HGVC New Purchase

[Montedk]

Ok everyone, I need to start out by saying that I am completely new to these types of vacation ownership/timeshare programs (which will likely become very evident soon!). My wife and I just purchased new from Orlando yesterday. We made the decision because to us the numbers seemed to make sense, but at the same time knew that we were able to rescind within 10 days. Honestly, we didn't do enough research beforehand and didn't want the opportunity to pass us by if it truly was as good of a deal as the salesman convinced us that it was.

I know already after reading several posts that most (if not all) of you will tell me to rescind immediately. What's not completely apparent is why, and how the numbers work out differently for buying resale. I'd like to understand what I'd be able to get a comparable package for in resale to fully see why everyone considers buying new to be such a bad deal.

Here are the details of the package that we purchased:

3400 Points on Even numbered years (EOY) for the Gold season
$868 MF EOY + $176 Club Dues Annually
7000 Bonus points to be used within 2 years (unless transferred to RCI to gain an additional 2 years)
$13750 Purchase Price

To us this seemed like a good plan for us. We don't need a lot of points as we don't travel a ton, but when we do we'd like to be able to go to see some nice resorts. Right now, we typically will go on one decent 5 night vacation each year, mostly outside of the peak seasons when the prices are lower. That being said, these prices didn't seem too bad to us. But what am I missing??

 

[brp]

Rescind. You have substantially overpaid for this. A dozen additional people will chime in to say the same thing.

Rescind immediately. Then come back and talk some more about resale. And join TUG.

But don't delay now, provided, of course, that you are still within the rescission period,

Cheers.

 

[Montedk]

Rescind. You have substantially overpaid for this. A dozen additional people will chime in to say the same thing.

Rescind immediately. Then come back and talk some more about resale. And join TUG.

But don't delay now, provided, of course, that you are still within the rescission period,

Cheers.

Yes, we just purchased yesterday so we technically have 9 days left. I knew everyone would say to rescind, but can you explain WHY? What is the appropriate value for this type of package? Why is this deal such a poor deal? Compared to what we would pay without the timeshare, it seems to be a better deal in the long run.

 

[dayooper]

On the Tug marketplace, there’s an every year 3400 point for $900 with $610 maintenance fees. You can get an every year 7000 point platinum 2 bedroom for around $7000 with around $850 MF’s.

There are people that have to give away the units you paid over $13000 for. Rescind your purchase, research the different types of resorts and purchase resale.

 

[brp]

Compared to what we would pay without the timeshare, it seems to be a better deal in the long run.

Definitely. No question about this. As @dayooper noted, you can just get this for a lot less. Also, you will find that 3400 EOY will not be enough

Cheers.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

Rescind. Not sure which property you are looking at in Orlando, but do a search on the Bargain Deals Forum and it is full of free Orlando timeshares. Each has pluses and minuses so you need to research to know what you are buying. Here are two HGVC listings where you could get for free/almost free and save $13k. These come around frequently especially in the fall when people don't want to pay 2020 MF.

You get all the same benefits as a developer buyer.

Free 3400 annual HGVC Tuscany

https://tugbbs.com/forums/index.php...international-drive-free.257875/#post-2017307

Free Park Soleil EOY 3400 points

https://tugbbs.com/forums/index.php...oints-eoy-even-1-bedroom.258500/#post-2022577

 

[Montedk]

So based on your responses so far, would it be correct to say that the deal I purchased would not be so bad if resale didn't exist and it were only compared to the alternative of always paying out of pocket for vacations? I think that's where logic failed me at the presentation, so I'm just trying to fully understand this before making any quick decisions (again).

It seems to me that the only reason it's a terrible idea to buy new is because there are so many resale's available for a better price (which is completely valid). Just trying to make sure I'm understanding this correctly.

Also, thank you for all your help! I'm so glad I found Tugs before it was too late.

 

[TheTimeTraveler]

Ok everyone, I need to start out by saying that I am completely new to these types of vacation ownership/timeshare programs (which will likely become very evident soon!). My wife and I just purchased new from Orlando yesterday. We made the decision because to us the numbers seemed to make sense, but at the same time knew that we were able to rescind within 10 days. Honestly, we didn't do enough research beforehand and didn't want the opportunity to pass us by if it truly was as good of a deal as the salesman convinced us that it was.

