• Welcome to the FREE TUGBBS forums! The absolute best place for owners to get help and advice about their timeshares for more than 32 years!

    Join Tens of Thousands of other owners just like you here to get any and all Timeshare questions answered 24 hours a day!
  • TUG started 32 years ago in October 1993 as a group of regular Timeshare owners just like you!

    Read about our 32nd anniversary: Happy 32nd Birthday TUG!
  • TUG has a YouTube Channel to produce weekly short informative videos on popular Timeshare topics!

    All subscribers auto-entered to win all free TUG membership giveaways!

    Visit TUG on Youtube!
  • TUG has now saved timeshare owners more than $24,000,000 dollars just by finding us in time to rescind a new Timeshare purchase! A truly incredible milestone!

    Read more here: TUG saves owners more than $24 Million dollars
  • Wish you could meet up with other TUG members? Well look no further as this annual event has been going on for years in Orlando! How to Attend the TUG January Get-Together!
  • Now through the end of the year you can join or renew your TUG membership at the lowest price ever offered! Learn More!
  • Sign up to get the TUG Newsletter for free!

    Tens of thousands of subscribing owners! A weekly recap of the best Timeshare resort reviews and the most popular topics discussed by owners!
  • Our official "end my sales presentation early" T-shirts are available again! Also come with the option for a free membership extension with purchase to offset the cost!

    All T-shirt options here!
  • A few of the most common links here on the forums for newbies and guests!

New Marriott Vacation Club Ownership levels announced

It’s high ~1.30 or so.
Ouch, I bet sales pass over the small matter of the maint fee increases when extolling the virtues of being able to book luxury properties at 13 months ahead. :hug
Enrolled weeks ownership is still looking like a winner, with Vistana mandatory resale pre Aug 2022 chairman chomping on the heals of Reserve and Pinnacle owners.
 
Seems like the inventory shenanigans are getting worse over time...

It used to be that I couldn't get a Saturday checkin at 14-15 months out. Now at 13 months + 3 weeks I'm being told no Friday, Saturday or Sunday remaining. As usual when I ask how it that possible, I'm being told "owners" with more weeks than me already got that inventory. Presumably the trust is the largest owner of them all and just books everything consecutively and concurrently...
 
Seems like the inventory shenanigans are getting worse over time...

It used to be that I couldn't get a Saturday checkin at 14-15 months out. Now at 13 months + 3 weeks I'm being told no Friday, Saturday or Sunday remaining. As usual when I ask how it that possible, I'm being told "owners" with more weeks than me already got that inventory. Presumably the trust is the largest owner of them all and just books everything consecutively and concurrently...
14-15 months ahead? I thought 13 months was the furthest out anyone could book. Since when can you book 14-15 months ahead (notwithstanding the new owner benefit levels, which I don’t think are actually implemented yet)?

Of course I agree that the trust probably books whatever it wants before any “real” owners get a shot at anything.
 
14-15 months ahead? I thought 13 months was the furthest out anyone could book. Since when can you book 14-15 months ahead (notwithstanding the new owner benefit levels, which I don’t think are actually implemented yet)?

If you have 2+ weeks you can book consecutively… so imagine booking 5 weeks in a row, only to be told on a #6 that there’s no Saturday left. Or worse - “nothing left.”


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
IMO, the biggest issue with MVC bookings is the lack of a home resort priority window. Like DVC's setup where home resort can book at 11 months and everyone else at 7 months.
 
Seems like the inventory shenanigans are getting worse over time...

It used to be that I couldn't get a Saturday checkin at 14-15 months out. Now at 13 months + 3 weeks I'm being told no Friday, Saturday or Sunday remaining. As usual when I ask how it that possible, I'm being told "owners" with more weeks than me already got that inventory. Presumably the trust is the largest owner of them all and just books everything consecutively and concurrently...
What resort is this ? That’s ridiculous .
 
NCV


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

So what's your story? You own six consecutive weeks and you're trying to book a block of 6 weeks?
 
14-15 months ahead? I thought 13 months was the furthest out anyone could book. Since when can you book 14-15 months ahead (notwithstanding the new owner benefit levels, which I don’t think are actually implemented yet)?

Of course I agree that the trust probably books whatever it wants before any “real” owners get a shot at anything.
Weeks reservation system, and inventory, is different from points reservation system. There are people and places that book months long chains of weeks this way, and you can go across resorts with it, as long as you own in seasons that allow you to meet the consecutive/concurrent requirements.

Now and then you see inventory in II that people have deposited because its a shoulder season that they don't want to use, but was part of a chain to get the weeks they actually did want.
 
I always see availability in abound even in the summer makes me wonder if these weeks/point buckets are indeed separate.

And that’s the complaint. I can book any day at my home resort using points, but I can’t book my home week because there’s no inventory for weeks users.
 
So what's your story? You own six consecutive weeks and you're trying to book a block of 6 weeks?

Weeks reservation system, and inventory, is different from points reservation system.

The bigger point I'm relating to is that those who claim that the points program also decimated the weeks program seem to have a good case.

