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NEW Developer Price Lists - Sept. 2008

DeniseM

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LisaRex

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Great resource, Denise. Thanks!

FYI, I traded in SVN for a two bedroom loft at the end of January. The rep told me it was 148,100 StarOptions, and my account info on MyStarCentral confirms this. However, all the 2 bdrm lofts on the attached documents are listed as 129,800k StarOptions.

Should i call and ask?
 

tlpnet

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I noticed the same thing on several of the properties here also. It seems that these price lists do not reflect the adjustment of the SO's for 2009. I would use the SO chart available on MSC instead of the SO's listed here.

-tim
 

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Thanks for posting the update!! I really, really appreciate having all this at my fingertips. :) Katherine
 

ctscribe

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Pardon my ignorance, but do people really pay 7k to 100k for one week's use? Unbelievable. Or evem two weeks with lock off.

Just hard to adjust to the thought of that kind of disposable income.


Dave:eek:
 

ctscribe

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OK I just figured it out the annual is the use not cost per year. DOH!:crash:
 
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DeniseM

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OK I just figured it out the annual is the use not cost per year. DOH!:crash:

It's the upfront purchase price - the price of buying the deed for the week - the Maintenance Fee is the yearly cost - but $100K is still ridiculous! Especially when you can pay less than half that on the resale market!
 

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It's the upfront purchase price - the price of buying the deed for the week - the Maintenance Fee is the yearly cost - but $100K is still ridiculous! Especially when you can pay less than half that on the resale market!
Dear Denise, I'm a new member! I've been reading through a lot of interesting topics on this forum to determine if I'm going down the wrong path in terms of my decision to buy from a developer (Westin). I'm an Australian and as much as I love going to Hawaii I don't think we would do it every year or even every other year. What attracted me to Westin apart from the quality of their properties is the option to convert options to Starwood SPG points, which allows me to stay in hotels around the world. Based on some of your comments and other members, buying from the developer seems to be a really bad idea. The only problem is that unless I buy from the developer I cannot covert to Starwood points and take advantage of staying in their hotels in Asia, Europe and the rest of the world. But....I think I read in one of the forums the conversion to Starwood SPG points does not buy you much and therefore this perk is pretty useless. I'm looking at spending USD$55K which I think is expensive for the Westin Princeville Ocean Resort Villas given that there are almost no Ocean views. I would really appreciate your thoughts....this includes all other members! Thank you! :wave:
 

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Desert Willows Plat *, Gold * and Gold...not Plat, Gold and Silver?

Thank you Denise for getting this together.

Anyone know the change in name designation withe the Westin Desert Willows?

Looks like used to be (Jan 2008) Platinum, Gold and Silver seasons.

Now (Sept 2008) Platinum *, Gold *, and Gold

(Weeks in each season correspond to previous weeks. i.e. old Silver 28-36 and now Gold 28-36. Prices same as well.)
 

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Dsutacha, I believe that the MFs for WPORV are hovering around $2200 USD* now. The StarOption->StarPoint conversion on a 2 bdrm platinum unit is 88,000 StarPoints. That means each StarPoint is costing you 2.5 cents even before adding in the $55k initial outlay. You can buy StarPoints outright on the SPG website for 3.5 cents each.

Personally, I think buying TSs only makes sense if you want to stay in TSs. A few people have made a career out of renting them and even realizing small gains, but they are anomolies. I'd advise anyone who couldn't travel at least every other year to not buy a TS at all, and most certainly not from the developer! The special assessments, the increasing MFs, the limitations of the programs are just not worth it. The perks that come with buying from the developer are merely icing on the cake. The TS is the cake. And it doesn't make sense to pay for the cake if you only want the icing.

Okay, I'm getting hungry now.

Consider this:

  • You can buy StarPoints outright at SPG.com for 3.5 cents each (I'm assuming folks in Australia can buy them, too), though admittedly there is a limit of 40,000 per calendar year per person. At that price, $55,000 would buy 1,571,428 StarPoints.
  • There are EOY resales at WPORV listed right now for $15k and annual resales listed for $30k. That gives you a sense of how much they depreciate on the open market.
  • Living in Australia, you're very limited to where you can travel within in the SVN network. Certainly you wouldn't travel half way around the world to stay in the Bahamas or St. John for a week. So SVN wouldn't be of much use to you at all. And using SVN to trade UP is the only reason I'd even consider buying from the developer.
  • Starwood is consistently offering sales to WPORV. And there are many rentals for WPORV, which will ultimately cost you far, far less than $55,000 + $2200/year in MFs.
  • Currently trading into most weeks at WPORV is easy. You could buy any EOY mandatory resort, with far less MFs, and simply trade into Hawaii if you plan ahead and call at 8 months out.

