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Is the auction rigged?

Camster

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I'm a newbie here and still learning. I put in bids on a couple of auctions this morning and then watched some odd things happen.

One of the auctions just simply vanished from ebay, gone, poof. The bid on the other suddenly jumped up by 12 hundred dollars and then started going up in $1000 increments. Since the bidders ids are private it kind of makes you wonder if the seller doesn't have something "arranged" to jack the price up. I mean, who would bid up in thousand dollar increments if you didn't have to?

Any insight would be appreciated.
 

DeniseM

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It is not unusual for sellers to end auctions early - happens all the time.

As far as the other one goes, it's hard to tell without a link. You can post it if you want to.
 

PigsDad

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You also have to understand how the bidding works on Ebay. Look on the help pages for a full explanation, and it may explain what you were seeing.

Kurt
 

Egret1986

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This is a reputable seller on eBay and....

this is a sought-after resort. It's also ending soon and the price is not out of line. I would assume it is just some bidders that really want it that are not sniping or putting in last minute bids. For a property like this, I don't believe that the increments of the bidding is unusual. Just my opinion.

And as posted previously, timeshare auctions sometimes are ended early by sellers for different reasons.
 

DavidnRobin

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I think you have been to the Starwood Forum, but if not make sure you come over to visit. Lots of WKV selling prices on eBay are listed in the Starwood Forum sticky.

There has been discussion on whether or not StarOptions can be combined - so be aware of this issue. I generally recommend that a minimum of 81K SOs are purchased to get the most bang for your buck. We own 2 resale units at WKV (1Bd premium in plat season - 81K SOs each)

Also - find out whether the 2009 week has been reserved - the 8-month SVO window has passed for this season.
 
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Camster

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Price seems right

You're right, the price does seem in line with other sales. Maybe these bidders are just going where they know the price will end up, but why would you go there before you have to? I'll happily bit to my limit, but I'd rather not pay a dime more than I have to in the process.

Oh well, there will always be others.
 

yumdrey

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I am very used to ebay and it seems like.... this sale is ended at very reasonable price and many people were watching this item :)
They just didn't bid until the last minutes. I was one of the people who watched this item.
Good timeshare items are still in good prices.
 

Harvey and Lin

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I have bid on some auctions by this seller but not won any or made any purchases from him. I have also had some private Emails with him and IMHO he is an honest Ebay seller. Harvey
 

VEGASZIP

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I was bidding on a Sheraton Vistana Villages timeshare a few weeks ago which expired at 10:00pm. At 9:59, I was the high bidder at $535.00. At 10:00 the timeshare sold for $2205. I think the automatic bidding took over the auction. I believe that Ebay has a countdown process where you are notified of a bid coming to an end. People can bid up to their maximum amount. My maximum was only 600. The winners may have had maximum bids up to 2500. The automatic bid function makes the necessary bid to win up to your maximum.
 

Mel

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The bidding history shows a series of proxy bids, which is why there are jumps

Starting Price US $499.00 Oct-13-08 18:45:00 PDT
US $500.00 Oct-14-08 01:32:46 PDT
US $511.00 Oct-14-08 06:02:00 PDT
US $521.00 Oct-14-08 20:39:31 PDT
US $660.00 Oct-15-08 02:37:57 PDT

These two bids are probably the same person
US $601.00 non-winning Oct-15-08 13:51:43 PDT
US $1,211.00 Oct-15-08 13:52:06 PDT
the $1211 is a proxy bid, probably showing as winning at $670, maybe $685 - one increment above the previous proxy bid of $660

Three more that are probably one bidder
US $810.99 non-winning Oct-15-08 20:33:10 PDT
US $909.12 non-winning Oct-15-08 20:33:35 PDT
US $1,212.12 Oct-15-08 20:34:41 PDT
This was shown as the winning bid, because it was less than one bid increment above the proxy bid of $1211

US $1,625.35 Oct-17-08 16:46:29 PDT

Again, 2 by a single bidder
US $1,501.00 Oct-17-08 18:06:17 PDT non-winning
US $1,701.00 Oct-17-08 18:06:27 PDT new proxy

