Newbie needs help with first HGVC resale purchase: Trump International or Grand Islander

[MrC123]

Looking to buy our first TS and have two different options. Both look like good deals relative to other offers but still leery about pulling the trigger on our first TS because it feels like we are always missing something in this complex world. We might use the Islander once or twice (prob never the Trump cuz we don't love Vegas) so primarily buying for the points to use elsewhere and paying cash so no financing needed. Would one of these be the better choice to sell easier next time? Vegas vs Hawaii challenges we might not know about? Thank you. Your help is definitely appreciated!!!

Trump International in Vegas - 2BR Float Platinum Annual
Points: 20,160 annual (No 2022 pts)
Price: $8300 with closing costs paid by seller
MF: $2,057

Grand Islander in Hawaii - 2BR Float Platinum Annual
Points: 23,040 annual (16,000 pts from 2022 included)
Price: $12000 with closing costs by buyer
MF: $2,032

 

[Hobokie]

Hi! I own HGVC and quite enjoy my purchase

Question for you: do you need this many pts?

Positive things I see you're probably considering/are aware of: you're looking at platinum units (you prob understand this is a better MF per pt) and you're only looking at annual pts vs every even or every odd (those memberships have to pay annual club dues every year even though they are only getting pts every other year).

I just checked the MF sticky for HGVC and it looks like the Trump Unit has MF of $2042.87 (a little lower than what you're showing, but not biggie). $2043 / 20,160 is about $0.10 per point. Compare this to the Hawaii property which is about $0.09 per pt. I'll let others comment on whether this is good MF ratio and purchase price since I'm less experienced in that area.

May I ask what drew you to these 2 specific listings?

 

[CalGalTraveler]

Welcome to TUG. Congrats on doing your homework.

The MF/pp are good on both of these (GI better). However this is your first purchase and you have a lot to learn.

I am assuming that you are buying these to trade so MF/pp matter. If you are buying to use the home week, suggest you buy where you want to go e.g. Lagoon, South Carolina summer weeks.

My main concern is exit especially since this is your first purchase. IMHO...I am partial to the more liquid resales with reasonable MF, and lower buy-in cost resulting in faster resale exit if you decide you want to sell. These are the 11,200+ HGVC Vegas (Blvd, Paradise, Elara) and any size Scotland where you can buy direct from HGVC office in Scotland. But that may be just me so take this advice with a grain of salt.

1) None of these are HGVC resorts so if you later wanted to qualify for MAX, they cannot trade in or deedback either of these units. You may not care but this is a consideration.

2) Is GI still under development sales? Some developers artificially lower their MF when selling to attract buyers with a subsidy? Check the most recent HOA docs for developer subsidies.

3) Buyers must come up with cash to buy these as they cannot be financed. The higher the cost, the more money people need to scrape up the smaller your buying audience. The lower the cost, the larger the buying pool who can afford.

Where do you want to travel? Stick around TUG and we can help you more.

 

[Hobokie]

100% agree with @CalGalTraveler ... exit strategy is a must and the name alone of your option 1 could prove problematic...

Didn't know about @CalGalTraveler point #2 (artificially lower MF while still under development sales, good to know!)

Regarding point #1 (MAX program), I haven't seen anyone here on TUG feel strongly on it? But it's a good call out in case our newbie wants to research.

@MrC123 maybe walk us through your logic on how you are picking these so we can point out relevant considerations?

Welcome to TUG! Stick around and consider subscribing!

 

[SmithOp]

I would go with #2, but that's just me...I own the same number of points at KingsLand, about the same maint fee, and I paid $13k.

You may never stay in the home unit because you can stretch those points for much longer than a week with smaller units in gold season. 23040 (old 14,400 points) has been a great ownership for me on a single contract. I don't anticipate any problems selling it when the time comes for about what I paid.

Sent from my Lenovo 10e using Tapatalk

 

[MrC123]

Welcome to TUG. Congrats on doing your homework.

The MF/pp are good on both of these (GI better). However this is your first purchase and you have a lot to learn.

I am assuming that you are buying these to trade so MF/pp matter. If you are buying to use the home week, suggest you buy where you want to go e.g. Lagoon, South Carolina summer weeks.

My main concern is exit especially since this is your first purchase. IMHO...I am partial to the more liquid resales with reasonable MF, and lower buy-in cost resulting in faster resale exit if you decide you want to sell. These are the 11,200+ HGVC Vegas (Blvd, Paradise, Elara) and any size Scotland where you can buy direct from HGVC office in Scotland. But that may be just me so take this advice with a grain of salt.

