TUG MEMBERS: Joining TUG does not automatically register you as a user of the TUG Bulletin Board. You must register yourself.


*ads are disabled when logged in as a member*
  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.
  2. The TUGBBS forums are completely free and open to the public and exist as the absolute best place for owners to get help and advice about their timeshares for more than 25 years!

    Join tens of thousands of other owners just like you here to get any and all Timeshare questions answered!
    Dismiss Notice
  3. TUG has now saved timeshare owners more than $13,000,000 dollars just by finding us in time to rescind a new Timeshare purchase! A truly incredible milestone!

    Read more here: TUG saves owners more than $13Million dollars
    Dismiss Notice
  4. Sign up to get the TUG Newsletter for free! Join tens of thousands of other owners who get this every week! Latest resort reviews and the most important topics discussed by owners during the week!
    Dismiss Notice
  5. TUG is trying out a new program that will trade you a TUG membership for a Timeshare resort review if you are an expired member, or even just a guest here on the forums!

    Read more here
    Dismiss Notice
  6. Our official "end my sales presentation early" T-shirts are available again! Also come with the option for a free membership extension with purchase to offset the cost!

    Read more Here
    Dismiss Notice
  7. Follow the TUG Member Banner as it travels the world on vacation with Timeshare owners! Also sign up to get the banner sent to you so you can submit a photo of your vacation with the banner to share with TUG! Banner Thread
    Dismiss Notice
  8. TUG has now joined Priceline.com as an affiliate!

    Members and guests who book air travel, rental cars and even Cruise Vacations thru TUG's priceline links will now support TUG in the process!

    Read more here
  9. A few of the most common links here on the forums for newbies and guests!
    Dismiss Notice

What happens if Marriott sells any Vistana property?

Discussion in 'Vistana Signature Experiences (formerly Starwood)' started by DannyTS, Nov 6, 2019.

  1. DannyTS

    DannyTS TUG Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2018
    Messages:
    2,056
    Likes Received:
    698
    Trophy Points:
    173
    I've read comments that some Vistana resorts are up for sale. I assume it is also possible to sell only certain phases, not the complete resort.

    1) What would the owners experience and what would happen with the VSE membership and the II priority?

    2) What are the implications to those Flex trusts that may include units from those resorts?

    3)Who would buy those properties? I assume another timeshare developer that does not have a presence in those areas?

    I see several categories of owners:
    voluntary resort retail
    mandatory resort retail

    voluntary resort resale
    mandatory resort resale

    Thanks everyone.
     
  2. YYJMSP

    YYJMSP TUG Member

    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2009
    Messages:
    2,259
    Likes Received:
    65
    Trophy Points:
    258
    Location:
    BC, Canada
    How can Marriott sell the properties, as we are the owners?

    I think you are talking about a property changing brands...
     
    klpca likes this.
  3. DannyTS

    DannyTS TUG Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2018
    Messages:
    2,056
    Likes Received:
    698
    Trophy Points:
    173
    I assume that the management of the resort would be taken over by another company. In addition Marriott would sell all the units it owns. The owners would keep their ownership under a new banner
     
  4. VacationForever

    VacationForever Tug Review Crew: Rookie TUG Member

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2010
    Messages:
    9,738
    Likes Received:
    3,604
    Trophy Points:
    398
    Location:
    Somewhere Out There
    You are over thinking it. I believe you are interpreting this from the Q3 update call. It does not affect existing developed and sold properties. I read it as undeveloped land.
    • As a result of the ILG Acquisition, the company performed a comprehensive review of its Vacation Ownership property and equipment including undeveloped parcels, future phases of existing resorts, operating hotels, and other non-core assets, to determine the best strategic direction with respect to these assets. As a result of the review, the company currently expects proceeds from future asset dispositions to be between $160 million and $220 million.
    • Some asset sales are already "in process."
     
    nuwermj and SteelerGal like this.
  5. SteelerGal

    SteelerGal TUG Member

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2019
    Messages:
    661
    Likes Received:
    242
    Trophy Points:
    94
    Location:
    90740
    Resorts Owned:
    WDW, WKV, SDO, HPP, HH, Bay Club
    Deleted
     
  6. Sea Six

    Sea Six TUG Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2005
    Messages:
    3,159
    Likes Received:
    362
    Trophy Points:
    319
    Location:
    Marco Island, FL
    Resorts Owned:
    Club Regency - Marco Island
    Lagunamar - Cancun
    Vistana Villages Key West (2) - Orlando
    Marriott has sold Starwood Hotels, not time shares. One of my favorites was the Westin Key West, now a Margaritaville. Can't use my points there anymore.
     