*I have no idea what the exchange rate is and what $1 AUS will buy.
 
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clsmit

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Great resource, Denise. Thanks!

FYI, I traded in SVN for a two bedroom loft at the end of January. The rep told me it was 148,100 StarOptions, and my account info on MyStarCentral confirms this. However, all the 2 bdrm lofts on the attached documents are listed as 129,800k StarOptions.

Should i call and ask?
Could it be that it costs more options to trade into the unit than you get to trade out? Isn't that what is going on with SVR? (Owners only getting 76K SO for their unit but it's 81.1K SO to trade in)

Not logical, but possible!
 

LisaRex

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Could it be that it costs more options to trade into the unit than you get to trade out? Isn't that what is going on with SVR? (Owners only getting 76K SO for their unit but it's 81.1K SO to trade in)

Not logical, but possible!
With Starwood anything is possible, but it sure makes it confusing. :)
 

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Dear Lisa,

Thank you very much for your response! What you said makes total sense to me and it actually matches the calculations that I did last night based on actual rates at hotels. If I divide the initial outlay of US55,000/AUD80,000 over 30 years, it is costing me together with the MF's a total of AUD$5,700 per annum. I called Starwood yesterday and to stay in London and Paris for 10 days it will cost me AUD$4,200 which gets me the same hotel that I can get for 96,000 Starwood points. Which means that the 86,400 for which I'm paying AUD$5,700 are not enough to get this rooms on points. I would have to top up in cash at an additional cost of AUD$480. In total under this program I'm paying AUD$6,180 for AUD$4,200 worth of real value based on today’s actual rates. The properties I picked were middle of the roar requiring only 12,000 points in low season. High season category 6 hotels are 25,000 points in high season! The Westin sales people made us believe that Hawaii was the most expensive and would therefore get us more nights in other countries including Europe. This may apply to other timeshares but definitely not hotels. I know what to do now….Thank you again! Have a wonderful Christmas and a Safe, Happy and Prosperous New Year! :)




Dsutacha, I believe that the MFs for WPORV are hovering around $2200 USD* now. The StarOption->StarPoint conversion on a 2 bdrm platinum unit is 88,000 StarPoints. That means each StarPoint is costing you 2.5 cents even before adding in the $55k initial outlay. You can buy StarPoints outright on the SPG website for 3.5 cents each.

Personally, I think buying TSs only makes sense if you want to stay in TSs. A few people have made a career out of renting them and even realizing small gains, but they are anomolies. I'd advise anyone who couldn't travel at least every other year to not buy a TS at all, and most certainly not from the developer! The special assessments, the increasing MFs, the limitations of the programs are just not worth it. The perks that come with buying from the developer are merely icing on the cake. The TS is the cake. And it doesn't make sense to pay for the cake if you only want the icing.

Okay, I'm getting hungry now.

Consider this:

  • You can buy StarPoints outright at SPG.com for 3.5 cents each (I'm assuming folks in Australia can buy them, too), though admittedly there is a limit of 40,000 per calendar year per person. At that price, $55,000 would buy 1,571,428 StarPoints.
  • There are EOY resales at WPORV listed right now for $15k and annual resales listed for $30k. That gives you a sense of how much they depreciate on the open market.
  • Living in Australia, you're very limited to where you can travel within in the SVN network. Certainly you wouldn't travel half way around the world to stay in the Bahamas or St. John for a week. So SVN wouldn't be of much use to you at all. And using SVN to trade UP is the only reason I'd even consider buying from the developer.
  • Starwood is consistently offering sales to WPORV. And there are many rentals for WPORV, which will ultimately cost you far, far less than $55,000 + $2200/year in MFs.
  • Currently trading into most weeks at WPORV is easy. You could buy any EOY mandatory resort, with far less MFs, and simply trade into Hawaii if you plan ahead and call at 8 months out.

*I have no idea what the exchange rate is and what $1 AUS will buy.
 

DeniseM

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I know what to do now….Thank you again! Have a wonderful Christmas and a Safe, Happy and Prosperous New Year! :)
Hey, you can't leave us hanging like that! :D We all want to know what your are going to do? ;)
 

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Dear Denise, You'll be happy to know that I have decided to cancel my purchase with the developer (I'm still within the cancellation period) and will instead look for one in the resale market. Most likely a Maui property in Hawaii! Only because I've been there many times and I love the place and would go back in a heart beat!:banana: Westin properties are still my first choice, so if you have any suggestions I'm all ears! Thanks to the members advise on this forum I think I’m making the right decision. Keep it going…it’s a good thing that you’re doing for your fellow timeshare users….hoping to become one soon. Merry Christmas and a Happy, Safe and Prosperous New Year to All from Down Under!:wave:


Hey, you can't leave us hanging like that! :D We all want to know what your are going to do? ;)
 

LisaRex

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I called Starwood yesterday and to stay in London and Paris for 10 days it will cost me AUD$4,200 which gets me the same hotel that I can get for 96,000 Starwood points.
Remember, too, that if you pay cash, you also earn StarPoints on stays. You don't earn them when you use points to stay.

