I like my enrolled points

[rthib]

Have to say that so far the new Marriott program is working for me.
Enrolled both my weeks and in addition to no fees, was able to have an incredible Christmas Vacation.

15 days at Cypress Harbour 2bdrn
- 1st week was a trade of my studio side Palm Dessert
Next 8 days was points including my bonus points.

Great thing was watching the madness that is Sunday Checkout while lounging at the pool.

Monday morning, check out (only one at the desk).
Go to Orlando Airport with no line.

Still not sold on the points only side, but like the flexibility of doing short stays or adding an extra day or two using points.

 

[TEDK63]

I tend to agree with you. I still have not figured out how to complete use the new systems yet but being a legacy/points owner seems to have advantages. I am still trying to find the best place to "rent" my extra points at. I would like to be revenue neutral if possible.

 

[iluvfla]

I didnt enroll, I own at Grand Chateu, a 2 bdrm L/O, in the weeks system I could lock off and stay 2 full weeks there, with the new system I cant, thats the major factor stoping me from joining the points. Just my 2 cents....

 

[dougp26364]

Make no mistake about it, I love our points programs with HGVC and DRI. I'd love our points program with MVC as well except I can't get enough value out of our points. The value of points compared to weeks is the deal breaker for us right now. Using our converted weeks, either we have to travel in very off season times, accept smaller units or accept shorter vacations. We can't even stay at our home resorts in the view catagory/size units that are deeded. I'm afraid until Marriott fixes that one aspect of the program, we'll remain on the outside looking in. Otherwise it's a great program and would match up against most for versitility.

 

[jme]

Make no mistake about it, I love our points programs with HGVC and DRI. I'd love our points program with MVC as well except I can't get enough value out of our points. The value of points compared to weeks is the deal breaker for us right now. Using our converted weeks, either we have to travel in very off season times, accept smaller units or accept shorter vacations. We can't even stay at our home resorts in the view catagory/size units that are deeded. I'm afraid until Marriott fixes that one aspect of the program, we'll remain on the outside looking in. Otherwise it's a great program and would match up against most for versitility.

amen, bro. amen and amen.

as i've mentioned before, with 6 weeks, we'd have 17,800 pts if enrolled, but we'll never give up our three favorite "occupy weeks", and the remaining 3 weeks if relinquished to DC points always only yield a net loss of power......have to reduce length of stays, drop down a season, etc. etc.

Plus we get very nice bonus weeks along the way when we trade those extra weeks with Interval, so I'm never going to accept a net loss. (With a bonus week we could easily get that extra Orlando week mentioned in a previous post for only $150, not valuable points.) We still get great trades, with a possibility of upgrading to a better season. That won't happen with DC. I get exactly what we paid for, and nothing less, sometimes more, and always will. The new system is just irrelevant for us.

 

[dioxide45]

I didnt enroll, I own at Grand Chateu, a 2 bdrm L/O, in the weeks system I could lock off and stay 2 full weeks there, with the new system I cant, thats the major factor stoping me from joining the points. Just my 2 cents....

You can still book your two weeks like you usually do and even continue to exchange them. You would save on II fees. You only add the option to use points, you aren't required to.

 

[rthib]

For me it is all about using the system to your advantage.

Enrollment was easy as I have two lockoff weeks, so the lock-off/free trade made that easy.

But with lock-offs and AC, after a while I end up with more weeks than I know what to do with.

This year we occupied at one home and then used a long ago deposit to get one week, but the second week had no II trade.
I was able to easily use points on a week I was no planning to use next year.

The saving to me was I was able to book three First class tickets at the lowest point price. By waiting until a week 52 showed up in II, I would have had to pay a penalty of almost 70K miles.

