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Woman seeks to change law after discovering truth about her genetic family tree

Glynda

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We have found out things we didn’t want to know and there a slew of supposed relatives that no one in the family has ever heard of (and they have done extensive genealogy)

DNA doesn't lie, people do.
 

rapmarks

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I may be missing something, but I don't understand. What results can not be true? It's entirely possible for full siblings to get different ancestry prediction results from their DNA tests. Only identical twins get the exact same mix. My husband is a fraternal twin. His twin sister has more German DNA than he. He has more Irish DNA than she. He has a small amount of Asian DNA. His twin has none. Your sister's child would have a a father's DNA to take into account in the mix also.
How can a person be only 2% Italian when they should be near 50%. Who do you think is lying? I remember my mother carrying the baby and my sister carrying the baby. They were both full Italian. I understand that an Italian relative could have immigrated to Italy,but to be 2% has to be inaccurate, when it should be close to fifty percent. The child’s father was polish, and she came out half polish, or close. You can’t tell me that isn’t a mistake. I am trying to picture my mother having an affair, she never drove, she had three little children, she lived upstAirs from my father’s mother and sisters. She dragged us with her everywhere. And by the way, there are all kinds of relativeson my side, who I know, that all came in as high percentage Italian on the same test. A difference of a few percentage points is normal, forty percent difference between first cousins is not. Did my sister get the wrong baby? She looks just like my mother, my sister, and two of my mother’s nieces
 

VacationForever

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How can a person be only 2% Italian when they should be near 50%. Who do you think is lying? I remember my mother carrying the baby and my sister carrying the baby. They were both full Italian. I understand that an Italian relative could have immigrated to Italy,but to be 2% has to be inaccurate, when it should be close to fifty percent. The child’s father was polish, and she came out half polish, or close. You can’t tell me that isn’t a mistake. I am trying to picture my mother having an affair, she never drove, she had three little children, she lived upstAirs from my father’s mother and sisters. She dragged us with her everywhere. And by the way, there are all kinds of relativeson my side, who I know, that all came in as high percentage Italian on the same test. A difference of a few percentage points is normal, forty percent difference between first cousins is not. Did my sister get the wrong baby? She looks just like my mother, my sister, and two of my mother’s nieces
Maybe she got swapped accidentally in the hospital?
 

rapmarks

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Well I think it really strange that the wrong baby has her father’s dna and looks like her mother. Isn’t it just a little possible that the company was inaccurate. By the way, the cousins she looks like, they had their dna done too, and she came up related to them.
 

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There is no "Italian" DNA. There is DNA from populations reported to be in geographical areas. The republic of Italy dates to 1946, so presumably people born since then in that region have "Italian" DNA. So Ethiopia might be where Italian Grand Parents might hail from if they were born around 1935. Seriously though, do a retest if you feel the test had poor results. And if it comes back "2% Italian" dig into how the heck they define "Italian" It might be southern European or Mediterranean. Matriarchal DNA should be a match, as it is passed basically unchanged, so your Mother's Mitochondrial DNA and Your Mitochondrial DNA should be a significant match. Two sisters from the same mother and father should also contain a very large amount of similar DNA. The whole "My DNA is Irish or Italian or Pitcairn Islandic" is a bit of a misnomer, as in the grand scheme of things your DNA predates most contemporary geopolitical boundaries.
 

Glynda

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How can a person be only 2% Italian when they should be near 50%. Who do you think is lying? I remember my mother carrying the baby and my sister carrying the baby. They were both full Italian. I understand that an Italian relative could have immigrated to Italy,but to be 2% has to be inaccurate, when it should be close to fifty percent. The child’s father was polish, and she came out half polish, or close. You can’t tell me that isn’t a mistake. I am trying to picture my mother having an affair, she never drove, she had three little children, she lived upstAirs from my father’s mother and sisters. She dragged us with her everywhere. And by the way, there are all kinds of relativeson my side, who I know, that all came in as high percentage Italian on the same test. A difference of a few percentage points is normal, forty percent difference between first cousins is not. Did my sister get the wrong baby? She looks just like my mother, my sister, and two of my mother’s nieces

Have your parents, you and your sister, and the father of your sister's child all had DNA testing at the same testing site? How do you know that both were full Italian? How do you know if your sister's child's father is fully Polish? As you said, you understand that people have immigrated. People have migrated from all over the world for centuries. Their future generations have assumed that they were what they were told. They aren't lying intentionally. They pass on what they recall being told. No one's recollection is 100% accurate. I am in no way insinuating that any particular person is lying.