I know already after reading several posts that most (if not all) of you will tell me to rescind immediately. What's not completely apparent is why, and how the numbers work out differently for buying resale. I'd like to understand what I'd be able to get a comparable package for in resale to fully see why everyone considers buying new to be such a bad deal.

Here are the details of the package that we purchased:

3400 Points on Even numbered years (EOY) for the Gold season
$868 MF EOY + $176 Club Dues Annually
7000 Bonus points to be used within 2 years (unless transferred to RCI to gain an additional 2 years)
$13750 Purchase Price

To us this seemed like a good plan for us. We don't need a lot of points as we don't travel a ton, but when we do we'd like to be able to go to see some nice resorts. Right now, we typically will go on one decent 5 night vacation each year, mostly outside of the peak seasons when the prices are lower. That being said, these prices didn't seem too bad to us. But what am I missing??

RESCIND IMMEDIATELY if for no other reason than to first research what you are buying. If you are on TUG then you can better understand your purchase and how much you will save by buying on the resale market.

Remember; Rescind now while you have the opportunity to do so. You can always go back to your salesperson and purchase again should you feel you were getting a bargain.


Once you rescind you can go out and celebrate a sharp decision






.

 

[Grammarhero]

You overpaid by $13.8k. Rescind if not for you, then your family. You owe it to your family to spend your money wisely.

Research Ts. If you still like Hilton after researching for two months, get one of their free resale Ts.

 

[PigsDad]

It seems to me that the only reason it's a terrible idea to buy new is because there are so many resale's available for a better price (which is completely valid). Just trying to make sure I'm understanding this correctly.

Yes, that is the core of the reason to rescind -- you can buy the exact same timeshare package resale for much less.

Most of us on this forum are happy HGVC owners, and think HGVC is a great timeshare to own. But given that you know little about the system (not blaming you; there is just lots to learn), our collective advice will be to Rescind, Research, and buy Resale (if, after taking more time, you decide HGVC will work for you).

Also, the deed you bought is a 1BR Gold week. In HGVC, the maintenance fees (MF) is based on room size, so if you bought a 1BR Platinum week at the same resort, your MF would be the same, but you would have 4800 points! Since you pay MF every year, maximizing the MF/point ratio is very important. That is also why a Gold or lower week is less desirable.

Kurt

 

[GMan82]

I never realized EOY weeks even existed until I came to TUG. My salesman never offered: mine were 5000 or 8400 points only. At the time I didn’t know what gold vs Platinum meant.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

Bottom line: You drive this 3400 EOY Orlando "off the lot" after passing the rescission period and it's worth zero ($0, nada) on the resale market. How's that for a good reason to rescind?

For $6 - 9k you could buy a resale 7k pt annual in Orlando which gives you a 2 bedroom at these resorts or approx two weeks in a 1bdrm anywhere in the HGVC system. You could pocket the difference in price, or look for a resale EOY for less

There are reputable real estate brokers who can help you find an ideal timeshare for your situation so you don't need to do this alone.

 

[JIMinNC]

Eighteen months ago we bought an every year, 7000 point contract at HGVC Sea World for $6500 plus closing costs and HGVC activation fees. Those fees add maybe $1000 to the price, so for about $7500 (just a little over half of what you paid), you would have have over twice the points you have every other year but would have them every year instead. Your annual maintenance fee would be more, about $1200 every year instead of $868 EOY, but you would have 14,000 points every two years instead of just 3400.

If you really don't want or need more than 3400 points EOY, then you should be able to get one of those for almost free. Many people who buy those small contracts find them to be insufficient, become unhappy, and just want to get rid of them.

 

[GTLINZ]

3400 Points on Even numbered years (EOY) for the Gold season
$868 MF EOY + $176 Club Dues Annually
7000 Bonus points to be used within 2 years (unless transferred to RCI to gain an additional 2 years)
$13750 Purchase Price

The issue is not only were you overcharged, but they sold you something that is virtually worthless for a tidy sum of cash that you need to get back as soon as possible. I do not know how the timeshare "salespersons" sleep at night. RESCIND NOW.