Thinking of weeks and points as "separate inventory buckets" may be ok when it comes to you or I booking weeks or points. But the trust itself is the biggest weeks owner and after 16 years we still have no idea when and how it secures inventory for its "home resorts". Pre 2010 I never had a problem getting Saturday checkins at 13 months out, even with fewer weeks; that issue started after 2010 and has absolutely gotten worse over time. And having both Saturdays and Sundays blocked and even no checkin days at all available at ~14 months out is relatively recent. Given that 50% of inventory is supposed to be released at 13 months out makes it hard for me to buy their story that hordes of multi-week owners are grabbing all that inventory like clockwork. But I can think one one very large multi-week owner (the Trust)...

As an example, if the trust has 600 Platinum weeks at a resort and the Platinum season at that resort spans 30 weeks, does the Trust get to book 20 reservations for each of the 30 weeks in the season? Does it split those reservations among the 3-4 possible checkin days, some more popular than others? Or does it get to determine what are the 6 most popular weeks in the platinum season and grab 100 reservations for each of those weeks all using the most popular checkin day/s (and it can do that very far in advance as a multi-week owner at multiple resorts booking consecutively/concurrently)? Because the latter option will break whatever is left of the weeks reservation system very fast...
 
Last edited:
As an example, if the trust has 600 Platinum weeks at a resort and the Platinum season at that resort spans 30 weeks, does the Trust get to book 20 reservations for each of the 30 weeks in the season? Does it split those reservations among the 3-4 possible checkin days, some more popular than others? Or does it get to determine what are the 5 most popular weeks in the platinum season and grab 120 reservations for each of those weeks all using the most popular checkin day/s (and it can do that very far in advance too as a multi-week owner booking consecutively/concurrently)? Because the latter option will break whatever is left of the weeks reservation system very fast...
Yes, and the same lack of visibility applies to the weeks reservation system and their own rental business and II. They generate modelling, which we don't see, and then load inventory accordingly and then shuffle if they appear to be getting it badly wrong at a system level. MVC don't know what week owners are going to want to reserve in the floating weeks system and it could vary according to whether the intent is to book and use, book and rent or book and deposit to II. Same for what they use of their owned weeks or points for sales and marketing packages and promotions, its all guessing.

An interesting effect is the rather significant changes in TDI for many locations, which means many of the "usual" weeks that owners would reserve to get the optimum TDI for deposit have changed, so that's going to mess up the modelling as people, like me, cancel what was reserved and then wait for a different date.

Then there's the effect of owners getting more savvy at getting what they want through any of the reservation channels, its a competitive environment where other individual owners with better knowledge or motivation can cause other owners to not get what they are used to getting.

I am still surprised how much decent inventory goes into II that appears to be bulk loads, when there is apparent demand for it via the points system. Aruba comes to mind specifically, as it is reportedly difficult to get via Abound but relatively straightforward via II.
 
How much has increased rental weeks on Redweek etc affected the lack of inventory? It's not uncommon to have people be unable to book a week at 12/13 month and then quickly see those exact weeks on Redweek. The issues are not solely MVC being devious to max their rental income, but also owners jumping in early and owning many weeks just so they can rent those out. Has the crack down on commercial renting been only lip service? I'm assuming yes seeing that sales are still pushing to buy more points so you can rent.
 
How much has increased rental weeks on Redweek etc affected the lack of inventory? It's not uncommon to have people be unable to book a week at 12/13 month and then quickly see those exact weeks on Redweek. The issues are not solely MVC being devious to max their rental income, but also owners jumping in early and owning many weeks just so they can rent those out. Has the crack down on commercial renting been only lip service? I'm assuming yes seeing that sales are still pushing to buy more points so you can rent.
There are 76 rentals on redweek in June, 152 in July and 170 in August 2026. That is crazy!! You see the same for Aruba during peak season.
 
IMO, the biggest issue with MVC bookings is the lack of a home resort priority window. Like DVC's setup where home resort can book at 11 months and everyone else at 7 months.
There is no such thing as a home resort with points in MVC. The points you are buying are not tied to a specific resort.
You can book your week at 12 months (or 13 months+ if multiple week)
 
There is no such thing as a home resort with points in MVC. The points you are buying are not tied to a specific resort.
You can book your week at 12 months (or 13 months+ if multiple week)
Yes, I know that. But that IMO is part of the problem.
 
Reading this thread gives a lot of value of owning at a Resort that has fixed weeks (such as Marriott's Monarch on Hilton Head). Many of their weeks are not only fixed weeks but also fixed Villa locations. It should be noted that some of their Villas do float for those who want to go through the 12 & 13 month weeks reservation routine every year.


















.
 
IMO, the biggest issue with MVC bookings is the lack of a home resort priority window. Like DVC's setup where home resort can book at 11 months and everyone else at 7 months.
There is no such thing as a home resort with points in MVC. The points you are buying are not tied to a specific resort.
You can book your week at 12 months (or 13 months+ if multiple week)

Well yes...which is why Abound Points are so much more annoying to own (at least from a booking perspective) than DVC, HGVC, Vistana, or even MVC Weeks + Interval Interational.

