Southwest Approved ONLY from California

[davidvel]

southwest-gets-faa-ok-for-flights-to-hawaii-from-california

The Federal Aviation Administration said Wednesday it has granted Southwest Airlines approval to begin flights between California and Hawaii, capping the airline's effort to extend its reach 2,400 miles (3,800 kilometers) across the Pacific.

 

[pspercy]

Fare war coming?
Just when I've paid off our flights for October . . .

 

[PigsDad]

AFAIK, SWA was only seeking approval for CA <--> HI routes, so I'm not sure why you emphasized "ONLY" in your title. The article certainly didn't say anything about this being a change in what SWA was asking for.

Kurt

 

[davidvel]

AFAIK, SWA was only seeking approval for CA <--> HI routes, so I'm not sure why you emphasized "ONLY" in your title. The article certainly didn't say anything about this being a change in what SWA was asking for.

Kurt

I thought they were planning to fly from LAS,PHX,DEN, PDX, SEA, but maybe that's down the road. I emphasized ONLY because CA is the ONLY state they were approved for now as I understand it. That might matter to those that live elsewhere.

 

[pedro47]

San Diego, Los Angeles, and Oakland were the approved cities in California.

 

[Tamaradarann]

San Diego, Los Angeles, and Oakland were the approved cities in California.

I just thought of an interested positive possibility for other cities in the Continental US with this Southwest Airlines development. Southwest is starting to fly direct from some West Coast cities to Hawaii. I wonder if instead of trying to compete with low price Southwest Airlines, Hawaii Airlines will remove themselves from those cities and add flights to other Continental US cities. Southwest Airlines Planes are smaller than Hawaiian's and can't fly direct to Hawaii from many of the Continental US Cities. The direct flight from JFK to Honolulu is great. Hawaiian could add additional flights from JFK to other islands, flights from other distant cities to Honolulu, or additional flights from JFK to Honolulu.

Why compete with Southwest, go where they can't!!

 

[dougp26364]

This will be interesting for us. At this point, the majority of routes have us making two layovers and changing planes in either LAX or SFO to get to Hawaii. So for us it’s no big deal as we’re already accustomed to this sort of flight plan. If SWA ever gets Phoenix or Las Vegas approved, then we might have a one layover flight plan. That would be wonderful.

 

[krj9999]

Because the 3 states on the US west coast account for over HALF of all mainland visitors to Hawaii. Other than a few large metro areas (Chicago, Dallas, etc.) filling larger planes daily wouldn't be easy and other airlines already have non-stops from those hub cities.

http://files.hawaii.gov/dbedt/visitor/visitor-research/2017-annual-visitor.pdf

Table 17 has the statistics by state, if curious.

I just thought of an interested positive possibility for other cities in the Continental US with this Southwest Airlines development. Southwest is starting to fly direct from some West Coast cities to Hawaii. I wonder if instead of trying to compete with low price Southwest Airlines, Hawaii Airlines will remove themselves from those cities and add flights to other Continental US cities. Southwest Airlines Planes are smaller than Hawaiian's and can't fly direct to Hawaii from many of the Continental US Cities. The direct flight from JFK to Honolulu is great. Hawaiian could add additional flights from JFK to other islands, flights from other distant cities to Honolulu, or additional flights from JFK to Honolulu.

Why compete with Southwest, go where they can't!!

 

[GetawaysRus]

San Diego, Los Angeles, and Oakland were the approved cities in California.

That's not what I read.

The following is copied from a CNBC article on the web:

Southwest plans to fly to the islands from four California cities: Oakland, San Diego, San Jose and Sacramento and fly to Honolulu, Kahului on Maui, Kona, and Lihue on Kauai. The airline also intends to offer service between the islands.

C'mon Southwest. How about considering Ontario? All you Palm Desert vacationers could then combine a week in the desert with a week in Hawaii.

 

[TheTimeTraveler]

I just thought of an interested positive possibility for other cities in the Continental US with this Southwest Airlines development. Southwest is starting to fly direct from some West Coast cities to Hawaii. I wonder if instead of trying to compete with low price Southwest Airlines, Hawaii Airlines will remove themselves from those cities and add flights to other Continental US cities. Southwest Airlines Planes are smaller than Hawaiian's and can't fly direct to Hawaii from many of the Continental US Cities. The direct flight from JFK to Honolulu is great. Hawaiian could add additional flights from JFK to other islands, flights from other distant cities to Honolulu, or additional flights from JFK to Honolulu.