A feature of HGVC units is that you pay the same maintenance fee no matter the season. My 4800 point platinum 1br in Orlando is worth a 2-3 thousand bucks on the open market - but a gold 3400 gold unit would be hard to sell. A silver 2400 point 1br is the same maintenance fee and would take a bribe to find a buyer. The numbers bear out over the long run because of the points to MF ratio. And to make it worse you got an EOY unit - you pay the HGVC fee (approaching $200) every year but pay the MF EOY. The vacations you would get with 3400 points EOY and paying the MFs likely would not beat out paying the going rate thru Hilton. And you paid a lot of money for the privilege of being taken advantage of.

So the first rule is that you almost always buy platinum. The second rule is that you buy resale - you retain almost all privileges (except Elite) and you pay closer to WHAT IT IS ACTUALLY WORTH ON THE OPEN MARKET.

So please RESCIND while you can and then figure out the details later - unless you simply do not care about your money.

 

[Panina]

I have gotten 3400 points for free and I have also given away 3400 for free. There is no need to pay $13750. Keep the money in your pocket. Watch the bargain section here on tug and you can find a freebie if all you want is 3400 points.

 

[ski_sierra]

I think you overpaid by $18k, not just $13k. Why? You were sold a terrible week.
It will not be easy to sell once you are done using it. Personally, somebody would have to pay me $5k to take over the week that you just bought. It has negative value due to the obligation of high maintenance fees.

For reference, I recently paid $6300 for a 7000 points resale week with MF of $800.


Can you calculate the cost of your 5 night vacations for next 10 to 15 years and compare it to what you will pay if keep this week? Since you travel off peak, it will be easy for you to rent timeshares on hilton.com, Redweek or Airbnb. And you won't be locked in to the HGVC network. My guess is your cost of keeping this HGVC week for 10 years will be 2-3x compared to renting similar accommodations.

 

[alwysonvac]

Yes, we just purchased yesterday so we technically have 9 days left. I knew everyone would say to rescind, but can you explain WHY? What is the appropriate value for this type of package? Why is this deal such a poor deal? Compared to what we would pay without the timeshare, it seems to be a better deal in the long run.

Because...
(1) You’ll only have one chance to rescind. But you’ll have endless opportunities to buy direct from the developer.
(2) The sales folks are known to stretch the truth (say whatever it takes) in order to make the sale. It’s best to give yourself time to learn the real facts and make an informed decision (learn what would work best for you and your family)
(3) The sales folks have been known to sell the lowest point package to get your foot in the door. It’s their way of getting members into a constant loop of developer upgrades. It’s best to figure out where you would like to go and look at when you normally travel. This will help you determine the appropriate amount of points you’ll need vs having the sales person drive the decision for you.
(4) You’ll save ten of thousands by buying resale vs buying direct from the developer. If you change your mind a month from now, here are the asking prices you’ll be looking at (see below). Why so low? There are simply more sellers than buyers. Some sellers eventually realize it’s best to give away their low value week for free vs competing with the masses for a buyer.

Resale “asking” Prices from http://www.judikoz.com/Search.aspx

​

Resale “asking” Prices from https://www.sellingtimeshares.net/category/listings/hilton/

​

Additional threads you might find helpful

• Just purchased but having second thoughts [merged] - https://tugbbs.com/forums/index.php?threads/just-purchased-but-having-second-thoughts-merged.274650/
• Rescind or not? - https://tugbbs.com/forums/index.php?threads/rescind-or-not.287154/

Good Luck and Welcome to TUG

 

[Denise L]

Definitely, rescind, as you knew everyone would say. You can always buy the exact same "deal" later once you do all of your research. Salespeople will always try to make you think that the deal will be gone once you walk away, but they are obviously trying to do whatever it takes to get you to buy.

I agree with you that timeshares are a great savings over paying retail for hotels, etc., but you can get an even better savings if you rescind and buy on the resale market (or get a bargain contract for practically nothing).

 

[Grammarhero]

Let’s contrast this to buying a new car. After two weeks, that new car will depreciate by 30 percent.

In great contrast, your timeshare will depreciate by 100 percent two weeks after your purchase.

In almost any Ts sales presentation, the salesman/saleswoman will offer $20-$25k, if rejected the supervisor will offer $9-15k, and if rejected the closer will offer $4-7k, typically the resort’s last, best final offer. While I applaud you for getting to the supervisor stage, you didn’t get to the closer stage or the resort’s last, best final offer, which isn’t good itself.

The closer is described on sales tip 8 at https://jbarrows.com/blog/vegas-sales-techniques/ the author of that post, for a Hilton Ts, actually flew down to FL just to hand-deliver the rescission letter. No need to fly to Hilton in your case. Just send a certified letter.

