• The TUGBBS forums are completely free and open to the public and exist as the absolute best place for owners to get help and advice about their timeshares for more than 30 years!

    Join Tens of Thousands of other Owners just like you here to get any and all Timeshare questions answered 24 hours a day!
  • TUG started 30 years ago in October 1993 as a group of regular Timeshare owners just like you!

    Read about our 30th anniversary: Happy 30th Birthday TUG!
  • TUG has a YouTube Channel to produce weekly short informative videos on popular Timeshare topics!

    Free memberships for every 50 subscribers!

    Visit TUG on Youtube!
  • TUG has now saved timeshare owners more than $21,000,000 dollars just by finding us in time to rescind a new Timeshare purchase! A truly incredible milestone!

    Read more here: TUG saves owners more than $21 Million dollars
  • Sign up to get the TUG Newsletter for free!

    60,000+ subscribing owners! A weekly recap of the best Timeshare resort reviews and the most popular topics discussed by owners!
  • Our official "end my sales presentation early" T-shirts are available again! Also come with the option for a free membership extension with purchase to offset the cost!

    All T-shirt options here!
  • A few of the most common links here on the forums for newbies and guests!

Bamboozled by Diamond Resorts

csalter2

TUG Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2008
Messages
1,968
Reaction score
554
Points
473
Location
Orange County, California
Resorts Owned
Marriott Ko Olina
Marriott Aruba Surf Club
Marriott Ocean Pointe
Diamond Resorts Gold
I can't believe this. I own with Diamond and when I bought additional points last year they agreed my maintenance fees for 2009. They credited me the amount of the maintenance fees on my account and it showed all year. I did not think that I had to worry about them. Then on January 1st I see a maintenace fee amount on there. I thought it was just some error. I called today and the customer service rep told me that because the maintenance fee went up for 2009 I had to pay the difference. I told the rep that I was told that the maintenance fee for the year was supposed to be covered as indicated on my contract. She got the contract and it showed a credit for the amount of last years maintenance fees. I checked mine and that's what it was. This is not right. That amount that was credited indicates that they were paying maintenance fees for the year. In my opinion they are reneging on their agreement with me even if they only credited the account. That to me is just not right. Am I wrong for feeling this way?
 

pgnewarkboy

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 10, 2005
Messages
2,770
Reaction score
1
Points
36
Feelings are feelings. You are entitled to them. However, the contract is the binding document. If the contract does not cover an increase in fees you are stuck. Thats how it works in the world of business. We as a society are finding out the hard way that we cannot put our trust in business. Any business. Business can be trusted to do only one thing - act in its own self interest at all times while ignoring the interests of society at large. Some people have theorized that acting in ones (businesses) self-interest always works to the betterment of all. That has objectively proven to be an incorrect view numerous times.

The timeshare industry was at one time unregulated. The practices of the industry as a whole resulted in regulation. Regulation cannot offer full protection to consumers. Any business transaction properly involves a certain amount of risk. That will not, cannot and should not be attempted to be eradicated. The old adage "Buyer Beware" still holds true and is necessary for our economic system to work. Fraud and manipulation are matters that must be wringed, once again and always, out of the system. There is, however, an obligation on every buyer or participant in a business transaction to protect themselves. You cannot count on anyone else to do it.

If you feel strongly about the matter, you will likely need an attorney to take the matter to court over an issue of contract interpretation. In all likelihood, the cost of the pursuing the legal matter will exceed the increased maintenance fees.

Anger, shock, dismay and other reactions to business being business is understandable but not rational.
 

BillR

TUG Member
Joined
Aug 12, 2006
Messages
194
Reaction score
0
Points
16
Location
United States of America
Feelings are feelings. You are entitled to them. However, the contract is the binding document. If the contract does not cover an increase in fees you are stuck. Thats how it works in the world of business. We as a society are finding out the hard way that we cannot put our trust in business. Any business. Business can be trusted to do only one thing - act in its own self interest at all times while ignoring the interests of society at large. Some people have theorized that acting in ones (businesses) self-interest always works to the betterment of all. That has objectively proven to be an incorrect view numerous times.

The timeshare industry was at one time unregulated. The practices of the industry as a whole resulted in regulation. Regulation cannot offer full protection to consumers. Any business transaction properly involves a certain amount of risk. That will not, cannot and should not be attempted to be eradicated. The old adage "Buyer Beware" still holds true and is necessary for our economic system to work. Fraud and manipulation are matters that must be wringed, once again and always, out of the system. There is, however, an obligation on every buyer or participant in a business transaction to protect themselves. You cannot count on anyone else to do it.

