• The TUGBBS forums are completely free and open to the public and exist as the absolute best place for owners to get help and advice about their timeshares for more than 30 years!

    Join Tens of Thousands of other Owners just like you here to get any and all Timeshare questions answered 24 hours a day!
  • TUG started 30 years ago in October 1993 as a group of regular Timeshare owners just like you!

    Read about our 30th anniversary: Happy 30th Birthday TUG!
  • TUG has a YouTube Channel to produce weekly short informative videos on popular Timeshare topics!

    Free memberships for every 50 subscribers!

    Visit TUG on Youtube!
  • TUG has now saved timeshare owners more than $21,000,000 dollars just by finding us in time to rescind a new Timeshare purchase! A truly incredible milestone!

    Read more here: TUG saves owners more than $21 Million dollars
  • Sign up to get the TUG Newsletter for free!

    60,000+ subscribing owners! A weekly recap of the best Timeshare resort reviews and the most popular topics discussed by owners!
  • Our official "end my sales presentation early" T-shirts are available again! Also come with the option for a free membership extension with purchase to offset the cost!

    All T-shirt options here!
  • A few of the most common links here on the forums for newbies and guests!

Need another Reason to dislike the Airline Industry???

DonM

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
788
Reaction score
1
Points
378
Location
New Fairfield, Connecticut
I found some cheap airfare to Hawaii from NYC in July and August '09. I originally used ITA Software, and found $437 round trip tix on AA.

I thought pricing might be coming down since July & August are not prime Hawaii travel times, plus the fact that the cost of oil has more than dropped 50% from it's high.

The problem is that it's really a come on since there are a very limited number of seats. That in itself, while understandable, is still annoying. However what really pissed me off was that the limited number of seats were not per fllight but total by destination! In other words the serach engines - including AA's own engine would show at least 2 of these economy tickets available to HNL for 6 different flights- but when I put 2 on hold all the others dissappeared on all the other 5 flights!

Do they stay awake at night trying to think of new ways to irritate us?
 

Talent312

TUG Review Crew: Veteran
TUG Member
Joined
Jul 4, 2007
Messages
17,629
Reaction score
7,470
Points
948
Resorts Owned
HGVC & GTS
I doubt that they stay awake at night, at all. But if they do, its likely to think of ways to avoid liquidation. Irritating the public is a secondary objective.
 

JoanE

TUG Member
Joined
Sep 24, 2006
Messages
35
Reaction score
0
Points
216
Location
cleveland, ohio
Resorts Owned
orange lake, pahio bali hai
had a fairly decent rate to maui from lax. for both of us + a rental car for 1 week + insurance = $1100.00 - Pleasant Holidays
joane
 

Poobah

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 26, 2005
Messages
453
Reaction score
20
Points
378
Location
Burnsville, MN
Seat Pricing

The airlines management of seat inventory is a science. They have statistics up the wazoo on which to base the allocation of seats to fare classes. This upcoming winter tourist seasons will, I believe, be a little different.

As the higher fare classes don't sell there will be more inventory allocated to lower fares. The non-stop MSP/HNL that we are on in March is not even 25% sold, so I am sure there is inventory available at lower fare classes. We used FF miles this year.

Having only two seats at a fare class inventoried over several flights is a bit bizzare, but not out of the unthinkable. Usually they are by ship, because some of the flights have better times, some are non-stop, etc. The cheaper inventory going to the "non-prime-time" flights.

If you got the fare you wanted then things are good. I will bet that there will be more inventory added to the fare you paid as a flight departure date approaches.

Have a Mai Tai and think about the warm sun and great sunsets in Hawaii!!!:whoopie:

Cheers,

Paul
 

urban5

TUG Member
Joined
Jul 26, 2005
Messages
459
Reaction score
25
Points
388
Location
New England
Resorts Owned
Royal Cancun
Airfares

I have a Chrismas flight to Cancun that I bought the first day flights were available for practically nothing, then several days later fare went up to over $1,000, and as time went on the flight remained almost empty. I was starting to worry that the flight would be canceled, but several months ago cost dropped to $700, then several weeks ago down to less than $500. Today there are three seats available.
 

Icarus

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
4,095
Reaction score
0
Points
271
You found two seats on the same flights from the East Coast to Hawaii for $437 round trip, and you thought the fare might go down? $437 r/t is a great fare on a major carrier from the West Coast to the islands.

What is there to complain about? I don't care what the price of oil is, they aren't making money on that fare.

July and August are not prime times for visiting Hawaii? (For the very end of August, that might be true.)

I think you got just about every assumption wrong in the OP. The airlines have very sophisticated yield management software and have had it for years. I don't think I'd be very surprised that the other fares disappeared after you booked two tix at that ridiculously low price.

Just curious, what was the next cheapest fare available after you snagged those 2 tix? If the difference is not very high, you should have grabbed them. If it was a huge difference, you could always hope that they will add some more available tix at the lower fare, but it's always a crap shoot.

I've been in situations where I could only get one ticket at the cheaper fare, and the 2nd ticket was at a higher fare, but the delta usually isn't that big. That's all that was available when I tried to book, and it's my choice if I want to book them or not.

Yeah, there's not much to like about the way they do yield management, especially when you are trying to use your miles, but that's the way the entire industry is. It's so competitive, they have to do stuff like this to try to get the highest price they can for every available seat.

-David
 
Last edited:

DonM

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
788
Reaction score
1
Points
378
Location
New Fairfield, Connecticut
You found two seats on the same flights from the East Coast to Hawaii for $437 round trip, and you thought the fare might go down? $437 r/t is a great fare on a major carrier from the West Coast to the islands.

