• The TUGBBS forums are completely free and open to the public and exist as the absolute best place for owners to get help and advice about their timeshares for more than 29 years!

    Join Tens of Thousands of other Owners just like you here to get any and all Timeshare questions answered!
  • TUG started 29 years ago in October 1993 as a group of regular Timeshare owners just like you!

    Check out our happy birthday post here: Happy Birthday TUG!
  • TUG has a YouTube Channel to produce weekly short informative videos on popular Timeshare topics!

    Come check it out for a chance to win a Free TUG membership (or renewal) just for helping out!

    Read more here
  • TUG has now saved timeshare owners more than $21,000,000 dollars just by finding us in time to rescind a new Timeshare purchase! A truly incredible milestone!

    Read more here: TUG saves owners more than $21 Million dollars
  • Follow the TUG Member Banner as it travels the world on vacation with Timeshare owners! Also sign up to get the banner sent to you so you can submit a photo of your vacation with the banner to share with TUG! Banner Thread
  • Sign up to get the TUG Newsletter for free! 60,000+ subscribers! Latest resort reviews and the most important topics discussed by owners during the week!
  • Our official "end my sales presentation early" T-shirts are available again! Also come with the option for a free membership extension with purchase to offset the cost!

    Read more Here
  • A few of the most common links here on the forums for newbies and guests!

At WKORV - any questions

luv_maui

TUG Review Crew: Expert
TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
1,351
Reaction score
897
Points
473
I'm planning to attend a presentation as long as I can convince my spouse to attend. If you have any questions I'll try to answer them for you.
 

DeniseM

Moderator
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
57,288
Reaction score
8,429
Points
1,849
Resorts Owned
WKORV, WKV, 2-SDO, 4-Kauai Beach Villas, Island Park Village (Yellowstone), Hyatt High Sierra, Dolphin's Cove (Anaheim)
I'd like to know what it would cost to upgrade ocean view to ocean front. Also - any info on the Poipu resort.
 

ciscogizmo1

Tug Review Crew: Rookie
TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
2,607
Reaction score
28
Points
433
Location
Northern California
Resorts Owned
Marriott: Shadow Ridge, Timber Lodge & Waiohai
Westin: Westin Ka'anapali Ocean Villas
Disney: Beach Club Villas & Bay Lake Towers
When will Princeville be Open for reservations?


When I checked the website last it said that the first set of units would be occupied in May 2008. So I guess, 12 months reservations open up soon. I hope there aren't any delays.
 

luv_maui

TUG Review Crew: Expert
TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
1,351
Reaction score
897
Points
473
I'd like to know what it would cost to upgrade ocean view to ocean front. Also - any info on the Poipu resort.

Per my sales rep, upgrades cannot be done from WKORV to WKORV. At least that was what I was told. They stated that an upgrade from WKORV OV would have to be upgraded to WKORV-N OF. I didn't follow-up on this possibility since I assumed you were only interested in OF at WKORV. He did indicate that even if WKORV-OF were available it would probably be at a price no less than WKORV-N which was $72,900 for EY.

Current pricing of Princeville:

$48,500 (EY), $33,500 (EOY), MF-$2,100/yr. Targeted opening date May 2008, couldn't find out when reservations could be made.

SPG Points Incentives: 80,000 (EY) or 50,000 (EOY) with purchase option till June 2007 to buy 86,000 SPG points for $1,800.
 

luv_maui

TUG Review Crew: Expert
TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
1,351
Reaction score
897
Points
473
WKORV-N update

Opening occupancy is supposed to be 8/21/07 which doesn't make sense since that's not a normal check-in day. Maybe my sales rep meant 7/21/07, but I didn't realize 8/21/07 was a Tuesday or else I would have questioned him on that date. They plan to open the 3 buildings closest to WKORV first with the buildings on the other side to be finished throughout this calendar year - completion of all buildings by end of this year.