(As a side note: I did kept checking and never saw that week show up on II, so I doubt you could have booked the Christmas to New Years week with an AC, plus you would still be out what it cost to stay one extra night. Depending on checkin, a trade would require you to be gone by 10am either new years day or worse the day after New Years. We got to enjoy both. I did use a cheap trade to get the first week, that is the beauty of the new system, you can do both)

We have another stay coming up that is added on to a trip.
Only need 5 week nights, so cheap by points and no II skim of 2 days, plus I can book it now and again get cheaper flights. Still have enough points left over from this and previous trade to spend more days, and still have 3 II weeks left.

The key is to work the system.
You can not do point and book back into your own resort, but why would you want to. And if you are planning to one week for another, that is also not the point. But I like the flexibility and also the face that I am still paying less in fees than before.

 

[jimf41]

Using our converted weeks, either we have to travel in very off season times, accept smaller units or accept shorter vacations. We can't even stay at our home resorts in the view catagory/size units that are deeded.

My math is a little different here. Doug and I both own 3bdrm Silver weeks at Ocean Pointe. Under the weeks system we could pick the month of May, September, October and the first three weeks in December. A total of 20 weeks to pick from. Under the points system for the 4225 points given for a 3bdrm Silver unit we get to choose the last three weeks in May, all of June, July, August and October at a savings of 225 points per week, September at a savings of 1325 points per week for a total of 25 weeks. The balance of the former Silver season November and three first three weeks of December comes at an extra cost of 1625 points.

So lets see how I made out. I get a total of 5 extra weeks to pick from, out of a total of 25 where I actually accumulate extra points. I have access to the entire Gold season without having to go thru II for a trade. I can still get those November and December weeks like I always did with no charge to lockout, change my reservation or add a guest.

There are a lot of resorts where owners did not fair so well in point allocation. Most notably the Caribbean resorts. But Ocean Pointe Silver and Platinum owners, c'mon we made out like bandits.

 

[davidn247]

I tend to agree with you. I still have not figured out how to complete use the new systems yet but being a legacy/points owner seems to have advantages. I am still trying to find the best place to "rent" my extra points at. I would like to be revenue neutral if possible.

A tugger (GregT) created a mini-site for points rental. Highly recommended. The link is below:

http://members.boardhost.com/MVCDPoints/index.html

 

[TEDK63]

David,

Thanks for the pointer. One additional question. The site wants Legacy differentiated from Trust points. Is there a difference in how they are applied?

A tugger (GregT) created a mini-site for points
rental. Highly recommended. The link is below:

http://members.boardhost.com/MVCDPoints/index.html

 

[dougp26364]

My math is a little different here. Doug and I both own 3bdrm Silver weeks at Ocean Pointe. Under the weeks system we could pick the month of May, September, October and the first three weeks in December. A total of 20 weeks to pick from. Under the points system for the 4225 points given for a 3bdrm Silver unit we get to choose the last three weeks in May, all of June, July, August and October at a savings of 225 points per week, September at a savings of 1325 points per week for a total of 25 weeks. The balance of the former Silver season November and three first three weeks of December comes at an extra cost of 1625 points.

So lets see how I made out. I get a total of 5 extra weeks to pick from, out of a total of 25 where I actually accumulate extra points. I have access to the entire Gold season without having to go thru II for a trade. I can still get those November and December weeks like I always did with no charge to lockout, change my reservation or add a guest.

There are a lot of resorts where owners did not fair so well in point allocation. Most notably the Caribbean resorts. But Ocean Pointe Silver and Platinum owners, c'mon we made out like bandits.

Some resorts, and for that matter, resort weeks at the same resort, will play out differently.

I can't book ANY week at MGC with the same view/unit catagory for the points I'm given.

With Ocean Pointe, there are weeks that would be a cost savings but, many are not. We have typically traveled to Ocean Pointe the first week of November. Marriott does not give us enough points to book our unit. If I converted to points I'd have to accept an ocean side rather than an ocean front unit, take fewer days or take a smaller unit. I haven't looked for a while but, I believe even doing all those things I'd still end up with less than my deeded week or, less than what I purchased.

