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Aruba Surf Club Marriot

michamato

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Hi

I am in need of some advice. I recently rescinded on my Tahiti Village in Las Vegas two days after I signed the contract, we decided the HIGH price and location just wasn't for us. I have always wanted a Marriot, but the price was out of reach, at least I thought it was, but why pay less for something you don't want right?

Marriot quoted me a gold season eoy Marriot Surf Club for 16700.00

I own a DVC and bought resale but Marriot keeps telling me what great point rewards, etc...and those would only be available if I bought through them.

any thoughts on what I should do? Buy direct or through resale?

We would most likely stay in Aruba eoy and maybe trade out on occassion but aruba for my family would be great and I wouldn't mind having to go there and stay.

Thanks
 

Docklander

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Resale Resale Resale

I bought my first two weeks at Aruba Surf Club through Marriott but that was before I discovered TUG. Knowing what I know now resale is almost always the best way to go. This is why.

1) The points you will receive from Marriott as an incentive for buying through them will not come close to equalling the savings you will make by buying thru the resale market. There was a time (some time ago apparently) where the points incentives were very high and were worth considering but those days seem to be well gone.

2) Additionally, Marriott almost cerainly told you that if you bought resale you would lose the option of trading in your week for marriott points should you wish not to use it. Whilst this is true it is also highly irrelavent IMO. Again, the money you could bring in by renting your week out on the open market would greatly exceed the points you would have received thru Marriott.

If you are still unsure then Dave (moderator on the Marriott board) is a resident expert on all things Marriott and you will probably struggle to field a question he can't answer.

Good luck
 

michamato

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thanks, I do need advice I should check that board too. It looks like 16700 for every other year, when I could get an every year for 16000.00 on red week or other places. Marriot did tell me all that stuff, but I could deposit it into Interval right? or I could rent it?
 

Dave M

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You can use a Marriott week, rent it or exchange it through Interval or one of the independent exchange companies, just like almost every other timeshare.

If you decide to rent, you can ask Marriott to make you an offer, but experience here indicates the offer will generally be significantly less than what you could get on the rental market on your own.

For a Marriott orientation, please read the FAQs for this Marriott forum, located at the top of the list of topics for the forum.
 

michamato

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Dave,

What do you think about Aruba surf Club? I am looking at an eoy, buying direct from Marriot, do you think resale is a better way to go, even without the points benefit? I hear you are an expert I would love to here your suggestions.

I would be spending most of my time there, but would like the option to trade, I am looking at a Gold season, 2 bedroom 2 bath lockout.


thanks
 

icydog

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Dave,

What do you think about Aruba surf Club? I am looking at an eoy, buying direct from Marriot, do you think resale is a better way to go, even without the points benefit? I hear you are an expert I would love to here your suggestions.

I would be spending most of my time there, but would like the option to trade, I am looking at a Gold season, 2 bedroom 2 bath lockout.


thanks
Hi I'm not Dave but I can tell you this much, the eoy contracts are harder to sell on the resale market so you can really get a nice contract if you look around.

Also the Aruba Marriotts, Gold Season, will give you and Accommodation Certificate if you deposit your gold week into II. An AC is a bonus week that allows you to get another week of vacation for $299, which if used for a Marriott, is a terrific bargain. Marriott owners get first dips on Marriott weeks deposited in II. Also, during the last 60 days before check in you'll find a lot of the top Marriotts that have not been taken listed on II. You'll see all these great resorts before non Marriott owners. Plus at 60 days you can use the studio portion to trade for any size week that is available. (A lot of folks buy off season Marriotts just for this opportunity). This II perk is great if you can travel within a two month timeframe. Marriott owners get first dips on those as well.