US $1,676.00 Oct-19-08 01:42:36 PDT non-winning
US $1,801.00 Oct-19-08 06:26:59 PDT new high bid
US $1,760.00 Oct-19-08 11:49:08 PDT - non winning
US $1,850.00 Oct-19-08 11:49:32 PDT (same bidder, now winning)
US $1,900.00 Oct-19-08 17:01:35 PDT (bid increment must have been $25, setting winning bid at $1875, which allowed someone else to bid $1900 too)
US $1,900.00 Oct-19-08 23:32:32 PDT (previous bid of same amount was winning bid - if this person had bid 1901, it would be winning)

US $3,100.00 Oct-20-08 13:51:49 PDT (proxy bid)
US $7,990.00 Oct-20-08 14:11:16 PDT (another proxy bid)

The next several bids didn't beat the proxy, but drove the winning bid up
US $4,100.00 Oct-20-08 14:20:52 PDT
US $5,000.00 Oct-20-08 14:21:23 PDT (probably same bidder)
US $5,500.00 Oct-20-08 17:05:01 PDT
US $6,000.00 Oct-20-08 18:00:41 PDT
US $6,200.00 Oct-20-08 18:07:33 PDT (probably same bidder)

These last 3 bids were probably made by the same person
US $7,500.00 Oct-20-08 18:24:30 PDT not winning,
US $7,900.00 Oct-20-08 18:25:55 PDT showed winning bid as 7990, less than a full bid increment above this bid, indicating the next bid would become the winning bid.
US $8,090.00 Oct-20-08 18:27:19 PDT

If any snipe bids were set, they were lower than the 8090 bid and were not accepted as bids. As such, they don't show in the bidding history.

If eBay would show the bid history in the order bids were placed, as I have reconstructed, it becomes easier to see the bidding patterns. Because they use proxy bidding, the history as shown on their site doesn't make much sense - If I place a bid for $8000 the first day of the auction, 40 other bids may be accepted before someone else comes close. If the next highest bid is $2000, I will win for far less than my original bid, that's just how the system works. If you bid that $2000, and still are not winning, you might decide to bid $2100 in hopes that my bid was $2001 - you'll notice some bidders use odd amounts for that reason. It can produces clues about what the winning bidder used as a proxy.
 

T_R_Oglodyte

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I was bidding on a Sheraton Vistana Villages timeshare a few weeks ago which expired at 10:00pm. At 9:59, I was the high bidder at $535.00. At 10:00 the timeshare sold for $2205. I think the automatic bidding took over the auction. I believe that Ebay has a countdown process where you are notified of a bid coming to an end. People can bid up to their maximum amount. My maximum was only 600. The winners may have had maximum bids up to 2500. The automatic bid function makes the necessary bid to win up to your maximum.
That's not due to a last-minute eBay notice - that's the sniping programs. Those last minute bidders probably had set their bids with a sniping service days before the auction ended, with instructions to to the service to enter the bid in the last minute.

I have my sniping service set to enter my bids about four seconds before the close of the auction.
 

AwayWeGo

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[triennial - points]
eSnipe-Dot-Com

In the olden days, I sniped in manually on eBay auctions.

Then I got lazy & signed up with eSnipe.

Now I rig all my eBay bids via eSnipe -- not that there's anything wrong with rigging bids that way.

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​
 

tombo

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Unfortunatelly (from personal experiencce) you can still win bids without snipe services if you bid too high or in the last few seconds. I won an auction a few weeks ago without a snipe service by entering my max bid with about 10 seconds to go. That doesn't beat anyone with a snipe service, but it doesn't give anyone time to change their max bid to beat your max bid if they wanted to. The highest bid using snipe or not wins, snipe services just outbid others up to your max bid in milliseconds with seconds left in the auction. If there was ever a week I had to own I would use a snipe service. Right now if I ever bid again I won't use a snipe service hoping deep down that I won't win the auction.

I love the resort I bought (addiction makes me say that), but I don't need anymore weeks anywhere for any price (keep repeating until I finally beat this addiction). From my experience the bids aren't rigged, and I own sooo many weeks that prove this point. Crap, if it was rigged I wouldn't own so many dang weeks. :annoyed:
 

AwayWeGo

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[triennial - points]
I Resemble That Remark.

