[2018] Slim pickings on resale

[north]

I think the maintenance fees are per month.

 

[Jan M.]

You know, for the amount of points, what little I know, those maintenance fees don’t look so bad. $0.61/1000 ?

Those maintenance fees of $431.32 a month come out to $5175.84 annually, $7.29 per thousand points. That is very high. Our maintenance fees of $5.02 per thousand are pretty good but not the lowest. That same amount of points, 710,000, costs us $1608.52 a year or $134.04 a month less.

 

[Arimaas]

I think the maintenance fees are per month.

Yes. No way it's annual at that rate. Still doesn't look too bad.

 

[55plus]

Yes. No way it's annual at that rate. Still doesn't look too bad.

Total HOA: $4764.10 + Program Fee: $411.80 = Total Annual $5175.90 ($431.32 Monthly)

 

[Arimaas]

Those maintenance fees of $431.32 a month come out to $5175.84 annually, $7.29 per thousand points. That is very high. Our maintenance fees of $5.02 per thousand are pretty good but not the lowest. That same amount of points, 710,000, costs us $1608.52 a year or $134.04 a month less.

Guess my math is off. lol. I guess Rutgers university should take back their engineering degree lol.

I just got a 154k unit with $74 per month ($888 annual) fees. If my math is correct this time, that’s $5.77 per thousand. How does that pan out in Wyndham world? Decent?

Also I’ve noticed that Atlantic City has high MFs. Any idea why that is? There doesn’t seem to be a lot of property there to take care of compared to say Bonet Creek? Could it be New Jersey property tax??

 

[55plus]

It's probably due to property tax and the Atlantic City Boardwalk location.

 

[Arimaas]

It's probably due to property tax and the Atlantic City Boardwalk location.

Has anyone actually stayed there for a week? Curious as to thoughts. AC is pretty dumpy.

 

[Roger830]

I cancelled there after reading reviews on TripAdvisor.

 

[55plus]

I stayed there several times. Overall Atlantic City is dumpy like Las Vegas, but along the coast/boardwalk, it's really nice. Las Vegas has it's dumpy area, but the tourists areas are well kept. There are casinos, entertainment, shows, amusement rides, etc., on the boardwalk. The resort is right off the boardwalk. See: https://www.travelchannel.com/videos/atlantic-city-boardwalk-0187137 and

to get an idea. It's worth a trip.

 

[Arimaas]

I stayed there several times. Overall Atlantic City is dumpy like Las Vegas, but along the coast/boardwalk, it's really nice. Las Vegas has it's dumpy area, but the tourists areas are well kept. There are casinos, entertainment, shows, amusement rides, etc., on the boardwalk. The resort is right off the boardwalk. See: https://www.travelchannel.com/videos/atlantic-city-boardwalk-0187137 and

to get an idea. It's worth a trip.

I’ll keep it in the back of my mind next trip to ac. I used to go once a year and stay at harrahs by the marina.

Does Wyndham offer last minute cash deal like Hilton does (called “open season” in Hilton?) I think it’s cash booking within 30 days. They actually aren’t so economical these days on the Hilton side.

 

[Railman83]

Has anyone actually stayed there for a week? Curious as to thoughts. AC is pretty dumpy.

It’s a nice place in an increasingly ugly city.

 

[Railman83]

I’ll keep it in the back of my mind next trip to ac. I used to go once a year and stay at harrahs by the marina.

Does Wyndham offer last minute cash deal like Hilton does (called “open season” in Hilton?) I think it’s cash booking within 30 days. They actually aren’t so economical these days on the Hilton side.

Rci has one last call deals and low priced extra vacations on AC and Jersey shore if you are flexible

 

[OutSkiing]

Has anyone actually stayed there for a week? Curious as to thoughts. AC is pretty dumpy.

We stayed there and felt it the resort was pretty nice. AC is a little old fashioned .. boardwalk is like stepping back in time. Not your glitzy new resort area .. lots of little hot dog / pizza / gift shop like joints along the boardwalk.

Bob

 

[Arimaas]

We stayed there and felt it the resort was pretty nice. AC is a little old fashioned .. boardwalk is like stepping back in time. Not your glitzy new resort area .. lots of little hot dog / pizza / gift shop like joints along the boardwalk.