Yes the points system can be bent but, you better be good at playing twister to make the best use of the program. I find it tough to stretch those points so that I get enough value to warrent making points reservations vs exchange reservations.

IMHO, the DC works best for those who's situtation has changed significantly from when they purchased. Perhaps they can no longer take full weeks vacations. Perhaps they've changed jobs and don't have the vacation time they once had, allowing them to only be able to take weekend trips. Perhaps they really wish they'd bought that ocean front rather than ocean view and are willing to give up size, days or season just to get the view. It will work for some but for us, it's all about reducing our costs in the ala carte fee's. Points reservations have always resulted in a net loss for where we want to travel at the times/dates we would like to travel.


Fortunately the program has a little something for almost everyone. It's my opinion that, with a little more forethought and examination of how other programs work, Marriott could have done a much better job for their owners. As it is they've done a decent job for most multi week owners but have left little value for most single week owners. That's leaving money on the table. Money that other developers have learned to pick up vs leaving some owners feeling left out.

 

[m61376]

My math is a little different here. Doug and I both own 3bdrm Silver weeks at Ocean Pointe. Under the weeks system we could pick the month of May, September, October and the first three weeks in December. A total of 20 weeks to pick from. Under the points system for the 4225 points given for a 3bdrm Silver unit we get to choose the last three weeks in May, all of June, July, August and October at a savings of 225 points per week, September at a savings of 1325 points per week for a total of 25 weeks. The balance of the former Silver season November and three first three weeks of December comes at an extra cost of 1625 points.

So lets see how I made out. I get a total of 5 extra weeks to pick from, out of a total of 25 where I actually accumulate extra points. I have access to the entire Gold season without having to go thru II for a trade. I can still get those November and December weeks like I always did with no charge to lockout, change my reservation or add a guest.

There are a lot of resorts where owners did not fair so well in point allocation. Most notably the Caribbean resorts. But Ocean Pointe Silver and Platinum owners, c'mon we made out like bandits.

Good for those on your side of the curve, but as you said not so good for Caribbean resort owners. I can't book a single week in my Platinum season with my 2BR Aruba unit using the point equivalent. I'm not sure if I can book any 3BR Gold weeks either with my 3BR unit; if I remember correctly there were a few that I could, but only a handful. Interestingly, I got less points for my 3BR Gold than your 3BR Silver, and I can't book a week at Ocean Pointe that would cost less than half the price to rent on Marriott.com than the week I am giving up would cost.

There were some winners and some losers in the point allocation system, and clearly those who were ahead of the curve can make good use of the system. But those who weren't allocated even close to the average points for their season (and, in some cases, not even enough to book a single week in their season) certainly find themselves always trading down, so while the program is good for some, it is not for others.

Obviously, we all weigh the benefits/costs according to our needs and travel styles, and I am glad the program has been good for some people. I am disappointed, though, that Marriott did not come up with a more balanced program; it doesn't make sense that Marriott on one hand rents my week for 5-6k, but on the other hand I can't trade it for a week which Marriott rents for 2500 or so. For some, the benefit of flexibility and ease of use may offset the loss in value, so there may be many Caribbean week owners, for example, that still like the system, but personally it doesn't make a lot of sense to me. I am surprised that Marriott created a system with so many glaring inequities.

 

[dougp26364]

FWIW, I've always said Marriott messed up when they first assigned seasons at Ocean Pointe. I think that came through loud and clear when you look at how they've assigned points. For silver season week owners who would prefer to travel during gold season, the points assignments worked out well. I don't think you'll get a lot of gold week owners who feel the same. You might not even find a platinum week owner who feels the same unless they're wanting to trade down in season.

For that matter, searching with my silver season studio unit using the weeks exchange program in the past often yeilded one bedroom exchanges during gold season. It hasn't ever been a tough exchange. I don't feel that points has improved our position as far as exchanging out of our purchased season at our home resort. Sure we'd have had to pay the $139 exchange fee and the $75 lock-off fee to exchange our studio ocean front unit for a one bedroom ocean side unit but, you'd have to make that exchange for several years to make up for the enrollment fee and difference betwee the ala carte fee's and yearly membership fee.

