"Important News About Your Payment Options"

[dioxide45]

Email received yesterday regarding availability of the "Maintenance Billing Statement". Statement was accessible from the Vistana Dashboard. The included BOD letter confirms the 1.5% fee reduction is due in part to implementation of the 3% credit card fee. Letter and budget are attached.

Thanks for posting this. I don't have the 2026 Westin Flex budget to compare numbers, but the cost to the association isn't going away completely. The Credit Card Fee line item is still $660,000. I wonder if they know the fee isn't completely implemented yet and know some people will pay early to avoid it and thus still accounting for the association having to cover some of the merchant fee costs for the 2027 budget year?

 

[Docsdrillers]

I wonder if this is prohibited for those living in Canada..

 

[dioxide45]

I wonder if this is prohibited for those living in Canada..

There was a question about international owners. Credit cards are easier given exchange rates and such. They also don't really have the option of using ACH or direct bank account withdrawal as I suspect one needs a US account at a US bank to use that.

It doesn't look like Canada has any prohibitions against credit card surcharges. Though Quebec may have such a restriction.

 

[YYJMSP]

It doesn't look like Canada has any prohibitions against credit card surcharges. Though Quebec may have such a restriction.

I thought there is (was?) a merchant agreement stipulation that they can't add on a credit card only surcharge, but stores got around that by offering a cash discount instead...

 

[dioxide45]

I thought there is (was?) a merchant agreement stipulation that they can't add on a credit card only surcharge, but stores got around that by offering a cash discount instead...

Perhaps at one time. Back before the anti-trust settlements against Visa and Mastercard, many merchants tried to use the "cash discount" as a way around merchant agreements that prohibited credit card surcharges. Those prohibitions have been lifted. This is what the government of Canada says about those surcharges now.

Merchant surcharges, service and convenience fees, and discounts - Canada.ca

Rules around surcharges, service fees, conveniences fees and discounts.

www.canada.ca

 

[tha]

I think that is exactly what is happening here; they are disclosing the 3% payment and the fact that it is not over what the law will allow, and of course, we can always pay cash. Some of the small little corner stores make it easy on themselves and just charge $0.75. I can really understand - most all of the shops that do that are mom and pop or small business shops. My hairdresser and her partner (a solo salon with very reasonable fees) started charging when they realized that had spent $40,000 one year on fees.

Successful 2 person salon with $1.3 million in credit card charges.

 

[YYJMSP]

Perhaps at one time. Back before the anti-trust settlements against Visa and Mastercard, many merchants tried to use the "cash discount" as a way around merchant agreements that prohibited credit card surcharges. Those prohibitions have been lifted. This is what the government of Canada says about those surcharges now.

Merchant surcharges, service and convenience fees, and discounts - Canada.ca

Rules around surcharges, service fees, conveniences fees and discounts.

www.canada.ca

Good find, I looked quickly but didn't see a "authoritative" answer, just a bunch of random sites

So next set of questions will be 3% vs 2.4% cap and how are foreign businesses treated, as those rules seem to apply to Canadian businesses...

 

[jp10558]

I want to know why Marriott Ocean Pointe (and all the MVCs I've been to) are cash free credit card only places if these fees are so bad they need to charge extra for the HOAs. Do the HOAs not pay for the fees at the on site shops, food places, or front desk charges? I know if I was told I can only pay by CC, and oh by the way we're also adding a 3% fee I'd be kinda pissed.

I'm not saying they DON'T build it in, but it's just a cost of doing business and no one is getting discounts. Why don't they ask for checks instead of cards on site? (Probably because they actually are a PITA vs cards and do cost more labor, but what do I know).

 

[dioxide45]

I want to know why Marriott Ocean Pointe (and all the MVCs I've been to) are cash free credit card only places if these fees are so bad they need to charge extra for the HOAs. Do the HOAs not pay for the fees at the on site shops, food places, or front desk charges? I know if I was told I can only pay by CC, and oh by the way we're also adding a 3% fee I'd be kinda pissed.