If you feel strongly about the matter, you will likely need an attorney to take the matter to court over an issue of contract interpretation. In all likelihood, the cost of the pursuing the legal matter will exceed the increased maintenance fees.

Anger, shock, dismay and other reactions to business being business is understandable but not rational.

I disagree totally! The trouble with the country today is the mamby pambys who are scared of their shadow and let others put it to them. Business being business was a different morality 20 years ago - there is no morality or ethics in our current society and the US, unfortunately, is failing fast!

Csalter2 - go for it! Has anyone heard of the ARDA scam that DRI is pulling?​
 

pgnewarkboy

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 10, 2005
Messages
2,770
Reaction score
1
Points
36
I disagree totally! The trouble with the country today is the mamby pambys who are scared of their shadow and let others put it to them. Business being business was a different morality 20 years ago - there is no morality or ethics in our current society and the US, unfortunately, is failing fast!

Csalter2 - go for it! Has anyone heard of the ARDA scam that DRI is pulling?​


I think its Namby Pamby not to be responsible for your own actions. I think it is Namby Pamby not to read your contract carefully and instead rely on the kindness of strangers. Fraud, on the other hand, is criminal and should be punished. Corporations are neither moral or immoral. Further, morality can't be legislated. Ethical conduct in business can be legislated to a certain extent and is currently regulated. The public has a right to restrain companies from fraud and market manipulation. It is obvious that the public should demand and get better accountability and transparency by business. I don't diagree with that point. When we get the short end of the stick in a personal business transaction, however, we need to examine what we did wrong and not just whine all over the place how we got the shaft by the evil business people. If we don't learn from our mistakes when doing business we will constantly make the same mistakes over and over again. That would be the inidividual's fault not the "evil" business.
 

WalnutBaron

TUG Review Crew: Expert
TUG Member
Joined
Mar 27, 2008
Messages
2,193
Reaction score
2,585
Points
574
Location
California
Resorts Owned
Hyatt Highlands Inn, Hyatt Pinon Pointe
I disagree totally! The trouble with the country today is the mamby pambys who are scared of their shadow and let others put it to them. Business being business was a different morality 20 years ago - there is no morality or ethics in our current society and the US, unfortunately, is failing fast!

As I learned in my undergraduate Contracts Law class "a contract is a contract is a contract". If the OP's contract clearly states that increases in maintenance fees are not covered under the terms of the contract, then the difference is due and payable.

And if the OP decides not to be a "mamby pamby" and decides to sue Diamond Resorts, she will summarily lose based on the information she's provided. Going after Diamond will be a potentially expensive, almost certainly time-consuming, and ultimately frustrating and failed enterprise.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

csalter2

TUG Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2008
Messages
1,968
Reaction score
554
Points
473
Location
Orange County, California
Resorts Owned
Marriott Ko Olina
Marriott Aruba Surf Club
Marriott Ocean Pointe
Diamond Resorts Gold
I disagree totally! The trouble with the country today is the mamby pambys who are scared of their shadow and let others put it to them. Business being business was a different morality 20 years ago - there is no morality or ethics in our current society and the US, unfortunately, is failing fast!

As I learned in my undergraduate Contracts Law class "a contract is a contract is a contract". If the OP's contract clearly states that increases in maintenance fees are not covered under the terms of the contract, then the difference is due and payable.

And if the OP decides not to be a "mamby pamby" and decides to sue Diamond Resorts, she will summarily lose based on the information she's provided. Going after Diamond will be a potentially expensive, almost certainly time-consuming, and ultimately frustrating and failed enterprise.


Let's make no mistake here. I am not whining. I looked at my contract and read it before I signed. It showed the 2500 credit for the maintenance fees. That is what the maintenance fees for the year were at the time. However, when someone tells you they are going to pay for next years maintenance fees and show you the credit, you believe it is fine. No, I am not a contract lawyer so maybe that is my fault not to know that I should have specifically put the additional language in the contract since I did not know the fees were going to increase to nearly another $1000. I fully understand that a contract is what a contract is, however, I believe it is misleading to the average customer who will not be a contract lawyer. The folks who write the contract know specifically what they are writing and I believe that they/DRI are the ones who are taking advantage of the average person.

If you took contract law, well you are at a much greater advantage than most. I am upset by this because it really is an integrity issue or one of greed. It may be in the form of a legality, but displays a lack of character within an organization. These relationships are to be long term when one buys a timeshare. This creates a lack of trust. Whenever maintenance fees go up there is always the why instead of trusting that your fees are being used to improve your vacations.

