Final Straw- Selling our Marriott/Vistana Timeshares

[nokaoi9]

After almost 15 years of ownership, which along the way has included losing a parent, getting married, and having my beautiful daughter, I am officially done with Marriott.

Earlier this week Hawaii extended the 14 day quarantine thru the end of July, we had a check in date of July 25th. I called Marriott yesterday to explore my options, and was told that the resort is still open, or I could deposit my week into II and would have two years from date of deposit to use the week, with a check-in date of less than 60 days from booking. To say I was furious is an understatement. How in good faith can they say the resort is “open” when all of the below are closed, and knowing people from the mainland would be under a 14 day quarantine? While not thrilled with the II option, I feel it is something I could have lived with, had it not been limited to the booking window of being less than 60 days. I’m likely not going to be able to book, nor would I prefer to book a nice trip (like to Hawaii) in under 60 days, which means my ~$2400 maintenance fee will turn into nothing more than a glorified getaway or AC exchange with II. On a positive note, I will no longer have to worry about managing four II memberships (Marriott corporate account, non corporate account, and two Vistana), and will save ~$8000 per year in maintenance fees, and not have to contemplate another enrollment fee when the MVCI/Vistana program is eventually rolled out. It really is sad to see what Marriott has become since we first purchased almost 15 years ago.

Having Tug there to learn from since the beginning was invaluable. We fortunately purchased Ko Olina via resale prior to finding Tug, but learned how to really maximize our ownership here over the years. Whenever we had a question, the community was quick to offer advice, which was always appreciated. Mahalo nui for all the great recommendations and suggestions over the years, it has been truly appreciated.

Aloha.

 

[SeaDoc]

After almost 15 years of ownership, which along the way has included losing a parent, getting married, and having my beautiful daughter, I am officially done with Marriott.

Earlier this week Hawaii extended the 14 day quarantine thru the end of July, we had a check in date of July 25th. I called Marriott yesterday to explore my options, and was told that the resort is still open, or I could deposit my week into II and would have two years from date of deposit to use the week, with a check-in date of less than 60 days from booking. To say I was furious is an understatement. How in good faith can they say the resort is “open” when all of the below are closed, and knowing people from the mainland would be under a 14 day quarantine? While not thrilled with the II option, I feel it is something I could have lived with, had it not been limited to the booking window of being less than 60 days. I’m likely not going to be able to book, nor would I prefer to book a nice trip (like to Hawaii) in under 60 days, which means my ~$2400 maintenance fee will turn into nothing more than a glorified getaway or AC exchange with II. On a positive note, I will no longer have to worry about managing four II memberships (Marriott corporate account, non corporate account, and two Vistana), and will save ~$8000 per year in maintenance fees, and not have to contemplate another enrollment fee when the MVCI/Vistana program is eventually rolled out. It really is sad to see what Marriott has become since we first purchased almost 15 years ago.

Having Tug there to learn from since the beginning was invaluable. We fortunately purchased Ko Olina via resale prior to finding Tug, but learned how to really maximize our ownership here over the years. Whenever we had a question, the community was quick to offer advice, which was always appreciated. Mahalo nui for all the great recommendations and suggestions over the years, it has been truly appreciated.

Aloha.

I’m perplexed at your anger being directed at MVCI and/or Marriott. Hawaii places these restrictions, many of us had to cancel, us in May with an oceanfront in Ka’anapali x 2 weeks. We rebooked x 3 weeks in Colorado during summer. Anger solves nothing, except an early grave. Best of luck to you.


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[enma]

You are upset now but these are very unusual times. I bet all of us with summer plans lost something. I had 5 weeks booked in Aruba , supposed to be there now. Got the same 60 day restriction weeks with II. Already used 3 of them for St Thomas for July. It all works out. Yes, will lose some money but people are losing lives from Covid so I am not complaining about my first world problems.

 

[davidvel]

Must be more to the story. Selling 4 timeshares you've owned for 15 years because you couldn't use 1 week due to a global pandemic seems like a bit of a stretch.

There is a quarantine by the state during the week YOU booked. How is MVC supposed to magically reincarnate that week? You own the week, not them.

 

[bogey21]

After almost 15 years of ownership, which along the way has included losing a parent, getting married, and having my beautiful daughter, I am officially done with Marriott.

Your reaction is like mine. When a Company does me wrong I vote with my feet and get as far away from them as I can...

