL WITH THE EXCEPTION OF STATES THAT LEGALIZE MEDICAL MARIJUANA. Possession above a certain amount is considered possession with intent to sell. If your imbiing friends were ever caught and arrested they might very well go to jaio particularly if they are black . Read AND JUSTICE FOR SOME BY GLENN GREENWALD and you will see the actual statistics. Some states make possession below a certain amount a disorderly persons offense which cn e penalized with just a fine and or 6 months in jail. These states, and there are very few f them are probaky in conflict with federal law which des not permit such leniency. Many more states have harsh penalties for possession of a small amount. Whether or not you get arrested and sent to jail depends largely on your skin color. There is much written on this topic based upon verifiable statistics instead of anecdotal evidence.
Not sure why you brought race and an obscure author into this topic.But if you must, we have a black president and a black attorney general not doing a thing about it. What a shame.
 

Tia

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In California it is illegal to sell, or provide carbonated soft drinks at school.


Well CA has something right . Soda machines have been in schools here since 21yo was in elementary school and machines were still in high schools last year when dtr was a senior. Her high school cafeteria is so small it encourages hs kids to go elsewhere for lunch -> fast food , plus they must drive as nothing except a gas station within 2+ miles.
 

"Roger"

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Just as an FYI, the exit row seats can only be purchased on the day of travel & I made my purchase about as early as one is able to. It may be that every single person on the plane would've been willing to pay $30 more, but only 12 of us were able to.

H
I must admit that I am not that familiar with many airlines. AirTran does allow you to buy exit row seats at the time of purchase. Frontier has a number of rows that offer "stretch seating" for $5 to $30 (I believe that is the range). These seats are more interesting in that there are no limitations as to who can sit in them.

This thread has got my curiousity up. I just went to the Frontier site and looked at a Minneapolis to Denver flight for this Friday. (I chose something near at hand in that it would be mostly full.) Ignoring the exit rows (not sure if they are up for sale or not), there were 114 regular seats available and 24 with stretch seating ($20 extra - on a flight of this length that would not give Frontier much profit over the extra cost of providing the extra room). Both sections had 15 seats still available. That means that the in your face, almost no pitch seats are selling at a 86% occupancy rate and the more leg room seats at a 37% pace.

Figures like this are hardly likely to encourage Frontier to offer more stretch seating. People want cheap.
 

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It also became more of an issue when airlines started to shrink the size of their seats as the public expanded the size of theirs.... :)

A perfect storm...
 

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I only noticed one posting on this thread that mentioned safety.

We often are seated in the exit row; the flight attendant usually asks us if we understand and are capable of performing the duty of opening the door should it be necessary. Sometimes the gate agent asks us also. It's pretty obvious this woman was not able to do this. She would have been an obstacle if an evacuation would have been necessary. Think about the flight that landed on the Hudson river - how could she possibly have gotten off that plane? I really feel for the person in the window seat.!

If you had expressed your concern to the flight attendant she could not have ignored the situation; their job includes passenger safety.

I was once seated in the center, aisle seat was empty. A very large man sat down next to me and flipped up the seatrest. An announcement was made that someone had left an oversized carryon in the coat closet (this was years ago) that was blocking the aisle and needed to be moved. No one claimed it - they announced his name on the intercom - it was him. He had to go up and claim it and find room for his bag in an overhead - the armrest was firmly down when he returned to his seat. There are simply people out there that feel the rules don't apply to them.

Since that experience I keep my arm on the armrest & I place a large book or magazine next to my thigh on either side of me - takes care of the ooze.

When my husband & I are seated next to one another we raise the armrest. I always sit in the middle; he gets the aisle or window. I am small and would feel discriminated if a really large person was seated next to me because they needed extra room!

Think maybe all airline employees should have chairs the same width as airline seats.
 

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Just got back from Waikiki - we flew in row 30 (the last row) - so the seats didn't "recline" even the 2.5 inches that the other seats do, what a pain in my knees.

DD threw a fit when we tried to put her on board - so the staff gave her special treatment, even gave her a set of wings - that was very nice.