I had read so many negative posts about DRI and until now had not experienced it. I spoke with them and basically they told me too bad while at the same time acknowledging that that could have been told to me as the maintenance fees credited would have covered 2009 before they increased the fees. To me it like the the letter of the law and the spirit of the law. DRI knows that I am not being untruthful about what was promised however, I feel they purposely write the contracts in a manner that a non contract lawyer like myself can be had. You may believe that I should have had a contract lawyer review it. That may be true but I have bough mutiple timeshares and not had this problem before and did not feel a need to at the time. I think that DRI has been deceitful in this case to a good customer who will now not recommend them to anyone.
 

Blondie

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
1,540
Reaction score
18
Points
398
Location
New England
Resorts Owned
Raintree Blue, Raintree Resorts; Sudwala Lodge, SA; Hollywood Sands, Hollywood , Fla
Most all of my resorts are places where I pay my maint fees in advance so I can either use the points or bank a week. When the actual fee does come due, some months or even a year or more later, I am billed for any increase and that, I believe, is standard practice in the industry. I don't think you are being taken to the cleaners. It sound more like a misunderstanding than an act of duplicity. Maint fees are not usually set until just before they come due and members who pay in advance, even those who do so because they are buying a unit, often pay the current year's fees. The additional fees are billed later. Sorry you are so upset but maybe you just did not know to ask about this particular issue.
 

pgnewarkboy

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 10, 2005
Messages
2,770
Reaction score
1
Points
36
With all due respect, Csalter got the promised credit. Why Csalter should not have to pay an increase in maintenance fees that is being paid by everyone else, is hard to understand.
I don't see anything deceptive about what DRI did.
 

CharlesS

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 8, 2005
Messages
242
Reaction score
13
Points
378
Location
Wisconsin
Let's hope and work for change

We as a society are finding out the hard way that we cannot put our trust in business. Any business. Business can be trusted to do only one thing - act in its own self interest at all times while ignoring the interests of society at large.
While I, unfortunately, have to agree that many businesses fall into that category, the same case can be made for individuals also. I have met people who have taken pride on how they have cheated the government on taxes or the insurance company, etc. It seems that people in all walks of life have been acting in their own self-interest. Hopefully, the enthusiasm and excitement we see on this inaugural day is a sign that we are now, finally willing to work for change.

Charles
 

viejoverde

newbie
Joined
Jan 18, 2009
Messages
19
Reaction score
0
Points
1
Location
tampa fa
If you read your contract you would be one of the very few. Then if you read all of it you would have also read that you would also be liable for any future "special assessments", they could be $500 or $5000 and no way to get out of them, so i wouldn't worry too much for the difference in your maintenance increase they are charging you for this year.
 

dougp26364

TUG Review Crew: Expert
TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
14,481
Reaction score
3,157
Points
698
Location
Kansas
Resorts Owned
Marriott Grand Chateau
Marriott Shadow Ridge
Marriott Ocean Pointe
Marriott Destination Club Points
Hilton Grand Vacation Club Las Vegas Blvd
Grand Colorado on Peak 8
Spinnaker French Quarter Resort Branson
If the contract clearly states that the MF's for 2009 will be paid and there is no amount limit set, then you have an arguement. If in the fine print is says that 2009 MF's will be paid up to a limit (the 2008 MF's), then they've fulfilled their agreement with you. If all that's on paper is an estimate, then I'd say that's a grey area.

You have only a couple of choices IMO:

1. Pay the amount in question and move on.

2. Complain and escalate the matter, pointing to specific area's of the contract that indicate only that the 2009 MF's would be paid and that there was no limit set on that amount. IMHO, estimates are only estimates and not a limit. That would be a fine point that you may or may not win.

3. Failing to get an answer that is satisfactory to you, you could file a complaint with the appropriate agencies in the state in which the contract was sold and in which the contract was signed if this was done by mail. This will likely be a long process but could eventually result in your account being credited with the amount in question.

4. Take you contract to a lawyer for their interpretation and suggestions as to whay recourse you may or may not have. Calling your local bar association may help find an attorny at a reasonable cost. Having a lawyer draft and send a letter to DRI in support of your claim may help greese the wheels to a satisfactory conclusion or, it could be a waste of money and time. You really need to read through the contract before taking this step to determine if you honestly feel it's a worthwhile cause and worth the time and money invested.

While I haven't been a big supporter of DRI and it's many issues these past couple of years, I can say that when someone complains and it gets high enough up, they do listen. If they're wrong they have generally made good on their mistake or promises.
 

csalter2

TUG Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2008
Messages
1,968
Reaction score
554
Points
473
Location
Orange County, California
Resorts Owned
Marriott Ko Olina
Marriott Aruba Surf Club
Marriott Ocean Pointe
Diamond Resorts Gold
DRI is on the Up and Up With Me

Hello Everyone,

I am happy to report the Diamond Resorts International did take care of the maintenance fees issue. They are honoring their agreement to pay the maintenance fee. I am very pleased about this because that was the deal closer for me.