  7. DannyTS

    DannyTS TUG Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2018
    Messages:
    2,056
    Likes Received:
    698
    Trophy Points:
    173
    I am trying to find the quote from the Q3 earnings call you are referring to. I did not find the transcript but there is a recording on their website. The actual quote (7:15 of the call):
    https://edge.media-server.com/mmc/p/pfhmotd6

    http://ir.marriottvacationsworldwide.com/investor-relations

    "As you know, earlier in the year we implemented our strategic review of our vacation ownership assets with the goal of disposing excess supply in certain locations. With the review now substantially complete we expect the disposition of these assets to generate cash proceeds between 160-220 million dollars over the next few years. It will begin with the assets that will have the highest yield; we already began the disposition process. We will keep you appraised of our progress."

    As you can see it is more vague than the one you mentioned. To me excess supply means units not land but I hope you are right
     
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2019
  8. jmhpsu93

    jmhpsu93 TUG Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2018
    Messages:
    233
    Likes Received:
    74
    Trophy Points:
    89
    Location:
    Maryland, USA
    Resorts Owned:
    Marriott Vacation Club Destination Points
    Marriott Grande Vista (x2)
    Crown Paradise Club
    Sheraton Vistana Villages (x2)
    There are two locations in Orlando adjacent to Lakeshore Reserve and Harbour Lake that were originally intended to be developed as additional phases for those resorts, and I believe MVC is actively pursuing to liquidate that land inventory.

    Like Danny said, depends on what "assets" means but I would imagine trying to divest of specific resorts (or even phases) that are in the MVC trust or Sheraton flex trust would be a nightmare. With those liquidation costs, I doubt they would consider them high yield.

    Then again, they could decide to sell the whole kit and caboodle tomorrow. :shrug:
     
  9. DannyTS

    DannyTS TUG Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2018
    Messages:
    2,056
    Likes Received:
    698
    Trophy Points:
    173
    I assume that the lot next to Live Aqua Cancun is also up for sale
     
  10. blondietink

    blondietink Guest

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2009
    Messages:
    779
    Likes Received:
    77
    Trophy Points:
    188
    Location:
    Western NYS
    They own that big empty hole in the ground next to Live Aqua that we have been walking by for years?
     
  11. DannyTS

    DannyTS TUG Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2018
    Messages:
    2,056
    Likes Received:
    698
    Trophy Points:
    173
    my understanding is that they own that piece of land. It is not too big, probably more suitable for a boutique hotel.
     
  12. bogey21

    bogey21 TUG Member

    Joined:
    Jun 8, 2005
    Messages:
    7,042
    Likes Received:
    1,761
    Trophy Points:
    449
    Location:
    Fort Worth, Texas
    It will be interesting to see what happens if Marriott stops managing some of the Vistana properties. If they do, my guess is that the non Marriott members of the HOAs will have to fend for themselves...

    George
     
  13. chemteach

    chemteach TUG Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2005
    Messages:
    1,081
    Likes Received:
    219
    Trophy Points:
    274
    Location:
    Los Angeles, CA
    I can see it now: "I went to a timeshare owner education seminar, and the salesman told me I should switch to the Flex program because my timeshare property is going to be sold to a different manager. What should I do?"

    LOL

    (I'm not making fun of the original post - I'm poking fun at timeshare salespeople who will use any tactic to try to get people to buy.)
     
  14. VacationForever

    VacationForever Tug Review Crew: Rookie TUG Member

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2010
    Messages:
    9,738
    Likes Received:
    3,604
    Trophy Points:
    398
    Location:
    Somewhere Out There
    This is called over reacting and reading into something that is not there. Management of Vistana timeshare properties won't be sold.

    Marriott makes 10% in management fees and will never want to let go of managing existing timeshare properties.