However, there are the secrets, the lies. Affairs. Children born as the result of a rape, the mother too frightened to tell. Children passed off as a husband's. Or husbands who had an affair and told no one. He may not have even known of the child's existence. A couple may have even taken in a child to raise as their own and not told anyone. It could have happened generations back and the DNA dice rolled differently for one sibling than another.

And yes, children switched at birth. And the very rare possibility that an testing site made an error. I have only read of one instance.

I have tested at two separate sites. I have uploaded those DNA tests to several different sites. Each ancestry prediction varies. Some by many percentages. Ancestry predictions are always being refined as more people test. Ancestry.com upgrades my predictions regularly. They have the largest data base so are assumed to be more accurate. However, it just depends upon how many, of each ethnicity, test.

I am impartial in your situation. You are emotionally involved. I read this kind of reaction to DNA results all the time on DNA sites. If you don't trust the DNA results, then by all means get tested on another.
 
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Glynda

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There is no "Italian" DNA. There is DNA from populations reported to be in geographical areas. The republic of Italy dates to 1946, so presumably people born since then in that region have "Italian" DNA. So Ethiopia might be where Italian Grand Parents might hail from if they were born around 1935. Seriously though, do a retest if you feel the test had poor results. And if it comes back "2% Italian" dig into how the heck they define "Italian" It might be southern European or Mediterranean. Matriarchal DNA should be a match, as it is passed basically unchanged, so your Mother's Mitochondrial DNA and Your Mitochondrial DNA should be a significant match. Two sisters from the same mother and father should also contain a very large amount of similar DNA. The whole "My DNA is Irish or Italian or Pitcairn Islandic" is a bit of a misnomer, as in the grand scheme of things your DNA predates most contemporary geopolitical boundaries.

Very well said!
 

rapmarks

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Well I give up. The two grandfathers that emigrated were faking it, and my sisters and Nieces who visited the family that stayed behind in Italy were faking it too, as well as the cousins who visited them. If there is no Italian dna,why do my children show 38 % Italian and 12 percent Southern European on their test and the relatives that I know from my side show the same.
I always wondered why the ancestry.com ads said I always thought I was German but I really was ............., Again this victim of rape and lies shows up related to all the known cousins, the known cousins have high Italian dna (which apparently is nonexistent) and my niece does not. But ancestry.com is right and my entire family is deceiving each other.and yes my niece is going to get tested on another site.
 

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Two of my sisters have dual citizenship, United States and Italian, we have photocopies of the immigration papers, and they proved the ancestry and they were granted Italian citizenship.
 

Glynda

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Well I give up. The two grandfathers that emigrated were faking it, and my sisters and Nieces who visited the family that stayed behind in Italy were faking it too, as well as the cousins who visited them. If there is no Italian dna,why do my children show 38 % Italian and 12 percent Southern European on their test and the relatives that I know from my side show the same.
I always wondered why the ancestry.com ads said I always thought I was German but I really was ............., Again this victim of rape and lies shows up related to all the known cousins, the known cousins have high Italian dna (which apparently is nonexistent) and my niece does not. But ancestry.com is right and my entire family is deceiving each other.and yes my niece is going to get tested on another site.

Take a deep breath. It appears to me as if you are shooting from the hip with your replies. No one is pointing fingers at your family's history but you. I, and others, are merely suggesting possibilities as to why any DNA test might vary from one's perception of what it should state. Along with re-testing I suggest that you do some reading about DNA and join a DNA search group to ask your questions of experts.
 

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I found out in my 40s that the father that raised me wasn't my biological father. I made my mother introduce me to my biological father. (He was a extramarital fling.) The guy was pretty much a jerk. I was definitely curious about my 4 half siblings but decided it wasn't worth messing up their lives to pursue. Things were so different in the 50s. My mom was absolutely sure that her husband didn't know but it's his family that spilled the beans. This secret tore my parent's marriage part and they never even discussed it.
 

rapmarks

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My niece did 23 and me this time, 31 percent Italian or Southern European. Mentioned specifically Veneta, where my mothers father was born.
So I guess she isn’t someone else’s child and part of a cover up as she shares 15% dna with my son, and16% dna with my daughter.
That is quite different from the 2% on ancestry, which I said from the start wasn’t right.

And also 49 percent polish, when my sister married, her husband’s grandparents lived across the street from us, they spoke Polish.
 
