• The TUGBBS forums are completely free and open to the public and exist as the absolute best place for owners to get help and advice about their timeshares for more than 30 years!

    Join Tens of Thousands of other Owners just like you here to get any and all Timeshare questions answered 24 hours a day!
  • TUG started 30 years ago in October 1993 as a group of regular Timeshare owners just like you!

    Read about our 30th anniversary: Happy 30th Birthday TUG!
  • TUG has a YouTube Channel to produce weekly short informative videos on popular Timeshare topics!

    Free memberships for every 50 subscribers!

    Visit TUG on Youtube!
  • TUG has now saved timeshare owners more than $21,000,000 dollars just by finding us in time to rescind a new Timeshare purchase! A truly incredible milestone!

    Read more here: TUG saves owners more than $21 Million dollars
  • Sign up to get the TUG Newsletter for free!

    60,000+ subscribing owners! A weekly recap of the best Timeshare resort reviews and the most popular topics discussed by owners!
  • Our official "end my sales presentation early" T-shirts are available again! Also come with the option for a free membership extension with purchase to offset the cost!

    All T-shirt options here!
  • A few of the most common links here on the forums for newbies and guests!

What is your maintenance fee threshold?

skimble

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2005
Messages
877
Reaction score
42
Points
388
Location
Murrieta, CA
Great location, well maintained with strong amenities and low maintenance fees-- that's the epitome of what we all want. But, that's hard to find and often changes.

The general rules in timesharing is are:
1. As maintenance fees rise, resale value decreases.
2. Maintenance fees only go up. (Even when they tell you they needed to add $60 to pay for a certain unexpected repair.)
3. When a developer inventory runs out, fees will rise dramatically.
4. Large maintenance fee increases can be linked to delinquencies, sales and foreclosures.
5. When maintenance fees surpass prevailing market rental rates, resorts struggle to keep owners.

I remember about 15-20 years ago, the threshold for acceptable fees was about $75/night or about $500/week. Then $100/night became the norm or $700/week. Now, I'm seeing them push $1,000/week (not Hilton, Marriott or Hyatt). One of my resorts has breached this 4 digit threshold. It's a strong 5 star resort, but this fee increase is an audacious step. I see the resales already, and I'm concerned that delinquencies will rise.
I have not reached my threshold (and probably wont since I own prime), but I know many off-season owners will-- and this is bad for all owners at this resort.
I'm speaking for California Coastal-- where I own most of my timeshare units.
But, costs are higher everywhere.
I know it varies by region and by location... but what is an acceptable threshold for your annual maintenance fees?
And, what is the unacceptable threshold where you say, "I quit... I'm not paying this anymore!"?
 

ronparise

TUG Member
Joined
Feb 10, 2011
Messages
12,664
Reaction score
2,134
Points
548
Great location, well maintained with strong amenities and low maintenance fees-- that's the epitome of what we all want. But, that's hard to find and often changes.

The general rules in timesharing is are:
1. As maintenance fees rise, resale value decreases.
2. Maintenance fees only go up. (Even when they tell you they needed to add $60 to pay for a certain unexpected repair.)
3. When a developer inventory runs out, fees will rise dramatically.
4. Large maintenance fee increases can be linked to delinquencies, sales and foreclosures.
5. When maintenance fees surpass prevailing market rental rates, resorts struggle to keep owners.

I remember about 15-20 years ago, the threshold for acceptable fees was about $75/night or about $500/week. Then $100/night became the norm or $700/week. Now, I'm seeing them push $1,000/week (not Hilton, Marriott or Hyatt). One of my resorts has breached this 4 digit threshold. It's a strong 5 star resort, but this fee increase is an audacious step. I see the resales already, and I'm concerned that delinquencies will rise.
I have not reached my threshold (and probably wont since I own prime), but I know many off-season owners will-- and this is bad for all owners at this resort.
I'm speaking for California Coastal-- where I own most of my timeshare units.
But, costs are higher everywhere.
I know it varies by region and by location... but what is an acceptable threshold for your annual maintenance fees?
And, what is the unacceptable threshold where you say, "I quit... I'm not paying this anymore!"?

Your number one and number five are pretty much the same thing. I would restate it and say, If maintenance fees rise beyond comparable rentals, resale value is less than zero. And when resale value is less than zero, owners walk away
Number two is true but it dosent matter if comparable rentals going up too
Number three just isnt true
Number four; drop the word "Large" and "sales" and Id agree, This is related what you say in the line Ive underlined and bolded in your post.

The issue you are describing is this: In many (all) seasonal resorts the maintenance fees for off season weeks are the same as for prime season weeks. Or put another way; Blue week owners are subsidizing the Red week owners. And that ain't fair.