Why compete with Southwest, go where they can't!!

For what it's worth: Starting in April of 2019 Hawaiian Air will be doing direct non stop 12 hour flights from Boston to Hawaii.




.

 

[pspercy]

I just thought of an interested positive possibility for other cities in the Continental US with this Southwest Airlines development. Southwest is starting to fly direct from some West Coast cities to Hawaii. I wonder if instead of trying to compete with low price Southwest Airlines, Hawaii Airlines will remove themselves from those cities and add flights to other Continental US cities. Southwest Airlines Planes are smaller than Hawaiian's and can't fly direct to Hawaii from many of the Continental US Cities. The direct flight from JFK to Honolulu is great. Hawaiian could add additional flights from JFK to other islands, flights from other distant cities to Honolulu, or additional flights from JFK to Honolulu.

Why compete with Southwest, go where they can't!!

Southwest hasn't been low price around here for a long, long time.

 

[Ralph Sir Edward]

Still . . . Dallas to Oakland, stay overnight free on HHonors points (Courtesy of the MFs paid on the Ascend card) fly out the next morning, on your choice of carriers. (Maybe, Premium Economy on HA or some other carrier.) Do the same on the way back. Avoiding red-eyes, and a chance to recover between flights. . .

 

[Tamaradarann]

Because the 3 states on the US west coast account for over HALF of all mainland visitors to Hawaii. Other than a few large metro areas (Chicago, Dallas, etc.) filling larger planes daily wouldn't be easy and other airlines already have non-stops from those hub cities.

http://files.hawaii.gov/dbedt/visitor/visitor-research/2017-annual-visitor.pdf

Table 17 has the statistics by state, if curious.

I believe that one of the reasons that the 3 West Coast states account for over half the mainland visitors to Hawaii is the non-stop flight. While it would have to be a longer non-stop flight from east and central cities having non-stop service does make it more doable.

 

[Tamaradarann]

Still . . . Dallas to Oakland, stay overnight free on HHonors points (Courtesy of the MFs paid on the Ascend card) fly out the next morning, on your choice of carriers. (Maybe, Premium Economy on HA or some other carrier.) Do the same on the way back. Avoiding red-eyes, and a chance to recover between flights. . .

As I have stated before, I am a big advocate of direct non-stop flights to Hawaii. While your scenario is doable, my perspective on it for our situation is:

- The free nights can be used for another vacation rather than breaking up a trip
- The cost of meals for the extra travel days could be used eating out in Hawaii
- We stay for a long time in Hawaii so we pack heavy, we would have to pay for baggage twice both ways
- We would have to pay for 2 extra cab fares both ways

If you needed to quantify the value of the costs I would estimate round trip costs at:

$400 for logging(value of HH)
$200 for extra meals
$280 baggage
$100 cabs
Total $980

 

[Ralph Sir Edward]

As I have stated before, I am a big advocate of direct non-stop flights to Hawaii. While your scenario is doable, my perspective on it for our situation is:

- The free nights can be used for another vacation rather than breaking up a trip
- The cost of meals for the extra travel days could be used eating out in Hawaii
- We stay for a long time in Hawaii so we pack heavy, we would have to pay for baggage twice both ways
- We would have to pay for 2 extra cab fares both ways

If you needed to quantify the value of the costs I would estimate round trip costs at:

$400 for logging(value of HH)
$200 for extra meals
$280 baggage
$100 cabs
Total $980

I think you are overpricing.
$200 for extra meals? I will be eating somewhere, so I don't consider this to be an extra cost, unless you want to treat airline food as equal to restaurant meal.
$280 for baggage? I travel very light - one carry on bag. I keep a storage room in Hawaii for all my vacation needs - but I do that whether I travel in one day or two. It is not an extra expense. (I go every year. Current cost $636 a year.)
$100 for cabs - agreed.
$400 for lodging (value of HH) This takes a little discussion. I currently have more "travel time" than I have vacation leave from work. (This problem will solve itself in 22 months. . . ) Saving HH for another trip, that I currently can't use, is not a bonus for me. Besides, the only way I can get to Hawaii and feel in good shape the next day is to fly first class. Otherwise, after 7-8 hours in the air, my gluteus maximus are in agony, and I am stiff and still sore the next day. Break it into two days, and I don't have nearly as much pain. From DFW, First Class run around $1,000 over coach. Plus I can "mix or match" airlines for the best deal - Alaska, Hawaiian, and Southwest will all fly out of Oakland to Hawaii. (No problem with connections, since there is a overnight gap.)

