Does DVC really hold its value?

[wilmetted]

Hi everyone - I recently became interested in possibly owning at a DVC resort. I've heard for many years that Disney Resorts really hold their value. I happened to go to ROFR.net and searched Disney and found many sales for under $500 passing ROFR. Am I missing something here? It seems strange to me that they could sell for such low prices and pass ROFR.

 

[ocdb8r]

Hi everyone - I recently became interested in possibly owning at a DVC resort. I've heard for many years that Disney Resorts really hold their value. I happened to go to ROFR.net and searched Disney and found many sales for under $500 passing ROFR. Am I missing something here? It seems strange to me that they could sell for such low prices and pass ROFR.

...those listings are the price PER POINT (which is generally how DVC sales are quoted given you can own almost any variable number of points). There are some listings that list the total price, but then you need to dig in to see what the per point price was.

In short, yes, Disney has historically held it's value (and even increased in value for people who purchased long ago or held long-term). Nothing is forever though; Disney has recently starting adding some restrictions on resales (e.g. resales are not able to access the newest resort "Riviera" - only the resorts built before then AND Riviera resales will be restricted to booking Riviera alone). It hasn't had much of an impact on resales thus far...but I would never count on long term value holding (especially as DVC is also a limited time right to use with the expiration date for early resorts starting to approach).

 

[Limace]

I’ve never heard of such a thing. Disboards has a great thread where people post what is passing ROFR or not-check there.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Finsadbel]

Some are listing full passing price and others are listing price per point.

EDIT- took too long for phone to update so I didn’t see someone else had already answered.

 

[RX8]

Not just hold their value but buy it right and see it increase in value. I purchased VGC (Grand Californian)) in 2018 for $155 per point and could sell it easily for $200. Could probably get more than that. Of course, this is still a timeshare so it could end up at $0 so I am not counting my windfall.

 

[kanerf]

I was lucky enough to purchase points on several contracts at under $100 a point. All of these are well north of $100 a point today and could easily be sold.

 

[Janann]

I bought Saratoga Springs resale for $99/point in 2018, and the current price is somewhere around $130/point. If I sold right now I would turn a profit, even after considering the closing costs.

If you search online there are lots of stories of people who bought for very low prices years ago, and could profitably sell today.

(Just to clarify...I'm not including the maintenance fees in my calculation; the calculation is based on acquisition cost and sale expenses.)

 

[tschwa2]

As long as DVC continues to exercise ROFR regularly than points will retain value. They have cut a lot of benefits from resale owners. My guess is if they drop ROFR by as much as 50%, within 2 years the resale value would fall to that level. In the short term there would be current owners who have the benefits already looking to supplement their points with some cheaper ones. The hard to get into resorts might be able to retail value above the ROFR even if it is dropped significantly but certainly not across the board.

 

[bizaro86]

(Just to clarify...I'm not including the maintenance fees in my calculation; the calculation is based on acquisition cost and sale expenses.)

Which is 100% reasonable, because DVC points have always had rental value well in excess of their MF - so you could have earned a profit by renting them along the way as well, if the value you got from using them one year didn't exceed MF.

That said, just because that is what happened in the past doesn't mean that is what will happen in the future. They're adding plenty of new supply, and like everything DVC points price on supply and demand. I think VGC in particular will feel the new supply from the tower at the Disneyland hotel. While VGC is a better location, thats also a big expansion in comparable supply coming online.

Eventually the expirations will start to bite on resale prices as well - the earliest ones will be 20 years out in under 3 weeks. Maybe that's still long enough that it doesn't hit prices yet, but I have a hard time believing when you get to 5-10 years that people will be paying $100-150/point. That will obviously depend on what Disney does at expiration. I'd expect an offer to renew but I'd also expect that to be expensive (another $140 for 40 more years or something like that).

 

[rickandcindy23]

Which is 100% reasonable, because DVC points have always had rental value well in excess of their MF - so you could have earned a profit by renting them along the way as well, if the value you got from using them one year didn't exceed MF.

That said, just because that is what happened in the past doesn't mean that is what will happen in the future. They're adding plenty of new supply, and like everything DVC points price on supply and demand. I think VGC in particular will feel the new supply from the tower at the Disneyland hotel. While VGC is a better location, thats also a big expansion in comparable supply coming online.

Eventually the expirations will start to bite on resale prices as well - the earliest ones will be 20 years out in under 3 weeks. Maybe that's still long enough that it doesn't hit prices yet, but I have a hard time believing when you get to 5-10 years that people will be paying $100-150/point. That will obviously depend on what Disney does at expiration. I'd expect an offer to renew but I'd also expect that to be expensive (another $140 for 40 more years or something like that).