To your question; The Blue week owners will reach their threshold first. As they walk away, fees will rise for every one because the same budget will be paid by fewer owners. And if the fees rise for the red week owners, beyond comparable rentals, they will walk too
 
Last edited:

uscav8r

TUG Review Crew: Expert
TUG Member
Joined
Feb 1, 2013
Messages
1,961
Reaction score
266
Points
294
Location
Virginia
You seem to focus too much on a singular dollar amount. One could argue that $500 in 1997 is roughly in line with $1000 in 2017 when adjusted for inflation.

I tend to agree with Ron; the true threshold must be a comparison to the contemporary alternatives.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

Saintsfanfl

TUG Member
Joined
Mar 7, 2012
Messages
8,844
Reaction score
630
Points
399
Location
Central Florida
To your question; The Blue week owners will reach their threshold first. As they walk away, fees will rise for every one because the same budget will be paid by fewer owners. And if the fees rise for the red week owners, beyond comparable rentals, they will walk too

This is so true and when this happens the timeshare must end. This failed model is the reason why the big companies switched to points systems. Points systems ultimately still have the same issue but are blended and can last much longer and possibly indefinitely if managed properly.

Places that do not have huge season variances like New Orleans and even Orlando are immune to the same issue but can still fail due to a number of other variables.
 

bogey21

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 8, 2005
Messages
9,455
Reaction score
4,662
Points
649
Location
Fort Worth, Texas
About 10-12 years ago when I was building out my portfolio of Independent HOA Controlled Weeks I targeted $400 - $500 MFs and only had to exceed my target one time. I'm guessing today I would be looking at $600 - $700.

George
 

WinniWoman

TUG Review Crew: Veteran
TUG Member
Joined
Jul 16, 2010
Messages
10,762
Reaction score
7,057
Points
749
Location
The Weirs, New Hampshire
Resorts Owned
Innseason Pollard Brook
I suspect that this is a growing problem for Weeks Owners.

George


This is why at Smuggs they ended up selling annual ownerships with "attached" floaters. If you wanted an annual prime fixed week ownership you had to take on an annual floater week with it, thus paying two maintenance fees per year. If you didn't want to do that you could only get an every other year prime week and for the years in between that you HAD to take on a floater week.

Luckily most of the floater weeks occur during some nice months like June and Sept/Oct. And there are very few blue weeks at Smuggs. Most are pink and white.
 

Jason245

TUG Review Crew: Expert
TUG Member
Joined
Jul 14, 2014
Messages
1,920
Reaction score
171
Points
173
Great location, well maintained with strong amenities and low maintenance fees-- that's the epitome of what we all want. But, that's hard to find and often changes.

The general rules in timesharing is are:
1. As maintenance fees rise, resale value decreases.
2. Maintenance fees only go up. (Even when they tell you they needed to add $60 to pay for a certain unexpected repair.)
3. When a developer inventory runs out, fees will rise dramatically.
4. Large maintenance fee increases can be linked to delinquencies, sales and foreclosures.
5. When maintenance fees surpass prevailing market rental rates, resorts struggle to keep owners.

I remember about 15-20 years ago, the threshold for acceptable fees was about $75/night or about $500/week. Then $100/night became the norm or $700/week. Now, I'm seeing them push $1,000/week (not Hilton, Marriott or Hyatt). One of my resorts has breached this 4 digit threshold. It's a strong 5 star resort, but this fee increase is an audacious step. I see the resales already, and I'm concerned that delinquencies will rise.
I have not reached my threshold (and probably wont since I own prime), but I know many off-season owners will-- and this is bad for all owners at this resort.
I'm speaking for California Coastal-- where I own most of my timeshare units.
But, costs are higher everywhere.
I know it varies by region and by location... but what is an acceptable threshold for your annual maintenance fees?
And, what is the unacceptable threshold where you say, "I quit... I'm not paying this anymore!"?
I think threshold is governed by two factors :

1. Disposable income.
2. The savings of owning vs renting.

1 governs the primary threshold decision.
2 governs the value decision .

If 1 significantly decrease I will definitely dump what I own.. if 2 decreases or goes negative, I might sell depending on whether I think it is a temporary or permenant market adjustment.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk
 

T-Dot-Traveller

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 10, 2015
Messages
4,645
Reaction score
3,592
Points
348
Location
Canada
Resorts Owned
Mayan Palace Regency
Taranova
I agree with the the posts in this thread .

The additional factor for Canadians is that almost all warm weather TS have MF denominated in $ USD .
so -USD to Loonie exchange rate is an added factor for me .

$ 700 USD = $ 875 to $ 900 Canadian . ( Nov 2017 - 1$ USD cost $1.28 CDN / / or 78 cents value in USD )
The range is cash vs a credit card with a foreign exchange fee .