If Starwood offers Australians a branded credit card, I'd strongly advise signing up for that if you haven't already. The Starwood AMEX here in the States earns 1:1 points for every dollar charged on it, plus double points for each dollar spent on Starwood properties (in addition to what you already earn as an SPG member). So just paying your MFs on it each year will earn you nearly 4,000 StarPoints each year.

For buying timeshares, my personal favorite sites are MyResortNetwork and SellmyTimeshareNow. And of course, FredM and James1975NY are resale brokers who'd surely appreciate your business. It's a buyer's market now, so I'm sure you'll find a fabulous deal. And then you can use all that money you saved to spur on the Maui economy!
 

nodge

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I'm an Australian . . .
Remember, for the best chance of reserving a top resort and/or top view, you need to call SVO in Orlando, Florida right when it opens at 9 a.m. (U.S. Eastern Time Zone, the same time zone as New York City) either 12 months out (if booking your home resort during your owned season) or 8 months out (if booking into another SVO resort using StarOptions or your home resort during a non-owned season).

With you being in Australia and all, and both areas having their own versions of daylight savings time (complete with different dates when they switch) you’ll need to regularly consult this handy-dandy time zone converter to help you figure out what time you’ll need to call SVO on your end.

I just used the converter to find out what time you’d have to have called SVO on your end to have reached them at 9 a.m. today (Thursday, December 19) their time. Here are the results:

Australian Capital Territory – Canberra : Friday at 1 a.m.
Australia – New South Wales – Sydney: Friday at 1 a.m.
Australian Northern Territory – Darwin: Thursday at 11:30 p.m.
Australia – Queensland – Brisbane: Midnight (between Thursday/Friday)
Australia – South Australia- Adelaide: Friday at 12:30 a.m.
Australia – Victoria – Melbourne: Friday at 1 a.m.
Australia – Western Australia – Perth: Thursday at 11 p.m.

Of course, if you called them today, you’d get a recording (like the one I got) that says they are shut down today for a holiday party, but please call back at 4 p.m. today when they all get back from their party. (Funny, I don’t remember reading anything about this shut-down on mystarcentral.com, the owner website designed to disseminate information like this to us owners.}

So you’d have to use the time zone converter again to find out when to call back so that someone there will actually pick-up the phone. Here are the results:

Australian Capital Territory – Canberra : Friday at 8 a.m.
Australia – New South Wales – Sydney: Friday at 8 a.m.
Australian Northern Territory – Darwin: Friday at 6:30 a.m.
Australia – Queensland – Brisbane: Friday at 7:00 a.m.
Australia – South Australia - Adelaide: Friday at 7:30 a.m.
Australia – Victoria – Melbourne: Friday at 8 a.m.
Australia – Western Australia – Perth: Friday at 6 a.m.

As an added bonus, if the desired week/resort you want isn’t available, you can do the whole thing over the next day/night with hopes of getting what you want when the next day of availability opens up at your desired resort.

Of course, there are better booking solutions available, like say . . . on-line owner availability checking and booking that Hilton and Hyatt timeshare owners all have . . . .but SVO would rather make you work for your vacation by forcing you to call someplace half-way around the world at God-awful times of the day and night.

I would think that this availability tracking/booking issue would make any SVO property purchase by someone so far away from the Orlando mothership think twice before buying into the SVO family of properties. At a very minimum, understand that your villa view/location in Maui will be significantly compromised if you are unwilling or unable to regularly make these odd hour reservations calls.

Good Luck,
-nodge
 
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Dear Lisa, I'm not sure if there is a Starwood Amex available in Australia but it will be one of the things I have to check over the next couple of weeks. Also, thank you for the timeshare sites.....it will come in very handy....what's your view eBay...there's one going cheap...around $6K for a 2-bedroom, EOY, Ocean view. Regards, Diego.

Remember, too, that if you pay cash, you also earn StarPoints on stays. You don't earn them when you use points to stay.

If Starwood offers Australians a branded credit card, I'd strongly advise signing up for that if you haven't already. The Starwood AMEX here in the States earns 1:1 points for every dollar charged on it, plus double points for each dollar spent on Starwood properties (in addition to what you already earn as an SPG member). So just paying your MFs on it each year will earn you nearly 4,000 StarPoints each year.

