DRI points perdicament. Need some opinions.

[uss2defiant]

Hi all,

Thank you in advance in reading this post. It's a long one.

At the DRI Vegas Cancun resort.
Wife met the customer relations rep, apparently not sales, to complain and do a review.

Apparently before they go public they are trying to make owners happy.

We are cureently silver level at 17,500.
Apparently with 7 different contracts (unbeknownst to us, we thought it waswjust one contract) as my wife, premarriage bought points at different times with the first one bought, maybe at 2011.

Problem they highlighted:
1.According to them, the cost analysis in 10 years with what we currently have is that we would be paying some total of approx 350k.
2. Apparently 6 of 7 of the contracts have prepayment penalty.

Solution:
They brought in this equity trade program from last September which ended that since we would be paying as much as some one in gold tier we might as well restructure all 7 contracts into one and purchase additional 12,500 points to make it a total of 30k points. The purchasing of 12,500 points would be about 40k dollars. That is on top of our existing loan.
With this in 10 years we would only be paying $150k vs $350. Also, so called insurance is a new feature so special assessments would be passed to us. I wasn't there so I don't know the math behind it.

I don't like the timeshare as there is no value.

Here is where we are at.
1. We felt that this was a better option and went with the equity trade but we will be rescinding this new purchase.
2. We called the DRI finance on the phone directly as the people here gave excuse that they could not provide any information regarding our previous 7 contracts. We thought it was just one contract as there was only one loan contract. We found out, as we suspected, that there is only one loan from DRI and there is no prepayment penalty. We also found out directly that the maintenance fee is just the annual base + the associated maintenance fee per point would be.

Questions:
1. Is there such a thing as prepayment penalty with individual contacts even though it is just one loan?
2. Is the info from the finance department correct or the associates at the resort correct?
2. Does 7 contracts mean 7 different deeds? I don't think I can easily sell 30k points together as opposed to 7 smalled chunks if individual contracts mean individual deeds. I was able to reach someone at SMTSN today and she said that it is 7 separate deeds and it would be easier to sell as opposed to a single 30k points.

Thank you.

I just don't know who to believe anymore.

 

[artringwald]

If you haven't created an account on their website, you should do it ASAP. If you log in you will be able to see if you have one contract or several.
Points rarely have any resale value. People are paying DRI money to take them back because they can't give them away.
I can't see how buying more points is going to save you money. Besides the $40K they want you to pay, you'd be paying more in maintenance fees.
Sorry I can't answer all your questions, but if you haven't followed the written instructions for rescinding, I hope you do it soon.
I would advise against borrowing money to buy a timeshare. If you don't have the cash for the purchase, it's a bad idea to get a loan.

 

[uss2defiant]

Thank you for the reply.
My wife has an account but has no clue where to get that information.

Any help will be might appreciated.

Thank you.

We will be rescinding. I don't understand why our MF with the points we currently have will increase any different % wise. Any insight on that?

 

[uss2defiant]

Also how do I get DRI to take it back? I was told that it has to be fully paid and all MF for ten years be paid.

Thank you.

 

[nuwermj]

1. Is there such a thing as prepayment penalty with individual contacts even though it is just one loan?
2. Is the info from the finance department correct or the associates at the resort correct?
2. Does 7 contracts mean 7 different deeds? I don't think I can easily sell 30k points together as opposed to 7 smalled chunks if individual contracts mean individual deeds. I was able to reach someone at SMTSN today and she said that it is 7 separate deeds and it would be easier to sell as opposed to a single 30k points.

1) A timeshare loan originating from Diamond Resorts will not have a prepayment penalty.
2) Trust the finance department before trusting the sales associate. You can check yourself: Log into your account; follow the navigation button labeled "Ownership Summary." This screen will show you each contract you have and the corresponding points.
3) You don't have deeds. You own shares of a pool of deeds. A trust fund owns the deeds and you own a share of the trust fund. Each point is a share. One can buy shares (points) in almost any block-quantity you'd like.

I just don't know who to believe anymore.

Never believe a Diamond sales agent. I have seen, maybe, 15 different reports about this "equity trade program" pitch out of the two Vegas sales centers (Cancun and Polo Towers). No one understands what it is or how it works. No one can reproduce the math for the savings. It's a huge, systematic fraud.

 

[artringwald]

Also how do I get DRI to take it back? I was told that it has to be fully paid and all MF for ten years be paid.

Thank you.

The loan has to be paid in full and the MF for the current year has to be paid in full before DRI will take it back. You do not have to pay ten years MF for them to take it back.

 

[pedro47]

Suggestion only please call DRI loan department on Tuesday morning and they should be able to tell you what you own, loan balances and about that the prepayment penalty. I do not feel the prepayment penalty is true.

Monday is a holiday (Labor Day). Their offices are closed.

However, to give your DRI timeshare back to Diamond your loan much be paid in full and your current MF must be paid in full.
2019 Maintenance Fees are due in Jan 2019.

Good luck.

 

[uss2defiant]

Thank you all for the replies.

Another question, the MF fee per point and base cost would be the same regardless of what status level, correct?

I think there are club fees too?

Thank you, I am trying to understand the MF. I didn't find or missed a post about it in the forum.

 

[nuwermj]

Another question, the MF fee per point and base cost would be the same regardless of what status level, correct?

I think there are club fees too?

Diamond has a few different ownership pools, each with slightly different fees. The largest pool is the "US Collection," which you likely own. US Collection fees for 2018 are:

Base (or standard) point assessment = $230.00
Per point standard assessment = $0.15936

Club dues:
You own more than 15,000 points so your dues are two parts:
Base Club fee = $181
Per point Club fee = $0.00518

For those who have fewer than 15,000 points the Club dues are are a fixed amount of $245.