I'm not saying they DON'T build it in, but it's just a cost of doing business and no one is getting discounts. Why don't they ask for checks instead of cards on site? (Probably because they actually are a PITA vs cards and do cost more labor, but what do I know).

All the onsite restaurants and shops are operated by a Marriott Vacations or third party vendor. The HOA is not paying the credit card fees. Cash only seems to be system wide, not just Ocean Pointe. More and more hotels and properties seem to be going this way. I would agree, it would be bad practice to charge a credit card surcharge but be cash free resort. That hasn't happened and I don't see it happening. Marriott charged enough of a markup on food and beverage that they can eat the merchant fees.

 

[bobmnu]

Just received an email from "Vistana Management, Inc." on "The Marriott Vacation Clubs" letterhead:

Dear Flex Collection Trust Owners,

Thank you for being part of The Marriott Vacation Clubs® family. As we prepare the 2027 draft budget for Board review and approval, the management company continues working with your Board to identify opportunities to help reduce Association costs while providing convenient payment options for Owners.

Credit card processing expenses are a significant cost for many Associations. Currently, these costs are funded through the Association’s annual budget, which means they are shared by all Owners regardless of the payment method used.

In an effort to reduce Association expenses, the Flex Collection Owners Association, Inc Board has directed the management company to pursue an alternate payment solution, beginning with the 2027 billing cycle. For 2027 and future years, Owners who choose to pay maintenance fees and/or club dues by credit card will be assessed a convenience fee surcharge of up to 3%, except where legally prohibited.

Some jurisdictions, including certain locations outside the United States, may limit or prohibit the use of a surcharge. As a result, the credit card processing expense line item cannot be eliminated entirely, but is expected to be significantly reduced for the Association.

This change better aligns credit card processing expenses with the Owners who choose to use that payment method, while helping reduce the total amount paid through the Association budget. Owners will continue to have flexible payment options. Those who choose to pay by credit card will be redirected to a third-party provider’s secure website to complete their transaction. All other currently accepted payment methods, including electronic check through ACH, debit card, and prepaid card, will remain available without a surcharge.

More information about this change, available payment options, and how the surcharge may apply will be included with the 2027 annual maintenance fee billing materials.

Thank you for your support as we continue to work together to efficiently manage costs for your Association.

Sincerely,
Vistana Management, Inc.

Well, that kind of takes away the "benefit" of using a Marriott branded credit cards to pay maintenance fees. I'll have to see if the 3% fee is worth paying relative to my perceived value of Bonvoy Points. I assume this will apply to MVC owners as well.

Disappointed, but not surprised.

Will this be like the government when you try to use a credit card to pay them? They charge 3 or 4% Credit card fee and have you go through a third party which charges you a % and a connivence fee.

 

[dioxide45]

Will this be like the government when you try to use a credit card to pay them? They charge 3 or 4% Credit card fee and have you go through a third party which charges you a % and a connivence fee.

Yes, that's how it will work.

 

[jp10558]

You know, with all these crazy fees, and credit card rates being insane, I wonder if someone will start doing more of a credit card like "revolving line of credit" where you then "pay cash" to the merchants. Though I guess you still give up many of the plusses in fraud protection, consumer protection etc in that case. I guess I did see may credit cards will no longer charge a "cash advance fee" and just let you deposit cash into your checking account from the card balance.

I suppose the potential benefit from a new product could be lower interest rates (not that I've seen many on offer but also don't get mailings about that and haven't looked) if you're using credit to "make up for" the fraud protection. What I'd like to see is ACH protections like credit cards, i.e. fraud coverage, chargback on merchant disputes, etc.

I guess for now the convenience, rewards, and the protections (That I do think people often don't know about or don't get talked about in these discussions) vs Debit cards and especially ACH or mailed Checks still ... make me swallow the 3% fee in many cases. At least for online transactions. In person I'm moving more towards cash, but don't love needing to carry what feels like "a lot" of cash to me (i.e. $200+ dollars), and then manage the ATMs because of the crazy ATM fees too. I guess it's probably good for me as I buy less from these businesses cause of the cash hassle so might actually save me some money.