 

[rthib]

I don't feel that points has improved our position as far as exchanging out of our purchased season at our home resort. Sure we'd have had to pay the $139 exchange fee and the $75 lock-off fee to exchange our studio ocean front unit for a one bedroom ocean side unit but, you'd have to make that exchange for several years to make up for the enrollment fee and difference betwee the ala carte fee's and yearly membership fee.

I do not think the points program is good (or was designed) for enrolled owners to use points to trade back into their own resort.
In fact it is specifically designed to discourage that.

If you are going home, use the weeks.

But from a pricing stand point, look at what you paid for your week and points you get then figure out what it would cost someone to buy the same thing in points. Marriott gets very little $$ from enrolled owners, so the program was designed to meet some needs - but if it was great from all owners who already bought, why would anyone want to buy points??

I think I am happy because I followed the first rule of time shares, I bought in a location and season I liked. That way, no matter what changes are made to program I always get what I paid for.

If you want to always go to you home resort and use your week I do not think enrolling is a good idea.
If you don't own lock offs, don't think you will see the value.

If you own multi lock-off weeks and exchange, it is pretty easy decision.

For me the math was:
Own 2 Lock-off weeks.
Stay in 1Bdrm and trade other 3 weeks.

II membership list is $89 but(multi years discount etc) = $50
So 2 x $75 lockoff = $150
3 Trades (3 x $1x9 depending on area) = $300+
So total cost each year was $500+

With Points, same thing cost $165 or a savings of at least $335/yr
So two years and it enrollment payed just in fees.
Add that is giving the 800 point bonus no value
(for me it was two extra nights at T/S)

Plus each year I ended up with 6 weeks (1 home, 3 deposit and 2 AC)
So if I didn't use all of them I had years trying to figure out what to do with extra weeks, or using partial weeks I can book what I want.

The math was easy.

 

[jont]

They are also working for me

Here's the most recent example of how points are working for me.
Last summer we decided to go to Frenchman's Cove in July 2012. Since I had a week already deposited with II ( done just before the DC rollout) I placed an ongoing request. After a few weeks I became anxious that my trade wouldn't come thru due to the possible impact of the DC on II availabilty. So I booked the week with points as a backup and kept the II request. A few weeks later my II request came thru so now I had back to back weeks at Frenchman's Cove. Not bad, except my kids refuse to spend 2 weeks away. So I put the week I got thru points for rent and was able to rent it last month for about 2x the maintenance fees (I used my MGC week). During the holidays, my wife a I decide it would be ok to spend 2-3 extra days on the Virgin Islands. So yesterday,I call my VOA (don't have enough points to see it online) if there is any availability. There is so I go on GregT point rental site and find the amount of points in need. I make the payment via Paypal and the points are in my account first thing this morning. I go online and make the reservation I need and now we are good to go.
Learning to work the points system from fellow tuggers made this all possible. Thank you guys and good luck with your future plans.

 

[kjd]

I have to agree with the OP on this one. The ability to extend a week to a ten or eleven day vacation with a mid week-checkout is a real benefit. Or just visiting an area for a few days without having to use a full week is also a good thing. Problem is that unless you buy more points you won't have much ability to extend a vacation.

What has worked for me is to take a weaker trading unit like a gold or silver and turn it in for points. By doing this the skim is less noticable and you have some points available to use at your discretion. Even though the points must be used up in a few years the flexibility is worth it. I like the combination of DC points, home resort weeks, II lockoff tradable weeks and MRP's as a mix to really make nice vacation packages.

 

[Mamianka]

I do not think the points program is good (or was designed) for enrolled owners to use points to trade back into their own resort.
In fact it is specifically designed to discourage that.

If you are going home, use the weeks.