George

 

[Rodenwjr]

I agree with all the above responses. There has to be more to the story because this seems like irrational anger taken out on the wrong thing. EVERYBODY is affected by this pandemic.

We gave up ALL of our vacations this summer and thanks to the contributors in this forum I was able to decide how I could best utilize our options. We pulled out of Hawaii in June and Tahoe and Newport Beach in July. We made a decision based on the covic info we had and coupled it with our options. We bailed outside the 60 day mark of everything and will use it next year as work and school schedules make it difficult to do a short notice trip.

Your/(Our) maintenance fees is a lot of money down the drain....THIS year. These crazy times will pass. If you've enjoyed your vacations the past 15 years then one year of unprecedented circumstances shouldn't stop you from many more years to come.

Good luck.

P.S. II has already offered us a summer week at Newport Coast next year. Our points are waiting to be used and we still have the option to bank them for 2021..


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[SueDonJ]

@nokaoi9, you're not the first person to be made angry by how COVID and the timeshare companies' responses to it have affected our timeshare use/ownership, and no doubt you won't be the last. But before you run very far and very fast from what has given you enjoyment for so many years, you might want to take a breath and more than a few minutes to understand why things are where they are in the timeshare world right now. There have been so many threads!

This is a monster of a thread but it gets at pretty much every aspect: MARRIOTT / CORONAVIRUS [MERGED]

This is the latest thread that gets at your issues but it's a pretty good compilation of the eventual calm acceptance that we've all had to work toward: The $99.00 ripoff

I hope this helps you at least let go of your anger, at most hold on to what's given you joy in the past.

 

[rthib]

Why didn't you deposit you unit at 60+ days. It is not like what was going on.
You gambled and lost.
Also, as someone once said. This is not an airport, so departure announcements are not necessary.

 

[SueDonJ]

Your reaction is like mine. When a Company does me wrong I vote with my feet and get as far away from them as I can...

George

So help me, George, I am banging my head off the desk once more!

You have been in every single one of the threads where people rant and rave at Marriott while letting off steam, and in every one you eventually end up agreeing that for the most part, Marriott isn't the Great Big Monster that's taken unfair advantage of a crisis to screw their owners but rather, a company that's offering *more* compensation than they're required to offer in the face of very real inventory allocation restrictions and mandates. Then the next thread comes along and BAM!, there you are AGAIN right back to square one claiming that Marriott is 'doing people wrong.'

AAAAAAARRRRRGGGGGHHHHH!!!!

Give it a rest! Please!

 

[MOXJO7282]

Why didn't you deposit you unit at 60+ days. It is not like what was going on.
You gambled and lost.
Also, as someone once said. This is not an airport, so departure announcements are not necessary.

This is my feelings as well. If you were monitoring the situation closely you had to know there was a 50/50 chance on July vacations and now I'm even wondering about August. I was monitoring the situation closely and worked with 2 MOC renters affected and gave them the options to change dates before 60 days or take a chance and take the certificate. 2 decided early to change dates and now they hopefully still have a Maui vacation later in the year to look forward to. One, however gambled and lost. He had his reasons but with him I was not open to any other recourse because I gave him options to be whole and now at least getting some value from the certificate but I'm sensing he isn't flexible so not sure how that will work out.

 

[ljmiii]

I feel your response to this issue and sympathize. But it isn't MVC's fault. It isn't anyone's fault.

Gov. Ige explained his plan to get out of this mess - at least for Hawaii - in March. Over the next couple of weeks he went into further detail on what would have to happen before Hawaii could allow tourists without quarantine. Based on that description my guess was and is October 1st for visitors from the mainland. I held onto my July reservations until I was 62 days out because there was no real reason not to...and a miracle treatment or vaccine could have been found.

If I may make one suggestion, don't let the frustrations of the moment make the decision for you. If you no longer want to go to the places you own that is one thing. But if you do want to go back next year, and the year after that, then there is no reason to sell. Particularly into the current market.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

60 days out on II is a terrible policy and @nokaoi9 has a right to be upset about the loss of $2400 MF. IMO MVC is lacking creativity in making this right for their customers. Perhaps they could allow a one time enrollment to points for use next year, or remove the 60 day window (very doable since they own II).