 

[daviator]

You know, with all these crazy fees, and credit card rates being insane, I wonder if someone will start doing more of a credit card like "revolving line of credit" where you then "pay cash" to the merchants. Though I guess you still give up many of the plusses in fraud protection, consumer protection etc in that case. I guess I did see may credit cards will no longer charge a "cash advance fee" and just let you deposit cash into your checking account from the card balance.

I suppose the potential benefit from a new product could be lower interest rates (not that I've seen many on offer but also don't get mailings about that and haven't looked) if you're using credit to "make up for" the fraud protection. What I'd like to see is ACH protections like credit cards, i.e. fraud coverage, chargback on merchant disputes, etc.

I guess for now the convenience, rewards, and the protections (That I do think people often don't know about or don't get talked about in these discussions) vs Debit cards and especially ACH or mailed Checks still ... make me swallow the 3% fee in many cases. At least for online transactions. In person I'm moving more towards cash, but don't love needing to carry what feels like "a lot" of cash to me (i.e. $200+ dollars), and then manage the ATMs because of the crazy ATM fees too. I guess it's probably good for me as I buy less from these businesses cause of the cash hassle so might actually save me some money.

There are so many benefits to paying by credit card, as you point out. I don’t use, or want to use, debit card for ANYTHING… if the debit card info gets hacked/stolen, thieves can empty your bank account in seconds and you will spend months fighting with the bank to get it back. In the meanwhile, all of your outstanding checks and EFT payments will fail and bounce, at least until you figure out what’s going on and put more money in the account(s) - hopefully you have money somewhere else so you can do that. With all the fraud these days, it’s just too risky to use a debit card for payment, especially online, in my view.

So this new world of having to pay 3% or whatever to pay by credit card really sucks. I will definitely patronize businesses which don’t pass on the fee; I have little expectation that businesses which add a surcharge are actually lowering their prices as a result. When I don’t have a choice, I’ll probably reluctantly pay the fee, but I’m left with bad feelings for the business involved and would not be inclined to give them more of my business.

Yes, I understand that accepting cards has a cost doe the business. This is nothing new, businesses have absorbed this cost for decades. They have lots of costs. Build them into your prices like you’ve presumably done for decades.

 

[dioxide45]

What I'd like to see is ACH protections like credit cards, i.e. fraud coverage, chargback on merchant disputes, etc.

The only way they can really offer fraud protection is to charge a fee. Someone has to pay for the protection. In a lot of cases the merchant simply gets the money taken out of their merchant payment account for a chargeback. In other cases the merchant may win the dispute but the credit card company still refunds the customer That money comes from somewhere. There are also costs to administer fraud protection. $1 on ACH transactions isn't going to cut it.

Edited to Add. There is also an incredible amount of misuse and fraud in the entire chargeback system. Some estimates are 30% and up of all chargebacks are fraudulent. Aka, buyer's remorse, unrecognized charge but they did buy it, family member used the person's card, or simple fraud, doing chargebacks without first trying remedy with the merchant. With that amount of fraud, I can understand why merchants want to mitigate the fees. They pay the merchant fees, then get hit with chargeback fees, then could be out the money for whatever the charged-back item was along with being out the money taken from their merchant account by the payment processor to cover the chargeback.

 

[boraxo]

Not surprised as Hyatt, which is under the Marriott umbrella, implemented that fee one or two years ago. I wonder if the Vistana resorts and Marriott resorts will do the same thing. I would think they would but we will have to wait and see.

Exactly. not a shocker. Unfortunately all businesses are looking for stealth price hikes and this is an easy one.

 

[dioxide45]

Exactly. not a shocker. Unfortunately all businesses are looking for stealth price hikes and this is an easy one.

But this isn't some greedy big company this time. Sure, it's Vistana, but it is really the home owners association that is removing the fee from maintenance fee billings and having individual owners pay the fee when they pay their maintenance fees. We don't know who or if anyone is really profiting off this new credit card fee.