When the Loonie was .92 cents a few years ago you saw more Canadians in Florida , because the vacation
cost was lower
 

skimble

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2005
Messages
877
Reaction score
42
Points
388
Location
Murrieta, CA
Your number one and number five are pretty much the same thing. I would restate it and say, If maintenance fees rise beyond comparable rentals, resale value is less than zero. And when resale value is less than zero, owners walk away
Number two is true but it dosent matter if comparable rentals going up too
Number three just isnt true
Number four; drop the word "Large" and "sales" and Id agree, This is related what you say in the line Ive underlined and bolded in your post.

The issue you are describing is this: In many (all) seasonal resorts the maintenance fees for off season weeks are the same as for prime season weeks. Or put another way; Blue week owners are subsidizing the Red week owners. And that ain't fair.

To your question; The Blue week owners will reach their threshold first. As they walk away, fees will rise for every one because the same budget will be paid by fewer owners. And if the fees rise for the red week owners, beyond comparable rentals, they will walk too

You make some good points/corrections to my list.
We know why people walk, and maintenance fees are a big part of that equation.
If owners saw fluctuations in their fees that moved up one year to pay for the new kitchen, then down to the normal range... maybe they'd maintain their ownership in the hopes that next year might stabilize. But the pattern is consistent... fees only go up.
I wasn't looking for a blue v. red week ownership discussion.
Everyone has a threshold where they say, "I'm out!" My sister's friend is just about to abort her ownership as it breached the $750 mark. I'm curious to know what the threshold is for different people in different areas.
 

skimble

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2005
Messages
877
Reaction score
42
Points
388
Location
Murrieta, CA
You seem to focus too much on a singular dollar amount. One could argue that $500 in 1997 is roughly in line with $1000 in 2017 when adjusted for inflation.

I tend to agree with Ron; the true threshold must be a comparison to the contemporary alternatives.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I see this with cars and houses-- a $15k car in '97 now goes for about $30k. But, that's attributable to low interest rates.
Not everything has doubled in price. If this is the case, is a $300 hotel room from '97 now going for $600?
I don't have the historical data, but I don't believe this to be the case.
 

vacationtime1

TUG Review Crew: Veteran
TUG Member
Joined
Sep 7, 2006
Messages
5,159
Reaction score
2,750
Points
649
Location
San Francisco
Resorts Owned
WKORV-OF (Maui)
WKV x2 (Scottsdale)
I'm curious to know what the threshold is for different people in different areas.

That will depend on differing purposes for owning timeshares, as well as the people owning them.

The MF's on my Maui 2bd OF are well above $2,000 and I'm fine with it; we lock off the unit so we can spend two weeks sitting on the lanai gawking at the OF view.

otoh, we owned a 2bd trader at Sheraton Broadway Plantation and dumped it when the MF's went over a thousand. When added to trading costs (Interval membership, trading fee, e-plus fee), the upside wasn't worth the effort.
 

SmithOp

TUG Review Crew
TUG Member
Joined
Jun 17, 2010
Messages
7,610
Reaction score
3,403
Points
499
Location
Huntington Beach, CA
Resorts Owned
HGVC King's Land 2BR Premier 23.040K Points.
This is so true and when this happens the timeshare must end. This failed model is the reason why the big companies switched to points systems. Points systems ultimately still have the same issue but are blended and can last much longer and possibly indefinitely if managed properly.

Places that do not have huge season variances like New Orleans and even Orlando are immune to the same issue but can still fail due to a number of other variables.

Agree on point systems, it gives more options in various locations to get a desirable week. Its getting more expensive to use exchange companies so being able to trade within the point system has advantages.

I think I reached my threshold a few year ago when I was up over $3k for multiple weeks. I’ve since sold 3 and got below $2K with a one week contract, if I want extra time I pay for cash rentals.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
 

uscav8r

TUG Review Crew: Expert
TUG Member
Joined
Feb 1, 2013
Messages
1,961
Reaction score
266
Points
294
Location
Virginia
I see this with cars and houses-- a $15k car in '97 now goes for about $30k. But, that's attributable to low interest rates.
Not everything has doubled in price. If this is the case, is a $300 hotel room from '97 now going for $600?
I don't have the historical data, but I don't believe this to be the case.
My initial thought was a WAG, but not egregiously far off. See this calculator (which spit out $768 in 2017 for $500 in 1997):

http://www.usinflationcalculator.com/

But you bring up a good point, it doesn’t matter what the general inflation is doing, but rather what is going on within like alternatives. I don’t have enough info regarding the growth of a $300 hotel room in 1997, but you can certainly find $600 rooms today at many luxury hotels.

That is why the second half of my comment is even more important than the first.

It really does come down to how good a deal timesharing is when compared to the alternative (AirBnB, hotel, camping). I still find value in my points timeshares since I have a family that enjoys multiple bedrooms and a kitchen at certain locations. A single person or couple may not have the same needs.