    Selling land is a different matter. They will get out of yearly tax obligations by holding on to the land unless they develop the land which will cost them lots of money. Selling undeveloped land gets the money into the bank right away and make shareholders happy.
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2019
    CalGalTraveler likes this.
  15. GrayFal

    GrayFal TUG Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2005
    Messages:
    5,340
    Likes Received:
    264
    Trophy Points:
    369
    Location:
    The Hamptons, NY
    Resorts Owned:
    Marriott Bluegreen WYN WestinStJohn VGV, SB & CV SVV Morritt's Seaside
    Marriott has stopped managing and taken their name off several properties but non since 2009 DC program. Paradise Island Beach Club was once a Marriott and two resorts in Hilton Head, Spicebush and Swallowtail. The HOA were not willing to upgrade the resorts to Marriott standards and on Hilton Head they started building their own resorts. I feel there might have been others but can’t recall.
     
    VacationForever likes this.
  16. DannyTS

    DannyTS TUG Member

    Joined:
    Mar 24, 2018
    Messages:
    2,056
    Likes Received:
    698
    Trophy Points:
    173
    I agree with you, it does not make sense for Marriott to give away the hen that lays the golden eggs. And especially now that Sheraton is trying to improve the Sheraton brand, it would seem like a wrong step. I hope you are right. I had just seen people speculating on various FB pages.
     
  17. JIMinNC

    JIMinNC TUG Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2005
    Messages:
    3,375
    Likes Received:
    2,025
    Trophy Points:
    449
    Location:
    Marvin, NC (Charlotte suburb)
    Resorts Owned:
    Marriott:
    Maui Ocean Club
    Waiohai Beach Club
    Barony Beach Club
    Destination Club Trust
    HGVC:
    HGVC at Sea World
    The text in the first bullet that @VacationForever posted was taken directly from the 3Q earnings press release that Marriott Vacations Worldwide issued. So that more specific terminology was officially from MVW. I would tend to agree that what they are talking about would seem to be excess land. Here is the link to that release:

    http://ir.marriottvacationsworldwid...cations-worldwide-mvw-reports-third-quarter-0
     
  18. dioxide45

    dioxide45 TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2006
    Messages:
    27,825
    Likes Received:
    2,638
    Trophy Points:
    699
    Location:
    NE Florida
    Resorts Owned:
    Marriott's Grande Vista
    Marriott's Harbour Lake
    SVV - Bella
    SVV - Key West
    Marriott already sold the land that was undeveloped adjectives to Harbor Lake. There are also a number of other properties with undeveloped land; Lakeshore Reserve, Vistana Villages, Ko'Olina. Off hand I am not sure what other Vistana properties have undeveloped land just sitting there that they could liquidate. But there are several other Marriott properties with undeveloped land.

    Selling this land really should have little impact on current owners, though there are some exceptions. At Lakeshore Reserve, more owners would help to spread out the maintance costs at the property which are quite high per unit week. More owners could help bring that down some. Though if they developed it, it would increase the crowding at the pools that may not be able to support the resort built out as was originally planned.
     
    DannyTS likes this.
  19. JIMinNC

    JIMinNC TUG Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2005
    Messages:
    3,375
    Likes Received:
    2,025
    Trophy Points:
    449
    Location:
    Marvin, NC (Charlotte suburb)
    Resorts Owned:
    Marriott:
    Maui Ocean Club
    Waiohai Beach Club
    Barony Beach Club
    Destination Club Trust
    HGVC:
    HGVC at Sea World
    The 2018 Marriott Vacations Worldwide 10-K lists the following properties with additional development potential. This does not include totally undeveloped land not associated with an existing resort.

    Marriott's Canyon Villas: 213 units built; 39 potential
    Marriott's Shadow Ridge: 569 units built; 430 potential
    Marriott's Harbour Lake: 312 units built; 588 potential
    Marriott's Lakeshore Reserve: 85 units built; 254 potential
    Marriott's KoOlina Beach Club: 546 units built;202 potential
    Marriott's Willow Ridge: 132 units built; 282 potential
    Marriott's Grand Chateau: 656 units built; 224 potential
    Marriott's Fairway Villas: 180 units built; 90 potential
    Marriott's Frenchman's Cove: 155 units built; 65 potential
    Sheraton Vistana Villages: 892 units built; 734 potential
    Sheraton Kauai Resort: 66 units built; 60 potential
    Sheraton Broadway Plantation: 342 units built; 160 potential
    Westin Desert Willow: 220 units built; 80 potential
    Westin Resort & Spa Cancun: 44 units built; 204 potential
    Hyatt RC Bonita Springs: 96 units built; 243 potential
    Hyatt RC Wild Oak Ranch: 120 units built; 168 potential
     