My thoughts, too - BUT we do not like ever using the small side of our lockoffs - we would rather stay four or five nights in a master suite (using points) than 7 nights (on a trade) in a small unit. So - we are toying around with giving in our MGC one year for points, go back there in the master unit with points (sound dumb, I know), and then taking the points that remain (that would have been the small part) and going someplace else (Florida?) for 4-5 mights, but in a master suite. From the beginning, many of us realized that (skim aside) you can work the points to trade time for space. Even though we are out of the room a lot, if we had to stay a week in a small unit, there were be a murder-suicide at some nice Marriott. What we do not like is having to give up our ENTIRE 2BR place (no locked off) to get into some of the nicer 2BR-only places - like Crystal Shores ( if we could even get in.) Most of the time, is is just us 2 - we do not travel with others that would use the other bedroom. Still learning - and not the wheeler-dealers that some folks on TUG are. We hear of folks trading their Master, and getting 2 BR - worked forus before - but doubt that this would work for Crystal . . .

 

[Topfuelweb]

Clarification please

I am trying to figure out the DC points deal. I own 2 weeks EOY at the Marriott Maui Ocean Club which they tell are worth 5850 for each week for a total of 11,700. I then looked up what it would cost in points to book at the same resort and it says on the website that the points required are 7000/week. So it looks like I am in the ditch by 1150 points per week for a total of 2300 points. Am I missing something here??? I also notice that if I use the points to go to MGV in Orlando and if I don't go in peak times, (using the rate card from the web site May 3-June 6 travel window for a 2 bdrm) the weekly rate is 1900 points so in theory I could have 6 weeks in Orlando. I guess if the points were always going to be the same I may think of it but what are the chances of that?? It looks like you would need to look at every resort and figure what the points are at every one you would want to go to and figure out if it works for you...It seems quite confusing to figure out the true value. In my case I loose out to going back to Maui, but benefit to go to lower rated resorts. Are my assumptions correct I think I have done my homework, but I am unsure.

amen, bro. amen and amen.

as i've mentioned before, with 6 weeks, we'd have 17,800 pts if enrolled, but we'll never give up our three favorite "occupy weeks", and the remaining 3 weeks if relinquished to DC points always only yield a net loss of power......have to reduce length of stays, drop down a season, etc. etc.

Plus we get very nice bonus weeks along the way when we trade those extra weeks with Interval, so I'm never going to accept a net loss. (With a bonus week we could easily get that extra Orlando week mentioned in a previous post for only $150, not valuable points.) We still get great trades, with a possibility of upgrading to a better season. That won't happen with DC. I get exactly what we paid for, and nothing less, sometimes more, and always will. The new system is just irrelevant for us.

 

[puckmanfl]

good morning

Top fuel....

You understand it ,just fine..What you are referring to is the skim!!! About 80 threads on this... not going to rehash it, but yes, you lose points when you exchange into your own or like properties... Sort of a hidden exchange fee!!!

Benefits for the owner of a high value week such as hawaii is you can get 6 weeks in Orlando...With old system you could get 4 if you lock off, 2 if you didn't. Ski week and Hawaii owners always had to trade down with II...

The good news is you can play BOTH games...!!! II and DCpoints...

 

[rthib]

It looks like you would need to look at every resort and figure what the points are at every one you would want to go to and figure out if it works for you...It seems quite confusing to figure out the true value.

You understand it correctly.
The points program is designed to discourage you from using points at your own resort and encourage you to make mid-week reservations to get maximum value.

If you enroll, you do not lose your home weeks and if you like to stay at your home resort, you can do that.

Some people refer to the difference in value as the "skim", but as you noted, before if you traded down to Orlando or used less than a full week, under the old system you were subject to the "II skim".

If you have multiple-weeks and lock-off, then you may pay for the program in fees savings and get the point flexibility as a bonus.
Math is a little different with EOY.

Also, for what it is worth you qualify for Premier status which gives you a few more points options and also a discount of points needed if you book during "flex period".

