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Marriott Club Points booking Disney inventory? How to stop Marriott LIES?

winger

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Just came across this 8 month old video. Somewhat comical, but is there really anything that can be done to eliminate salesperson lies at Marriott? I expect more from Marriott - they aren't just a mom & p OP company!

 

dioxide45

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Just came across this 8 month old video. Somewhat comical, but is there really anything that can be done to eliminate salesperson lies at Marriott? I expect more from Marriott - they aren't just a mom & p OP company!

I've watched that video. I beleive I left a comment on it. To be fair, the presentation was just after the affiliation of DVC with II rolled out, so I give the salesperson a small pass on the "lie". They really should have said nothing at all. However, we continue to see this perpetuate currently. Some will defend the sales reps and claim it is only a half lie, because, well you can use Club Points to book DVC resorts. It just has to happen through II. Sales likes to talk everything up like it is the greatest thing ever without getting into the weeds of the details. They have told us in the past it is because they are always excited to share news with their owners. Yeah sure.... It is so they can make more sales. People need to stop defending even half lies. Sales should be 100% upfront about what it is they are selling.
 
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CPNY

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“Merging with” and didn’t even have it in their system yet haha. Jodi was amazing but she couldn’t show you anything because it’s in interval and good luck. Marriott sales weasels.

HAHA buy now because the price will go up once the Disney Marriott mergercomes out hah. Yeah sure the CEO of Disney who has so many other pressing matters to to deal with, personally made sure DVC left RCI and went to Intervals
 

winger

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I've watched that video. I beleive I left a comment on it. To be fair, the presentation was just after the affiliation of DVC with II rolled out, so I give the salesperson a small pass on the "lie". They really should have said nothing at all. However, we continue to see this perpetuate currently. Some will defend the sales reps and claim it is only a half lie, because, well you can use Club Points to book DVC resorts. It just has to happen through II. Sales likes to talk everything up like it is the greatest thing ever without getting into the weeds of the details. They have told us in the past it is because they are always excited to share news with their owners. Yeah sure.... It is so they can make more sales. People need to stop defending even half lies. Sales should be 100% upfront about what it is they are selling.
Marriott is a respected company, or at least somewhat, and their product is good. It does not need lies of any shade to sell.
 

rickandcindy23

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Marriott is a respected company, or at least somewhat, and their product is good. It does not need lies of any shade to sell.
Agreed, yet a hard-up salesperson will say anything to make a sale. I have attended one Marriott presentation that was so bad, I was shocked at the claims this salesperson made in Orlando. TUG's own Dave M confirmed that the guy was lying about everything he claimed. He made outrageous claims. Nice guy, but a liar.
 

winger

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Agreed, yet a hard-up salesperson will say anything to make a sale. I have attended one Marriott presentation that was so bad, I was shocked at the claims this salesperson made in Orlando. TUG's own Dave M confirmed that the guy was lying about everything he claimed. He made outrageous claims. Nice guy, but a liar.
This past summer, we had a rudish rep who went as far as claiming we will no longer be able to exchange into MVC's because II removed all Marriott's from its inventory. We can only get into MVC's using DC Points. Well, I am thinking of asking for him by name on Owner Updates the next times we visit there in Nov and next July on II exchanges .
 

dioxide45

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Marriott is a respected company, or at least somewhat, and their product is good. It does not need lies of any shade to sell.
The problem is, that Marriott is a very expensive product and when you run all the numbers there are only a few edge cases where it makes financial sense to own developer purchased points. Notice how they no longer do the "comparison to rental rates" like they used to years ago? It is mainly because it is hard to make the numbers work out, even in a high inflationary environment. They have resorted to the same smoke and mirrors to sell a product that most people buying it simply don't need.
 

Dean

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Marriott is a respected company, or at least somewhat, and their product is good. It does not need lies of any shade to sell.
Short of a draw such as WDW, timeshares are a difficult sell on a good day. Most timeshares are sold, not bought. If the only people who bought them were those where they made sense, the system would likely collapse. If you removed those that couldn't truly afford it, then the system would fail almost instantly. IMO one has to be able to hold their nose on the sales side to participate and those that can't likely should exit or just avoid them altogether. It's somewhat like taking state college assistance in states that fund that with a lottery since a lottery is basically a tax on the poor portions of the state.
 

winger

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Short of a draw such as WDW, timeshares are a difficult sell on a good day. Most timeshares are sold, not bought. If the only people who bought them were those where they made sense, the system would likely collapse. If you removed those that couldn't truly afford it, then the system would fail almost instantly. IMO one has to be able to hold their nose on the sales side to participate and those that can't likely should exit or just avoid them altogether. It's somewhat like taking state college assistance in states that fund that with a lottery since a lottery is basically a tax on the poor portions of the state.
Would a system based strictly on sales/resales survive? Developer only gets involved if they have unsold inventory, in which case they will sell but without the highly costly, heavy handed marketing/sales that most of us detest. This removes a lot of the upfront cost that owners end up paying. The underlying operations of resorts would be supported by the MF (HOAs) structure in place today.
 