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Patri

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Well I give up. The two grandfathers that emigrated were faking it, and my sisters and Nieces who visited the family that stayed behind in Italy were faking it too, as well as the cousins who visited them. If there is no Italian dna,why do my children show 38 % Italian and 12 percent Southern European on their test and the relatives that I know from my side show the same.
I always wondered why the ancestry.com ads said I always thought I was German but I really was ............., Again this victim of rape and lies shows up related to all the known cousins, the known cousins have high Italian dna (which apparently is nonexistent) and my niece does not. But ancestry.com is right and my entire family is deceiving each other.and yes my niece is going to get tested on another site.
I'm with you rap. I think some of these companies are sending fake reports because testing is so popular now. My sister used 23andMe. She came back 31% Scandinavian (close to what we believe we are), 12% French/German (a little low), and other overlapping backgrounds.
So we thought it would be fun to test my mom while we had the chance. She is 91 and has dementia. It was very tough to even get a swab. She didn't trust or understand what was going on. That test was through MyHeritage. The results were 72% Scandinavian and 28% English. Mom is 100% German. We have family records going back to where all her grandparents were born in Germany. German was the first language of the oldest siblings in Mom's family.
We sent the test using her married name, Nelson, so I swear an employee just sent back a report based on her name. Mom's parents were poor farmers. They had 11 children one after another. Mom was in the middle. Her mother would have been too tired, busy and without opportunity or interest in having an affair.
I was so disappointed. We won't be seeking a test through another company. Why waste the money? And now mom is even further gone mentally, so we're not going to poke around in her.
 

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Yes, I realize that someone from a nearby country can migrate and blend in and that populations are mixed. But the dna doesn’t lie, wrong child, cover up comments, were not true were they, so now we know that the ancestry fugures were way off, and yes I do understand dna, started studying it when they first did the testing.
And my daughter and niece have the exact same maternal hapalog, which seems to assert what I was saying all along.
 

Glynda

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My niece did 23 and me this time, 31 percent Italian or Southern European. Mentioned specifically Veneta, where my mothers father was born.
So I guess she isn’t someone else’s child and part of a cover up as she shares 15% dna with my son, and16% dna with my daughter.
That is quite different from the 2% on ancestry, which I said from the start wasn’t right.

And also 49 percent polish, when my sister married, her husband’s grandparents lived across the street from us, they spoke Polish.

I'm glad that you have closure. Just curious...I don't know how recently your niece tested on Ancestry, but have you checked back to see if there is an update to her results on Ancestry?

As I also noted above, "I have tested at two separate sites. I have uploaded those DNA tests to several different sites. Each ancestry prediction varies. Some by many percentages. Ancestry predictions are always being refined as more people test. Ancestry.com upgrades my predictions regularly. They have the largest data base so are assumed to be more accurate. However, it just depends upon how many, of each ethnicity, test."

Here are my results of two DNA tests, Ancestry and 23andme, and one at My Heritage where I uploaded one of the two tests' data, I don't remember which. You will see how much the reports seem to vary. At one time Ancestry also reflected what you see in the My Heritage results. 23andme also has upgraded my results as time has passed. I don't believe any of these made a mistake. I believe that they differ based upon how they define geographical areas and the size of their databases.

Glynda

Ancestry.com:

Ethnicity Estimate
  • England, Wales & Northwestern Europe 46%
  • Ireland & Scotland 31%
  • Norway 15%
  • Germanic Europe 4%
  • Sweden 2%
  • Finland 1%
  • Greece & the Balkans 1%

23andme:

European 99.2%

Northwestern European 98.5%

British & Irish 55.9%

French & German 19%

Scandinavian 5.6%

Finnish 0.9%

Broadly Northwestern European 17.2%

Southern European 0.4%

Broadly Southern European 0.4%

Trace Ancestry 0.5%

Unassigned 0.2%


MyHeritage.com:

Europe 100%

North and West Europe 66.8%

Irish, Scottish, and Welsh 50.4%

Finnish 8.7%

English 7.7%

South Europe 28.7%

Iberian 28.7%

East European 3.5%

Baltic: 3.5%

Ashkenazi Jewish 1.0%
 
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rapmarks

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My niece did both tests within a month. Either ancestry does not refine any Southern European ancestry, or there was an error.
Ancestry had her at 53% Russian, 23 and me 49% Polish which is more likely.

