Cash rate vs maintenance fees, happy to be in the win column for 2025

[jellen613]

I just paid my points maintenance fee on 2500 Abound points (deeded week due in January). A few months ago my nephew and family (who we travel with annually) said they wanted somewhere warm over their daughter's spring break, so I booked a week at Marriott's BeachPlace Towers in mid April using 2900 points. I checked the cash rate for the exact dates of our stay: with taxes and fees: $6138.
The math doesn't always work as well in my favor, however for 2025 I am pleased.

Update: I did check the member stay longer rate, and its only $4808. Still way ahead with the math.

 

[Hindsite]

I just paid my points maintenance fee on 2500 Abound points (deeded week due in January). A few months ago my nephew and family (who we travel with annually) said they wanted somewhere warm over their daughter's spring break, so I booked a week at Marriott's BeachPlace Towers in mid April using 2900 points. I checked the cash rate for the exact dates of our stay: with taxes and fees: $6138.
The math doesn't always work as well in my favor, however for 2025 I am pleased.

Update: I did check the member stay longer rate, and its only $4808. Still way ahead with the math.

I see a lot of this type of comparison, and while it makes people feel good, I'm not convince its actually represents saving that people would actually incur, for most people. My question is, would you have actually paid $4,808 for them to go, or would you have found something cheaper? If you would have paid that then great, if not, then any $$ saving is actually relative to what would have been spent.

I'm also significantly ahead on actual costs comparison, but the baseline was what we were actually spending on vacation lodging prior to buying. Its not as headline grabbing as yours, but its there and I'm very happy with the better facilities than we were getting prior to owning.

 

[Red elephant]

I see a lot of this type of comparison, and while it makes people feel good, I'm not convince its actually represents saving that people would actually incur, for most people. My question is, would you have actually paid $4,808 for them to go, or would you have found something cheaper? If you would have paid that then great, if not, then any $$ saving is actually relative to what would have been spent.

I'm also significantly ahead on actual costs comparison, but the baseline was what we were actually spending on vacation lodging prior to buying. Its not as headline grabbing as yours, but its there and I'm very happy with the better facilities than we were getting prior to owning.

This is true for me as well. The first time I went to Hilton head I stayed at the Westin hotel next to Barony. We got 2 connecting rooms for $350 per night and only stayed 5 nights. Now I use my MGC 1 bedroom that I exchange for 2 bedroom and stay for 7 days. I bought it for $3k.

 

[AlmostRetired]

I just paid my points maintenance fee on 2500 Abound points (deeded week due in January). A few months ago my nephew and family (who we travel with annually) said they wanted somewhere warm over their daughter's spring break, so I booked a week at Marriott's BeachPlace Towers in mid April using 2900 points. I checked the cash rate for the exact dates of our stay: with taxes and fees: $6138.
The math doesn't always work as well in my favor, however for 2025 I am pleased.

Update: I did check the member stay longer rate, and its only $4808. Still way ahead with the math.

Everyone gets to decide what they like to compare it against and while I might not look at it this way, you are not wrong. When I look at the value of my II trades with my 3 bedroom Grand Chateau, I used the MF of the GC against the MF of what I traded for. When I rent points, I use what I can rent it for using Redweek. Using Redweek as a gage, if you are getting a two bedroom, you are getting a good deal.

Using the Rack Rate can be advantageous. I am using an accommodation certificate for Disney's Old Key West Resort in early March. It cost me 750 because I had to prepay some fee, I believe parking at Disney for week. I reserved it 4 months ago without having a clue if I could use it, but knowing I have a ton of nieces/nephews I could give it to if I don't use it. I am now planning on going with my wife, son, my DIL and my 2 1/2 year old granddaughter. My DIL is due early summer. Even though my granddaughter is too young, and they are busy at work, I convinced them to at least make plans to go by A) paying everyone's airfare, B) reminding her that if not now, than when with a newborn on the way and lastly c) the rack rate on the Disney website is over $1000 a day for a 2 bedroom. Both my son and DIL know I would never spend near that but it does offer a baseline of value for what someone could theoretically pay.

In any case, even using Redweek rental shows you got a good deal so using the Marriott rate it is a steal.

 

[TolmiePeak]

How do you come out ahead when you can get plenty of people here on TUG to sell you their points for less than the maintenance fees on those points?

 

[jellen613]

How do you come out ahead when you can get plenty of people here on TUG to sell you their points for less than the maintenance fees on those points?

As I already own the points and use every point and my deeded week every year, I am only able to compare what I have spent to the potential of what I would have spent. If I needed more, yes, I could buy points from other Tuggers. So only comparing to what I have already spent with the "value" of what I am getting.