 

[daviator]

But this isn't some greedy big company this time. Sure, it's Vistana, but it is really the home owners association that is removing the fee from maintenance fee billings and having individual owners pay the fee when they pay their maintenance fees. We don't know who or if anyone is really profiting off this new credit card fee.

The question, I guess, is whether the additional fee is actually saving or costing owners money. I thought I read somewhere that something like 77% of owners paid their MFs by credit card. Given that MVC was [probably) paying less than 2% in credit card fees, and now those 77% of owners (assuming they continue to choose to use a credit card) will pay 3%, the vast majority of owners are going to pay more (3% increase and a less-than-2% decrease.) So owners as a group will pay more, but it lets them claim the MFs are lower.

On the other hand, if I were an owner who wrote a check for my MFs every year, I might be happy to no longer be paying to subsidize the credit card usage of other owners. So there are winners and losers with this change, but the winners are vastly outnumbered by the losers.

 

[Hindsite]

There are so many benefits to paying by credit card, as you point out. I don’t use, or want to use, debit card for ANYTHING… if the debit card info gets hacked/stolen, thieves can empty your bank account in seconds and you will spend months fighting with the bank to get it back. In the meanwhile, all of your outstanding checks and EFT payments will fail and bounce, at least until you figure out what’s going on and put more money in the account(s) - hopefully you have money somewhere else so you can do that. With all the fraud these days, it’s just too risky to use a debit card for payment, especially online, in my view.

Its really easy to have a debit card that you use in lieu of a credit card that is linked to a secondary account and not your main bank account. You can manage the balance on that so it never gets to the point where there is enough in there for the loss to be a major issue and if the account gets blocked while you sort problems out, you still have your main account to carry on using. It even looks like the Bonvoy branded Debit cards that they have introduced in the UK can link to any account that you want. Its going to work differently to a credit card as you won't have potentially tens of thousands of spend that you can make without thinking about it, but in reality, for how we spend, the adjustment wouldn't be difficult.

I've done this with my very elderly Dad, to give him the dignity of having a debit card to pay for sundry items as and when he wants, but no risk of more than a few hundred being lost if he gets scammed or robbed. His main bill paying account is completely separate so protected from that risk.

 

[sponger76]

Its really easy to have a debit card that you use in lieu of a credit card that is linked to a secondary account and not your main bank account. You can manage the balance on that so it never gets to the point where there is enough in there for the loss to be a major issue and if the account gets blocked while you sort problems out, you still have your main account to carry on using. It even looks like the Bonvoy branded Debit cards that they have introduced in the UK can link to any account that you want. Its going to work differently to a credit card as you won't have potentially tens of thousands of spend that you can make without thinking about it, but in reality, for how we spend, the adjustment wouldn't be difficult.

I've done this with my very elderly Dad, to give him the dignity of having a debit card to pay for sundry items as and when he wants, but no risk of more than a few hundred being lost if he gets scammed or robbed. His main bill paying account is completely separate so protected from that risk.

There are also "pre-paid" debit cards that you can reload as needed, such as the GO card from Navy Federal Credit Union.

 

[Hindsite]

There are also "pre-paid" debit cards that you can reload as needed, such as the GO card from Navy Federal Credit Union.

...and I'm not sure if the Marriott gift cards can be used or not, that would be a good plan!!

 

[dioxide45]

...and I'm not sure if the Marriott gift cards can be used or not, that would be a good plan!!

They can't use Marriott gift cards for maintenance fee payments. That worked many years ago after some of us discovered a work around, but that work around only worked until Marriott changed credit card fulfillment vendors.

Prepaid Visa and MC cards can be used. Those usually require some kind of activation fee at the time of purchase and may have a $1000 limit per card. It wouldn't make sense to use these since you likely won't get any additional Bonvoy reward benefits. I know some other credit cards are different and you may get additional rewards if you buy the prepaid gift cards at certain merchants, at least in the USA.