$980 vs $1,000? Shrug. Different strokes for different folks.

(I get a priceless bonus. An afternoon with my niece, her husband, and my grand niece - who live 30 miles from the Oakland airport. . . . )

 

[Tamaradarann]

I think you are overpricing.
$200 for extra meals? I will be eating somewhere, so I don't consider this to be an extra cost, unless you want to treat airline food as equal to restaurant meal.
$280 for baggage? I travel very light - one carry on bag. I keep a storage room in Hawaii for all my vacation needs - but I do that whether I travel in one day or two. It is not an extra expense. (I go every year. Current cost $636 a year.)
$100 for cabs - agreed.
$400 for lodging (value of HH) This takes a little discussion. I currently have more "travel time" than I have vacation leave from work. (This problem will solve itself in 22 months. . . ) Saving HH for another trip, that I currently can't use, is not a bonus for me. Besides, the only way I can get to Hawaii and feel in good shape the next day is to fly first class. Otherwise, after 7-8 hours in the air, my gluteus maximus are in agony, and I am stiff and still sore the next day. Break it into two days, and I don't have nearly as much pain. From DFW, First Class run around $1,000 over coach. Plus I can "mix or match" airlines for the best deal - Alaska, Hawaiian, and Southwest will all fly out of Oakland to Hawaii. (No problem with connections, since there is a overnight gap.)

$980 vs $1,000? Shrug. Different strokes for different folks.

(I get a priceless bonus. An afternoon with my niece, her husband, and my grand niece - who live 30 miles from the Oakland airport. . . . )

I don't believe our difference is my overpricing it is case of Different Folks for Different Folks!! You are still working and we are retired so our perspective on free time and use of Hilton Honors points is obviously different. In addition, we don't have relatives to visit or stay with in California.(this also effects your meal costs) Furthermore, our luggage needs are also different.

While one still has to eat, eating home or in a timeshare is usually much less expensive than eating out. The $200 for extra meals is for 2 full extra days for 2 people eating outside of your home or timeshare.

 

[Ralph Sir Edward]

If one is using the layover approach, it may not be 2 days worth of meals.

For example: (I'm using Dallas with Oakland hub. Another person might try another hub.)

Non-stop from Dallas to Oakland in the evening. Depart DAL at 7:50 PM, arrive 9:45 PM local. Eat early evening meal before flight. (Assuming TSA preboard.) Go straight to hotel and crash. No extra meals the first day.

Day two. Buy breakfast if there's time. (May be a very early flight, often 7:00 AM to 8:00 AM departure, it may also have a breakfast.) If one has the time, usually have free buffet for breakfast - HH Gold perk from Ascend card. Get to Hawaii, buy lunch before grocery shopping. Eat groceries. . .

Return.

Eat meal at timeshare before leaving. (Often an early flight, may be breakfast before checkout.) Get to Oakland in the evening. Eat meal. Fly out the next day late morning, have HH free buffet (there will be time), then eat at home upon arrival.

Total purchased meals - one breakfast, one lunch, one evening meal (x2).

This is, if your goal is just to recover between flights. (And have no red-eye return flights!)

(Oh, BTW, the hotel has free airport shuttle 24X7, no cab cost. If you pay the rack rate, the rooms are around $300 for both nights combined.)

 

[Tamaradarann]

If one is using the layover approach, it may not be 2 days worth of meals.

For example: (I'm using Dallas with Oakland hub. Another person might try another hub.)

Non-stop from Dallas to Oakland in the evening. Depart DAL at 7:50 PM, arrive 9:45 PM local. Eat early evening meal before flight. (Assuming TSA preboard.) Go straight to hotel and crash. No extra meals the first day.

Day two. Buy breakfast if there's time. (May be a very early flight, often 7:00 AM to 8:00 AM departure, it may also have a breakfast.) If one has the time, usually have free buffet for breakfast - HH Gold perk from Ascend card. Get to Hawaii, buy lunch before grocery shopping. Eat groceries. . .