Yes, I agree. My OKW will expire in 2042. I don't care for myself, but our daugther is on the deed with us, and she will want to renew.

If prices go back down (doubtful), I would like to buy more Disney. But I am happy with my 500 points, 250 at SSR, 250 at OKW. We paid between $50-60 per point for them. OKW was less than SSR by about $10 per point at the time, probably due to the upcoming expiration. We bought about 12-14 years ago. There is real value in renting them. I use go-koala.com to rent but book the nights for lesser-expensive times of year and list the dates myself.

 

[littlestar]

Be careful on what you buy with DVC. The new Riviera resort has resale restrictions - resale owners can only stay at Riviera. I would look at the DVC resorts that fall under the old rules where resale can book the other DVC’s at the 7 month window like Saratoga, Old Key West (2057 end date), Copper Creek, Polynesian, Animal Kingdom, etc.

All the DVC’s are RTU (right to use) and have an end date. We own at two DVC resorts (Beach Club bought around 2003 direct from Disney for around $80 per point) and Saratoga bought for around $100 per point direct from Disney. So far the contracts have held their value but the clock is ticking on the years left (especially our Beach Club ownership which expires in 2042). But an end date is probably a good thing as we age.

Our first DVC contract was bought in 2002 at the Villas at Wilderness Lodge (called Boulder Ridge now) for $75 a point direct from Disney. We sold those points long ago.

 

[wilmetted]

This is so much clearer. I was worried I'd purchase and then value would drop to almost $0
Thanks to everyone

 

[Deb & Bill]

Yes, I agree. My OKW will expire in 2042. I don't care for myself, but our daugther is on the deed with us, and she will want to renew.

If prices go back down (doubtful), I would like to buy more Disney. But I am happy with my 500 points, 250 at SSR, 250 at OKW. We paid between $50-60 per point for them. OKW was less than SSR by about $10 per point at the time, probably due to the upcoming expiration. We bought about 12-14 years ago. There is real value in renting them. I use go-koala.com to rent but book the nights for lesser-expensive times of year and list the dates myself.

I doubt they will offer a renewal process. Just close it down, fix it up and resell. As DVC sells OKW points, they extend them to 2057, but if you didn't purchase the extension when they offered, you won't be able to extend to 2057 at OKW. I doubt they will ever offer contract extension to the other resorts that expire in 2042 since the OKW extension was such a disaster.

 

[rickandcindy23]

I doubt they will offer a renewal process. Just close it down, fix it up and resell. As DVC sells OKW points, they extend them to 2057, but if you didn't purchase the extension when they offered, you won't be able to extend to 2057 at OKW. I doubt they will ever offer contract extension to the other resorts that expire in 2042 since the OKW extension was such a disaster.

I will wait for the price to drop again and will buy more. The economy is on a downturn. I remember when Steamboat Bill, a TUG member here, bought a lot of points from Disney direct for a great price, which included this year's and next year's fees. It was actually almost as cheap as buying resale. He paid somewhere between $80-85 per point. I would buy if they drop it to $120 per point direct, not before. No reason to buy anything.

My resale points have the same benefits as resale because I bought before DVC devalued it. We added our two sons so they could inherit the points and so they can get discounted AP's. Our renewal was $800 for the Sorcerer's pass, which is so much more than we used to pay, but more trips to Disney are planned for that extra high renewal rate.

BTW, I was never offered the extension for OKW as a resale buyer.

 

[nomoretslt]

As of today, it absolutely holds its value.
1997...purchased 150 points at Boardwalk Villas for $62 per point. Plus they credited me for my stay that week in a one bedroom....I don’t recall how much...but probably close to $1,500. Could now sell for at least $135 pp. and that’s after enjoying for over 20 years. Expiration date is 2042, so expect price to drop soon.

2004...purchased 130 points at Saratoga Springs Resort for $95 pp. direct and received 2 annual passes for one year. It was not a good purchase....in fact we never stayed there but used those points until 2019 to stay in almost every other resort in WDW and also two trips to Aulani. The resale value was terrible for years but started coming back to life. We sold in 2019 for $102 pp and put the money towards our Riviera purchase.

2008...purchased 170 points at Bay Lake Tower direct for $109 pp. and received a weeks stay at Saratoga Springs (the only time we stayed there). Could probably get at least $160 pp. expiration date us 2054 so value will hold a bit longer.

2010 and 2011...purchased 50 point Bay Lake Tower contracts on resale for $102 and $95...could get at least $160 pp.