I know a lot of people who also use VRBO or Airbnb, and I haven't seen that there are "savings" for using those products. I have stayed in Airbnb's when Marriott doesn't have a property in a location, and they have been very nice, however not any cheaper than what I have spent on the MVC products.

 

[jellen613]

Everyone gets to decide what they like to compare it against and while I might not look at it this way, you are not wrong. When I look at the value of my II trades with my 3 bedroom Grand Chateau, I used the MF of the GC against the MF of what I traded for. When I rent points, I use what I can rent it for using Redweek. Using Redweek as a gage, if you are getting a two bedroom, you are getting a good deal.

Using the Rack Rate can be advantageous. I am using an accommodation certificate for Disney's Old Key West Resort in early March. It cost me 750 because I had to prepay some fee, I believe parking at Disney for week. I reserved it 4 months ago without having a clue if I could use it, but knowing I have a ton of nieces/nephews I could give it to if I don't use it. I am now planning on going with my wife, son, my DIL and my 2 1/2 year old granddaughter. My DIL is due early summer. Even though my granddaughter is too young, and they are busy at work, I convinced them to at least make plans to go by A) paying everyone's airfare, B) reminding her that if not now, than when with a newborn on the way and lastly c) the rack rate on the Disney website is over $1000 a day for a 2 bedroom. Both my son and DIL know I would never spend near that but it does offer a baseline of value for what someone could theoretically pay.

In any case, even using Redweek rental shows you got a good deal so using the Marriott rate it is a steal.

My deeded week is not a great trader in II (Barony, gold, gardenview). That being said, I love Barony. I bought in 2008 from the developer, and the gardenview Barony week was 18k, Oceanside/front over 30K. I actually did my first trade ever in II for 2025, I am pleased w/ my trade, however next time I will look more closely at the TDI before booking and depositing my week (it was a decent TDI a Barony, but not the best that I could have traded).

 

[jellen613]

I see a lot of this type of comparison, and while it makes people feel good, I'm not convince its actually represents saving that people would actually incur, for most people. My question is, would you have actually paid $4,808 for them to go, or would you have found something cheaper? If you would have paid that then great, if not, then any $$ saving is actually relative to what would have been spent.

I'm also significantly ahead on actual costs comparison, but the baseline was what we were actually spending on vacation lodging prior to buying. Its not as headline grabbing as yours, but its there and I'm very happy with the better facilities than we were getting prior to owning.

I likely would not have paid $4808, however the cheaper alternative would not be directly on the beach. I don't normally stay directly on the beach, given that we have 2 young children going with us, that will be a bonus to not have to lug all the things to and from the beach. Also, I don't normally travel over peak spring break, it's usually just my husband and myself, as select owners, we have found traveling shoulder seasons to be the best to get places that we want to go (Spain, Vail, Tahoe). We are both in healthcare, so traveling peak seasons can be a challenge with schedules. Many healthcare employers limit how many staff can take off in the summer and over the holidays.

Just for comparison, I looked up a VRBO (on the beach) very similar to Marriott Beach Towers, total cost: $3820, + daily parking ($64.20x7=$450) + daily resort fee (62.15x7=$435). Grand total: $4705. Basically the same, and with the Marriott property I get the 7 nights, I get the Bonvoy points on anything we buy there.

 

[DanCali]

If it was such a great deal, you can buy 10+ more Platinum resale weeks at $1000-$2000 each and make great use of them.

The problem with that argument is that if it really was such a great deal, the resale weeks would not cost $1000-$2000. But they do...

 

[jp10558]

I see a lot of this type of comparison, and while it makes people feel good, I'm not convince its actually represents saving that people would actually incur, for most people. My question is, would you have actually paid $4,808 for them to go, or would you have found something cheaper? If you would have paid that then great, if not, then any $$ saving is actually relative to what would have been spent.

I think a lot of people consider savings as some abstract "value" for what they got. In most cases, just staying anywhere is a cost. Many people also just won't book say a $1,000 a night hotel room, but would stay there on a points or free night certificate. Is that a savings or something else?

I'm also significantly ahead on actual costs comparison, but the baseline was what we were actually spending on vacation lodging prior to buying. Its not as headline grabbing as yours, but its there and I'm very happy with the better facilities than we were getting prior to owning.

This seems wrong just because of inflation and also different pricing over time. I wouldn't compare my Walmart+ savings on BurgerKing (25%) to what I spent at BurgerKing before I was a Walmart+ member (say in 2019) - I'd at least have to compare it to current day alternatives that are substantially similar for it to make any sense.

The other thing is - what if you're talking about different sort of trips before and after? I don't think I ever stayed at a resort before owning a TS. I never stayed for 7 nights at one place unless it was a family member's house. Does it make sense to compare those lodging spend?