To compare, Hilton Grand Vacations is treating their owners much better; automatically pushing 2019 banked points to 2021 (which can then be deposited for another 2 years in RCI), longer unrestricted windows to reserve etc. They are trying to find ways to smooth out inventory demand over the next few years and keep owners satisfied. They are also bringing on many new resorts in 2021/22 which will help alleviate inventory demand concerns. I don't hear complaints like this on the HGV forum so there are solutions out there.

I recognize that HGV and MVC are structured differently but they are not that different; HGVC is effectively the same as an MVC deed plus points enrollment. The biggest difference is that all HGVC deeds are required to be enrolled upon purchase. And HGV doesn't own RCI like MVC owns II. The difference is that MVC is lacking the will to develop creative solutions make this right for their owners. or perhaps they are trying to penalize MVC owners who haven't enrolled?

 

[pchung6]

I feel your pain. I lost few Hawaii weeks also and had to cancel our summer vacation plan completely. Covid has changed everyone's life and even my job is on the edge now. My question is if your reservation was July-25, why you wait until now to cancel? If you cancel before May-25, you should be fine and able to extend the points. I understand we rather just use the summer week, but this global pandemic is really uncontrollable by anyone. Before you move on from your 4 beautiful weeks, are you sure you really want to part away when there are still many good vacations ahead in next 10-20 years?

 

[pchung6]

The difference is that MVC is lacking the will to develop creative solutions make this right for their owners. or perhaps they are trying to penalize MVC owners who haven't enrolled?

You just nailed it.

 

[bogey21]

So help me, George, I am banging my head off the desk once more!.....There you are AGAIN right back to square one claiming that Marriott is 'doing people wrong.'
Give it a rest! Please!

The truth is the truth. I paid approximately $13,000 each for my Sabal Palms, Harbour Club and Heritage Weeks, all pre-construction. Almost immediately Marriott started tinkering big time with the benefits attached to my Weeks all to their benefit and all to my detriment. I finally got pissed and sold. Fortunately I sold before they destroyed all the value in my Weeks and I came out about whole. What would I own today if I hadn't sold? How much would I get if I had waited and sold today? What are the MFs today vs when I sold my Weeks? My point is that the prudent thing to do when a company (and I'm not only talking Marriott) starts down the path of devaluing what you bought for their benefit run as far away from them as fast as you can...

I acknowledge that Marriott has top of the line Resorts, maybe the best out there. My gripe is that over the years Marriott has made too many changes in their program, all to their benefit and to the detriment of their customers. In addition they have allowed their Customer Service, which once was excellent, to deteriorate dramatically...

George

 

[frank808]

After almost 15 years of ownership, which along the way has included losing a parent, getting married, and having my beautiful daughter, I am officially done with Marriott.

Earlier this week Hawaii extended the 14 day quarantine thru the end of July, we had a check in date of July 25th. I called Marriott yesterday to explore my options, and was told that the resort is still open, or I could deposit my week into II and would have two years from date of deposit to use the week, with a check-in date of less than 60 days from booking. To say I was furious is an understatement. How in good faith can they say the resort is “open” when all of the below are closed, and knowing people from the mainland would be under a 14 day quarantine? While not thrilled with the II option, I feel it is something I could have lived with, had it not been limited to the booking window of being less than 60 days. I’m likely not going to be able to book, nor would I prefer to book a nice trip (like to Hawaii) in under 60 days, which means my ~$2400 maintenance fee will turn into nothing more than a glorified getaway or AC exchange with II. On a positive note, I will no longer have to worry about managing four II memberships (Marriott corporate account, non corporate account, and two Vistana), and will save ~$8000 per year in maintenance fees, and not have to contemplate another enrollment fee when the MVCI/Vistana program is eventually rolled out. It really is sad to see what Marriott has become since we first purchased almost 15 years ago.

Having Tug there to learn from since the beginning was invaluable. We fortunately purchased Ko Olina via resale prior to finding Tug, but learned how to really maximize our ownership here over the years. Whenever we had a question, the community was quick to offer advice, which was always appreciated. Mahalo nui for all the great recommendations and suggestions over the years, it has been truly appreciated.

Aloha.

Pool and barbecue opens up June 15
The fitness centers open up June 19. Problem is untol quarantine is completed you ate not allowed out of your villa.

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[ljmiii]

60 days out on II is a terrible policy...I recognize that HGV and MVC are structured differently but they are not that different; HGVC is effectively the same as an MVC deed plus points enrollment.... he difference is that MVC is lacking the will to develop creative solutions make this right for their owners. or perhaps they are trying to penalize MVC owners who haven't enrolled?