What is there to complain about? I don't care what the price of oil is, they aren't making money on that fare.

July and August are not prime times for visiting Hawaii? (For the very end of August, that might be true.)

I think you got just about every assumption wrong in the OP. The airlines have very sophisticated yield management software and have had it for years. I don't think I'd be very surprised that the other fares disappeared after you booked two tix at that ridiculously low price.

Just curious, what was the next cheapest fare available after you snagged those 2 tix? If the difference is not very high, you should have grabbed them. If it was a huge difference, you could always hope that they will add some more available tix at the lower fare, but it's always a crap shoot.

I've been in situations where I could only get one ticket at the cheaper fare, and the 2nd ticket was at a higher fare, but the delta usually isn't that big. That's all that was available when I tried to book, and it's my choice if I want to book them or not.

Yeah, there's not much to like about the way they do yield management, especially when you are trying to use your miles, but that's the way the entire industry is. It's so competitive, they have to do stuff like this to try to get the highest price they can for every available seat.

-David


I was surprised that you so misinterpreted what I said- but after re reading what I wrote I see that it was poorly worded, and that's my mistake.

This is hopefully a better explanation:

First off I think $437 R/T from NYC to HNL is a fantastic fare. I wasn't thinking that prices would go lower that $437- I was gratified that they were that low just rationalizing that they were that low due to the lower demand due to the poor economy, plus the much lower cost of energy.

Next- I need 4 tickets for my family- not just two. The search for 4 tickets together on the same flight produced zero results. The airline in question showed at least 6 different flights to HNL that had at least 2 tickets at that price. (I thought the $437 price so good that I would have had my family take two different flights to HNL)

My complaint is that after putting two tickets from one of those 6 flights on hold, I tried to do the same for the other 2 tickets I need- but they all disappeared. The other 5 flights no longer had at least two tickets at that prices. The two tickets were per destination not per flight. They never existed on all 6 flights- only two tickets existed cumulatively on all 6 flights.

FYI the next price as I recall was 2 1/2 x more

Don
 

isisdave

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
2,773
Reaction score
1,292
Points
548
Location
Evansville IN
Resorts Owned
Marriott Waiohai
Don, sometimes those sites put cookies on your system that prevent deals from being shown again for a while. Try clearing your cookies, or browsing with a different browser or from another computer, and maybe some more will reappear. I don't think you'll find more than two on the same flight that way, though.
 

danb

Tug Review Crew: Rookie
TUG Member
Joined
Jun 7, 2005
Messages
359
Reaction score
1
Points
16
Location
Ewa Beach, HI
Cheap Airfare to HNL

We got airfare out of Newark to HNL last July for 276.10 each. We are leaving this Tuesday. Couldn't pass it up. :banana:
 

Neesie

TUG Member
Joined
Jul 11, 2005
Messages
573
Reaction score
10
Points
378
Location
Minnesota
I bought two tickets to Ft. Lauderdale on Midwest Airlines this summer (return was going to be out of Ft. Myers). This fall I started receiving e-mails about a change to my itinery. I have received these in the past when the schedule changes by a few minutes, but then I noticed on of the e-mails was URGENT.

Turns out Midwest Airlines cancelled their service to Ft. Lauderdale and decided to change our flight to Indianapolis instead. At first I thought it was a layover in Indianapolis which was irritating enough. But I had to deal with their irritating 1-800 number at least a half a dozen times. I would patiently explain that I didn't want to go to Indianapolis and the foreigner on the other end would attempt to call the airline and then cut me off after about 20 minutes. I finally completed a call in which they promised to refund my money (gee, thanks!) but it will take up to two billing cycles since Travelocity and Midwest Airlines is involved. Luckily I found comparable tickets on Northwest but it is no easy task since I am flying in to one city and out of another and have car rentals to match. I am still waiting for my refund, tho.:doh:
 

davidvel

TUG Member
Joined
May 9, 2008
Messages
7,844
Reaction score
4,801
Points
648
Location
No. Cty. San Diego
Resorts Owned
Marriott Shadow Ridge (Villages)
Carlsbad Inn
The airlines management of seat inventory is a science. They have statistics up the wazoo on which to base the allocation of seats to fare classes. This upcoming winter tourist seasons will, I believe, be a little different.
Yes, and quite a "science" it is. All of these legacy airlines that use this science (you know you find a flight one day for $200, one hour later its $1,250, and 1 day later its $150), all based upon decades of data and algorithims, are doing oh so well. They have been through multiple bankruptcies, mergers, new BKs, and will be begging for the next bailout, and yet no one should question their science on how to maximize revenue.

Stupid airlines like Southwest who don't use this science have been profitable every year for decades (except last quarter) using a simplified rate structure.
 

DonM

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
788
Reaction score
1
Points
378
Location
New Fairfield, Connecticut
Yes, and quite a "science" it is. All of these legacy airlines that use this science (you know you find a flight one day for $200, one hour later its $1,250, and 1 day later its $150), all based upon decades of data and algorithims, are doing oh so well. They have been through multiple bankruptcies, mergers, new BKs, and will be begging for the next bailout, and yet no one should question their science on how to maximize revenue.

Stupid airlines like Southwest who don't use this science have been profitable every year for decades (except last quarter) using a simplified rate structure.

Well said- I was thinking the same thing, but you said it better than I could have
 

Icarus

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
4,095
Reaction score
0
Points
271
Well said- I was thinking the same thing, but you said it better than I could have

except for the fact that in this case, that system is working in your favor :)

I read in another thread that you (apparently) found a 3rd ticket at $437 and are waiting for the last one to open up, right?

-David
 
Top