All the other systems allow you to buy where you most want to stay, have a good to great chance of getting the villa/dates you want, and then exchange or trade into other resorts when you wish (understanding that owners have priority).
 
All the other systems allow you to buy where you most want to stay, have a good to great chance of getting the villa/dates you want, and then exchange or trade into other resorts when you wish (understanding that owners have priority).
... and another win for enrolled MVC weeks with a side nod to Vistana mandatory resale pre Aug 2022 :cool:
 
The enrolled weeks at a property I am studying get less points for enrolling them than are required to book them with points; I think this might be a stupid question, but is that what this forum is referring to when you talk about MVW skimming week owners?
 
The enrolled weeks at a property I am studying get less points for enrolling them than are required to book them with points; I think this might be a stupid question, but is that what this forum is referring to when you talk about MVW skimming week owners?
Every MVC and Vistana week gives fewer points (when you elect Abound points) then it would cost to book that same week with Abound points. That is what people have come to refer to as "the skim."

There are some properties where the Abound points charts vary significantly from week to week, and there may be certain low-demand weeks that might cost fewer points to book than higher-demand weeks in the same season, so I guess it's not fair to say that you'll ALWAYS pay more to book your resort with points, but that's certainly always true for high demand weeks.

If you own a platinum week somewhere but you always travel there during less popular times, you might not really be negatively impacted by the skim. But in the simplest example, if you own someplace like Maui (where there's only one season), you will pretty much always have to spend more points to book a week there than you'd receive for electing a Maui week.
 
Reading public blog's, it appears that for the NEW [Reserve & Pinnacle] Owner Benefit Levels [OBL]:
  • Resale POINTS [even if the $3/Point was paid] will NOT be considered when calculating NEW OBL's
  • Resale WEEKS purchased [VSN/MVCI] post cutoff-date are assumed to NOT count toward OBL.
  • Resale WEEKS purchased as part of a Hybrid-Bundle [directly from MVW] may count toward OBL.
Since qualifying for the NEW OBL's are being treated differently from the existing levels:
Questions [will the following be treated like Resale-Points for the NEW OBL's]
  • What about Resale WEEKS [VSN/MVW] purchased and Enrolled post cutoff?
  • What about Resale WEEKS [VSN/MVW] purchased and Enrolled pre cutoff and grandfathered in?
  • What about Resale WEEKS [VSN Mandatory: Accrue Star-Options] that were purchased pre cutoff and Enrolled?
  • What about Resale WEEKS [VSN Mandatory: Accrue Star-Options] that were purchased pre cutoff but NEVER Enrolled and grandfathered in?

1779948079332.png
 
Last edited:
"I am still surprised how much decent inventory goes into II that appears to be bulk loads, when there is apparent demand for it via the points system. Aruba comes to mind specifically, as it is reportedly difficult to get via Abound but relatively straightforward via II."

Remember, MVW can only knock on the same owner’s door, so many times. At some point, MVW may conclude that an existing owner is not going to buy anymore, however, MVW will keep trying, and, now, in a new, Diamond-esque environment, MVW will try one (they think) creative shenanigan after another, to get an existing owner to buy more.

I will admit to some degree of direct naiveté, as we have not attended a sales presentation, or, as the deceptive crooks at MVW call it, an “Owner Update,” in at least 25 years. My limited experience with these things, is what we hear, or what I read.

To my point, MVW has an incentive to drop bulk developer inventory into the I.I. exchange and getaway buckets. I can’t speak to how much inventory makes it out of the 21 day MVW Hold stable, but, I surmise, that MVW drops bulk developer inventory into the I.I. exchange and getaway buckets, for the sole purpose of soliciting new/non-MVW clients, while they are on vacation, representing a subset of vacationers that MVW has not churned and churned, to the point of no return. These non-MVW owners are a captive audience for MVW sales, while they are on vacation; as MVW puts it, they are “in the ether (as in anesthetic gas)" when they are on vacation; this is the perfect mix of a non-MVW owner, and a client “in the ether” for MVW to get in for the “sales kill,” while they are on vacation. And, in my opinion, the playing field has changed, where MVCI may have had some sales integrity, 20 or so years ago, all stops are off, and I expect these Diamond-esque creatures to introduce new levels of iconic, Diamond Resorts, guerrilla, sale and marketing techniques at MVW resorts.
 
Reading public blog's, it appears that for the NEW [Reserve & Pinnacle] Owner Benefit Levels [OBL]:

I'm not going to believe anything that people interpret on this until we either see the FAQs updated to reflect this or real workd experience that isn't sales lying to people. Remembering that sales have spend over 15 years lying to MVC weeks owners that they had to make a purchase to be able to enroll their eligible weeks, when it could be done for free.

Here is the actual note. As you would expect its nice and wide open, so can be interpreted in any range of ways that suits whoever is interpreting it. The ONLY example it gives seems to be the one relating to an MVC direct purchase that enrolls and MVC resale purchase.

1779949736677.png
 
Top