Some interesting differences among my children
Daughter shows Italian is southern, Calabria, while son shows northern, Venetian, both are in the family.
For French and German, each 14%, daughter shows Bavarian, son shows Swiss.
But as a whole, they are within a percentage point different in every subgroup.
There is a map where you can see where all relatives tested are located.

And my son, daughter, and niece show identical maternal haplogroup.
Now that my niece took test, we can pull out all relatives on my side, and can tell which ones are on my husband’s side.(without having to go through additional steps)

The really unfortunate part is my daughter shows genetic likelihood of Alzheimer’s, which my husband, his mother, and probably his grandmother had.


As I said earlier this explains ancestry’s ads which have people stating they thought they were one nationality and they were another, I don’t think ancestry separates that well.
 

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I know enough about both sides of the family and undergoing DNA testing won't tell me anything about family roots. However on the medical side, it is good to know what sort of illnesses and diseases we may be susceptible to. Up to this point in life, not one person whom we know that is genetically linked to us on both sides of the family has had cancer. We are talking about all uncles, aunts, grand uncles and cousins. I am keeping my fingers crossed that maybe we will luck out too.
Same with my husband. One grandmother died of cancer in her late 80's, but otherwise no cancer in his family, until he was diagnosed in his 50's. The frustrating thing (for me) was that his family did have a lot of heart disease which I blamed on his mother's midwestern cooking. Lot's of eggs fried in bacon grease, lots of red meat. Nothing terrible, just not super healthy. We have always eaten a lean diet heavy on fruits and vegetables. We don't drink soda, but water instead. And still, cancer, with a side of heart disease thrown in for good measure. I feel a bit betrayed!
 

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My niece did both tests within a month. Either ancestry does not refine any Southern European ancestry, or there was an error.
Ancestry had her at 53% Russian, 23 and me 49% Polish which is more likely.

Some interesting differences among my children
Daughter shows Italian is southern, Calabria, while son shows northern, Venetian, both are in the family.
For French and German, each 14%, daughter shows Bavarian, son shows Swiss.
But as a whole, they are within a percentage point different in every subgroup.
There is a map where you can see where all relatives tested are located.

And my son, daughter, and niece show identical maternal haplogroup.
Now that my niece took test, we can pull out all relatives on my side, and can tell which ones are on my husband’s side.(without having to go through additional steps)

The really unfortunate part is my daughter shows genetic likelihood of Alzheimer’s, which my husband, his mother, and probably his grandmother had.


As I said earlier this explains ancestry’s ads which have people stating they thought they were one nationality and they were another, I don’t think ancestry separates that well.

Each of your children are uniquely themselves and a mixture of their ancestors but not identical. It's kind of fun to declare that one has more of a favorite relative's DNA. My sister-in-law declared for years that my husband got the German grandfather's side and she the Irish of their father. It was with great satisfaction that we informed her that the opposite was true.

As you can see my Southern European varies greatly on My Heritage from Ancestry and 23andme too.
 

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I'm with you rap. I think some of these companies are sending fake reports because testing is so popular now. My sister used 23andMe. She came back 31% Scandinavian (close to what we believe we are), 12% French/German (a little low), and other overlapping backgrounds.
So we thought it would be fun to test my mom while we had the chance. She is 91 and has dementia. It was very tough to even get a swab. She didn't trust or understand what was going on. That test was through MyHeritage. The results were 72% Scandinavian and 28% English. Mom is 100% German. We have family records going back to where all her grandparents were born in Germany. German was the first language of the oldest siblings in Mom's family.
We sent the test using her married name, Nelson, so I swear an employee just sent back a report based on her name. Mom's parents were poor farmers. They had 11 children one after another. Mom was in the middle. Her mother would have been too tired, busy and without opportunity or interest in having an affair.
I was so disappointed. We won't be seeking a test through another company. Why waste the money? And now mom is even further gone mentally, so we're not going to poke around in her.
My sister did the test on Ancestry and we also got Scandinavian instead of the German we know that we are. An uncle who is pretty well versed in dna things says that they just use an area, not specific countries, sometimes.