Pricing for WKORV-N (MF:$1,775):

OF: $72,900 (EY), $39,900 (EOY)
OV: $60,900 (EY), $39,900 (EOY)

Yes, that is correct that the EOY price was the same for both OV or OF. However, the other half buy up would be the difference between the EY - EOY price.

SPG Point Incentives:

OF: 125,000 (EY), 110,000 (EOY)
OV: 100,000 (EY), 70,000 (EOY)

Since EOY occupancy not available until 2009, EY available for 2008, the EOY purchase comes with the right to buy 80,000 SPG points for $1,675 for each year 2007 and 2008. The EY only gets to buy 80,000 SPG points for $1,675 for 2007.

30 days same as cash with 10% down
can use credit card for both the 10% down as well as the entire balance
SPG Gold fo life

Since I was told that they would be sold out in probably 3 - 6 months, the one year option to buy the other half of an EOY wouldn't be any good but would allow me to sell stock or anything else to free up cash to buy the other half before they're sold out.

I hope to take current pictures of WKORV-N before we check out on Saturday.
 

dss

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 7, 2005
Messages
188
Reaction score
15
Points
378
Location
Oakland, CA
Thanks for all the great information. We are staying in our WKORV unit this December and i'm wondering how complete the facilities at North will be by then? Do you have any idea if they pools/spa will be fully functional by then?
 

DeniseM

Moderator
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
57,288
Reaction score
8,429
Points
1,849
Resorts Owned
WKORV, WKV, 2-SDO, 4-Kauai Beach Villas, Island Park Village (Yellowstone), Hyatt High Sierra, Dolphin's Cove (Anaheim)
Per my sales rep, upgrades cannot be done from WKORV to WKORV.

I guess I should have known better than to expect an accurate answer from a salesman! I have already confirmed with the main sales office that this could be done, I just wanted the price... :wall:

Thanks for trying!!!! :hi:
 

saluki

TUG Member
Joined
Mar 30, 2006
Messages
513
Reaction score
2
Points
378
Location
STL
I am amazed how many resales are already listed for WKORV-N. I just looked on myrresortnetwork.com & saw quite a few.
 

DavidnRobin

TUG Member
Joined
Dec 20, 2005
Messages
11,723
Reaction score
2,169
Points
698
Location
San Francisco Bay Area
Resorts Owned
WKORV OFD (Maui)
WPORV (Kauai)
WSJ-VGV (St. John)
WKV (Scottsdale)
I guess I should have known better than to expect an accurate answer from a salesman! I have already confirmed with the main sales office that this could be done, I just wanted the price... :wall:

Thanks for trying!!!! :hi:
DeniseM - as you are surely aware almost anything within reason can be negotiated with SVO (e.g. our recent WPORV purchase). In regards to WPORV - the incentives for WPORV being sold at WKV are much greater. I wonder if they are just waiting for the 7-day rescind period to past - before SVO calls and tells me SVO Corporate won't follow-thru ('but thank you for playing...')

The SVO book price (Nov'06) for the WKORV OF Dlx price was ~$86K - even if they were available and you were able to get them down to $72.9K - would it really be worth it? I mean - for example - if you were to try this - why not... sell yours on the reslae market - buy WKORV OF resale - and then buy WPORV EOY and requal the WKORV for about the same amount of money (plus incentives) - you may have to go to WKV for this... :)
 

DavidnRobin

TUG Member
Joined
Dec 20, 2005
Messages
11,723
Reaction score
2,169
Points
698
Location
San Francisco Bay Area
Resorts Owned
WKORV OFD (Maui)
WPORV (Kauai)
WSJ-VGV (St. John)
WKV (Scottsdale)
I am amazed how many resales are already listed for WKORV-N. I just looked on myrresortnetwork.com & saw quite a few.
Personally (from watching them over the last year) - I do not trust all the resale listings on MRN, but they are starting to pop-up. There is one on eBay right now.
 

luv_maui

TUG Review Crew: Expert
TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
1,351
Reaction score
897
Points
473
Thanks for all the great information. We are staying in our WKORV unit this December and i'm wondering how complete the facilities at North will be by then? Do you have any idea if they pools/spa will be fully functional by then?

