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Slim pickings on resale

Discussion in 'Wyndham Vacation Resorts' started by Railman83, Feb 9, 2018.

  1. Railman83

    Railman83 TUG Member

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    EBay, Redweek, and the usual suspects have very few low mf contracts of any size, and few small ones. For a while there was a flood of CWA contracts, but even less of those.

    What is left is a few crap contracts that a year ago couldn’t be given away.

    One wonders if this is all Ovation?
     
  2. TUGBrian

    TUGBrian Administrator

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  3. kaljor

    kaljor TUG Member

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    It's funny, I skim eBay quite a bit to keep up with current sale prices, and I will say that most of what's listed does seem to be selling. I also see a lot more auctions where there are no costs other that your winning bid. As far as what is available, I see a fair amount of CWA, and it seems to be going for just under or just over a penny a point. Obviously some of the contracts are too big for some shoppers and some are too small, but they do seem to be there.

    I haven't checked the TUG classified in a while, I will take a look right now.
     
  4. kaljor

    kaljor TUG Member

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    Just glanced at the link posted, and he's correct. You have to read every ad to get a feel, but if you want to pick up a contract without the uncertainty of an auction, it's a good idea. There were some with lower MF's, and I assume that with these ads, the seller may be willing to negotiate a bit. Unlike eBay.
     
  5. Railman83

    Railman83 TUG Member

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    That is several months worth of ads on TUG, and you don’t see the National Harbors, Canterbury, La Belle, PCBs, and so forth either there or on EBay. It used to be you’d see free contacts on bargain deals on mid sized mid mf contracts; these are less frequent.

    I’ve been watching EBay and Tug daily for a couple of years and what I’m seeing is smaller contracts in general, contracts with middling to high mfs in general; in short, generally the less desirable stuff. I don’t have it spreadsheeted out, but early in the year in 2016 and 2017, you had a much better selection of larger, more desirable contracts.




     
  6. md8287

    md8287 TUG Member

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    I agree, very few (especially reasonably priced) Wyndham contracts flowing through right now. Good for selling I suppose.
     
  7. ilya

    ilya TUG Member

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    I agree as well. Has anyone bought from TUG recently. I wonder if the contracts are still available. This time last year there was a ton on Ebay.
     
  8. TUGBrian

    TUGBrian Administrator

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    all ads on TUG have been posted or renewed within the last 90 days.

    while I dont monitor ebay, based on our resale history page, there hasnt been a wyndam (or wyndham points) resort in the top 25 resales posted on TUG since 2014.
     
  9. Arimaas

    Arimaas TUG Member

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    So let me ask you veteran Wyndham folks then. I think I want to get into Wyndham (I've posted on this, so I won't bore you again with my reasoning and background), but thought it was a good idea to wait, see how my Hilton unit works out for awhile before committing to another Timeshare. However, with the resale market slowing down (from what you have reported) and the Ovation program being pushed (obviously to try and slow down the resale market), does it pay to grab a contract now? I'm looking at 154,000 points so that I can get a 1-BR basically wherever and whenever I want for a week. Maybe get an EOY contract to start?

    Just asking the 2¢ of the Wyndham experts on here.
     
  10. Railman83

    Railman83 TUG Member

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    There will always be something somewhere at 154 that is worth buying. I’d actually recommend 238k because the program fee is $128 flat and like .56 per thousand whichever is higher. So a 49k or 105k or a 154k will pay $128 until the .56 kicks in around 230 or so. Think of it as a regressive tax on lower point owners.

    A lot has been said about maintenance fees being the long run cost and that is true, but only becomes noticeable if you are building a sizable position (I have 1.5 million) and you plan on holding a long time.

    For example if you have 154k and you have low mf of, say 5 per thousand that is $64 per month, mid mf of 6 or would be $77, high of say 7 is $89. You can get the 6.5 or 7 for free usually with free transfer and closing which is about $600 or so.

    So if you choice is to buy 154k at Grand Desert you might pay $750 plus $600 in closing costs to have those $64 per month fees.

    If you bought 154 elsewhere at 6 you would pay $13 per month more but have saved $1350 initial cost. So you would be ahead for 8.65 years, 11+ years if you count the interest on the $1350 you didn’t spend.

    When you multiply by 10 or do and you are talking 1.5M and your time horizon is 25 years then the mf become more important.

    I’m tied in at 5.5 with 11 contracts of mixed quality. If I had to do over I’d have got 3-5 big contracts, but the upside for my portfolio is I can peal off contracts gradually is I get increasingly closer to death. Some have worth, some are attractive free, a couple would be hard to give away (7-8) and I would have to pair with a larger nicer contract to make someone else’s math work out.

    My advice is to look in the 5.5-6.25 range if you can get for $1000-1500 all in for a 231k. I thought I overpaid for one on tug (1900 for 238k with mf of 4.56) but I’m now glad I did.

    My second advice is to look a rental sites that have Wyndham properties. Booking.com has a one bedroom for $729 and a two bedroom for $797 on a Friday two night stay at Nat harbor prime summer Using points at my 5.6 rate would save $237 and $336 respectively for using 100k or 60K respectively. Seldom are larger units at popular times available so another plus for owing.

    Extrapolating our for your 154 intent you would save $500 to $610 off a retail price for those 154k. You tend to save more with smaller units over retail so your mileage may vary.