1) None of these are HGVC resorts so if you later wanted to qualify for MAX, they cannot trade in or deedback either of these units. You may not care but this is a consideration.

2) Is GI still under development sales? Some developers artificially lower their MF when selling to attract buyers with a subsidy? Check the most recent HOA docs for developer subsidies.

3) Buyers must come up with cash to buy these as they cannot be financed. The higher the cost, the more money people need to scrape up the smaller your buying audience. The lower the cost, the larger the buying pool who can afford.

Where do you want to travel? Stick around TUG and we can help you more.

Man, I thought we did decent homework and then you presented these deep thoughts, lol. Thank you for stretching our minds as there always seem to be more to consider. We do want to see Hawaii so leaning that route but also considered the 11,200 Vegas idea just to get into the game.

 

[MrC123]

100% agree with @CalGalTraveler ... exit strategy is a must and the name alone of your option 1 could prove problematic...

Didn't know about @CalGalTraveler point #2 (artificially lower MF while still under development sales, good to know!)

Regarding point #1 (MAX program), I haven't seen anyone here on TUG feel strongly on it? But it's a good call out in case our newbie wants to research.

@MrC123 maybe walk us through your logic on how you are picking these so we can point out relevant considerations?

Welcome to TUG! Stick around and consider subscribing!

Thanks, Hobokie. On many of the forums, it seems people are selling their early TS that has too few points and upgrading to larger point packages. We like efficiency so

Welcome to TUG. Congrats on doing your homework.

The MF/pp are good on both of these (GI better). However this is your first purchase and you have a lot to learn.

I am assuming that you are buying these to trade so MF/pp matter. If you are buying to use the home week, suggest you buy where you want to go e.g. Lagoon, South Carolina summer weeks.

My main concern is exit especially since this is your first purchase. IMHO...I am partial to the more liquid resales with reasonable MF, and lower buy-in cost resulting in faster resale exit if you decide you want to sell. These are the 11,200+ HGVC Vegas (Blvd, Paradise, Elara) and any size Scotland where you can buy direct from HGVC office in Scotland. But that may be just me so take this advice with a grain of salt.

1) None of these are HGVC resorts so if you later wanted to qualify for MAX, they cannot trade in or deedback either of these units. You may not care but this is a consideration.

2) Is GI still under development sales? Some developers artificially lower their MF when selling to attract buyers with a subsidy? Check the most recent HOA docs for developer subsidies.

3) Buyers must come up with cash to buy these as they cannot be financed. The higher the cost, the more money people need to scrape up the smaller your buying audience. The lower the cost, the larger the buying pool who can afford.

Where do you want to travel? Stick around TUG and we can help you more.

Rereading your post and you said GI isn't an HGVC resort. Can you clarify this because we thought it was based on how it is listed on the HGVC site (pic attached). Not that we are dying to get to Max but would like to keep options open. Really appreciate your insights so we get this right the first time out! Thanks again.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

@MrC123 It is great you are asking the questions now so you are not surprised. I have been at this game for almost 8 years and I am still learning (but glad we own as we have had great vacations). Some things you will only learn as an owner by using the system so getting in the game with a decent trader with sufficient points - at least 11,200 will teach you a lot. And if it is too much or too little you can sell it for close to what you paid resale.

You are wise to not buy too few points. Yes people make it work. I have heard many say they bought too few points and have to dispose and buy something new. I not heard anyone say that 11,200 (old 7000) points was too many. Check out the points sticky on this forum. If you want to visit Hawaii you will need more points as many units are higher than 11,200 and you would need to borrow from future years. If you only need 1 bdrms or studios during high season or travel during shoulder or low season for 2 bdrms you should be fine.

I would also be concerned about buying GI right now because they have been finding cases of Legionnaires in the building. This may involve expensive renovations to the cooling system and airducts which may result in a future assessment for the owners to pay for it. Approach this as not only a vacation buyer but with the lens of a real estate buyer.

How to know if it is an HGVC owned property? Ask here and Tuggers can tell you. Anything that says Affiliates will also not qualify.

Good luck. Keep asking questions. TUG is like grad school for TS. Many knowledgable people here. Sign up for a membership for $15 to pay it back (I don't receive any of it.) It will be the best $15 you ever spent for making the right TS decision.