The salesman told me that the restaurants and spa would be fully functional when opening 8/21 which is a bad date. I just assumed the pool would be open as well. The only part not open would be the buildings furthest away from WKORV (facing the old Embassy side). The buildings closest to WKORV are supposed to be done. The rest of the buildings are supposed to be done by end of this year - or at least that's what I was told.

Now then, this info came from the saleman who told me upgrades from WKORV OV could only be done to WKORV-N OF which we now know is incorrect. He did state that the pricing for an OF WKORV unit would be no lower than the WKORV-N which was $72,900 for EY. I think he was simply guessing at the pricing though.
 

Negma

TUG Member
Joined
Jul 27, 2005
Messages
630
Reaction score
134
Points
403
Location
California
Resorts Owned
DVC Boardwalk WKV WMH WKORVN SVR Harborside 5* and spoiled
They better be open by July, that is when they started taking reservations, in fact, we are going in August, hmmmm.
 

luv_maui

TUG Review Crew: Expert
TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
1,351
Reaction score
897
Points
473
If you could get and post some updated photos of WKORVN from the beach side, that would be great. Thanks!

Tried taking some this morning that sun in the background screwed up my pictures. I'll have to try later tonight or tomorrow morning before sunrise. Unless they're planning to cut down the trees between the beach and WKORV-N, those tree are going to obstruct those OF views.
 

saluki

TUG Member
Joined
Mar 30, 2006
Messages
513
Reaction score
2
Points
378
Location
STL
Tried taking some this morning that sun in the background screwed up my pictures. I'll have to try later tonight or tomorrow morning before sunrise. Unless they're planning to cut down the trees between the beach and WKORV-N, those tree are going to obstruct those OF views.

As long as you're at it...some shots of the pool area would be great if possible. :)

Hope you're having a great trip.
 

Courts

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
378
Reaction score
0
Points
226
Location
Bucks Co, PA.
Tried taking some this morning that sun in the background screwed up my pictures. I'll have to try later tonight or tomorrow morning before sunrise. Unless they're planning to cut down the trees between the beach and WKORV-N, those tree are going to obstruct those OF views.
When I was there, it appeared they were planting trees.

I was thinking the same thing about the view. Of course the OV's have the same problem at both WKORV and WKORV-N depending on the floor.
 

eekrat

Guest
Joined
Dec 28, 2006
Messages
27
Reaction score
0
Points
311
Location
SF Bay Area
Opening occupancy is supposed to be 8/21/07 which doesn't make sense since that's not a normal check-in day. Maybe my sales rep meant 7/21/07, but I didn't realize 8/21/07 was a Tuesday or else I would have questioned him on that date. They plan to open the 3 buildings closest to WKORV first with the buildings on the other side to be finished throughout this calendar year - completion of all buildings by end of this year.

Pricing for WKORV-N (MF:$1,775):

OF: $72,900 (EY), $39,900 (EOY)
OV: $60,900 (EY), $39,900 (EOY)

Yes, that is correct that the EOY price was the same for both OV or OF. However, the other half buy up would be the difference between the EY - EOY price.

SPG Point Incentives:

OF: 125,000 (EY), 110,000 (EOY)
OV: 100,000 (EY), 70,000 (EOY)

Since EOY occupancy not available until 2009, EY available for 2008, the EOY purchase comes with the right to buy 80,000 SPG points for $1,675 for each year 2007 and 2008. The EY only gets to buy 80,000 SPG points for $1,675 for 2007.

