Help My Poor Naive Grandmother...

[wazeek]

My grandmother agreed to 4 Time Shares a number of years back. Now, after many bad experiences at the resorts, she wants to get rid of them. She also just recently realized that these Time Shares are a part of her estate and her grandchildren will be liable for the fees.

She has 4 Time Shares with Wyndham (usually she goes to Mexico), she gets in the 100,000 range of points. She OWES $17,000 plus the maintenance fees.

She met with a company called Transfer Smart yesterday, agreed to a contract, and then called me last night to see what I thought about it. Here are the HUGE red flags:

1) They asked for a fee upfront. They claim they sell the Time Shares to corporations. They also claim they USED to allow people to donate Time Shares, but no longer.
2) They told her to stop paying the Time Share and go into FORECLOSURE on purpose as it will only hurt her credit for 7 years
3) She only has 3 days to rescind the contract

Clearly the only thing Transfer Smart transfers is scam money to their account. I will tell her today to cancel that deal.

My question is, what is the best thing for her to do? She would even be willing to pay off the $17,000 owed and give the Time Share away for free. She really just wants to get rid of it. Would this be a possibility, or would there be an even better option?

I can get additional information if that would help. I do not know much about the time shares she has or what the typical things one would need to know to assess the situation.

Thank you all in advance.

 

[presley]

Nobody has to accept it after she dies.

You don't have to pay upfront fees to go into foreclosure. Going into foreclosure is a good idea for a older person who wants to get out of their TS and doesn't plan on going into debt for anything.

Get her out of whatever contract she agreed to yesterday. Have her stop payment immediately.

If she wants to continue using her TS, she can continue to pay and use it. Nobody has to take it on when she dies. You can all refuse it.

If she doesn't want to use it anymore, let them foreclose on it. Who cares? You only need good credit if you plan on going into debt. Planning on going into debt is a dumb plan.

 

[T_R_Oglodyte]

She met with a company called Transfer Smart yesterday, agreed to a contract, and then called me last night to see what I thought about it. Here are the HUGE red flags:

1) They asked for a fee upfront. They claim they sell the Time Shares to corporations. ...

This is a classic line used by scammers, and if there were any shadow of doubt this removes it.

Corporations are not buying timeshares. There is no reason for them to do so, no advantage for them to do so. There are no special tax breaks that corporations receive for owning timeshares.

This is a complete fabrication.

****

As you've probably deduced, all that's going to happen here is the company is going to take your grandmother's money and do nothing. In the meantime, they're advising her to default.

 

[wazeek]

In what circumstance would stopping all payments on the TS and going into foreclosure be a bad idea? In all fairness, this is my grandmother-in-law. I believe she has assets from inheritance and clearly enough cash on hand to pay off the full TS. I doubt she will be buying another house anytime and she can probably buy her next car with cash. Thus she may not need credit worthiness. Can the TS sue and go after her current assets?

 

[Ridewithme38]

In what circumstance would stopping all payments on the TS and going into foreclosure be a bad idea? In all fairness, this is my grandmother-in-law. I believe she has assets from inheritance and clearly enough cash on hand to pay off the full TS. I doubt she will be buying another house anytime and she can probably buy her next car with cash. Thus she may not need credit worthiness. Can the TS sue and go after her current assets?

Major surgery that her insurance may not cover, Long term care if she becomes unable to care for herself are just two things i can think of that will require a credit check....Alot of the time Savings are wiped out VERY quickly for the elderly when they get sick and if it something major....She'll need her credit

How many points does she actually have? Is she a Platinum owner? Maybe she can enter into a contract with someone who will be willing to pay her maintance fees in exchange for having their name added to the deeds

 

[wazeek]

Didn't think about those circumstances, Ridewithme38. Guess I am too young still...

As far as the foreclosure route, can litigation proceed to go after her current assets? Would Wyndham send this amount to a collection agency? I know that is it fairly easy to offer a settlement amount to a collection agency for typically half the amount owed with the stipulation that they remove all records of the debt from all three reporting agencies. Would that be a possibility a few years down the road?

 

[glypnirsgirl]

oh my - what a quandary.

You have the first step correct. Rescind the contract. Stop payment on check immediately or report to credit card issuer as soon as she gets her statement if it has not been credited. Send the rescission letter by certified mail.

And ride's questions are very relevant. How many total points does she own? Where is her home resort?

elaine

 

[wazeek]

I do not have that info with me right now. I'll get it from her later today and respond when I have it.

 

[T_R_Oglodyte]

Didn't think about those circumstances, Ridewithme38. Guess I am too young still...

As far as the foreclosure route, can litigation proceed to go after her current assets? Would Wyndham send this amount to a collection agency? I know that is it fairly easy to offer a settlement amount to a collection agency for typically half the amount owed with the stipulation that they remove all records of the debt from all three reporting agencies. Would that be a possibility a few years down the road?

Those are legal questions that are you better off asking of a lawyer with specific experience in debt collections, bankruptcy, etc.

 

[DeniseM]

Major surgery that her insurance may not cover, Long term care if she becomes unable to care for herself are just two things i can think of that will require a credit check....Alot of the time Savings are wiped out VERY quickly for the elderly when they get sick and if it something major....She'll need her credit

How many points does she actually have? Is she a Platinum owner? Maybe she can enter into a contract with someone who will be willing to pay her maintance fees in exchange for having their name added to the deeds

She OWES $17,000 plus the maintenance fees.