2011... purchased 50 point wilderness lodge contract on resale for $75 pp and sold in 2017 for $106 pp (new name is Boulder Ridge...lame!!!). Put that money towards another Boardwalk contract.

2011...purchased 50 point Boardwalk contract on resale for $74 pp and sold in 2019 for $151 pp (also used the money towards our Riviera purchase).

2017...purchased 200 point Boardwalk contract on resale for $90 pp. could sell for $135 pp.

2019... purchased 2 Riviera contracts of 100 points each (200 total, but can sell each 100 point contract separately if I need to). $170 pp. No freebies this time like our Boardwalk and Saratoga purchases. But got an “incentive” for buying a larger amount of points. Right now it is going for less than $150 pp for larger contracts on the resale market and I think about $196 direct for buying 100 points. $204 I think for smaller contracts. Have enjoyed 3 stays of 5 to 6 nights there and it is an absolutely beautiful resort. Expiration is 2062 I think.

I am done buying and selling. I have 3 of the best resorts for location. I hope I live to see my Boardwalk points expire (I’ll be 85). Bay Lake and Riviera are already co-deeded with our kids. They can do what they want with them. They were all bought with cash or short term loans (6 months low or no interest)

My dues/fees all told come to around $5,000.

What I love about DVC is I’m not locked in to a particular week or particular type room. I can bank some or all of my points to the next year for a longer vacation. I can borrow also if I run out of points (although they had to put borrowing restrictions in place because of cancellations due to COVID and there were just too many points in the system). Plus all my resale points are grandfathered in so are not affected by new Disney rules.

Of course this can change at any time. There is much uncertainty about so many things. I’ve not regretted any of my DVC purchases....In 1997 $60 pp was considered a lot of money. I think the resale market peaked around August/September. I can see the prices have been slowly dropping.

 

[heathpack]

I bought my DVC Villas at Grand Californian resale at $88/point ten years ago. Now I could likely sell for $288/point without too much trouble.

Yes, it holds its resale value. And then some!

Eventually it will start to depreciate, since the contract expires in 2060. But we have a little while on that yet.

 

[elaine]

I’m not in the same class as prior great deals. But for “average Jane” dvc resale purchases-saw it, wanted it, bought it…Bought vwl for $85 in 2007, sold $93 2015 to buy larger akv contract at $80 in 2015. Sold for $106 (during covid-thinking done with dvc), re-evaluated and rebought (after resale pricing uptick-good strategy-huh?) at $125 a year later.
Fairly confident I can sell for at least $125+10% (to cover selling fees) in the future. Even if pricing ticked down 10-20%, imho I’m still ahead after 2 years vs renting points.
When I sell, I’ll strip the contract and transfer to my other small dvc contract to get 2 more years of points to use after the sale. That gives me additional value-as stripped contracts only sell for a marginally lower price.
I’d only buy dvc 2054 or longer with lots of time to sell. I’ll sell when at least 25+ years left.

 

[TheHolleys87]

When I sell, I’ll strip the contract and transfer to my other small dvc contract

Do you have two memberships, i.e., is your small contract a different UY or titled differently from the one you would sell? Transfers are between memberships, not contracts. I don’t want others who aren’t familiar with DVC to get the wrong idea about how to strip a contract before selling it. If the DVC owner has only one membership, the only way to strip the contract is to make reservations with it and complete those reservations before the closing date of the sale.

 

[elaine]

Do you have two memberships, i.e., is your small contract a different UY or titled differently from the one you would sell

yes. I could not get same UY for small HHI contract--so it's a separate membership. One of the few (only) benefits to having a different UY! I'll transfer both current and the follow year's points and can still bank both years if transferred before banking deadline. Wish I'd done that before prior sale!

 

[montygz]

Disney holds its value, but remember, for most people a Disney visit also means buying park tickets, eating park meals, buying merchandise and the like. Those things increase in cost every year and aren't cheap.

 

[cbyrne1174]

Disney holds its value, but remember, for most people a Disney visit also means buying park tickets, eating park meals, buying merchandise and the like. Those things increase in cost every year and aren't cheap.

lol I just bought 50 points just to use their pools in the summer. I would never waste that much on a hotel room if I was just going to be in a park most of the day.

 

[nomoretslt]

lol I just bought 50 points just to use their pools in the summer. I would never waste that much on a hotel room if I was just going to be in a park most of the day.

Do you plan on spending one night at a resort once a week to use the pools? I don’t quite understand your plan. 50 points will get 5 nights at the cheapest studio. Not the whole summer.