The bottom line is: If timesharing is a good deal keep it, and if it is not then sell it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

VacationForever

TUG Review Crew
TUG Member
Joined
Dec 5, 2010
Messages
16,199
Reaction score
10,612
Points
1,048
Location
Somewhere Out There
Our thresholds to sell partially or whole would be

1) When we no longer can use all that we own, either due to health reasons or competing vacation options.

2) MF makes up higher proportion of our annual expenses than what we are willing to spend. Our travel/entertainment budget is about 40-50% of our annual expenses, and MF only makes up a small portion of our travel/entertainment budget. One day when we decide to reduce travel/entertainment budget, we will look at our timeshare portfolio and decide if it is what gets slashed.
 
Last edited:

dougp26364

TUG Review Crew: Expert
TUG Member
Joined
Jun 6, 2005
Messages
14,481
Reaction score
3,157
Points
698
Location
Kansas
Resorts Owned
Marriott Grand Chateau
Marriott Shadow Ridge
Marriott Ocean Pointe
Marriott Destination Club Points
Hilton Grand Vacation Club Las Vegas Blvd
Grand Colorado on Peak 8
Spinnaker French Quarter Resort Branson
Great location, well maintained with strong amenities and low maintenance fees-- that's the epitome of what we all want. But, that's hard to find and often changes.

The general rules in timesharing is are:
1. As maintenance fees rise, resale value decreases.
2. Maintenance fees only go up. (Even when they tell you they needed to add $60 to pay for a certain unexpected repair.)
3. When a developer inventory runs out, fees will rise dramatically.
4. Large maintenance fee increases can be linked to delinquencies, sales and foreclosures.
5. When maintenance fees surpass prevailing market rental rates, resorts struggle to keep owners.

I remember about 15-20 years ago, the threshold for acceptable fees was about $75/night or about $500/week. Then $100/night became the norm or $700/week. Now, I'm seeing them push $1,000/week (not Hilton, Marriott or Hyatt). One of my resorts has breached this 4 digit threshold. It's a strong 5 star resort, but this fee increase is an audacious step. I see the resales already, and I'm concerned that delinquencies will rise.
I have not reached my threshold (and probably wont since I own prime), but I know many off-season owners will-- and this is bad for all owners at this resort.
I'm speaking for California Coastal-- where I own most of my timeshare units.
But, costs are higher everywhere.
I know it varies by region and by location... but what is an acceptable threshold for your annual maintenance fees?
And, what is the unacceptable threshold where you say, "I quit... I'm not paying this anymore!"?

I haven’t read thru the entire thread. I thought I’d address the original post directly based on our experience.

For background we use to own a total of 7 weeks, one of which is a combination of 2 EOY weeks. When we started in 1998 MF’s on the 2 bedroom Polo Towers unit, which was our first timeshare, was a little under $500.

A couple of years ago MF’s passed our threshold of comfort. We gave away the cheapest timeshare, Grand Regency in Branson, MO (now defunct and out of business) because we couldn’t make good use of it. The MF’s were $358/year for the 1 bedroom unit. We also deeded back our 2 DRI weeks, the MF’s had climbed to $1,400/week plus $560 roughly to belong to the internal exchange club. It just wasn’t worth the cost anymore for the accommodations and how we were able to use them. Shedding those three weeks saved us $3,700/year.

Currently we still own 2 Marriott 3bedoom lock out units, 1 HGVC 2 bedroom unit (7,000 points), a 1 Bedroom unit at Grand Colorado on Peak 8 and a 2 bedroom unit at French Quarter Resort in Branson.
The Marriott units are fast approaching g $2,000/year each and we can get 4 weeks out of them if we want. The Grand Colorado week will run us around $700 and the unit at French Quarter is $620. Marriott also charges us $255 to be a member of their internal exchange program.

The week at French Quarter Resort in Branson will likely be next to go. It’s affordable but, we just don’t use it like we use to. We prefer to go to Colorado vs Branson now. So it’s not affordability so much as usefulness. The next to go will be Marriott’s Grand Chateau. The fees at that resort are way out of proportion for Las Vegas. Beautiful resort but, nearly $2,000/year is way overpriced for Vegas. HGVC does as well for far less money. I just looked at our Marriott’s Ocean Pointe MF’s and my heart sank, nearly $2,200 for our 3 bedroom OF week (I’m hoping part of this is a SA from hurricane damage). It’s our favorite, but to keep it, I’m going to have to get rid of others. I have repeatedly warned the HOA that their continual adding of amenities, combined with the threat of hurricanes, would begin to kill off owners as it would become unaffordable. I bet we see that reality start to pick up speed with this billing.

The biggest questions aren’t if, but when and how. If I can give or sell the weeks great. I’d prefer not to default but, if that’s how it has to be I won’t bankrupt myself to pay a MF.
 
Last edited:

skimble

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 9, 2005
Messages
877
Reaction score
42
Points
388
Location
Murrieta, CA
I haven’t read thru the entire thread. I thought I’d address the original post directly based on our experience.

