Delay in New VIP Levels Due to Corona Virus

[r4rab]

Better to have the cash on hand and not need it then need the cash and not be able to get it because everyone else is also drawing down on their credit lines. Interest rates are low enough that it is a small price to pay for the comfort of cash on hand.

 

[Jan M.]

Better to have the cash on hand and not need it then need the cash and not be able to get it because everyone else is also drawing down on their credit lines. Interest rates are low enough that it is a small price to pay for the comfort of cash on hand.

That was my first thought when I read Craig's post.

 

[dgalati]

Better to have the cash on hand and not need it then need the cash and not be able to get it because everyone else is also drawing down on their credit lines. Interest rates are low enough that it is a small price to pay for the comfort of cash on hand.

Its called smart money. Ford is a classic example of borrowing money to survive. Without borrowing before 2008 melt down they would of needed a government bailout. Unlike the other domestic automakers they survived without government assistance.

 

[raygo123]

I'm betting they needed the money to buy HGVC.

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[Richelle]

I suspect they won’t announce anything until all resorts have reopened and they can start selling again. I also suspect that initially prices will go down to get cash flow in. How low, I don’t know. It will still be more expensive then resale.

The other question is, how many sales people will still be there when they reopen? They don’t get paid if they don’t sell, so they are not making anything. They likely or paying jobs elsewhere.

 

[Richelle]

I'm betting they needed the money to buy HGVC.

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They need the money to stay alive. If there is any left over, they may try to buy HGVC. However, I read an article that Hilton wasn’t to keen on Wyndham using their name. I’m sure if the offer was large enough, they may forget their concerns and take the money. I don’t think Wyndham can afford them at the moment.

 

[raygo123]

They need the money to stay alive. If there is any left over, they may try to buy HGVC. However, I read an article that Hilton wasn’t to keen on Wyndham using their name. I’m sure if the offer was large enough, they may forget their concerns and take the money. I don’t think Wyndham can afford them at the moment.

I was told at the party weekend it is a done deal by one of the regional person. Take it for what it's worth. I don't want a bunch of responses from anyone telling me they lie.

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[dgalati]

They need the money to stay alive. If there is any left over, they may try to buy HGVC. However, I read an article that Hilton wasn’t to keen on Wyndham using their name. I’m sure if the offer was large enough, they may forget their concerns and take the money. I don’t think Wyndham can afford them at the moment.

With todays economic conditions very few deals happen. Unless they have Berkshire capital available for these buying opportunities.

 

[dgalati]

I was told at the party weekend it is a done deal by one of the regional person. Take it for what it's worth. I don't want a bunch of responses from anyone telling me they lie.

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Did the regional person you talk to have a reciding hairline, big red nose and red hair? LOL

 

[r4rab]

I was told at the party weekend it is a done deal by one of the regional person. Take it for what it's worth. I don't want a bunch of responses from anyone telling me they lie.

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It might have been a done deal at that time. There is always a way to back out of a deal if necessary and, if any agreement has been made, Wyndham may find it necessary (and cheaper) to back out after this is all done and the financial fallout is better known. At this point everything is up in the air in the corporate world. Many companies are positioning for merely survival through this all.

 

[55plus]

Is Wyndham telesales offering any deals to generate revenue?

 

[Richelle]

Is Wyndham telesales offering any deals to generate revenue?

Nope. They shut them down. Wouldn’t be “fair” to the resort sales people if telesales could sell and they couldn’t. Poor babies. My guess is, if this drags on long enough, they will rethink that.

 

[raygo123]

Nope. They shut them down. Wouldn’t be “fair” to the resort sales people if telesales could sell and they couldn’t. Poor babies. My guess is, if this drags on long enough, they will rethink that.

From another site

Wyndham has called me every day for the past 6 days. We did not answer. Every day he says that he is calling us to tell us about the new changes that are being made that will affect our ownership. We are VIP Gold. I hate talking to Wyndham because they always try to sell me something. Does anyone know what this is about? Thanks!
March 28

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[55plus]

Nope. They shut them down. Wouldn’t be “fair” to the resort sales people if telesales could sell and they couldn’t. Poor babies. My guess is, if this drags on long enough, they will rethink that.