If you bought an annual contract you could get three weeks for one. A EOY will get you three weeks over two years which isn't a bad proposition for an owner. Just watch the maintenance fees, they are high at the Aruba Resorts. Take your time, buy resale when you are ready but first hang around and learn the ins and outs of the Marriott System before making this kind of decision. I own at DVC as well, and Marriott is not the same animal. They are both wonderful clubs but they don't work the same way. Don't get Marriott Reward points confused with DVC points. DVC points are the vehicle used to get your Disney Vacations, and if you want an interval vacation, DVC deposits a weeks worth of points into II for you with the anticipation of getting a superb trade. Marriott rewards points, Marriott points are garnered by depositing your week with Marriott, these are NOT allowed to be used for timeshare vacations but are used to get you air and hotel reservations.

I think if you do what I do you can rent your weeks and use that money to pay for your airfare +hotels and still have spending money. I am new to points since I have always purchased resale until now. Now I am buying the new Marriott Crystal Shores from the developer but the points offered mean little to me. I intend to use my week.
 
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Dave M

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There are many knowledgeable people on this forum. You have received good advice already.

I believe there are some valid reasons for buying from Marriott in the right situation. Most of those reasons include (1) a new resort that's not yet in resales that you feel you have to have now, (2) an offer with a boatload of front-end incentive points or (3) a preconstruction deal at prices almost guaranteed to allow you to break even on a resale within five years or so.

None of those situations seems to apply.

You stated:
It looks like $16,700 for every other year, when I could get an every year for $16,000 on red week or other places.
I can't imagine a situation where I would buy the EOY week from Marriott if I could get the EY week at the same resort on the resale market for about the same price or less. Having the Marriott Rewards points exchange option is nice, but the price you would pay for it is very high!

Also, as to Redweek and other resale prices, keep in mind that they are only asking prices. A bit of negotiation and patience will usually allow you to purchase your timeshare at an ideal price.
 

bbyanks

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Also keep in mind regarding points, that trading in a Marriott purchased Surf Club gold oceanview will only get you 90,000 points. Not worth the approx. $1,000 annual maintenance fee.
 

michamato

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thanks, I have alot of thinking to do. The Marriot woman told me that if I don't buy through Marriot that I am not allowed the 24 days before Marriot goes on the open market. (meaning I am not like the other marriot owners that buy direct through them) That does that make a big difference right? If I bought Marriot I would WANT the right to trade into other Marriots before everyone else. The points dont really mean much to me, and I like eoy because of the maintenace fee. We would go to Aruba almost every other year, not every year, so I thought that would be best, I cant find a resale on the market for every other year at the surf club either, I would love to see the difference in price.
 
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Dave M

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thanks, I have alot of thinking to do. The Marriot woman told me that if I don't buy through Marriot that I am not allowed the 24 days before Marriot goes on the open market. (meaning I am not like the other marriot owners that buy direct through them).
No thinking is necessary. What she told you is false. All Marriotts can see other Marriott weeks that are within the 24-day priority exchange period.

Take a look at this general description of the 24-day priority period from the FAQs at the MVCI site:
Weeks relinquished by Marriott Owners will be offered to other Marriott Owners requesting a comparable Internal Exchange within the Marriott family of resorts before becoming available to other Interval International® members.
Note there is no stated restriction applying only to those who bought from Marriott. Contrast that with the following quote from that site regarding whether you are eligible to exchange for Marriott Rewards points, which is the only ownership disadvantage of buying resale:
Determine if you are eligible to trade your week(s) for points by answering "yes" to every item listed below.
....
I purchased my timeshare interest from or through Marriott Vacation Club® International....
Note the specific resale restriction in this case versus its absence for accessing the 24-day window.

Although Marriott's salespeople are probably more honest and straightforward than most, they are still individuals and I'm sure a few make some strange or inaccurate claims. The next time that happens, ask them to show you where that claim is written down. Always remember that when it comes to purchasing from a developer, if they aren't willing to put it in the contract or some other legal document, such as the public offering statement, it doesn't exist!
 

michamato

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thanks Dave,

That to me then is a lie, not a spin, but LIE. I asked straight out if I still got my 24 day prioirty because I bought resale, she said NO, it is flagged and not eligible. I am going to ask her for that in writing.
 

Dave M

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Adding....