 

[cbyrne1174]

Do you plan on spending one night at a resort once a week to use the pools? I don’t quite understand your plan. 50 points will get 5 nights at the cheapest studio. Not the whole summer.

1 night in a studio in whatever is available at the 7 month mark. I live an hour away. I just want 3 trips a year in June/July when I have off work. I can always book a 1 bedroom suite at Wyndham's Cypress Palms for under $60 a night Sun-Fri all summer long if I want to visit the parks but am too lazy to do the hour drive there and back from my house. My kid is prime Disney age (6) and I will probably have one more kid so I figured 7.8k for 50 SSR points isn't that expensive since I don't have to pay interest on that small amount of points. I bought off of DVC resale market and put 2k on my 0% intro APR card and am paying cash for the remaining 5.8k at $141/point + dues and closing.

Wyndham and Marriott are better systems to own in if you plan on spending a lot of time inside a theme park. Disney is just too expensive. I spent more money on my 50 DVC points than I did on my Marriott and Wyndham resale combined. I'd rather stay in a Bonnet Creek 1200 sq foot 1 bedroom Presidential Reserve unit on floors 16-19 over an OKW studio (they're the same price per night btw). I just am looking at mostly 1 night at AKV, Beach Club, Boardwalk, Poly, WL and GF. My Marriott also trades into OKW and SSR pretty easily for 2/3 the price of using SSR points.

 

[nomoretslt]

Getting Animal Kingdom should be easy for one night (and a real point saver if you get standard view) Same with Polynesian.....there is nothing BUT studios there and being on the monorail is a plus. Grand Floridian can be tough, but maybe not for just one night if you utilize the waitlist. Bay Lake Tower standard view availability will pop up sometimes. Easy walk to Magic Kingdom. The pool at Beach Club is really popular...you may be able to snag a night there. Boardwalk Villas standard view is hard to come by as it is the best bargain for a near park resort. Waitlist and stalk.
You can park at the resort and check in as early as you want and use the facilities ...although people have been waiting until after 4:00 to get their rooms. Not enough experienced staff. Check out is 11 am but you can use the resorts facilities until midnight. I’m sure you already knew all of this.
We have around 850 points now between 3 resorts. We are definitely spoiled and mostly like being in the Disney bubble. Although the constant price increases for tickets and food and this new nonsense of the Genie + and paid Lightening Lane is thoroughly annoying....
Since it is mostly just the two of us most trips we are up and out early for the parks and back to the resort for lunch, beers and pool time. Then back to a park in the evening. Maybe. We avoid Disney Springs and mostly cook or order food from outside the bubble. We like our space and get a one bedroom.
Your kid would probably love Animal Kingdom Lodge. There’s something about seeing the animals that is just so cool.

 

[cbyrne1174]

Getting Animal Kingdom should be easy for one night (and a real point saver if you get standard view) Same with Polynesian.....there is nothing BUT studios there and being on the monorail is a plus. Grand Floridian can be tough, but maybe not for just one night if you utilize the waitlist. Bay Lake Tower standard view availability will pop up sometimes. Easy walk to Magic Kingdom. The pool at Beach Club is really popular...you may be able to snag a night there. Boardwalk Villas standard view is hard to come by as it is the best bargain for a near park resort. Waitlist and stalk.
You can park at the resort and check in as early as you want and use the facilities ...although people have been waiting until after 4:00 to get their rooms. Not enough experienced staff. Check out is 11 am but you can use the resorts facilities until midnight. I’m sure you already knew all of this.
We have around 850 points now between 3 resorts. We are definitely spoiled and mostly like being in the Disney bubble. Although the constant price increases for tickets and food and this new nonsense of the Genie + and paid Lightening Lane is thoroughly annoying....
Since it is mostly just the two of us most trips we are up and out early for the parks and back to the resort for lunch, beers and pool time. Then back to a park in the evening. Maybe. We avoid Disney Springs and mostly cook or order food from outside the bubble. We like our space and get a one bedroom.
Your kid would probably love Animal Kingdom Lodge. There’s something about seeing the animals that is just so cool.

Ive been to every resort before and use the amenities all the time (except the pools). I always watch the MK fireworks from either the hill at the poly or the stairs at contemporary at a higher floor. Single night availability isn’t hard to do if you book it the minute it opens to everyone.

Wyndham Clearwater is a resort that everyone complains about never having availability, but I always can book the remaining two night inventory when it opens up at the 90 day mark. I go 1-2 times a year and never book right when the inventory opens. I even got Dec 27-29 in a presidential reserve unit. Most DVC owners aren’t local and can’t make use of 1 night inventory like I can.