For buying timeshares, my personal favorite sites are MyResortNetwork and SellmyTimeshareNow. And of course, FredM and James1975NY are resale brokers who'd surely appreciate your business. It's a buyer's market now, so I'm sure you'll find a fabulous deal. And then you can use all that money you saved to spur on the Maui economy!
 

Dsutacha777

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Hi Nodge, Over the last 10 years I've worked for two North American companies so I'm pretty familiar with the time difference issue...which is no fun! On the other hand I don't particularly mind.....unless the booking process is time consuming and difficult. In terms of what program is best....I'm still leaning towards Starwood. In terms of accommodation the beat Hilton hands down. The Hyatt on the other hand is pretty good....need to look into this one! All great advice anyway! and I'm very grateful to you and everyone else for your comments and advice. Regards, Diego (Merry Christmas!)

Remember, for the best chance of reserving a top resort and/or top view, you need to call SVO in Orlando, Florida right when it opens at 9 a.m. (U.S. Eastern Time Zone, the same time zone as New York City) either 12 months out (if booking your home resort during your owned season) or 8 months out (if booking into another SVO resort using StarOptions or your home resort during a non-owned season).

With you being in Australia and all, and both areas having their own versions of daylight savings time (complete with different dates when they switch) you’ll need to regularly consult this handy-dandy time zone converter to help you figure out what time you’ll need to call SVO on your end.

I just used the converter to find out what time you’d have to have called SVO on your end to have reached them at 9 a.m. today (Thursday, December 19) their time. Here are the results:

Australian Capital Territory – Canberra : Friday at 1 a.m.
Australia – New South Wales – Sydney: Friday at 1 a.m.
Australian Northern Territory – Darwin: Thursday at 11:30 p.m.
Australia – Queensland – Brisbane: Midnight (between Thursday/Friday)
Australia – South Australia- Adelaide: Friday at 12:30 a.m.
Australia – Victoria – Melbourne: Friday at 1 a.m.
Australia – Western Australia – Perth: Thursday at 11 p.m.

Of course, if you called them today, you’d get a recording (like the one I got) that says they are shut down today for a holiday party, but please call back at 4 p.m. today when they all get back from their party. (Funny, I don’t remember reading anything about this shut-down on mystarcentral.com, the owner website designed to disseminate information like this to us owners.}

So you’d have to use the time zone converter again to find out when to call back so that someone there will actually pick-up the phone. Here are the results:

Australian Capital Territory – Canberra : Friday at 8 a.m.
Australia – New South Wales – Sydney: Friday at 8 a.m.
Australian Northern Territory – Darwin: Friday at 6:30 a.m.
Australia – Queensland – Brisbane: Friday at 7:00 a.m.
Australia – South Australia - Adelaide: Friday at 7:30 a.m.
Australia – Victoria – Melbourne: Friday at 8 a.m.
Australia – Western Australia – Perth: Friday at 6 a.m.

As an added bonus, if the desired week/resort you want isn’t available, you can do the whole thing over the next day/night with hopes of getting what you want when the next day of availability opens up at your desired resort.

Of course, there are better booking solutions available, like say . . . on-line owner availability checking and booking that Hilton and Hyatt timeshare owners all have . . . .but SVO would rather make you work for your vacation by forcing you to call someplace half-way around the world at God-awful times of the day and night.

I would think that this availability tracking/booking issue would make any SVO property purchase by someone so far away from the Orlando mothership think twice before buying into the SVO family of properties. At a very minimum, understand that your villa view/location in Maui will be significantly compromised if you are unwilling or unable to regularly make these odd hour reservations calls.

Good Luck,
-nodge
 

LisaRex

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Dear Lisa, I'm not sure if there is a Starwood Amex available in Australia but it will be one of the things I have to check over the next couple of weeks. Also, thank you for the timeshare sites.....it will come in very handy....what's your view eBay...there's one going cheap...around $6K for a 2-bedroom, EOY, Ocean view. Regards, Diego.
Stick to a reputable seller (one with good feedback and lots of transactions) and pay with a credit card to give you some buyer protection, and I think you'll be fine. Also ask for the exact unit number to confirm that it's, indeed, ocean view. $6k is a tremendous deal for OV.

Edited to add: Looks like it's an Island view. Still a pretty good deal, but if I'm going to pay $2k a year in MFs, I'd pay more for a better view. Your mileage may vary.
 
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DavidnRobin

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I would never send money directly to the seller - make sure a Title company is used with an escrow account (hopefully with your choosing) - no matter what the ad states. Also, ebay auctions are non-binding (no mater what the ad states).
 

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[Advertising/soliciting is not allowed on TUG, except in the Timeshare Marketplace linked in the red bar at the top of the page, and you are responding to a post that is 3 mos. old. - DeniseM Moderator.]
 
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