Search this Marriott forum using the terms resale and disadvantage. Although you'll find 16 threads, you won't find a single post in those threads from anyone who claims to have been denied the 24-day priority exchange window because of buying a resale week. None of the more than 500 active BBS participants who list Marriotts in their profile has ever complained about such a restriction.

That's because it doesn't exist.

There has been some speculation here (and that's all it is - speculation) that, when Marriott takes over its internal exchanges from II (presumably in late 2009 or in 2010), it might institute some policy that favors those who have purchased at least one timeshare from Marriott. Such speculation usually suggests that, if Marriott does adopt such a policy, it is likely Marriott would grandfather those who already own resale timeshares.

No one - at least outside of Marriott - knows what Marriott will do. But to pay Marriott double what you have to pay for a resale week based on what might or might not happen in the future would seem foolhardy!
 

Dave M

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That to me then is a lie, not a spin, but LIE.
To me, it's a lie if she knows her info to be false. However, the Marriott system is complex. It's asking a lot to expect that every salesperson knows every detail about the program. I don't know many people in business who know half as much as they think they do.

That brings up another point. If you are getting misinformation on this topic, its quite possible that you are getting misinformation (promises?) on other points. Thus, be sure to write down anything she says that is important to you. If you can't find it in any of Marriott's written materials, ask for the written version of the claim/promise/threat. The wrong time to find out that statements aren't accurate is after you have purchased and your recision period has expired.
 

michamato

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Oh thankfully I didn't buy yet. I did just rescind on tahiti village, that was a HUGE error and it is almost all set. I have been doing my homework and want Marriot Surf club, and have wanted it for over a year after I bought my DVC.

So....I just got off the phone with my rep and told her (demanded) that she put in writing that I do not get the 24 day priority period, she said I must of misunderstood. I said "no, you told me I didn't get it, there was no misunderstanding". She said that someone who buys from corporate would get preference to someone who didn't though. Again I said put that in writing, and she couldn't again I told her that wasn't true. I can't beleive someone would lie straight out.

DONE!! Now to find a great 2 bedroom lockoff in Aruba gold season...any suggestions on where to buy resale???
When I bought DVC I bought through the Timeshare store, I found them to be great for Disney but they don't have much inventory for Aruba and Marriot, any thought would be great! Thanks for everyone here saving me from a big mistake!!!

Yeah, I'd do a purchase/rescind just to get some of that bravo sierra in writing. Negotiate ;) :D

Ooh and Aah and get that sales manager to sign it :) I'm sure Marriott legal would have fun with that...

Pat
 

Dave M

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In some states, you can back up your request for something in writing with the law. As an example, Section 721.07 of the Florida Statutes provides:
The seller is prohibited from making any representations other than those contained in the contract and this public offering statement.
Thus, if a salesperson makes a representation that you can't find in writing, persist in asking for something in writing.
 

gores95

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To the OP....cannot agree more with the posts above. We are new to TS and took the Surf Club tour back in 11/06. Very tempting to purchase a 2BR Gold Oceanview for the Marriott price of $27,000 or so.

Instead came home, read everything I could (especially TUG!!) and ended up purchasing in January of this year an EVERY year 2BR Gold OceanSIDE resale from Shelley Preece at Transaction Realty for....$15,500!!!! Shelley was great and I highly recommend her...she has lots of contacts at Marriott and I believe helped us get through ROFR. Usage began in 2008 so I ended up locking off and depositing the 1BR side with II and was granted an AC. I now have three weeks to use with my 2BR lockoff!! Takes a little bit of the sting out of laying out the bucks for the purchase!

If Marriott decides to change the rules on how they treat resales vs. developer purchases (and they could I guess) I am hopeful existing units will be "grandfathered".

PM me if you need more info.