 

[jellen613]

I think a lot of people consider savings as some abstract "value" for what they got. In most cases, just staying anywhere is a cost. Many people also just won't book say a $1,000 a night hotel room, but would stay there on a points or free night certificate. Is that a savings or something else?

This seems wrong just because of inflation and also different pricing over time. I wouldn't compare my Walmart+ savings on BurgerKing (25%) to what I spent at BurgerKing before I was a Walmart+ member (say in 2019) - I'd at least have to compare it to current day alternatives that are substantially similar for it to make any sense.

The other thing is - what if you're talking about different sort of trips before and after? I don't think I ever stayed at a resort before owning a TS. I never stayed for 7 nights at one place unless it was a family member's house. Does it make sense to compare those lodging spend?

Being in Philadelphia, many people in PA and NJ in the summer go the Jersey Shore for a week every summer, and rent a house for the 7 days. So I think it depends on the location/destination. As a kid, my parents had a condo with RCI, so we did go a week somewhere every year.

People definitely travel differently now. I would say probably 30% of our vacations (my husband and I) we spend a week somewhere (usually our home resort). The other 70% it is a range of typically 3-5 nights somewhere. I like that I can have both with Marriott, thus I have a deeded week and points.

 

[ljmiii]

The other thing is - what if you're talking about different sort of trips before and after? I don't think I ever stayed at a resort before owning a TS. I never stayed for 7 nights at one place unless it was a family member's house. Does it make sense to compare those lodging spend?

As @jellen613 alluded to, renting a week is how most people visit the shore from North Carolina up through Maine. And how many people stay at East Coast ski destinations.

As for staying before you buy, that’s the usual advice given to prospective owners. Certainly the reason we own DVC is first paying cash to stay in a DVC 2BR villa. And we own HGVC because we really liked staying at Hilton Hawaiian Village…and really hated the cash price of doing so. Only MVC’s Waiohai was bought sight unseen.

 

[winger]

I see a lot of this type of comparison, and while it makes people feel good, I'm not convince its actually represents saving that people would actually incur, for most people. My question is, would you have actually paid $4,808 for them to go, or would you have found something cheaper? If you would have paid that then great, if not, then any $$ saving is actually relative to what would have been spent.

....

My spouse and I discussed this a couple of trips ago when the topic of rising annual timeshare ownership fees came up.

We decided this is a lifestyle choice to pay extra (TS fees) to stay in nicer places - something gradually more important for us as we age. In this case, it makes some sense to compare TS costs vs cash cost, if anything else to help justify the large upfront cost many of us paid to get in these TS systems. That said, when we were in our 20's, Motel 6 or less (tent camping anyone? and we even slept in our van once!) was the way to go because money was scarce; now, it is hard to want to stay in that level of accomodations after spending so many years in nice, comfortable, spacious timeshare condos, especially if we are staying for more than 2 nights and even more so if someone is joining us.

 

[jp10558]

As @jellen613 alluded to, renting a week is how most people visit the shore from North Carolina up through Maine. And how many people stay at East Coast ski destinations.

I was basically pointing out that if you want to compare to your previous costs to work out "savings" - that's a personal comparison, so maybe / probably isn't that useful generically which was another point I edited out of my initial reply because I felt like it was just arguing "nah it isn't" to the point. I wanted to talk about how even with their suggested comparison, it's a flawed choice if you're going to discount the cash rate because of all the issues.

I think all of it is the problem - like many things in life, you have a bunch of legitimate ways to analyze it and the first part is figuring out which (maybe set of) way(s) makes sense for the person.

For my money, IF you're comparing renting a week somewhere other than a hotel, necessarily you're talking about either timeshare, AirBnB, VRBO, Vacasa or a traditional vacation house rental broker. I'd argue many of those comparisons make timeshare owned weeks look pretty good - especially if you don't need a full house. One of my co-workers rents whole houses for a week in the Outer Banks frequently, and they're like 8 BR houses, so he needs to get a lot of friend or acquaintance couples to share the room cost. The last one he did was $11,000 for the whole week. That per bedroom cost makes a lot of timeshare's MFs look pretty good IMO. I've said before that AirBnB is very hit or miss, sometimes it's a good price, often it isn't, especially with the extra fees and what still feels like higher risk to me than other options.

I'd argue the trickier issue is MFs vs RCI or II cash rates, but that's harder in a general sense because many places don't show up there at all, and of those, even more don't show up for desired weeks. If you're me who likes summer stuff and doesn't ski, Massanutten for instance always makes sense to do RCI cash rates and they're almost always something like $300 less than MFs.

This availability is also why I often discount "redweek or direct owner rental" - because it's often hard for me to even find availability. So hotel site cash rate might be there for resorts that there isn't a public rental average that's easy to find.