Dean

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Would a system based strictly on sales/resales survive? Developer only gets involved if they have unsold inventory, in which case they will sell but without the highly costly, heavy handed marketing/sales that most of us detest. This removes a lot of the upfront cost that owners end up paying. The underlying operations of resorts would be supported by the MF (HOAs) structure in place today.
Likely not and it would remove all potential expansion options and take the most of the usual players out of the management business. It's just the reality of the system. It appears to me that when there is an economic downturn the sales force is more aggressive which makes sense. However, I don't think your questions actually matters in that it's not going to happen so were back to my point of being willing to accept issues or not play in the sandbox. That's not to say that we shouldn't push back but I'm not personally willing to beat my head against the wall for something that, IMO, is a lost cause. And the reality is that MVC is better than most in this area.
 

l0410z

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There was a point in time when Marriott offered a value proposition that stood on it’s own without the need for lying. I still remember my first presentation in 1995. It was the second year we rented a unit at the Monarch from a broker but the first time we were invited to a sales presentation at the Grande Ocean. We could have been the poster couple for Marriott. We had 2 kids, love to travel at least 2 weeks a year on vacation, was renting a unit at the Monarch and frequent travel using Marriott Hotels.

The salesman did a great job of taking us through the value proposition, displaced hotel and rental costs, larger space, trading to other locations (II), kitchens, being able to rent the unit to make money, exchanging to Marriott hotels anywhere in the world. This was perfect for us. My biggest challenge was the price so my wife and I wanted a few days to discuss it but even that wasn’t a show stopper.

A couple of days after, we decided that we liked the Monarch and wanted to buy there. When I reached out to the sales person he said he can’t sell resale and couldn’t help us. It didn’t take long to find the resale group within Marriott and worked with a man named Wayne Williams. He explained why he thought fixed week was better, the Monarch exchanging for 135,000 reward points every year and best of all, the price half on what new would cost at the GO. Truth is, even if I purchased new at the GO, I would have thought it worth it.

As resale became easier to find and grew in popularity and Marriott devalued the reward vacation packages, the timeshare value proposition declined and lying became a viable tool in Marriott’s sales kit with Marriott’s blessing,
It has continued to get worse because the price of a point increases based on no real underlying value other then an emotional one (need to vacation). I know TUG members get great deals because they are educated to put an educated value on purchase but TUG members are only a small fraction of owners.

Having sold at IBM (I am sure a subset of members may not know who IBM is) for 30 years across divisions and at multiple levels, I understand the need to sell value. If the value isn’t there, lying is not an acceptable alternative and if found out, firing was immediate. I am amazed that Marriott allows it and customers accept lying so matter of fact. I can only guess that so many owners go for just the incentive knowing they will never buy or not for an update, Marriott thinks lying is fair game.
 
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winger

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...

Having sold at IBM (inam sure a subset of members may not know who IBM is) for 30 years across divisions and at multiple levels, I understand the need to sell value....
Who is IBM?
 

rickandcindy23

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With the internet the way it is, reviews all over for whatever you want to review, you would think honesty would be the best policy, to not have the negative publicity.

Our son runs a fireplace store way south of Denver near 470 and I-25. He sells to people within a 40-mile radius of his store because he has the best reviews. He had a call from a guy who saw the reviews of the store. He lives about 40 miles away, but he called to ask if Josh would give them an in-home estimate, or if that is too far to go. Our son said he would be happy to work with him. He is pulling business from other stores because the reviews are just bad for stores that are in the neighborhoods of some of his customers.
 

l0410z

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Who is IBM?
IBM pulled out of the consumer business in 2005 by selling the PC business. Many people 25 years or younger do not know of IBM. I was assuming we had members who are managing vacations for there parents or taken over ownership.
 

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Marriott is a respected company, or at least somewhat, and their product is good. It does not need lies of any shade to sell.
People have to make a distinction between how the Marriott resorts are managed and how everything else related to the timeshare business is managed.

In order to use the brands, the resorts have to maintain certain standards imposed by the agreement with Marriott International. In addition to that, MVW makes 10% of the resort budgets so why would they be cheap when they make a cut on every dollar? The resorts should look nice, and this is where MVW and all the other owners agree.

When it comes to all other aspects of our ownership, our interests are not aligned.
 
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