Everyone with points in the US Collection has their fees computed with this formula. There are some variations, like, for example, if you also own a deeded week. But if you have only points, and they are in only one collection (one ownership pool) then the above is the formula.

 

[Iggyearl]

We will be rescinding. I don't understand why our MF with the points we currently have will increase any different % wise. Any insight on that?

Please note that your rescission rights in Nevada include 5 calendar days. You need to write a letter to Diamond corporate expressing your desire to rescind your latest contract. It needs to be postmarked by 5 days after the signed contract. There should be instructions in the contract as to the mailing address. That will reset your relationship with Diamond back to where you were before the signing. You should send your letter from any full service postal facility which is open 24 hours, and can give you a receipt of mailing. If you miss this deadline, you will have a heck of a time getting rid of this contract.

 

[uss2defiant]

We will be faxing and mailing it.

 

[Iggyearl]

For your future reference, there is a Facebook page - https://www.facebook.com/groups/DiamondResortsOwnersAdvocacy/ - where Diamond owners can discuss topics like yours, and get help and advice regarding their timeshares. I don't own Diamond, but the link was given to me by Irene Parker, who is a consumer activist in the timeshare industry. Diamond has a reputation regarding high pressure and the veracity of their sales agents. This site may help you separate the wheat from the chaff. Good luck.

 

[youppi]

The 2018 MF on 17,500 pts in US Collection is $3,290.45.
If the MF increase by 5% annually over the next 10 years you will pay in MF a total of $43,456.27
How they arrive at $350K in 10 years with 17,500 pts ? Do you have over $300K of loan ?

 

[uss2defiant]

Thank youfor that MF calculation.
I have no clue how they got to that, I wasn't there when they showed my wife number.
Even with my current loan at 10 years, it is not even $350k.


Possibly the different contracts have different MFs?

But from a previous post, if we already have points, the MF calculations are standard, correct?

 

[uss2defiant]

Thank you that FB group link. I already see one of the first few posts that applies to my situation at the same resort and that owner is here as well.

 

[nuwermj]

I have no clue how they got to that [$350k over 10 years number]

I do. A bold faced lie. Standard practice at a Diamond Resorts Sales Center.

In the words of the Attorney General of Arizona:
"The State [of Arizona] believes that actions and statements by certain Diamond employees, including Vacation Counselors, Sales Managers, and Quality Assurance Officers, constitute deception, deceptive or unfair acts or practices, fraud, false pretenses, false promises, misrepresentations, or concealment, suppression, or omission of material facts in violation of the ACFA [Arizona Consumer Fraud Act]."

The Attorney General lists five pages of specific actions and statements that lead to this conclusion.

 

[youppi]

May be the 350K is the calculus for an acquisition of permanent points (30K points @ $9 per point + MF for 10 years). They didn't take in account that they have already 17500 pts.
and the 150K is the calculus for there new 10 years RTU only points (30K points @ $x per point + lower MF for 10 years but you have no points after 10 years).

 

[uss2defiant]

That could be. Failed cost benefit employee.
Either way, there was someone else at the resort too who posted on the FB group similar lies.

We'll be taking care of the paperwork before we leave town.

Either way.... Sigh .... FML...

All of your replies were very helpful! Especially this holiday weekend.

 

[DRIless]

Questions: Answer to your 2nd #2

2. Does 7 contracts mean 7 different deeds? I don't think I can easily sell 30k points together as opposed to 7 smalled chunks if individual contracts mean individual deeds. I was able to reach someone at SMTSN today and she said that it is 7 separate deeds and it would be easier to sell as opposed to a single 30k points.

You most probably do not have deeds but Points in various "Collections" that are held in a Trust. It's much easier for DRI to foreclose this way. SMTSN is not your friend. It won't be easy to sell anything, DRI devalues the resale purchase by not allowing transfer of The Club membership, your ownerships could only be used in their respective "Collection," and even if all sold to the same person could not be used together to make a single reservation.

You need to take stock of what you have and use it to its full advantage while you still have outstanding loans because you will never get what you owe for it, no matter how little.


BEWARE OF TIMESHARE MATH

 

[uss2defiant]

Thank you.
Could you please clarify what you mean by various Collections?
I thought the points are all the the US collection.

 

[youppi]

Each time you buy from DRI, you have a new contract for the amount of points you bought.
Log on your account and go to Ownership Summary. All your contracts will be listed there with the number of points for each.
So, if you have 7 contracts for a total of 17,500 pts, that means that you have bought 7 times with an average of 2,500 pts each time (7*2,500=17,500).
The disadvantage of having multiple contract is if you want to give back all your points then you will need to pay 7*$250=$1,750.
The advantage is if you want to keep some points and give back the rest then you can.

 

[uss2defiant]

Bummer. I was fearing that but that still beats $45k

 

[DRIless]

Thank you.
Could you please clarify what you mean by various Collections?
I thought the points are all the the US collection.

There's a US Collection, a Hawaii Collection, maybe a California Collection, maybe more?

 

[DRIless]

Each time you buy from DRI, you have a new contract for the amount of points you bought.
Log on your account and go to Ownership Summary. All your contracts will be listed there with the number of points for each.
So, if you have 7 contracts for a total of 17,500 pts, that means that you have bought 7 times with an average of 2,500 pts each time (7*2,500=17,500).
The disadvantage of having multiple contract is if you want to give back all your points then you will need to pay 7*$250=$1,750.
The advantage is if you want to keep some points and give back the rest then you can.

I've recently heard that that program is not active now.

 

[youppi]

I've recently heard that that program is not active now.

If Transitions program is not active then DRI should remove it from the web site because I just login and clicked on Transitions and it said that my contract is eligible to give back.