30 days same as cash with 10% down
can use credit card for both the 10% down as well as the entire balance
SPG Gold fo life

Since I was told that they would be sold out in probably 3 - 6 months, the one year option to buy the other half of an EOY wouldn't be any good but would allow me to sell stock or anything else to free up cash to buy the other half before they're sold out.

I hope to take current pictures of WKORV-N before we check out on Saturday.

We purchased from the developer (I know) in December and have the option to purchase the 80,000 starpoints for $1675. Is it the opinion of experienced TUGers that this is a an option that should be exercised? Any opinions would be welcome, thanks.
 

saluki

TUG Member
Joined
Mar 30, 2006
Messages
513
Reaction score
2
Points
378
Location
STL
We purchased from the developer (I know) in December and have the option to purchase the 80,000 starpoints for $1675. Is it the opinion of experienced TUGers that this is a an option that should be exercised? Any opinions would be welcome, thanks.

That's a decent value. You could do two 4-night award stays at a category 4 property. You get a 5th night free with that award giving you 10 nights lodging for your $1675. If you charge to your SPG Amex, you will pick up another 1675 points.
 

DeniseM

Moderator
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
57,288
Reaction score
8,429
Points
1,849
Resorts Owned
WKORV, WKV, 2-SDO, 4-Kauai Beach Villas, Island Park Village (Yellowstone), Hyatt High Sierra, Dolphin's Cove (Anaheim)
We purchased from the developer (I know) in December and have the option to purchase the 80,000 starpoints for $1675. Is it the opinion of experienced TUGers that this is a an option that should be exercised? Any opinions would be welcome, thanks.

I wouldn't do it...but I'm not a fan of Starpoints. For example, $80K Starpoints won't even get you a week, in a standard no-view room at the Maui Sheraton or Westin.
 

smsavage

TUG Member
Joined
Sep 14, 2005
Messages
130
Reaction score
0
Points
226
Location
San Jose, CA
We purchased from the developer (I know) in December and have the option to purchase the 80,000 starpoints for $1675. Is it the opinion of experienced TUGers that this is a an option that should be exercised? Any opinions would be welcome, thanks.

Doing some quick math, it looks like each point would be worth about 2.09 cents each. The best way to figure future worth of the points is to take the rate of a hotel that you want to stay at and divide it by the number of starpoints needed to stay there. I wouldn't recommend hanging on to them too long, as Starwood readjusts each year (usually up).

For example, we'll be checking into the Westin Maui for a couple of days next week and it cost me 13,500 points per night. The lowest rate that I could find for the room was $440 (plus taxes). 440 divided by 13,500 values each starpoint at about 3.25 cents each. It would be higher if you add in the tax costs.

Short story long, I guess it really depends on where you want to go. Some hotels will be better values and others won't be. I just recommend doing the math first to help you decide if you'll get your money's worth out of the investment. Hope that helps.
 
Last edited:

DeniseM

Moderator
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
57,288
Reaction score
8,429
Points
1,849
Resorts Owned
WKORV, WKV, 2-SDO, 4-Kauai Beach Villas, Island Park Village (Yellowstone), Hyatt High Sierra, Dolphin's Cove (Anaheim)
Unless they're planning to cut down the trees between the beach and WKORV-N, those tree are going to obstruct those OF views.

The beach trees in front of the WKORV were much thicker before the resort opened and then they cut them waaaay back. They are practically skeletal now. All beaches in Hawaii are public property, so my understanding is that Starwood has to have state approval to make any changes in the natural beach vegetation. At the first owner's meeting after the WKORV opened they said the state would not let them remove the Kiawe trees, despite the fact that they drop huge thorns! :eek: Supposedly these particular trees are historic trees. Wear shoes when you walk under those trees!

As a side note, we've been told by a couple of different tour guides that thorn bearing Kiawe trees were introduced to Hawaii by missionaries to force the native population to wear shoes.
 