Marc
 
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m61376

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I already sent you a PM with a few recommendations, including Shelley from Transactionrealty that I had actually rec. to Marc. Marc's post is a perfect ex. of why people should not be so focused on the ROFR "price." He got an OS week (which is a more desirable view than OV at the SC) for less than someone else recently posted an OV got nabbed at. Had he listened to the naysayers and didn't negotiate the best price he could he would have overpaid. Another day, Marriott may have nabbed it. But- for whatever reason (could be that they just nabbed another, who knows) they let that one pass on that day. Tomorrow, who knows. BUT- Dave's advice is still the best- negotiate the best price you can. Make sure you aren't committed to any monetary layout that is not refundable and take your chances. Hopefully it will go through. If not, tomorrow, next week or next month there will be another deal.

Knowing the ROFR line helps the buyer in setting a realisitic price in his/her mind. However, if you are lucky and find a more anxious seller, take advantage of it and try to get the best deal you can. If Marriott exercises ROFR, it's frustrating- I know- but you'll survive. After a few hours of grumbling you'll begin your quest again. Happy hunting :wave: :wave:
 

Docklander

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Marc's post is a perfect ex. of why people should not be so focused on the ROFR "price." He got an OS week (which is a more desirable view than OV at the SC) for less than someone else recently posted an OV got nabbed at. Had he listened to the naysayers and didn't negotiate the best price he could he would have overpaid. Another day, Marriott may have nabbed it. But- for whatever reason (could be that they just nabbed another, who knows) they let that one pass on that day. Tomorrow, who knows. BUT- Dave's advice is still the best- negotiate the best price you can. Make sure you aren't committed to any monetary layout that is not refundable and take your chances. Hopefully it will go through. If not, tomorrow, next week or next month there will be another deal.

Knowing the ROFR line helps the buyer in setting a realisitic price in his/her mind. However, if you are lucky and find a more anxious seller, take advantage of it and try to get the best deal you can. If Marriott exercises ROFR, it's frustrating- I know- but you'll survive. After a few hours of grumbling you'll begin your quest again. Happy hunting :wave: :wave:
Marc purchased in January, we are now talking about ROFR in July, the two are completely separate and cannot be compared. In January Marriott had a lot of inventory left at MSC, whilst they have next to none right now. The price that Marc paid (well done by the way!) will not pass ROFR now....infact it wont even come close to passing and I'm prepared to bet that no one on here will get an OV let alone an OS past ROFR at that price in the next 6 months. Like I've said before, IMO, giving people the idea that Marriott will let properties pass ROFR at prices that (in current market conditions) are too low is just setting them up for losing week after week to ROFR and getting precisely nowhere with their purchases. Better see what prices are actually passing and seeing if that is what you're willing to pay. Most importantly, please please please stop comparing prices that passed ROFR way in the past (by which I mean more than 4 months ago) with todays market as they provide no guide whatsoever.
 

m61376

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Obviously we disagree on approach; I have read your bantering with Dave in another thread on this matter.

However, if you read enough about people's experiences and talk to enough realtors (and, actually, I spoke to many realtors about this resort in particular) you will realize that even those people that deal daily with Marriott do not know what the magic ROFR number is. I have been told by many people that what passes today may get nabbed at a higher price tomorrow and vice versa. I still stand by what I wrote and the advice that Dave proffers- negotiate the best deal you can because you never know. Use the ROFR as a guideline as to what may be a realistic price but recognize that it is not set in stone. It can be as variable as who expresses interest in what units while visiting the resort that past week (so what Marriott anticipates its needs may be), so things may pass now or in the future at even a lower price than it did a few months ago, contrary to what you maintain, esp. when there are more resales on the market (gen. in late Fall when MF's are approaching).

You are right that the closer you get to the imaginary ROFR line, the more likely the unit will get nabbed. If you have a crystal ball and go below the ROFR line you will likely lose it- but, since realistically that line fluctuates and is unknown, if you look at it as being set in stone you will certainly have less aggravation (you are right there) but may likely pay more than you need to. Only you can determine if paying a little more is worth saving some aggravation.

I just noticed this recent evidence of exactly what I was saying- look at this thread: http://www.tugbbs.com/forums/showthread.php?t=51386. A MMC week just passed at a much lower price than others were recently (and not so recently) nabbed at. Just proves ya never know....
 
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