For background we use to own a total of 7 weeks, one of which is a combination of 2 EOY weeks. When we started in 1998 MF’s on the 2 bedroom Polo Towers unit, which was our first timeshare, was a little under $500.

A couple of years ago MF’s passed our threshold of comfort. We gave away the cheapest timeshare, Grand Regency in Branson, MO (now defunct and out of business) because we couldn’t make good use of it. The MF’s were $358/year for the 1 bedroom unit. We also deeded back our 2 DRI weeks, the MF’s had climbed to $1,400/week plus $560 roughly to belong to the internal exchange club. It just wasn’t worth the cost anymore for the accommodations and how we were able to use them. Shedding those three weeks saved us $3,700/year.

Currently we still own 2 Marriott 3bedoom lock out units, 1 HGVC 2 bedroom unit (7,000 points), a 1 Bedroom unit at Grand Colorado on Peak 8 and a 2 bedroom unit at French Quarter Resort in Branson.
The Marriott units are fast approaching g $2,000/year each and we can get 4 weeks out of them if we want. The Grand Colorado week will run us around $700 and the unit at French Quarter is $620. Marriott also charges us $255 to be a member of their internal exchange program.

The week at French Quarter Resort in Branson will likely be next to go. It’s affordable but, we just don’t use it like we use to. We prefer to go to Colorado vs Branson now. So it’s not affordability so much as usefulness. The next to go will be Marriott’s Grand Chateau. The fees at that resort are way out of proportion for Las Vegas. Beautiful resort but, nearly $2,000/year is way overpriced for Vegas. HGVC does as well for far less money. I just looked at our Marriott’s Ocean Pointe MF’s and my heart sank, nearly $2,200 for our 3 bedroom OF week (I’m hoping part of this is a SA from hurricane damage). It’s our favorite, but to keep it, I’m going to have to get rid of others. I have repeatedly warned the HOA that their continual adding of amenities, combined with the threat of hurricanes, would begin to kill off owners as it would become unaffordable. I bet we see that reality start to pick up speed with this billing.

The biggest questions aren’t if, but when and how. If I can give or sell the weeks great. I’d prefer not to default but, if that’s how it has to be I won’t bankrupt myself to pay a MF.

One of the resorts I own at has done a great job of maintaining low fees. Since I bought it about 10 years ago, the fees have remained consistent and low. However, when energy prices surged, they added a surcharge of about $150... but that lasted only one year. They had a special assessment one year to pay for new air conditioners/heaters... it was included in our fees and it added about $200. But... my fees went right back to the low norm. And, the fees remain low.
I think I prefer it this way. I would rather see the occasional special assessment to pay for an unanticipated purchase or unexpected surcharge. They have an operating budget, and they work within that budget. There are slight increases-- more reflective of inflation. But, they do a good job offsetting some of that-- keeping fees low.
So, am I looking at property that is poorly maintained? No... I don't believe so.
A lot of resort function like the government. Issue a new tax to pay for something, and when that thing is paid for they retain the tax and call it income.

This year at the Carlsbad Inn, fees have increased by $96 (1 bedroom units) to bring them over the $1000 mark. $36 to pay for increased operating costs, and $60 increase to pay for garage waterproofing. I've seen this kind of thing before... an increase to pay for a certain unanticipated expense--like garage waterproofing. However, like I said before, fees only go up. THIS is why I prefer the model of a special assessment.
Send me a separate bill for $60 to pay for this garage waterproofing. Or, include it in my annual assessment, but make it clear that it's a one-time special assessment. But that's not the way it works. More likely, they will envelop it as additional annual income and use for unnecessary expenses.
And next year, we will get our anticipated 3-5% annual increase again.
I'll take a small special assessment every 5-10 years over this practice.
I believe the CBI is using the garage excuse to test owners.... after pushing fees over $1000, will there be push-back? If there is, they can retract it next year. If there isn't, they can use the money as an increase for operating costs.
 

JudiZ

TUG Review Crew: Veteran
TUG Member
Joined
Jun 7, 2005
Messages
349
Reaction score
317
Points
423
Location
Southern New Hampshire
One of the resorts I own at has done a great job of maintaining low fees. Since I bought it about 10 years ago, the fees have remained consistent and low. However, when energy prices surged, they added a surcharge of about $150... but that lasted only one year. They had a special assessment one year to pay for new air conditioners/heaters... it was included in our fees and it added about $200. But... my fees went right back to the low norm. And, the fees remain low.
I think I prefer it this way. I would rather see the occasional special assessment to pay for an unanticipated purchase or unexpected surcharge. They have an operating budget, and they work within that budget. There are slight increases-- more reflective of inflation. But, they do a good job offsetting some of that-- keeping fees low.
So, am I looking at property that is poorly maintained? No... I don't believe so.
A lot of resort function like the government. Issue a new tax to pay for something, and when that thing is paid for they retain the tax and call it income.