Bob

Yeah. I guess the “boardwalk empire” days are long over

 

[jlands]

Interesting trends on recent eBay auctions. Pretty rapid increase in prices. All of these are at Bali Hai:

Feb 13: 308k EEY for $2,074 ($1,775 bid + $299 transfer) = $13.5 per 1k

Mar 1: 325k annual for $5,124 ($3,756 bid + $718.98 for 6 months MF + $350 closing costs + $299 transfer fee) = $15.8 per 1k

Mar 5: 308k annual for $6,065 ($4,700 bid + $715.50 for 6 months MF + $350 closing costs + $299 transfer fee) = $19.7 per 1k

 

[vacationhopeful]

I used to drive down and burn points at Skyline Towers. Even took my 89yo aunt there. She liked getting out of her senior building and she remembers AC at its PRIME. The building is nice, the hangtag staff likes me and the sales staff are the PIAs like every other Wyndham property.
I prefer going up to Shawnee and using my owner's day priviledges ... all w/o the sales staff sweethearts... when I am in the area.

Shawnee is almost all converted fixed weeks. MFs per week are the same but when you overlay points and use those points value to divide into the MFs... PRIME season ratios are very good for those owners ... LOW season ratios are a BAD deal ... but that is one of the reasons Wyndham LOVES CWA ... it hides/buries that bad ratio in the fine print.

 

[Railman83]

Interesting trends on recent eBay auctions. Pretty rapid increase in prices. All of these are at Bali Hai:

Feb 13: 308k EEY for $2,074 ($1,775 bid + $299 transfer) = $13.5 per 1k

Mar 1: 325k annual for $5,124 ($3,756 bid + $718.98 for 6 months MF + $350 closing costs + $299 transfer fee) = $15.8 per 1k

Mar 5: 308k annual for $6,065 ($4,700 bid + $715.50 for 6 months MF + $350 closing costs + $299 transfer fee) = $19.7 per 1k

Shockingly, just a week ago I bought a Bali Hai 375K for $1000 plus $600 closing and transfer from A Timedhare Broker Inc as I was responding to another of their ads on TUG. Good deal if it goes through.

 

[Railman83]

I see more inventory on EBay but the prices are very high. A 210K Waikiki Beach walk for $1890 plus $850 in closing.

 

[CO skier]

Going into the summer season, there is a fair amount of supply selling on EBay for some reasonable prices from a buyer's view. There are quite a number of "Best Offers" accepted.

These are a few of the bargains at bid prices.

500,000 Club Access $5.90/1000
https://www.ebay.com/itm/500-000-An...928826?hash=item1cabd4b77a:g:h0MAAOSwax5Y1ukc

506,000 Club Access $3.90/1000 all in
https://www.ebay.com/itm/506-000-An...893093?hash=item441d82e2a5:g:heYAAOSw~6dayUu9

801,000 Club Access $4.75 all in
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Wyndham-Po...009787?hash=item1caba82cfb:g:cPwAAOSwb-tanIyx

154,000 Grand Desert $3.25/1000
https://www.ebay.com/itm/WYNDHAM-GRAND-DESERT-RESORT-154-000-POINTS-LAS-VEGAS-NEVADA-TIMESHARE-/183231854246?hash=item2aa97836a6:g:Q4gAAOSwAvJW-~lm&nma=true&si=YypFKrQ9XRhTftTb9%2Bv%2Br3v%2FKI4%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

126,000 Grand Desert $8.67/1000 (This shows how EBay pricing can be all over the map; "comps" don't mean much on EBay. Someone overpaid, but maybe it was just what they wanted.)
https://www.ebay.com/itm/WYNDHAM-PO...448963?hash=item1cac19b043:g:VpsAAOSwpoNanIzE

154,000 Waikiki Beach $14.25/1000 (Which is about average for low maintenance fee Hawaii resorts)
https://www.ebay.com/itm/WYNDHAM-WA...303082?hash=item3b0d5d84aa:g:ZIIAAOSwk-9Zf5nh

Royal Vista $5.20/1000 all in
https://www.ebay.com/itm/WYNDHAM-RO...403028?hash=item3d6465df94:g:rk4AAOSwvHRa3TAb

Lots more, and this is different than years past. Usually prices are headed up by this time of year. Today is as good a time as any to snipe an auction and pick up a bargain.

 

[Railman83]

Going into the summer season, there is a fair amount of supply selling on EBay for some reasonable prices from a buyer's view. There are quite a number of "Best Offers" accepted.