 

[Topfuelweb]

DC

Thanks for the clarification, it is quite interesting as you peel back the onion so to speak what is involved in timeshare ownership and all the things you need to be aware of. I will look up the skim and try to make sure I know what is going on there as well. I am glad I stumbled across TUG as the information here is awesome, thanks everyone.

 

[dougp26364]

All points programs encourage exchange within the system. The problem with Marriott's is that you don't get enough points for your home resort weeks to match the exchanges you were getting with weeks exchanges if you utilize points. In Marriott's mind, it's more like for like but, in my mind I'm giving up value.

I know I keep going back to comparing Marriott with HGVC and DRI but, those are the two programs I'm familiar with and use every year. With HGVC I can move from my Plat. 2 bedroom unit to another Plat. 2 bedroom unit within the system. IOW, like for like. If I want, I can upgrade to a plus or premier unit (better view/location) or, I can move down to a lower season or smaller size.

With DRI I can do the same but, if I want to reserve only the 1 bedroom side, there's not enough points left over to reserve a studio unit for later in the year. That's DRI's "skim". With my fixed week unit in DRI I do have the option to keep my week or have it converted to points. With our floating week, I'm not afforded that option automatically. Perhaps I could call and keep the float week in the weeks program vs their points program but, for us it's a moot point as I can easily work their points reservations system to get the same value out of points I was getting in the weeks exchange system. Actually, I've always felt I was getting better value in points with DRI than history shows I was getting with weeks exchanges.

Don't get me wrong, the flexiblity points offers is outstanding. However of the three points based reservations systems in which we belong, Marriott's is by far the weakest and offers the least value. I have been very dissapointed with their points product in both value and flexiblity.

There very well may come a day when I need the flexablity of partial week reservations or simply want to pay the price to upgrade a view. Things are constantly changing at work and there could come a point in time where some value is better than no value, thus points reservations of partial weeks, weekends or high priced view catagories could salvage some value if things change drastically from what we now consider our norm. It was one of the minor reasons we joined.

What I like most about the DC is the one membership fee rather than the ala carte pricing. I've made excellent use of that feature and it works VERY well for us. When I was considering making a change to a reservation date, cost was not a factor and making the change didn't leave a bad taste in my mouth because of an additional fee.

With HGVC, the flexiblity is there but, they ding you for a lot of little extra fee's. That's HGVC's "skim". To make a reservation at another resort costs you $69, to save points has a fee, changing a reservation has a fee ect.....

Every system has a way of collecting money, either directly out of your pocket or on the back end in some fashion. Those of us who speak out against the "skim" do so because it interfers enough with our style of vacationing we feel compelled to say something. Marriott's program and how they handle their "skim" creates a situation that isn't good for a number of owners and, IMHO, discourages a large number from participating. To me that's a shame but, it is what it is. There are aspects of the program I like, those I don't like I just don't utilize.

 

[Topfuelweb]

One more question....if I opt into the DC points, do my MF's then go up which based on what I can gather would put me up about $400/yr as I pay about $1800 currently based on my two weeks EOY. Is there any other pitfalls I need to be aware of.

Thanks

 

[dougp26364]

One more question....if I opt into the DC points, do my MF's then go up which based on what I can gather would put me up about $400/yr as I pay about $1800 currently based on my two weeks EOY. Is there any other pitfalls I need to be aware of.

Thanks

You're MF's stay the same. You still own your deeded weeks. You gain the option to convert those weeks to points but, they are legacy week points insead of trust points. The only additional fee is the yearly membership fee.

From what I've been reading the differences between trust points and legacy points has narrowed. Originally Marriott had some convulted way to decide if a reservation was possible based on whether or not the available week was deposited via the trust or a legacy week. I believe they've seen the error of doing things that way and it appears from recent posts that if a night is available to reserve using points, it no longer matters where those points came from or from which "bucket" they were deposited.