If there was ever a week I had to own I would use a snipe service. Right now if I ever bid again I won't use a snipe service hoping deep down that I won't win the auction.
I am currently undergoing a self-imposed eBay moratorium for just that very reason -- except in my case the issue is horns more than timeshares. But the same principle applies. Not only that, horns (like timeshares) are easier to buy than to sell.
I love the resort I bought (addiction makes me say that), but I don't need anymore weeks anywhere for any price (keep repeating until I finally beat this addiction). From my experience the bids aren't rigged, and I own sooo many weeks that prove this point. Crap, if it was rigged I wouldn't own so many dang weeks.
It is just sheer luck that has kept me from going overboard on eBay timeshares the way I have with eBay horns.

I am this close to gritting my teeth & putting all the excess unloved horns on eBay (1 at a time, so as not to put my offerings in competition with each other) until the surplus is gone & I'm left with just my 3 keepers (Alexander 103, Lawson 804, Yamaha YHR-666N -- all 3 full doubles) & my 1 oddball collector's item (pristine Josef Lidl copy of Karl Lehman double compensator).

-- Alan Cole, McLean (Fairfax County), Virginia, USA.​

 

Camster

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OK, I get it... not rigged, just fast.

Thanks for all the education. I use a snipe service, seems like a plus at the very end. But you have to know your limit.
 

brucecz

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Thanks for all the education. I use a snipe service, seems like a plus at the very end. But you have to know your limit.
TR is correct. One advantage of the esnipe I use that I do not have to worry about my computor suddenly running to slow to make a last second bid,

I can also bid 3 days earlier and then cancel 5 or more mintues out before the auction ends and I do nopt show up.

Also if my bid snipe was not high enough in some to show up no one will know that we bid so when a similar one comes up we may be able to steal one at a lower price because we did not show up as a bidder before for that ownership.

The another advantage it keeps be out of bidding wars. I started using it after one time because our computor was running slow so I put by bid about 1 minute before the end and someone bid 4 more times and cost us another $100 to win. We have won over 20 timeshares using esnipe.

Bruce :D
 

T_R_Oglodyte

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Sniping services are also great when an item you want is listed in multiple auctions, and as soon as you win one auction you have no interest in the remaining auctions.

With a snipe service it's easy to put auctions into a group, set your bid amount for each auction, and have the snipe service not enter any more bids after you win an auction.

For example, when I was looking to replace my Bluetooth earpiece I located about ten auctions with suitable items. I only need one earpiece so if I win one auction there's no point in continuing to bid on additional auctions.
 
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PigsDad

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I wonder how long it will be until Ebay provides its own sniping service. It seems like a logical expansion of their services, just as they did when they added integrated paying services, for example.

Kurt
 

SDKath

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Remember that sniping services really don't help you win though. The person who enters the highest "snipe" or non-snipe amount is the winner. The only advantage to snipe something is that the sale price looks falsely low until about 20 seconds before auction end. So many unknowing people will bid right above that artificially low amount. Then BOOM, the snipers come in and whoever has the highest amount wins, often $1000s higher than usual.

A recent example was a Westin property I was bidding on. It was at $550ish around 30 seconds before close. It closed 30 seconds later for $4500!

Katherine
 

Mel

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There are both advantages and disadvantages to sniping.

On the pro side, you don't spark interest from other bidders, which can drive the price up. If the only other serious bidder placed an early proxy bid for $1000, and you snipe at $2000, you will win for $1025 (or whatever the next increment is at that point). If you bid 2000 near the beginning, you $1025 bid will show as the winning bid, and the other bidder will get an email telling him he was outbid. If he decides maybe he's willing to pay more, he might then bid $1500, and drive your winning bid up another $500. Of course, he should have either sniped or bid what he was really willing to pay in the first place - but he's now driven your price up 50%

On the con side, if someone else snipes for the same amount, and their bid is placed first, you lose the auction. If they bid $1000, and you sniped at $1010 you still might not win, depending what the third highest bid was - if the high bid hits $1000 before your bid is placed, your bid might not be accepted because it's less than a full increment above the high bid.
 
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