 

[Nowaker]

11,200 pts Las Vegas deeds are easier to acquire and easier to sell in the future. I'd suggest looking at LV Boulevard (some listings name it as "on the Strip") in 2 BR Platinum, as well as Elara and Paradise.

Higher point deeds at Trump are good in MFpp terms but higher points means higher cost, that is, harder to sell in the future.

That's one of the factors to consider. But if you see yourself using HGVC for a long time, then maybe you can ignore this factor altogether.

Have you stayed at HGVC before? I'd suggest purchasing their promotional package first (like $100-$200 for 3 nights, presentation required) and try out. Then reject a sale but buy the VIP package - 11,000-ish points (capped at 7 nights) for $1800 - which will give you a way get a real feel of HGVC.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

BTW...I am not sure, can Elara be traded in for Max upgrades? I know Blvd and Paradise can. With Elara you also must be careful not to get a Westgate deed. It can be confusing because they are still called HGVC because they manage the entire property. Only when you see the estoppel can you be sure.

As a first timer, you may want to consider working with a broker to help guide you through this. It will cost more than Ebay but will avoid getting scammed by an Ebay provider (there are good ones too) or not buying what you need. It's a bit dizzying at first but may be worth it.

 

[SmithOp]

If you want Hawaii the higher point contracts are better imo. When I go we stay at least two weeks if I'm paying to fly there.

If you put together two Vegas deeds you pay two sets of closing fees.

I don't agree it's harder to sell higher points people are always looking to upgrade, there are buyers.

Sent from my SM-G970U using Tapatalk

 

[Nowaker]

With Elara you also must be careful not to get a Westgate deed.

Good point. As long as the estoppel discloses points, it's not a Westgate deed. If it mentions a specific week or half-week, it's Westgate.

 

[MrC123]

@MrC123 It is great you are asking the questions now so you are not surprised. I have been at this game for almost 8 years and I am still learning (but glad we own as we have had great vacations). Some things you will only learn as an owner by using the system so getting in the game with a decent trader with sufficient points - at least 11,200 will teach you a lot. And if it is too much or too little you can sell it for close to what you paid resale.

You are wise to not buy too few points. Yes people make it work. I have heard many say they bought too few points and have to dispose and buy something new. I not heard anyone say that 11,200 (old 7000) points was too many. Check out the points sticky on this forum. If you want to visit Hawaii you will need more points as many units are higher than 11,200 and you would need to borrow from future years. If you only need 1 bdrms or studios during high season or travel during shoulder or low season for 2 bdrms you should be fine.

I would also be concerned about buying GI right now because they have been finding cases of Legionnaires in the building. This may involve expensive renovations to the cooling system and airducts which may result in a future assessment for the owners to pay for it. Approach this as not only a vacation buyer but with the lens of a real estate buyer.

How to know if it is an HGVC owned property? Ask here and Tuggers can tell you. Anything that says Affiliates will also not qualify.

Good luck. Keep asking questions. TUG is like grad school for TS. Many knowledgable people here. Sign up for a membership for $15 to pay it back (I don't receive any of it.) It will be the best $15 you ever spent for making the right TS decision.

Wow, thank you so much for sharing. DId some searching and GI has had 5 cases of Legionnaires in the last year and just last month was the most recent.

 

[Nowaker]

I not heard anyone say that 11,200 (old 7000) points was too many.

Haha. Look at me! Just back in October/November I was contemplating (new) 11,200 vs 8,000. Come January I was sitting at 33,040, and I got another 11,200 in February, for a total of 44,240. And I have another 8,000 lined up from a TUGer, as it seems 50k is a sweetspot for my family.

 

[Rockinit]

Looking to buy our first TS and have two different options. Both look like good deals relative to other offers but still leery about pulling the trigger on our first TS because it feels like we are always missing something in this complex world. We might use the Islander once or twice (prob never the Trump cuz we don't love Vegas) so primarily buying for the points to use elsewhere and paying cash so no financing needed. Would one of these be the better choice to sell easier next time? Vegas vs Hawaii challenges we might not know about? Thank you. Your help is definitely appreciated!!!

Trump International in Vegas - 2BR Float Platinum Annual
Points: 20,160 annual (No 2022 pts)
Price: $8300 with closing costs paid by seller
MF: $2,057

Grand Islander in Hawaii - 2BR Float Platinum Annual
Points: 23,040 annual (16,000 pts from 2022 included)
Price: $12000 with closing costs by buyer
MF: $2,032

It seems you got a lot more responses in the FB group. Remember to post your final outcome.