Goodness knows I never thought I would be defending MVC after their initial response to the COVID-19 crisis...but here goes.

60 days out on MVC and II isn't a "terrible" policy. It's less friendly to those who cancel than HGVC and RCI's 30 day policy...but does result in fewer empty rooms.

And it turns out that HGVC is actually very different than MVC. With HGVC you are really buying points that have a certain MF and right to make a home reservation based on the 'week' that you purchase. I found out the hard way that HGVC doesn't actually keep track of weeks in relation to the points you own. Yes, you own a 'deeded week' but that's not how HGVC's reservation system works. Nor is it how HGVC's gateway into RCI works...you use points not 'your' week. Which has allowed HGVC to more easily accommodate owners through the COVID crisis.

I'm actually reasonably pleased with the solution MVC ended up with for those who made points reservations and cancelled less than 61+ days out. They got a longer booking window than normal last minute cancellations but shorter than people booking 'fresh' points. And unlike HGVC, there is no additional fee to use cancelled 2020 MVC points in 2021.

But weeks are weeks and the time has passed - when I cancelled my Waiohai week there weren't any unbooked weeks left in 2020. And the solution - you get something but not quite as good a something as those who cancelled more than 60 days out - seems perfectly fair.

PS If you want to complain that when MVC rolled out the Destinations Program they should have tied points to every week in perpetuity (like in HGVC) and made the point values fixed (which I've been bitten by) I'm completely with you. And while we're dreaming points in should have equaled points out (like in HGVC). But those are topics argued ad infinitum back in 2010. It's MVC's game and we're just players.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

True, the fact that everyone in HGVC is enrolled automatically has created this wonderful dynamic because few people actually reserve their deeded week making it a very fluid points type system. Staroptions may be similar too. Although we own a staroption unit we have never traded it but it seems to have similar benefits to HGVC. Don't MVC enrolled weeks take on the same characteristics for short stays and upgrades based on points?

The fact you can exchange your HGVC week as points into RCI for a shorter stay vs. a fixed week to week exchange IMO is a better system, except if you are into using lockoffs to extend or rent half of your unit to pay MF in which Vistana and MVC weeks are superior.

Every system has it's pluses and minuses.

 

[gln60]

So help me, George, I am banging my head off the desk once more!

You have been in every single one of the threads where people rant and rave at Marriott while letting off steam, and in every one you eventually end up agreeing that for the most part, Marriott isn't the Great Big Monster that's taken unfair advantage of a crisis to screw their owners but rather, a company that's offering *more* compensation than they're required to offer in the face of very real inventory allocation restrictions and mandates. Then the next thread comes along and BAM!, there you are AGAIN right back to square one claiming that Marriott is 'doing people wrong.'

AAAAAAARRRRRGGGGGHHHHH!!!!

Give it a rest! Please!

Please stop judging posters that you don’t agree with....being a bully doesn’t help

 

[davidvel]

Please stop judging posters that you don’t agree with....being a bully doesn’t help

If you think Sue is a bully, well...

 

[Dean]

After almost 15 years of ownership, which along the way has included losing a parent, getting married, and having my beautiful daughter, I am officially done with Marriott.

Earlier this week Hawaii extended the 14 day quarantine thru the end of July, we had a check in date of July 25th. I called Marriott yesterday to explore my options, and was told that the resort is still open, or I could deposit my week into II and would have two years from date of deposit to use the week, with a check-in date of less than 60 days from booking. To say I was furious is an understatement. How in good faith can they say the resort is “open” when all of the below are closed, and knowing people from the mainland would be under a 14 day quarantine? While not thrilled with the II option, I feel it is something I could have lived with, had it not been limited to the booking window of being less than 60 days. I’m likely not going to be able to book, nor would I prefer to book a nice trip (like to Hawaii) in under 60 days, which means my ~$2400 maintenance fee will turn into nothing more than a glorified getaway or AC exchange with II. On a positive note, I will no longer have to worry about managing four II memberships (Marriott corporate account, non corporate account, and two Vistana), and will save ~$8000 per year in maintenance fees, and not have to contemplate another enrollment fee when the MVCI/Vistana program is eventually rolled out. It really is sad to see what Marriott has become since we first purchased almost 15 years ago.