DeniseM

Moderator
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
57,288
Reaction score
8,429
Points
1,849
Resorts Owned
WKORV, WKV, 2-SDO, 4-Kauai Beach Villas, Island Park Village (Yellowstone), Hyatt High Sierra, Dolphin's Cove (Anaheim)
The SVO book price (Nov'06) for the WKORV OF Dlx price was ~$86K - even if they were available and you were able to get them down to $72.9K - would it really be worth it? I mean - for example - if you were to try this - why not... sell yours on the reslae market - buy WKORV OF resale - and then buy WPORV EOY and requal the WKORV for about the same amount of money (plus incentives) - you may have to go to WKV for this... :)

I know - the thing is, we paid $45K and would be lucky to sell it for $30K in today's market, so we would take a loss of $15K on the sale. If we found a great price for an OF resale - say $50K, it would end up costing us 65K, when you consider the loss on the first property. Now I'm thinking about selling our OV week, buying an EOY OF week at the WKORV, and an OF week on another island at a less expensive resort...or maybe upgrading to OF at the Poipu resort....
 

BradC

Guest
Joined
Jun 17, 2005
Messages
291
Reaction score
2
Points
328
Location
CA, USA
I know - the thing is, we paid $45K and would be lucky to sell it for $30K in today's market, so we would take a loss of $15K on the sale. If we found a great price for an OF resale - say $50K, it would end up costing us 65K, when you consider the loss on the first property. Now I'm thinking about selling our OV week, buying an EOY OF week at the WKORV, and an OF week on another island at a less expensive resort...or maybe upgrading to OF at the Poipu resort....
I know it's hard to look at the loss from your original price when selling, but you really shouldn't figure that into your equation. The $45k you originally spent is gone regardless of whether you keep your current unit or "trade" it for an OF resale.

So with the numbers you quoted above, you should look at it as a cost of $20k to upgrade from OV to OF WKORV ($50k spent less $30 received on the sale).

The hard part is quantifying the "downgrade" from the developer-purchased to resale-purchased unit. I agree with you that the loss of conversion to StarPoints is a minimal concern, so I guess the only thing you would really lose is the elite-qualification, and of course that's only true if you don't requalify.
 
Last edited:

DavidnRobin

TUG Member
Joined
Dec 20, 2005
Messages
11,723
Reaction score
2,169
Points
698
Location
San Francisco Bay Area
Resorts Owned
WKORV OFD (Maui)
WPORV (Kauai)
WSJ-VGV (St. John)
WKV (Scottsdale)
I know - the thing is, we paid $45K and would be lucky to sell it for $30K in today's market, so we would take a loss of $15K on the sale. If we found a great price for an OF resale - say $50K, it would end up costing us 65K, when you consider the loss on the first property. Now I'm thinking about selling our OV week, buying an EOY OF week at the WKORV, and an OF week on another island at a less expensive resort...or maybe upgrading to OF at the Poipu resort....

I like the upgrade to Poipu idea.

As you know - that $15K is gone no matter what (unless there is a dramatic increase in value as SVO claims in their TS spiel) so it is a loss whatever decision is made (unless you hold onto it).

Have you stayed/seen the OF (Dlx or Prem) units at WKORV? Is there a OF TS like that in the islands? (I don't know the answer...). Have you seen an EOY OF for sale at WKORV?

If I had known that the studio-side of the center OF units had a real lanai - I probably would have gone with that (even giving up the corner and light) because of the lower MFs and being true OF. If you can easily rent the studio-side to cover the MFs (or plus some), then I think that is the best place to be (all factors considered). With only 12 of them - that is truly a unique TS (and maybe worth the extra cost).

Good luck. I am glad I followed the RRR&R (the 1st 3 Rs thanks to you and DL) makes me feel better about paying the $20K premium. This is how I feel about the WPORV EOY - I expect to take a $9K loss, but the upside is hopefully worth it.

Our 7-day rescind period has passed... :ignore:
 
Top