If you want some fun try being Hawaiian. We know that we are. Lineage can be traced back to the ali'i. (No joke). We come up as "Pacific Islanders". They have to group everyone with heritage from the entire Pacific ocean areas into one single group, lol. My uncle who is the family researcher of our Hawaiian heritage was mad about that result! But it had something to do with the lack of samples to be able to differentiate between groups.
 

rapmarks

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In response to previous post, not as young as the dates you are giving.
My grandfathers came here in 1910, my grandmothers parents came in 1875.
My paternal grandfather had three uncles here who sponsored him. His father remarried after his mother died and new stepmother did not want his children. He emigrated, then brought younger brother and sister here. The older sister stayed there. My sisters and some cousins have visited those relatives in Italy. There is a book out about that family, I was asked for photos to include in that book. Those three uncles each had ten children. Everyone lived in the Roseland section of Chicago.
From the start, I said my niece had to have more than 2% Italian, they were not even showing any neighboring countries. I am not the one who speculated that there was a family secret regarding her birth. And subsequent testing verified my opinion.
 

Glynda

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Same with my husband. One grandmother died of cancer in her late 80's, but otherwise no cancer in his family, until he was diagnosed in his 50's. The frustrating thing (for me) was that his family did have a lot of heart disease which I blamed on his mother's midwestern cooking. Lot's of eggs fried in bacon grease, lots of red meat. Nothing terrible, just not super healthy. We have always eaten a lean diet heavy on fruits and vegetables. We don't drink soda, but water instead. And still, cancer, with a side of heart disease thrown in for good measure. I feel a bit betrayed!

My adopted mother has reached 97, in good health for her age. All her life she's eaten, and cooked, Southern fried meats, fried seafood & even some fried veggies. She puts bacon or ham in just about every veggie, has pancakes, bacon/sausage, eggs and grits regularly. She uses lots of butter and salt. White bread, biscuits and cornbread and always has vanilla ice cream in the freezer to top her baked pies and cobblers. Go figure!
 

Glynda

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My sister did the test on Ancestry and we also got Scandinavian instead of the German we know that we are. An uncle who is pretty well versed in dna things says that they just use an area, not specific countries, sometimes.

If you want some fun try being Hawaiian. We know that we are. Lineage can be traced back to the ali'i. (No joke). We come up as "Pacific Islanders". They have to group everyone with heritage from the entire Pacific ocean areas into one single group, lol. My uncle who is the family researcher of our Hawaiian heritage was mad about that result! But it had something to do with the lack of samples to be able to differentiate between groups.

I would recommend checking back on results on Ancestry as they do frequently up date and refine the results as more people test. Also I would sign up for their Beta program. At one time, they had Eastern European among my results but now have refined the results. If the family I am researching now as my possible paternal origins is indeed my paternal bio-father's family, one would think I would show Ukraine and more German ancestry. However, one side of that family is more British, as am I, so knowing the lower possibility of being from their Russian and German sides, I can focus on the British.


23andme has recently refined their results to even show this concerning my ancestry and this could be a big help in my search! I'm amazed that they can
do this!

United Kingdom
The United Kingdom has 165 administrative regions, and we found the strongest evidence of your ancestry in the following 10 regions.

1. Greater London
2. Glasgow City
3. Lancashire
4. Greater Manchester
5. West Midlands
6. Edinburgh
7. Merseryside
8. West Yorkshire
9. Suffolk
10. Tyne and Wear


Ireland has 26 administrative regions, and we found the strongest evidence of your ancestry in the following 10 regions.
  1. County Dublin
  2. County Cork
  3. County Tipperary
  4. County Clare
  5. County Limerick
  6. County Kerry
  7. County Mayo
  8. County Offaly
  9. County Roscommon
  10. County Sligo
Germany has 16 administrative regions, and we found the strongest evidence of your ancestry in the following 1 regions.
Baden-Württemberg


Iceland. Although it is likely you had ancestors who lived in Iceland in the last 200 years, we have not been able to identify the specific regions in Iceland where your ancestors may have lived.

Sweden has 21 administrative regions, and we found the strongest evidence of your ancestry in the following 1 regions.
Gavleborg County


Though my bio ancestors seem to be primarily from the British Isles, my potential bio father's family tree shows a number of German ancestors having lived in Baden-Württemberg and my German results above only list Baden-Wurttemberg as a potential area! Am I on to something? It's all a journey of discovery with lots yet to learn!

Also on my bio-maternal side, I can trace from my great-grandmother 's family back to the earliest migration in Iceland's history and from there back to Norway further.

One last thing, my bio maternal great-grandfather immigrated to the US from Sweden. We are unable to trace him back further than his immigration from Stockholm to the US. He could have traveled to take the ship. Above, 23andme has broken the Swedish side down to just one county!

Sorry, if this has bored you! :rolleyes: I'm just thinking out loud with my fingers!
 
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