These are a few of the bargains at bid prices.

500,000 Club Access $5.90/1000
https://www.ebay.com/itm/500-000-An...928826?hash=item1cabd4b77a:g:h0MAAOSwax5Y1ukc

506,000 Club Access $3.90/1000 all in
https://www.ebay.com/itm/506-000-An...893093?hash=item441d82e2a5:g:heYAAOSw~6dayUu9

801,000 Club Access $4.75 all in
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Wyndham-Po...009787?hash=item1caba82cfb:g:cPwAAOSwb-tanIyx

154,000 Grand Desert $3.25/1000
https://www.ebay.com/itm/WYNDHAM-GRAND-DESERT-RESORT-154-000-POINTS-LAS-VEGAS-NEVADA-TIMESHARE-/183231854246?hash=item2aa97836a6:g:Q4gAAOSwAvJW-~lm&nma=true&si=YypFKrQ9XRhTftTb9%2Bv%2Br3v%2FKI4%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

126,000 Grand Desert $8.67/1000 (This shows how EBay pricing can be all over the map; "comps" don't mean much on EBay. Someone overpaid, but maybe it was just what they wanted.)
https://www.ebay.com/itm/WYNDHAM-PO...448963?hash=item1cac19b043:g:VpsAAOSwpoNanIzE

154,000 Waikiki Beach $14.25/1000 (Which is about average for low maintenance fee Hawaii resorts)
https://www.ebay.com/itm/WYNDHAM-WA...303082?hash=item3b0d5d84aa:g:ZIIAAOSwk-9Zf5nh

Royal Vista $5.20/1000 all in
https://www.ebay.com/itm/WYNDHAM-RO...403028?hash=item3d6465df94:g:rk4AAOSwvHRa3TAb

Lots more, and this is different than years past. Usually prices are headed up by this time of year. Today is as good a time as any to snipe an auction and pick up a bargain.

I am officially out of market with one last 375k contract to close in 2 months or so for a total of 1850k at a rate of 5.4 per 1000.

Fourteen contacts in the last 18 months and I’ve only been delivered wrong in two cases: Flagstaff 105 that cost $8 more per mo than advertised and a majestic sun that was delivered as a Club Destin (same fees) even though the estoppel letter was posted in EBay auction.

I also have 3 Solid weeks (Christmas) of 4br at Massanutten for trading and 240 DVC points for renting as cost offset. So my net cost will be $1000 per month or about a luxury car payment. For those who doubt the value of timeshares, this is what those points allow me to do:

In the next two years I’ll use half points for travel and half to point deposit forward to my retirement beginning at end of 2021. I will work these off and push less and less forward, so starting Jan 2022, for two month winter I will be in Hawaii with stops before and after in So Cal and Vegas. For two months July and August I will travel the eastern US.

I will always have at least a 1br with kitchen and can likely stretch both periods a week or two on either end with judicious trades or last calls. My total cost will work out to about $90 per day.

There is no other way this could be done. I own a 2br vacation rental at a moderate resort in PCB and a summer week rents for $2000 all fees and tax. A winter week is $800. I am one of the lowest priced in my resort and the cost to rent the same weeks would be 25k, or about 2.5 times what it costs to stay at my choice of resorts at times of my choosing.

My conclusion is that timeshares, if done right, are an incredible value. The engineering trade off for better and cheaper accommodations than other lodging options is that you have to be flexible and able to plan ahead. In other words, you are earning a massive premium for your own time and effort.

My only advice for those seeking similar retirement is that a) you stay as much in one system as possible b) don’t buy anything you would have a problem giving away later, and c) buy in segments that you can pare off to match reduced travel. I violated these rules a bit with some free contracts, but in net i own nothing that someone wouldn’t take, and if pressed I could rent for MFs or better.

In the meantime as I await retirement I can take a couple of weeks vacation a year and treat my posse to 3br weekends every month at Nat Harbor, Old Town, Massanutten, et al.

All of this is possible because of TUG. The knowledge gained here is, by my estimation, worth about $15-20K per year in travel. You might come here ignorant and behind curve with a bad purchase, but if you read TUG forums every day you will not leave here that way and can largely rehabilitate all but the worst situations.

My three best purchases were in TUG forums and I got three for free here. EBay has been solid as well. My big regret is my first $900 in resale purchases were before I got smart enough to buy right.