    SteelerGal and VacationForever like this.
  20. SueDonJ

    SueDonJ Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2006
    Messages:
    13,396
    Likes Received:
    905
    Trophy Points:
    749
    Location:
    Massachusetts and Hilton Head Island
    Resorts Owned:
    Marriott Barony Beach and SurfWatch
    Two of the original five buildings at the StreamSide (Vail, CO) property are no longer managed by Marriott. Birch, Douglas and Evergreen remain; Aspen and Cedar, no.

    The governing docs stipulate the percentage of owners who need to vote in favor of separating from Marriott, OR, Marriott can sever the Management Agreement as long as they're in compliance with the stipulated severance terms. Not surprisingly it is a much easier process for Marriott to sever than for owners to sever.

    If/when it happens the Marriott name comes off the buildings and all affiliation agreements end - i.e. any Bonvoy-related benefits, any Destination Club-related benefits including the DC-related II corporate account, the Marriott preference in II individual accounts, etc. If you continue to own a formerly-Marriott Week (assuming the resort contracts with a new management company,) that Week will no longer count towards any Marriott ownership status levels.

    [ETA] Having said all that, I agree that the statements in this latest update call appear to refer to undeveloped land, and it's not unusual for Marriott to sell parcels from time to time.
     
  21. SteelerGal

    SteelerGal TUG Member

    Joined:
    Mar 8, 2019
    Messages:
    661
    Likes Received:
    242
    Trophy Points:
    94
    Location:
    90740
    Resorts Owned:
    WDW, WKV, SDO, HPP, HH, Bay Club
    I’m sure the land in CA has a nice lovely price tag.
     
  22. controller1

    controller1 TUG Member

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2017
    Messages:
    1,322
    Likes Received:
    661
    Trophy Points:
    173
    Location:
    Baton Rouge, LA
    Resorts Owned:
    Westin KORVN OF
    Westin Nanea OF
    Westin FLEX
    I believe those "potential" units shown on the two above are currently hotel rooms.
     
  23. jmhpsu93

    jmhpsu93 TUG Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2018
    Messages:
    233
    Likes Received:
    74
    Trophy Points:
    89
    Location:
    Maryland, USA
    Resorts Owned:
    Marriott Vacation Club Destination Points
    Marriott Grande Vista (x2)
    Crown Paradise Club
    Sheraton Vistana Villages (x2)
    And given those conversions are underway, likely the numbers are different today. We were at the Westin in July 2018 and they were in the midst of TS conversion.
     
  24. JIMinNC

    JIMinNC TUG Member

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2005
    Messages:
    3,375
    Likes Received:
    2,025
    Trophy Points:
    449
    Location:
    Marvin, NC (Charlotte suburb)
    Resorts Owned:
    Marriott:
    Maui Ocean Club
    Waiohai Beach Club
    Barony Beach Club
    Destination Club Trust
    HGVC:
    HGVC at Sea World
    Yes. Correct. That fact was actually footnoted in the 10-K. I just didn't include that in my post. So those two would not be potential real property divestitures, but represent potential unit additions to the portfolio.

    Having said that, I wonder if they decide those hotels are "non-core assets"(which are assets they might sell according to their press release), could they still sell the hotel, but then for any inventory that had already been conveyed to one of their flex trusts, they would just replace that inventory with other inventory from other locations? That location would then cease to be bookable by flex owners, but the flex trusts would still be "whole".
     
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2019
  25. controller1

    controller1 TUG Member

    Joined:
    Aug 14, 2017
    Messages:
    1,322
    Likes Received:
    661
    Trophy Points:
    173
    Location:
    Baton Rouge, LA
    Resorts Owned:
    Westin KORVN OF
    Westin Nanea OF
    Westin FLEX
    I don't know about that. Since Vistana is no longer selling weeks at many properties and is only selling Flex points I would hate to be that one who purchased Flex points because I wanted to be an owner of Timeshare A only to have Timeshare A cease to be part of the Flex product.
     

Share This Page