This year at the Carlsbad Inn, fees have increased by $96 (1 bedroom units) to bring them over the $1000 mark. $36 to pay for increased operating costs, and $60 increase to pay for garage waterproofing. I've seen this kind of thing before... an increase to pay for a certain unanticipated expense--like garage waterproofing. However, like I said before, fees only go up. THIS is why I prefer the model of a special assessment.
Send me a separate bill for $60 to pay for this garage waterproofing. Or, include it in my annual assessment, but make it clear that it's a one-time special assessment. But that's not the way it works. More likely, they will envelop it as additional annual income and use for unnecessary expenses.
And next year, we will get our anticipated 3-5% annual increase again.
I'll take a small special assessment every 5-10 years over this practice.
I believe the CBI is using the garage excuse to test owners.... after pushing fees over $1000, will there be push-back? If there is, they can retract it next year. If there isn't, they can use the money as an increase for operating costs.

I agree completely! Last year, we received a special assessment from one our resorts for $330 to be paid in two installments. It was specifically for updated flooring. One (or two) and done. I have two weeks that both have modest maintenance fees with small annual increases and an occasional special assessments - this makes the best sense to me. Neither is fancy but both are perfect for us. I think, however, that there must be a threshold for us and I am pretty sure $1000 would be it. Since neither of my weeks is even close to that, no reason for me to be concerned. On the other hand, my Wyndham points are more than that but I have been able to get three weeks where I want to go every two years so I guess I take a "cost averaging" position on that. Not to mention, they get me where I want to go at a price I want to pay with the amenities that I want to have.

Judi Z
 

garyk01

Tug Review Crew: Rookie
TUG Member
Joined
Sep 11, 2010
Messages
30
Reaction score
4
Points
218
Location
Edmonton AB Canada
Resorts Owned
Fairmont Hot Springs Resort Mountainside , Fairmont BC Canada, Indian Palms Intervals , Indio CA
Great location, well maintained with strong amenities and low maintenance fees-- that's the epitome of what we all want. But, that's hard to find and often changes.

The general rules in timesharing is are:
1. As maintenance fees rise, resale value decreases.
2. Maintenance fees only go up. (Even when they tell you they needed to add $60 to pay for a certain unexpected repair.)
3. When a developer inventory runs out, fees will rise dramatically.
4. Large maintenance fee increases can be linked to delinquencies, sales and foreclosures.
5. When maintenance fees surpass prevailing market rental rates, resorts struggle to keep owners.

I remember about 15-20 years ago, the threshold for acceptable fees was about $75/night or about $500/week. Then $100/night became the norm or $700/week. Now, I'm seeing them push $1,000/week (not Hilton, Marriott or Hyatt). One of my resorts has breached this 4 digit threshold. It's a strong 5 star resort, but this fee increase is an audacious step. I see the resales already, and I'm concerned that delinquencies will rise.
I have not reached my threshold (and probably wont since I own prime), but I know many off-season owners will-- and this is bad for all owners at this resort.
I'm speaking for California Coastal-- where I own most of my timeshare units.
But, costs are higher everywhere.
I know it varies by region and by location... but what is an acceptable threshold for your annual maintenance fees?
And, what is the unacceptable threshold where you say, "I quit... I'm not paying this anymore!"?

For myself, it is what does the resort charge for rentals per week that book it themselves off the internet or walk ins?

Example, if it costs $1400.00 a week to stay at the place for non owners and a owner rate is $1100 per week ,I look as it being a $300 per week saving still . Assuming you still want to go to that place every year you own, and your buy in fee averaged out is less than the total price per week, meaning if you paid $2000 to buy into the place and you plan on using it 20 uses , before it expires or you will get rid of it by then, that averages out to a extra $100 per usage to be added to the maintence fee yearly to get your true cost per week.
 

rosco1e

Tug Review Crew: Rookie
TUG Member
Joined
Oct 22, 2014
Messages
16
Reaction score
7
Points
113
I sell when it gets over $500 something. I had almost 30 timeshares at one time and sold all but 5 as each one crossed the $600 barrier. TS's are great but you're locked and that counts for something (downside). You can very easily rent an airbnb in most places, for in many instances what it costs to trade into something. You have to figure it this way: $550 for the maint. Another $230 for the trade. Now you're up to 780. Not hard to rent a place for $780 on airbnb. It gets even worse if you want to stay longer. Try a month. 780 times 4 is $3200ish. You can rent a spectacular place for a month virtually anywhere for that much money. Typically in the $2200 range or less.

Timeshare places are pricing themselves out. Especially at a time when most costs are actually deflating and they up fees by 6-8%. That's nuts.
 

lovesexy

TUG Member
Joined
Aug 24, 2015
Messages
9
Reaction score
1
Points
113
Location
9556 South Calumet Ave Chicago Illinois
Great location, well maintained with strong amenities and low maintenance fees-- that's the epitome of what we all want. But, that's hard to find and often changes.