They are very good people trying to make your flight safer and easier both - but they can't make the seats bigger or the butts smaller.

I am amazed how this thread has run on and on .... is it a record yet?

:rolleyes:
 

pjrose

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Just got back from Waikiki - we flew in row 30 (the last row) - so the seats didn't "recline" even the 2.5 inches that the other seats do, what a pain in my knees.

DD threw a fit when we tried to put her on board - so the staff gave her special treatment, even gave her a set of wings - that was very nice.
Awwwww, all parents have been through those fits. I didn't realize they still had wings to give kids!

They are very good people trying to make your flight safer and easier both - but they can't make the seats bigger or the butts smaller.

I am amazed how this thread has run on and on .... is it a record yet?

:rolleyes:
#6 on TUG Lounge, only ones ahead are several American Idol threads, picture of the day, and song of the day.

When you're looking at the list of Lounge threads, click on Replies at the very top to sort, or just click here:
http://tugbbs.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=2&daysprune=-1&order=desc&sort=replycount

Of course it's up there; we're covering some important ground (air?) here.....safety, courtesy, obesity, airline bottom lines, seating, nutrition, measuring..... :)
 
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beejaybeeohio

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I only noticed one posting on this thread that mentioned safety.

We often are seated in the exit row; the flight attendant usually asks us if we understand and are capable of performing the duty of opening the door should it be necessary. Sometimes the gate agent asks us also. It's pretty obvious this woman was not able to do this. She would have been an obstacle if an evacuation would have been necessary. Think about the flight that landed on the Hudson river - how could she possibly have gotten off that plane? I really feel for the person in the window seat.
I am also very concerned when frail-looking elderly folk have exit row seats!
 

Ridewithme38

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NO STATE HAS MADE THE POSESWION OF POT IN ANY AMOUNT LEGAL WITH THE EXCEPTION OF STATES THAT LEGALIZE MEDICAL MARIJUANA. Possession above a certain amount is considered possession with intent to sell. If your imbiing friends were ever caught and arrested they might very well go to jaio particularly if they are black . Read AND JUSTICE FOR SOME BY GLENN GREENWALD and you will see the actual statistics. Some states make possession below a certain amount a disorderly persons offense which cn e penalized with just a fine and or 6 months in jail. These states, and there are very few f them are probaky in conflict with federal law which des not permit such leniency. Many more states have harsh penalties for possession of a small amount. Whether or not you get arrested and sent to jail depends largely on your skin color. There is much written on this topic based upon verifiable statistics instead of anecdotal evidence.
there are states that have 'decriminalized' it up to a certain amount, NY is one of them, 25 grams is the 'decriminalized' level in NY....now don't get me wrong, i know that's not 'legal' but the fines for having it are equal to that of a parking ticket, i think i only paid a couple hundred dollars in high school, but the court case was pretty embarrassing, i was under 18 so the parents had to go to court with me, which with both parents working meant they had to take time off work for it and several friends were also ticketed...NOW, if caught USING, it is a whole different story, that can result in 3 months in prison

While there is Some black/white disparity when dealing with legal cases, i didn't experience that in high school, i was with several kids when we got ticketed, we all lived in the same town, but were from many different ethnic backgrounds...The black or hispanic kids that were with me suffered no more, atleast in that case, then i did....IMO, it's not a skin color thing, but a economic background thing...We were all well spoken, upper Middle class kids from a decent area with no history of legal problems(I was older when i got my first DWI)
 

Passepartout

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Of course it's up there; we're covering some important ground (air?) here.....safety, courtesy, obesity, airline bottom lines, seating, nutrition, measuring..... :)
I cannot think of anything even remotely related to air travel or obesity or any of the above that hasn't been addressed ad nauseum.

PLEASE! Moderators: Put this thread out of it's misery and close it! Enough already when we get down to expounding on marijuana laws. Absolutely no bearing on the subject of the thread.

Jim
 

ace2000

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PLEASE! Moderators: Put this thread out of it's misery and close it! Enough already when we get down to expounding on marijuana laws. Absolutely no bearing on the subject of the thread.

Jim
+1

TUG is better than this! :)
 
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