Having Tug there to learn from since the beginning was invaluable. We fortunately purchased Ko Olina via resale prior to finding Tug, but learned how to really maximize our ownership here over the years. Whenever we had a question, the community was quick to offer advice, which was always appreciated. Mahalo nui for all the great recommendations and suggestions over the years, it has been truly appreciated.

Aloha.

I understand being upset at losing the week but what some don't realize is they took risks and have responsibilities. It's EXACTLY like if you owned a condo and couldn't go or the amenities were limited. MVC has done a lot, IMO, probably more than they should have. And the reality is that it's mostly on the backs of the other members in terms of reduced future availability likely for several years. That they were even able to get II to give the added flexibility is interesting unto itself and a pretty big help IMO even though I realize the weeks will be challenging to get good use out of.

The truth is the truth. I paid approximately $13,000 each for my Sabal Palms, Harbour Club and Heritage Weeks, all pre-construction. Almost immediately Marriott started tinkering big time with the benefits attached to my Weeks all to their benefit and all to my detriment. I finally got pissed and sold. Fortunately I sold before they destroyed all the value in my Weeks and I came out about whole. What would I own today if I hadn't sold? How much would I get if I had waited and sold today? What are the MFs today vs when I sold my Weeks? My point is that the prudent thing to do when a company (and I'm not only talking Marriott) starts down the path of devaluing what you bought for their benefit run as far away from them as fast as you can...

I acknowledge that Marriott has top of the line Resorts, maybe the best out there. My gripe is that over the years Marriott has made too many changes in their program, all to their benefit and to the detriment of their customers. In addition they have allowed their Customer Service, which once was excellent, to deteriorate dramatically...

George

What did they remove that was in the POS and/or contractual.

 

[Ken555]

I understand being upset at losing the week but what some don't realize is they took risks and have responsibilities. It's EXACTLY like if you owned a condo and couldn't go or the amenities were limited.

Bingo.

Sadly, I’m sure this won’t be the last thread on this topic.


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[JIMinNC]

To compare, Hilton Grand Vacations is treating their owners much better; automatically pushing 2019 banked points to 2021 (which can then be deposited for another 2 years in RCI), longer unrestricted windows to reserve etc. They are trying to find ways to smooth out inventory demand over the next few years and keep owners satisfied. They are also bringing on many new resorts in 2021/22 which will help alleviate inventory demand concerns. I don't hear complaints like this on the HGV forum so there are solutions out there.

I recognize that HGV and MVC are structured differently but they are not that different; HGVC is effectively the same as an MVC deed plus points enrollment. The biggest difference is that all HGVC deeds are required to be enrolled upon purchase. And HGV doesn't own RCI like MVC owns II. The difference is that MVC is lacking the will to develop creative solutions make this right for their owners. or perhaps they are trying to penalize MVC owners who haven't enrolled?

I think it is too early to say whether the HGVC approach or the MVC approach is the best for owners. For now, it certainly would seem that HGVC is being more flexible and accommodating because they are offering more flexibility into 2021 and beyond. But their approach has the potential to create supply/demand mismatches in 2021 and maybe even 2022. By limiting the re-booking window MVC is taking the pain now rather than kicking the can down the road. If it becomes very difficult to book Club reservations in 2021 but MVC is more normalized will you still feel the HGVC approach is better? Only time will tell.

I also think you may have nailed it and identified one reason that HGVC may feel they can be more accommodating right now - all the new inventory they have in the pipeline - new Waikiki, Big Island Ocean Tower, Cabo, Charleston, the new NYC properties, new Myrtle Beach, etc. That's a lot of unsold weeks controlled by HGVC which gives them more flexibility in how they manage inventory in 2021 than MVC might have with less new stuff in the pipeline.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

I also think you may have nailed it and identified one reason that HGVC may feel they can be more accommodating right now - all the new inventory they have in the pipeline - new Waikiki, Big Island Ocean Tower, Cabo, Charleston, the new NYC properties, new Myrtle Beach, etc. That's a lot of unsold weeks controlled by HGVC which gives them more flexibility in how they manage inventory in 2021 than MVC might have with less new stuff in the pipeline.

Agree the new properties play into their hand. Not only will these burn more points, they potentially get another bite of the apple by offering presentations at the new property to their base.

 

[Ken555]

Agree the new properties play into their hand. Not only will these burn more points, they potentially get another bite of the apple by offering presentations at the new property to their base.

In this scenario, it’s not too far to suggest they would also be perceived as a better run company by prospects (and owners) when compared to MVC.


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