 

[Hindsite]

The other thing is - what if you're talking about different sort of trips before and after? I don't think I ever stayed at a resort before owning a TS. I never stayed for 7 nights at one place unless it was a family member's house. Does it make sense to compare those lodging spend?

Yes you need to take into account the changes over time and the better range of facilities that can be got with timeshare stays, which is why I'm so please that we are still saving compared to what we used to spend on things that were not as good..
In our case, I do consider it sensible to compare the different types of lodging spend as the aim of having a vacation is the same either way, and its the cost of achieving that objective. For others it may be different.

 

[jp10558]

In our case, I do consider it sensible to compare the different types of lodging spend as the aim of having a vacation is the same either way,

See, I think this also changed for me in a significant way post timeshare. At least for some trips. Pre Timeshare it was me and one or two other people sharing one hotel room. We were primarily going to NYC or other cities we wanted to explore. I.e. 0 was about the accommodations, and at best they might have a pool, but frequently didn't. This is great for going to conventions, seeing museums, trying restaurants, and seeing shows.

Post TSs I'm looking at activities like ping pong, hot tubs, saunas, steam rooms, walking paths at or around the location in addition to going to things in the area of the accommodations. Beyond wanting stuff to do when not actively exploring the area, it's nice to have more to do that lay on a bed trying to watch TV or look at my phone. Sure I still CAN do that, but it's usually lower on my list. We've also started booking larger units when feasible so can invite friends or other family members. We're also considering doing like mini reunions perhaps. Plus, now with remote work (not specific to the timeshare purchases) many trips are also helpful having 2 different areas where I and another traveler can work remote without having noise / meetings conflict.

Again, I just think it's possible - TS opened up so much other opportunities to me - that the trips are so personally different that comparing them to pre TS just hotel trips isn't really that useful.

 

[Hindsite]

Again, I just think it's possible - TS opened up so much other opportunities to me - that the trips are so personally different that comparing them to pre TS just hotel trips isn't really that useful.

If anything TS has limited the range of places we travel, due to the relatively low numbers of quality resorts outside of the US. Next year I'm going to have to fork out a boat load of money to go to resorts in Greece and Portugal, as that's where I want to go and there's no sensible TS options. We're going to end up paying 50-100% more for vacation lodging and either getting the same as the TS or smaller accomodation. They still have all the key things I want from a TS, including 2-bed units, facilities, pools, grounds, activities etc, but are resort hotels.

While your tastes may have changed, and hence the price comparison, are you spending more, or less than you were pre TS and by how much?

 

[jp10558]

While your tastes may have changed, and hence the price comparison, are you spending more, or less than you were pre TS and by how much?

I guess technically I'm spending more as I'm going on way more trips. I mean, this is where it gets real tricky. I got TS in Jan 2023 basically. From Dec 2019-May 2023 I went on 0 trips due to COVID. So leaving my house meant I spent more money. Is this useful information?

Ok, well, let's go back to 12 years ago to 5 years ago, the "old normal" I guess. I used to go to NYC for 3-4 days before Christmas from 2015-2019. These were mostly hotel points and free nights, so obviously less. I would go on a longer trip in 2012, 2013, 2016. So not every year, and the longer trips were ~9 days. Again, much of the trips were shared hotels using points and free night certs. Again obviously less. The problem is I cannot go back in time to 2012 and get a Hampton Inn near Orlando for $79 a night today - I just looked and today they're running $170. That's around 120% increase. Should I count my today getaway at $750 as 135% increase over the 2012 Hampton Inn?

Is it even reasonable to expect to "save money" vs a lower quality option 12 years ago in anything in life? Even if we say 2022, the year directly before TS for me - the comparison is not doing anything. In the vast majority of cases, doing nothing is obviously cheaper - this doesn't tell anyone anything. It's like arguing over sunlight amounts by commenting the sun rises in the east in the morning. Like the definition of "No *bleep* Sherlock" with a bit of "Thanks' Captain Obvious" thrown in.

If we compare my current Orlando trip to the current alternatives - Sheraton Vistana Villages 2BR to a Hampton Inn in Orlando, that's $1,007.13 at the lowest price for Hilton Honors discount, after taxes and fees. SVV Was $780 after taxes and fees as I recall. In that case, I both saved money, and got way better places to stay. But that's getaway. If I stayed in Seaworld HGVC on points, I'd probably be at about the same cost as the Hampton, but again have 2x the bedrooms etc...

 

[Hindsite]

I mean, this is where it gets real tricky.

Seems you are making it work relative to the cost of trips that you would take if you didn't have a TS, even if they would be smaller units and lower quality. That's a decent comparison and a good reason to own a TS.
Enjoy!