Return.

Eat meal at timeshare before leaving. (Often an early flight, may be breakfast before checkout.) Get to Oakland in the evening. Eat meal. Fly out the next day late morning, have HH free buffet (there will be time), then eat at home upon arrival.

Total purchased meals - one breakfast, one lunch, one evening meal (x2).

This is, if your goal is just to recover between flights. (And have no red-eye return flights!)

(Oh, BTW, the hotel has free airport shuttle 24X7, no cab cost. If you pay the rack rate, the rooms are around $300 for both nights combined.)

Another different stroke; we are from Long Island, there is no direct flight to Oakland it is at least 1 stopover in Baltimore or Orlando(I have no clue why one would fly from Long Island to Orlando to fly West ask Southwest if you want to know). We have never done Oakland, but the trip to just to Las Vegas is 8 hours.

Thank you for your thoughts, we will review the entire situation in the future when we need to pay for a flight. Our Hawaiian miles gives us free non-stop service at this time so it is not even a consideration. We are already booked for the entire 2019 year, coming back from Hawaii in 2020 would be our first opportunity to even look at the possibility.

 

[Ralph Sir Edward]

Code share from Dallas to Hawaii via Hawaiian Air is 21 hours, with an overnight layover. Dallas is American's main hub, and other than Southwest, there is no real competition. Each place has its own set of parameters for air travel. (1st class from DFW to KOA run around $2,000 round trip 10 months in advance and goes up as the time shortens. . . )

 

[Tamaradarann]

Code share from Dallas to Hawaii via Hawaiian Air is 21 hours, with an overnight layover. Dallas is American's main hub, and other than Southwest, there is no real competition. Each place has its own set of parameters for air travel. (1st class from DFW to KOA run around $2,000 round trip 10 months in advance and goes up as the time shortens. . . )

Great Points. That is why my hope with Southwest's Hawaii initiative is instead of it benefiting us coming from Long Island, I hope Hawaiian Airlines gives up on the locations that Southwest flies from directly and adds additional flights to East Coast Cities like JFK!

 

[b2bailey]

Any clues regarding flights to Lihue?

 

[DavidnRobin]

Another different stroke; we are from Long Island, there is no direct flight to Oakland it is at least 1 stopover in Baltimore or Orlando(I have no clue why one would fly from Long Island to Orlando to fly West ask Southwest if you want to know). We have never done Oakland, but the trip to just to Las Vegas is 8 hours.

Thank you for your thoughts, we will review the entire situation in the future when we need to pay for a flight. Our Hawaiian miles gives us free non-stop service at this time so it is not even a consideration. We are already booked for the entire 2019 year, coming back from Hawaii in 2020 would be our first opportunity to even look at the possibility.

BART runs from SFO to OAK (with tram). Or Lyft/Uber between SFO-OAK-SJC.


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[Tamaradarann]

BART runs from SFO to OAK (with tram). Or Lyft/Uber between SFO-OAK-SJC.


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I am not sure what is the relevance of the BART/LYFT/UBER transportation options? I know another option is we could drive from Long Island to Oakland to take Southwest to Honolulu. I still think that the Hawaiian Airlines direct flight from JFK to Honolulu is the best option for our situation.

 

[DavidnRobin]

I am not sure what is the relevance of the BART/LYFT/UBER transportation options? I know another option is we could drive from Long Island to Oakland to take Southwest to Honolulu. I still think that the Hawaiian Airlines direct flight from JFK to Honolulu is the best option for our situation.

The relevance is that you can fly to any airport in SF Bay Area - and then get to OAK (or any of them).
(eg. We are flying LIH-OAK then, SJC-LAS by taking Lyft between OAK and LAS).
Unless I misunderstand the situation.


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[1Kflyerguy]

I think there are lots of valid flight options. Personally i am a lazy traveler and would prefer a direct flight, and would probably never book something where i had to change airports. That said i can see others may prefer to save a few bucks and go with a less expensive routing.

I am based in San Jose Ca, so i rarely need a connection for Hawaii, but i use the same logic for my other trips.

What i expect will happen is that added competition drives down ticket prices for United and Hawaiian as well, at least thats my hope.