I have always been pleased with my timeshare purchase from Epic to Sunterra to now DRI. My kids and I use the points for family vacations and it is a treat. I love my Marriott Ko Olina but I like the flexibility of my DRI points. I have been taking time to visit the DRI properties and its affiliates. Although some of the resorts are not as swanky as some of the Marriott properties, they usually have nice size accommodations and real clean. I also like the upgrades I have seen at some of the properties like the Grand Beach II. The 3 bdrms lockoffs are really, really nice. We are going to have a family reunion there this summer. I love Palm Springs and I am just waiting to see that refurbished so that I can take frequent trips to Palm Springs at no additional costs.

With the new locations here in Socal such as the Carlsbad and Coronado properties. I can travel to spots that are within and hour and a half and not have to break too much of a sweat and have lots of fun.

I like being a happy owner and will probably continue to be as long as the properties are well maintained. :banana: :banana: :banana: :banana:
 

dougp26364

TUG Review Crew: Expert
TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
14,481
Reaction score
3,157
Points
698
Location
Kansas
Resorts Owned
Marriott Grand Chateau
Marriott Shadow Ridge
Marriott Ocean Pointe
Marriott Destination Club Points
Hilton Grand Vacation Club Las Vegas Blvd
Grand Colorado on Peak 8
Spinnaker French Quarter Resort Branson
I'm glad that this has all worked out for you. I still think it's a shame that they did not honor their agreement without you having to argue the point with them. Reputable companies do not force their customers to have to fight for what was agreed upon in the original contract.
 
Last edited:

pgnewarkboy

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 10, 2005
Messages
2,770
Reaction score
1
Points
36
I'm glad that this has all worked out for you. I still think it's a shame that they did not honor their agreement without you having to argue the point with them. Reputable companies do not force their customers to have to fight for what was agreed upon in the original contract.


I really wish that "reputable" companies satisfied all customer disputes quickly and to the satisfaction of the customer. Read Conde Naste Traveller magazine , the Ombudsman section, and you will find that it is simply not the case. The Ombudman handles consumer complaints related to cruises, hotels, resorts, rental cars, etc. etc. This is not a magazine that caters to the low rent traveller. I am no longer astounded at the shabby treatment received by travellers by the biggest most expensive names in the travel industry.
 

dougp26364

TUG Review Crew: Expert
TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
14,481
Reaction score
3,157
Points
698
Location
Kansas
Resorts Owned
Marriott Grand Chateau
Marriott Shadow Ridge
Marriott Ocean Pointe
Marriott Destination Club Points
Hilton Grand Vacation Club Las Vegas Blvd
Grand Colorado on Peak 8
Spinnaker French Quarter Resort Branson
I really wish that "reputable" companies satisfied all customer disputes quickly and to the satisfaction of the customer. Read Conde Naste Traveller magazine , the Ombudsman section, and you will find that it is simply not the case. The Ombudman handles consumer complaints related to cruises, hotels, resorts, rental cars, etc. etc. This is not a magazine that caters to the low rent traveller. I am no longer astounded at the shabby treatment received by travellers by the biggest most expensive names in the travel industry.

OK, I can change my statement. DRI is good about honoring what they put in writing so long as the owner is good about making them honor it. It's a shame when you feel you must constantly force your timeshare management company to toe the line with their written agreements.
 

nightnurse613

TUG Review Crew: Expert
TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
2,088
Reaction score
55
Points
408
Location
Phoenix, AZ
So, maybe we should change the title from Bamboozled by DRI to DRI Comes Through or ????? I would like to think that, in the final analysis, DRI did the right thing. All's well that ends well. :eek:
 

dougp26364

TUG Review Crew: Expert
TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
14,481
Reaction score
3,157
Points
698
Location
Kansas
Resorts Owned
Marriott Grand Chateau
Marriott Shadow Ridge
Marriott Ocean Pointe
Marriott Destination Club Points
Hilton Grand Vacation Club Las Vegas Blvd
Grand Colorado on Peak 8
Spinnaker French Quarter Resort Branson
So, maybe we should change the title from Bamboozled by DRI to DRI Comes Through or ????? I would like to think that, in the final analysis, DRI did the right thing. All's well that ends well. :eek:


And that is the one decent thing about DRI. When it's pointed out that something they've done is wrong, they generally seem to correct that mistake. I'm just hoping that, as time goes on, making those mistakes will be eliminated all together.
 
Top