 

[RX8]

You mention buying “new”. There is no such thing as a new timeshare. It is the exact same rooms you are staying in whether or not you bought “new” from the developer or if you bought resale. To expand on grammerhero’s car analogy, resale has the same condition and same miles as “new” except it is thousands of dollars cheaper.

 

[Grammarhero]

You mention buying “new”. There is no such thing as a new timeshare. It is the exact same rooms you are staying in whether or not you bought “new” from the developer or if you bought resale. To expand on grammerhero’s car analogy, resale has the same condition and same miles as “new” except it is thousands of dollars cheaper.

@Montedk to expand further, would you rather buy a new car for $13.8k yourself, or buy that exact same “new car” from another person two weeks later for $0 who originally bought for $13.8k?

 

[Grammarhero]

So based on your responses so far, would it be correct to say that the deal I purchased would not be so bad if resale didn't exist and it were only compared to the alternative of always paying out of pocket for vacations? I think that's where logic failed me at the presentation, so I'm just trying to fully understand this before making any quick decisions (again).

It seems to me that the only reason it's a terrible idea to buy new is because there are so many resale's available for a better price (which is completely valid). Just trying to make sure I'm understanding this correctly.

Also, thank you for all your help! I'm so glad I found Tugs before it was too late.

Even if there were no resale market, you still got a bad deal. You could have gotten to the third stage, with the closer who would have offered you $4-7k.

 

[GT75]

Welcome to TUG. You have come to the right place to get honest answers to your questions. If we haven't answered all of your questions, please free to ask.

btw, I will also agree with the advice already given and strongly suggest that you rescind. I think that HGVC has a very good product that I am very happy with but you can purchase it for a lot less resale. We can help you do that too. HGVC treats their resales customers very well with all of the same benefits except that it will not count towards elite level (which starts at 14K points and not worth very much anyway) and you won't get any bonus points (you will just save a lot of money). We can also help you make a better more informed purchase to ensure that you get exactly want you need. I also believe that you will need more points.

 

[brp]

We may now be above the dozen I predicted

But you'll see that we're all, basically, speaking the with one voice here.

Cheers.

 

[CPNY]

Ok everyone, I need to start out by saying that I am completely new to these types of vacation ownership/timeshare programs (which will likely become very evident soon!). My wife and I just purchased new from Orlando yesterday. We made the decision because to us the numbers seemed to make sense, but at the same time knew that we were able to rescind within 10 days. Honestly, we didn't do enough research beforehand and didn't want the opportunity to pass us by if it truly was as good of a deal as the salesman convinced us that it was.

I know already after reading several posts that most (if not all) of you will tell me to rescind immediately. What's not completely apparent is why, and how the numbers work out differently for buying resale. I'd like to understand what I'd be able to get a comparable package for in resale to fully see why everyone considers buying new to be such a bad deal.

Here are the details of the package that we purchased:

3400 Points on Even numbered years (EOY) for the Gold season
$868 MF EOY + $176 Club Dues Annually
7000 Bonus points to be used within 2 years (unless transferred to RCI to gain an additional 2 years)
$13750 Purchase Price

To us this seemed like a good plan for us. We don't need a lot of points as we don't travel a ton, but when we do we'd like to be able to go to see some nice resorts. Right now, we typically will go on one decent 5 night vacation each year, mostly outside of the peak seasons when the prices are lower. That being said, these prices didn't seem too bad to us. But what am I missing??

Any updates? Follow the instructions on rescinding to the letter.

I had an old co worker call me out of the blue because she and her husband bough HGVC for 21K through the developer, since she knew I owned TS. I jumped through the phone and had her rescind. She was orig upset that she was “sold”. I told her to forget that, it happens to everyone. Bottom line is, you, like her, saw value in ownership. We all do or else we wouldn’t be here! I’m known for always going on vacation. It’s a running joke “where are you going these days?” It’s a fact that vacation ownership members do travel a lot! It’s a great thing. Anyway, she rescinded, got her 21K back and bought the same amount of points resale for $1,500. Don’t feel bad you paid that much. Just buy resale and you’ll really enjoy your ownership. Let us know what you decide to do.

Remember, rescind doesn’t mean don’t own! It just means don’t over pay