 

[abtraveller]

Just received an email from "Vistana Management, Inc." on "The Marriott Vacation Clubs" letterhead:

Dear Flex Collection Trust Owners,

Thank you for being part of The Marriott Vacation Clubs® family. As we prepare the 2027 draft budget for Board review and approval, the management company continues working with your Board to identify opportunities to help reduce Association costs while providing convenient payment options for Owners.

Credit card processing expenses are a significant cost for many Associations. Currently, these costs are funded through the Association’s annual budget, which means they are shared by all Owners regardless of the payment method used.

In an effort to reduce Association expenses, the Flex Collection Owners Association, Inc Board has directed the management company to pursue an alternate payment solution, beginning with the 2027 billing cycle. For 2027 and future years, Owners who choose to pay maintenance fees and/or club dues by credit card will be assessed a convenience fee surcharge of up to 3%, except where legally prohibited.

Some jurisdictions, including certain locations outside the United States, may limit or prohibit the use of a surcharge. As a result, the credit card processing expense line item cannot be eliminated entirely, but is expected to be significantly reduced for the Association.

This change better aligns credit card processing expenses with the Owners who choose to use that payment method, while helping reduce the total amount paid through the Association budget. Owners will continue to have flexible payment options. Those who choose to pay by credit card will be redirected to a third-party provider’s secure website to complete their transaction. All other currently accepted payment methods, including electronic check through ACH, debit card, and prepaid card, will remain available without a surcharge.

More information about this change, available payment options, and how the surcharge may apply will be included with the 2027 annual maintenance fee billing materials.

Thank you for your support as we continue to work together to efficiently manage costs for your Association.

Sincerely,
Vistana Management, Inc.

Well, that kind of takes away the "benefit" of using a Marriott branded credit cards to pay maintenance fees. I'll have to see if the 3% fee is worth paying relative to my perceived value of Bonvoy Points. I assume this will apply to MVC owners as well.

Disappointed, but not surprised.

And there you have it... Marriott just today ..
The Marriott Vacation Clubs: Marriott Vacation Club, Sheraton Vacation Club, and Westin Vacation Club
Dear Marriott Vacation Club Trust Owner,

Thank you for being part of The Marriott Vacation Clubs® family. As we prepare the 2027 draft budget for Board review and approval, the management company continues working with your Board to identify opportunities to help reduce Association costs while providing convenient payment options for Owners.

Credit card processing expenses are a significant cost for many Associations. Currently, these costs are funded through the Association’s annual budget, which means they are shared by all Owners regardless of the payment method used.

At the direction of the MVC Trust Owners Association, Inc. Board, the management company pursued an alternate payment solution, beginning with the 2027 billing cycle in an effort to reduce Association expense. For 2027 and future years, Owners who choose to pay maintenance fees and/or club dues by credit card will be assessed a convenience fee surcharge of up to 3%, except where legally prohibited.

Some jurisdictions, including certain locations outside the United States, may limit or prohibit the use of a surcharge. As a result, the credit card processing expense line item cannot be eliminated entirely, but is expected to be significantly reduced for the Association.

This change better aligns credit card processing expenses with the Owners who choose to use that payment method, while helping reduce the total amount paid through the Association budget. Owners will continue to have flexible payment options. Those who choose to pay by credit card will be redirected to a third-party provider’s secure website to complete their transaction. All other currently accepted payment methods, including electronic check through ACH, debit card, and prepaid card, will remain available without a surcharge.

 

[Henry M.]

I haven't received any notice like this. All my ownership is for Vistana weeks, not points. I guess it must be in the works.

 

[lily28]

i own marriott and vistana weeks too and didn’t get any letters. maybe i will prepaid next year maintenance fees as trying to reach sapphire reserve $75k spend to get bonus southwest gift card and apple store gifts

 

[dioxide45]

i own marriott and vistana weeks too and didn’t get any letters. maybe i will prepaid next year maintenance fees as trying to reach sapphire reserve $75k spend to get bonus southwest gift card and apple store gifts

Weeks owners haven't received any emails, yet. I suspect we will get them at an individual resort level about a week before they send out the maintenance fee bills. I certainly intend to prepay as much as I can.