Sales is a cut throat business. There isn't anything fair about sales, especially when it comes to timeshares and sales weasels.

 

[Richelle]

Sales is a cut throat business. There isn't anything fair about sales, especially when it comes to timeshares and sales weasels.

I talked to a telesales rep last night. They must have changed their minds at some point because they are selling now. I saw that post too, but I’ve also been hearing a lot of stories about scammers pretending to be from Wyndham. Assumed it was a scammer because telesales was not supposed to be selling.

I had the sales VP specifically say they are very protective of the resort sales people because that’s where 90% of their sales come from. He also said they don’t like people telling them to rescind and buy direct from corporate. That made no sense to me because they are getting the money either way. Maybe they make more money through resort sales. However, when you’re not bringing in any revenue, “fair” goes right out the window.

 

[dgalati]

I talked to a telesales rep last night. They must have changed their minds at some point because they are selling now. I saw that post too, but I’ve also been hearing a lot of stories about scammers pretending to be from Wyndham. Assumed it was a scammer because telesales was not supposed to be selling.

I had the sales VP specifically say they are very protective of the resort sales people because that’s where 90% of their sales come from. He also said they don’t like people telling them to rescind and buy direct from corporate. That made no sense to me because they are getting the money either way. Maybe they make more money through resort sales. However, when you’re not bringing in any revenue, “fair” goes right out the window.

The survival of the company depends on sales. Pretty ironic most here scream rescind.

 

[paxsarah]

Pretty ironic most here scream rescind.

We know we're only reaching a small fraction of buyers - not nearly enough to really impact the bottom line. The vast majority of buyers never search online and find TUG or one of the FB groups, or at least not during the rescission period. The handful of lucky researchers who find us in time to send their rescission letter are wins for them as individuals, but not a large enough population to impact Wyndham's survival or probably even to blip their radar.

 

[Eric B]

IMHO, the cost of operating the resorts that currently exist is covered by the HOA fees that are paid for by our fees. The cost of the reservation system is covered by the program fee. If sales were to stop entirely, we would likely see a great reduction in expansion efforts and an increase in the HOA fees to compensate for those that Wyndham pays out of its sales profits. VIP benefits would also likely be eliminated because their only purpose is to incentivize retail purchases. While the survival of the company as it now operates depends to a large extent on sales, it is possible for resorts to operate without an active sales program. Some of my favorite resorts work that way and don't have outrageous MFs.

 

[Sandi Bo]

IMHO, the cost of operating the resorts that currently exist is covered by the HOA fees that are paid for by our fees. The cost of the reservation system is covered by the program fee. If sales were to stop entirely, we would likely see a great reduction in expansion efforts and an increase in the HOA fees to compensate for those that Wyndham pays out of its sales profits. VIP benefits would also likely be eliminated because their only purpose is to incentivize retail purchases. While the survival of the company as it now operates depends to a large extent on sales, it is possible for resorts to operate without an active sales program. Some of my favorite resorts work that way and don't have outrageous MFs.

I agree. If we keep paying our maintenance fees, the resorts themselves should still be okay (theoretically, right)? Most of this is way over my head, but that's what I was thinking. It cost Wyndham nothing to refund out points. It put more points available (for the same amount of rooms) in the future. And I don't mind that they did that, I think it was the right thing to do. But it didn't cost them anything to do it. Which is why I'm surprised they aren't moving forward bonus or credit pool points.

 

[dgalati]

IMHO, the cost of operating the resorts that currently exist is covered by the HOA fees that are paid for by our fees. The cost of the reservation system is covered by the program fee. If sales were to stop entirely, we would likely see a great reduction in expansion efforts and an increase in the HOA fees to compensate for those that Wyndham pays out of its sales profits. VIP benefits would also likely be eliminated because their only purpose is to incentivize retail purchases. While the survival of the company as it now operates depends to a large extent on sales, it is possible for resorts to operate without an active sales program. Some of my favorite resorts work that way and don't have outrageous MFs.

So what you are saying is VIP levels are promoted to create Wyndham sales. Wyndham pays a portion of sales profits to HOA's keeping maintenance fees low. Without sales the incentives of buying new levels of a VIP ownership would be eliminated leading to higher maintenance fees. Interesting that sales and VIP owners are rowing the same boat and need each other to survive.