Putting one's name on the deed may make them liable for the mortgage payments...

 

[Ridewithme38]

She OWES $17,000 plus the maintenance fees.

She would even be willing to pay off the $17,000 owed and give the Time Share away for free. She really just wants to get rid of it. Would this be a possibility, or would there be an even better option?

How many points does she actually have? Is she a Platinum owner? Maybe she can enter into a contract with someone who will be willing to pay her maintance fees in exchange for having their name added to the deeds

I think, with the market the way it is, its impossible to sell, the best option is to pay off the $17,000 and IF a platinum owner, have someone sign on the deed in exchange for them paying the MF's and having full use of the points and the Platinum benefits

 

[DeniseM]

I think, with the market the way it is, its impossible to sell, the best option is to pay off the $17,000 and IF a platinum owner, have someone sign on the deed in exchange for them paying the MF's and having full use of the points and the Platinum benefits

If she's going to do that, it would make more sense to completely transfer it over to someone and get out of it completely - as long as she is on the deed - she is liable for the MF.

 

[Ridewithme38]

If she's going to do that, it would make more sense to completely transfer it over to someone and get out of it completely - as long as she is on the deed - she is liable for the MF.

It's the difference between buying and renting...To be fair i'm a bit paranoid, i'd never Buy a TS on a beach because of the wear and tear of the salt water....But i'd rent it

No, wait, i just reread what i wrote, you're right! Let me say that again, DeniseM you are Right! It makes no sense to put the 'points managers' name on the deed, you can just setup a simple contract that allows him full use of the points and Platinum privileges without his name on the deed, that way, the grandmother has a legal contract that the 'manager' signed that he will pay...and in 100years(ok maybe not that long) when grandma passes away no one will have to take on the responsibility of the TS

wazeek: I think something like what i outlined above will be the only way your grandmother can get out from under the expense of MF's there are hundreds upon hundreds of Timeshares that don't even sell for $1 on ebay almost weekly....The contract protects your mother from the 'points manager' not paying AND she doesn't have to worry about the MF's anymore

 

[wazeek]

Thank you all for the advice thus far. I just talked to her and she already cancelled the contract with Transfer Smart, and she is now going to call her card company and have them issue a new card under fraud suspicion. Score another point for the TUG community.

As for the additional information, I was incorrect. She has 4 TS, 3 of them are paid off and she wants to keep them. She does travel a few times a year and lets the grandkids take trips if they pay maintenance fees for the month.

The one she does want to sell is the Wyndham due to bad experiences with their customer service. What she has is:

La Belle Maison, New Orleans - Home Resort
Floating Weeks, 2 Bd
254,000 Points (61,000 on account... whatever that means )
VIP Member

She doesn't know the exact fees, but they are around $200/month. (She pays $500/month to pay the deed).

Paying $17k to get rid of it is a tough pill to swallow, but she understands it costs to get the monkey off her back. Destroying the credit score by foreclosing is not an option. Seems to be a pride/moral stance more than anything.


As far as the other advice to have a "points manager" take over MF, that would be great, but from a logical standpoint, why would anyone agree to this. Wouldn't that person just want the deed if they agree to pay the fees? How would Wyndham honor this contract if the manager stopped paying the MF?

 

[ronparise]

the suggestion to have someone "manage" the wyndham account was based on the assumption that your grandmother is a VIP with Wyhdham...Those benefits dont transfer with a sale

I wonder how your grandmother is a VIP...Im betting its a temporary thing and those odd 61000 points are bonus points. When they are gone so is the VIP designation

 

[ronparise]

To give you an idea of what a La Belle Maison contract is worth today (more than the average Wyndham points contract) see ebay sale #200721141119

610000 points, 3 hours left to go, high bid is just $1007

 

[ronparise]

heres a thought


Wyndham has a program whereby they sell "assumable loan" contracts...So I know at least in some cases they get this stuff back and resell it for the amount due.... I see the back end, when they offer something to be to assumed...but I dont know who to talk to to get them to actually take it back

 

[tschwa2]

Wyndham has a program whereby they sell "assumable loan" contracts...So I know at least in some cases they get this stuff back and resell it for the amount due.... I see the back end, when they offer something to be to assumed...but I dont know who to talk to to get them to actually take it back.

Maybe its from dead people with loans who's families refuse to take the TS and the loan. I can't imagine Wyndham accepting back something with a loan unless they are setting up an even bigger loan when purchasing more points.

 

[antjmar]

Maybe its from dead people with loans who's families refuse to take the TS and the loan. I can't imagine Wyndham accepting back something with a loan unless they are setting up an even bigger loan when purchasing more points.

The ones they offered me had very high cost per K points, not sure if they are all that way.

 

[vacationhopeful]

heres a thought


Wyndham has a program whereby they sell "assumable loan" contracts...So I know at least in some cases they get this stuff back and resell it for the amount due.... I see the back end, when they offer something to be to assumed...but I dont know who to talk to to get them to actually take it back

Yes, I have run into that ofder also. Seems it involve a dead husband and poor wife, but the salesman's lips were moving. Might try the "duress" or "dimished capacity" reasons.