This is a very, very, long way of saying that the $15 spent on TUG was the best $15 I’ve spent in my life.

So hat tip to TugBrian, we are all better for the community you have built!

 

[bendadin]

Club Destin is an affiliate. I have an affiliate that is SO much cheaper MF (same area.) It might not be such a bad thing.

I've just started a new search. I am looking for WBC. Right not I'd take anything but in a perfect world, I am hoping that someone is ready to dump an odd year contract. Keeping up with EOY just takes too much thinking. lol

 

[capital city]

Going into the summer season, there is a fair amount of supply selling on EBay for some reasonable prices from a buyer's view. There are quite a number of "Best Offers" accepted.

These are a few of the bargains at bid prices.

500,000 Club Access $5.90/1000
https://www.ebay.com/itm/500-000-An...928826?hash=item1cabd4b77a:g:h0MAAOSwax5Y1ukc

506,000 Club Access $3.90/1000 all in
https://www.ebay.com/itm/506-000-An...893093?hash=item441d82e2a5:g:heYAAOSw~6dayUu9

801,000 Club Access $4.75 all in
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Wyndham-Po...009787?hash=item1caba82cfb:g:cPwAAOSwb-tanIyx

154,000 Grand Desert $3.25/1000
https://www.ebay.com/itm/WYNDHAM-GRAND-DESERT-RESORT-154-000-POINTS-LAS-VEGAS-NEVADA-TIMESHARE-/183231854246?hash=item2aa97836a6:g:Q4gAAOSwAvJW-~lm&nma=true&si=YypFKrQ9XRhTftTb9%2Bv%2Br3v%2FKI4%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557

126,000 Grand Desert $8.67/1000 (This shows how EBay pricing can be all over the map; "comps" don't mean much on EBay. Someone overpaid, but maybe it was just what they wanted.)
https://www.ebay.com/itm/WYNDHAM-PO...448963?hash=item1cac19b043:g:VpsAAOSwpoNanIzE

154,000 Waikiki Beach $14.25/1000 (Which is about average for low maintenance fee Hawaii resorts)
https://www.ebay.com/itm/WYNDHAM-WA...303082?hash=item3b0d5d84aa:g:ZIIAAOSwk-9Zf5nh

Royal Vista $5.20/1000 all in
https://www.ebay.com/itm/WYNDHAM-RO...403028?hash=item3d6465df94:g:rk4AAOSwvHRa3TAb

Lots more, and this is different than years past. Usually prices are headed up by this time of year. Today is as good a time as any to snipe an auction and pick up a bargain.

I ended with the 801,000 club access. After asking a couple of questions I was told all 801,000 points for 2018 are still available. With the Wyndham wait time I will probably only have 3 at most 4 monthly payments and all the points. As long as I can make good use of them I think I came out really well especially considering where we were 4 months ago with contract cost. Makes me start to believe the theory on Wyndham buying back contracts. Something or someone was driving up the price there for a few months.

 

[ronparise]

I ended with the 801,000 club access. After asking a couple of questions I was told all 801,000 points for 2018 are still available. With the Wyndham wait time I will probably only have 3 at most 4 monthly payments and all the points. As long as I can make good use of them I think I came out really well especially considering where we were 4 months ago with contract cost. Makes me start to believe the theory on Wyndham buying back contracts. Something or someone was driving up the price there for a few months.

Believe it we used to buy on ebay and turn right around and sell to Wyndham at a profit. There was a short time a few years ago when we drove prices up to $15/1000 points

 

[Avislo]

We stayed there and felt it the resort was pretty nice. AC is a little old fashioned .. boardwalk is like stepping back in time. Not your glitzy new resort area .. lots of little hot dog / pizza / gift shop like joints along the boardwalk.

Bob

Wyndham Skyline Tower is a nice resort just off the ocean. Some of the Casinos are nearby. Have not been there is awhile, do not know if a few of them that closed up shop are re-opened by someone or what the buildings are currently used for.

 

[CCdad]

Several were auctions listed by the same closing company that were bid up in the extreme.

Look up the insane price paid recently for a larger BHV points contract. Then check out the other auctions that had completed within a couple weeks of the BHV one.

Someone ran up the bids and probably never won one Wyndham contract. Some of the closed contracts were later relisted.