    One way to find a bargain is converted fixed week anomalies. Essentially you look on EBay and it will be a resort widely known to be a high range mf, except the previous owner had converted a high demand fixed week and got more points for lower fees. Hard to find and you should email seller for estoppel for sure, but a lot of “collectors” will pass because they assume the mfs are higher like rest of resort and don’t bother to read ad.




     
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  11. Braindead

    Braindead TUG Member

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    None of us can predict what resale prices will be a year from now.
    If Ovation gets more popular simple supply and demand would indicate prices could rise.
    In simple math if you buy 154k points with MFs of $5 per thousand verses one that $6 per thousand MFs you will save $154.00 a year in MFs.
    If you do the same on 1,500,000 points you would save $1,500.00 per year on MFs. So yes it adds up fast.
    Only buy a high MF property if have to own there for ARP.
    I WOULD NOT RECOMMEND anyone buying even resale if you plan on owning less than 5 years. This the only time I would recommend renting.
    As long as you are in for 10 plus years buy low MF resorts and your more likely you will get your some of your money back.
    You will also have a better chance that Wyndham will take it back through Ovation. Remember they can pick and choose which resales they will take back
     
    needhelp likes this.
  12. Roger830

    Roger830 TUG Member

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    The EOY makes sense. I have two of the EOY Panama City 168,000 point contracts, which have very low MF. A big advantage of EOY is when it comes time to sell. Wyndham has been transferring current year points when contracts are sold. If I sell my odd year EOY today, there are no current year points.

    154,000 won't get a 1-BR at all resorts.
     
    Dave Landry likes this.
  13. Dave Landry

    Dave Landry TUG Member

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    Purchased Panama City from tug in October of last year. Still waiting on transfer.
     
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  14. spackler

    spackler TUG Member

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    On eBay, I use the search string "wyndham (pts, points) -worldmark -access" as I'm not interested in CWA, and the numbers have steadily gone down over the past year or so. Right now only 8 auctions fit that search, down from 50-60 last year.
     
  15. needhelp

    needhelp TUG Member

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    I have a search for "wyndham timeshare Canterbury" and "wyndham timeshare south shore"; I never get any results
     
  16. Dave Landry

    Dave Landry TUG Member

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    I was offered a 189k south Shore contract for 2000 if I also paid closing costs. Ended up passing and got a 259k Panama city for 2000 including all closing fees. Was afraid that I overpaid but haven't seen anything close yet unless I wanted to buy a million or more points.
     
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  17. scootr5

    scootr5 Tug Review Crew: Rookie TUG Member

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    I’ve only seen a resale South Shore twice. The second time was the one I purchased.
     
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  18. Dave Landry

    Dave Landry TUG Member

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    A 686000 National Harbour just sold for over 10.50/1000 on Ebay! Not seeing many bargains lately for sure.
     
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  19. CCdad

    CCdad TUG Member

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    Someone paid the Buy It Now (BIN) price of $4,200 + $450 closing costs + $299 transfer fee for the 500K National Harbor contract yesterday morning.

    The seller on that auction originally wanted $7,495 BIN plus costs, then relisted for it $4,995 BIN plus costs and finally dropped it to $4,200 BIN plus costs over the course of ten days or so.
     
  20. Arimaas

    Arimaas TUG Member

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    Where is the best place to go for Wyndham resales? TUG? I through the question out there again, do you guys think the resale market is drying up? Have you seen this before? I was waiting to see what kind of tax return I get before diving in to a Wyndham contract.
     
  21. Dave Landry

    Dave Landry TUG Member

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    I purchased here in the marketplace. I really don't think the resale market will ever dry up unless Wyndham starts massively purchasing contracts back. Once you decide to jump in just be patient and watch the ads. Sooner or later something will pop up that suits your needs. As members age or get tired of traveling they may not have family to pass it down to or have any who want it.
     
  22. ronparise

    ronparise TUG Member

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    In the past most of the contracts on eBay came from the various timeshare relief companies (formerly known as “post card” companies) If you don’t know, these companies will take your timeshares off your hands if you pay them a fee.

    Since Wyndham will take back their product (and, in certain cases, buy it back), there is no need to pay anyone to get rid of a Wyndham timeshare. As a result, the timeshare relief companies don’t get much Wyndham and Therefore very few Wyndham contracts show up on eBay

    At least that’s this former owners analysis
     
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  23. Braindead

    Braindead TUG Member

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    As supply goes down prices seem to be easing upward. Resales usually bottom in price between November-January.
    Are prices rebounding faster than what you’ve seen in past years ? Prices seem to be going up fast lately
     
  24. ronparise

    ronparise TUG Member

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    I not watching eBay any more so I can’t answer your question. I think you are right. There is a seasonal change in the supply/ demand relationship. The bigger question is; why? What causes the change in supply and demand?



    In the past here’s what I think was happening; Prices went up when Wyndham was buying (Ovation and other means) eBay supply was downand
    And prices went down when Wyndham wasn’t buying (eBay supply was up)

    I know of several big players that made a lot of money buying when prices were down and selling when prices were up. I sold to some anonymous LLC that I think was a front for Wyndham The LLC bought in the summer and didn’t buy in the winter
     
  25. kukenan

    kukenan TUG Member

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    Only 3 Club Wyndham Access contracts selling on ebay right now, last year were lots (10, 20, 30) of contracs for sale. Very effective strategy for Wyn, they are selling good at developer prices, and buying for nothing (Ovation) or very cheap on eBay TUG, RedWeek, megarenters.

    Maybe in the future will be hard to find a CWP or CWA resale contracts.
     

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