The general rules in timesharing is are:
1. As maintenance fees rise, resale value decreases.
2. Maintenance fees only go up. (Even when they tell you they needed to add $60 to pay for a certain unexpected repair.)
3. When a developer inventory runs out, fees will rise dramatically.
4. Large maintenance fee increases can be linked to delinquencies, sales and foreclosures.
5. When maintenance fees surpass prevailing market rental rates, resorts struggle to keep owners.

I remember about 15-20 years ago, the threshold for acceptable fees was about $75/night or about $500/week. Then $100/night became the norm or $700/week. Now, I'm seeing them push $1,000/week (not Hilton, Marriott or Hyatt). One of my resorts has breached this 4 digit threshold. It's a strong 5 star resort, but this fee increase is an audacious step. I see the resales already, and I'm concerned that delinquencies will rise.
I have not reached my threshold (and probably wont since I own prime), but I know many off-season owners will-- and this is bad for all owners at this resort.
I'm speaking for California Coastal-- where I own most of my timeshare units.
But, costs are higher everywhere.
I know it varies by region and by location... but what is an acceptable threshold for your annual maintenance fees?
And, what is the unacceptable threshold where you say, "I quit... I'm not paying this anymore!"?
Another point I consider regarding my fees is the exchange companies I deal with. If I can get extra weeks or vacations from a particular exvhange company, then I will be more likely to keep my particular unit. I currently own Sheraton and Holiday Inn. I usually get a extra vacation I can use from Interval which I consider when I pay my almost 700 fees for my Sheraton 2 bedroom unit. I also get extra points and nights through IHG etc. I tell people though that since the Timeshare market is going through some changes etc....dont buy new...always buy resale.
 

WinniWoman

TUG Review Crew: Veteran
TUG Member
Joined
Jul 16, 2010
Messages
10,762
Reaction score
7,057
Points
749
Location
The Weirs, New Hampshire
Resorts Owned
Innseason Pollard Brook
I sell when it gets over $500 something. I had almost 30 timeshares at one time and sold all but 5 as each one crossed the $600 barrier. TS's are great but you're locked and that counts for something (downside). You can very easily rent an airbnb in most places, for in many instances what it costs to trade into something. You have to figure it this way: $550 for the maint. Another $230 for the trade. Now you're up to 780. Not hard to rent a place for $780 on airbnb. It gets even worse if you want to stay longer. Try a month. 780 times 4 is $3200ish. You can rent a spectacular place for a month virtually anywhere for that much money. Typically in the $2200 range or less.

Timeshare places are pricing themselves out. Especially at a time when most costs are actually deflating and they up fees by 6-8%. That's nuts.


But there is something to be said for being at a resort as opposed to just a home or apartment. I prefer to be at a resort hands down, though sometimes there isn't one where we want to go and then we rent a single home, condo or cottage. Even then. I might prefer a Homewood Suites or a hotel like that.
 

rosieox

TUG Member
Joined
Apr 25, 2007
Messages
4
Reaction score
2
Points
3
Location
CA
We purchased the Bay Club at Waikoloa in 99 and the fees were $550. There was a clause in the contract that the MFs would not raise more than 3% a year. They were sold to Hilton and the fees doubled over night. We paid it for a number of years at $1150. We could usually get two weeks for our one in other locations, but with RCI exchange fees costing $200 a week we were paying $775 per week. We found that in many of these exchange weeks in RCI we could get the 'extended vacation' week with RCI at the same resort for $350 cash. That coupled with AirBNB and VRBO being cheaper, we deeded back ours to Hilton. We're done with timeshares. We are still RCI members and may use the 'extended vacations', but we haven't found anything we're interested in yet. As for inflation, we traveled pretty extensively in 99 as we do now. We would pay around $100 in 99 for the same hotels we pay $130 for today.
 
Last edited:

DaveNV

TUG Review Crew: Expert
TUG Member
Joined
Jun 1, 2006
Messages
22,003
Reaction score
29,217
Points
1,348
Location
Mesquite, Nevada
Resorts Owned
Free Agent
I wonder if there is a matrix somewhere that shows average cost per night for the average timeshare? My threshold was crossed when a weeks MF at my favorite resort exceeded what I could pay to rent the same unit in the same resort. Why own when I can rent the same thing for less money?

I've been messing with timeshares for coming up on fifteen years, and the days of spending low maintenance fees for high vacation values seem to be mostly long gone. I know there are gems in the mix, but by and large, costs have outweighed the convenience of ownership. As exchange companies have made it more and more expensive to trade a week for something else, the factored costs have also gone up considerably, leading to the current mantra of "own where you want to vacation." The concept of timesharing, for me, was mainly about exchanging. That all changed when exchange costs went over the top.