 

[dgalati]

IMHO, the cost of operating the resorts that currently exist is covered by the HOA fees that are paid for by our fees. The cost of the reservation system is covered by the program fee. If sales were to stop entirely, we would likely see a great reduction in expansion efforts and an increase in the HOA fees to compensate for those that Wyndham pays out of its sales profits. VIP benefits would also likely be eliminated because their only purpose is to incentivize retail purchases. While the survival of the company as it now operates depends to a large extent on sales, it is possible for resorts to operate without an active sales program. Some of my favorite resorts work that way and don't have outrageous MFs.

Worldmark comes to mind as one of those favorite resorts without VIP benefit costs leading to outrageous MF's?

 

[HitchHiker71]

IMHO, the cost of operating the resorts that currently exist is covered by the HOA fees that are paid for by our fees. The cost of the reservation system is covered by the program fee. If sales were to stop entirely, we would likely see a great reduction in expansion efforts and an increase in the HOA fees to compensate for those that Wyndham pays out of its sales profits. VIP benefits would also likely be eliminated because their only purpose is to incentivize retail purchases. While the survival of the company as it now operates depends to a large extent on sales, it is possible for resorts to operate without an active sales program. Some of my favorite resorts work that way and don't have outrageous MFs.

I don’t think we would see much of any change in the HOA fees as you surmise. I would submit that any expansion efforts that may be coming out of Wyndham’s pockets due to developer sales would instead have to come from special assessments at each resort location. So while the HOA fees probably wouldn’t change much - we would see more special assessments to all deeded owners to fund capital improvements to each resort instead.

Wyndam doesn’t just provide sales and marketing, they also manage the entire trust via CWP - which is really an exchange system that allows us to freely trade inventory that we own via the CWP system across all of the member resorts. Were Wyndham to cease to exist - so does the CWP exchange system in place today AFAIK. Basically it would all revert back to something akin to RCI exchanges if the CWP exchange were no longer to exist, at least that’s my guess. Not sure how this would impact CWA owners in particular - since CWA owners don’t have deeds.


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[raygo123]

I don’t think we would see much of any change in the HOA fees as you surmise. I would submit that any expansion efforts that may be coming out of Wyndham’s pockets due to developer sales would instead have to come from special assessments at each resort location. So while the HOA fees probably wouldn’t change much - we would see more special assessments to all deeded owners to fund capital improvements to each resort instead.

Wyndam doesn’t just provide sales and marketing, they also manage the entire trust via CWP - which is really an exchange system that allows us to freely trade inventory that we own via the CWP system across all of the member resorts. Were Wyndham to cease to exist - so does the CWP exchange system in place today AFAIK. Basically it would all revert back to something akin to RCI exchanges if the CWP exchange were no longer to exist, at least that’s my guess. Not sure how this would impact CWA owners in particular - since CWA owners don’t have deeds.


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Yes CWA is backed by deeds. It will be a mess to untangle that mess. you would have to find a company big enough to manage it. Probably Diamond.

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[OutSkiing]

IMHO, the cost of operating the resorts that currently exist is covered by the HOA fees that are paid for by our fees. The cost of the reservation system is covered by the program fee. If sales were to stop entirely, we would likely see a great reduction in expansion efforts and an increase in the HOA fees to compensate for those that Wyndham pays out of its sales profits.

I agree in the short run owners and HOAs could continue with little impact. The Ovations program would probably cease to exist. But longer term, what happens to the units that are no longer owned due to maintenance fee default or attrition due to older owners phasing out ? Re-selling those units is a valuable service to HOAs and owners.

Bob

 

[dgalati]

Yes CWA is backed by deeds. It will be a mess to untangle that mess. you would have to find a company big enough to manage it. Probably Diamond.

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I agree in the short run owners and HOAs could continue with little impact. The Ovations program would probably cease to exist. But longer term, what happens to the units that are no longer owned due to maintenance fee default or attrition due to older owners phasing out ? Re-selling those units is a valuable service to HOAs and owners.

Bob

What about new VIP program Privileges?