Currently, I own one EOY Southern California week that I am leaning toward passing along to a new owner. It's a great place, and MF are reasonable for the area, but it doesn't fit well into the vacation mix for me, and would be better served to someone who could use it as a day-use resort. I live too far away, and now have two family members who live in the resort area. My other timeshare is a newly-purchased WorldMark points contract. After all these years, it makes more sense for me to go that way, than it is to own a week at a specific resort.

All in all, it's been interesting, and I've learned a lot. I'm just not sure how all this will play out in the long run. But that's just my take on things right now - wait six months and ask me again. ;)

Dave
 

ksb1

newbie
Joined
Aug 2, 2015
Messages
5
Reaction score
5
Points
63
Location
Manchester, NJ08759
Great location, well maintained with strong amenities and low maintenance fees-- that's the epitome of what we all want. But, that's hard to find and often changes.

The general rules in timesharing is are:
1. As maintenance fees rise, resale value decreases.
2. Maintenance fees only go up. (Even when they tell you they needed to add $60 to pay for a certain unexpected repair.)
3. When a developer inventory runs out, fees will rise dramatically.
4. Large maintenance fee increases can be linked to delinquencies, sales and foreclosures.
5. When maintenance fees surpass prevailing market rental rates, resorts struggle to keep owners.

I remember about 15-20 years ago, the threshold for acceptable fees was about $75/night or about $500/week. Then $100/night became the norm or $700/week. Now, I'm seeing them push $1,000/week (not Hilton, Marriott or Hyatt). One of my resorts has breached this 4 digit threshold. It's a strong 5 star resort, but this fee increase is an audacious step. I see the resales already, and I'm concerned that delinquencies will rise.
I have not reached my threshold (and probably wont since I own prime), but I know many off-season owners will-- and this is bad for all owners at this resort.
I'm speaking for California Coastal-- where I own most of my timeshare units.
But, costs are higher everywhere.
I know it varies by region and by location... but what is an acceptable threshold for your annual maintenance fees?
And, what is the unacceptable threshold where you say, "I quit... I'm not paying this anymore!"?
Great location, well maintained with strong amenities and low maintenance fees-- that's the epitome of what we all want. But, that's hard to find and often changes.

The general rules in timesharing is are:
1. As maintenance fees rise, resale value decreases.
2. Maintenance fees only go up. (Even when they tell you they needed to add $60 to pay for a certain unexpected repair.)
3. When a developer inventory runs out, fees will rise dramatically.
4. Large maintenance fee increases can be linked to delinquencies, sales and foreclosures.
5. When maintenance fees surpass prevailing market rental rates, resorts struggle to keep owners.

I remember about 15-20 years ago, the threshold for acceptable fees was about $75/night or about $500/week. Then $100/night became the norm or $700/week. Now, I'm seeing them push $1,000/week (not Hilton, Marriott or Hyatt). One of my resorts has breached this 4 digit threshold. It's a strong 5 star resort, but this fee increase is an audacious step. I see the resales already, and I'm concerned that delinquencies will rise.
I have not reached my threshold (and probably wont since I own prime), but I know many off-season owners will-- and this is bad for all owners at this resort.
I'm speaking for California Coastal-- where I own most of my timeshare units.
But, costs are higher everywhere.
I know it varies by region and by location... but what is an acceptable threshold for your annual maintenance fees?
And, what is the unacceptable threshold where you say, "I quit... I'm not paying this anymore!"?

So I bought this timeshare in Acapulco Mexico in the early days of timeshare
I paid upfount all maintenance fees for the 20 year timeshare program. This locked in my maintenance fee for the full 20 years at a low upfount price.
The only problem was that the resort did not do the maintenance and slowly but surely the place degraded as time went on.
In the end, the resort was removed from exchanging on RCI.
With 8 years remaining, I am no longer able to use my exchange priviledges with RCI. I no longer use the resort and was not compensated for the lost weeks remaining on my Contract.
I pursued the matter with Profeco in Mexico, but it only resulted in the owner, repeatedly, never responding to court appearances and being fined by Profeco, with the money collected being given to the Mexican government.

So in response to the general issue of fees raising, I would say that it is better to have fees raise, but that the money be spent on upgrading the resort facilities to maintain its competitiveness with newer and better resorts. After all, we all wish to get a fair and equal value exchange.

To this end, I have upgraded to a top of the line, two bedroom, resort in the Mayan Riveria, paying a yearly exhange fees in excess of $2000/yr. The resort has continually upgrades and maintains their resort in top quality. Any weeks that go unused, I do not pay that years maintenance fee, with no penalty. Howerver, as I purchased the unit to use, I have chosen to support the maintenance fee and to enjoy all of the amenities that the resort has to offer. Rather than a decreasing inventory, sales and foreclosures, the resort is expanding, in its multiple locations and attractions.

KSB1
 
Top