Rescinding should not be automatic response

[csalter2]

One of the things I notice here is that some on this site automatically without any questions asked tell a person who bought directly from the developer to rescind. I believe we should not always be so quick to tell people to rescind without hearing the whole story or getting more information.

There are times where you can come out ahead with the developer. It’s not always the case but it does happen. This can be especially true if a large amount of points are being purchased. The hybrid bundles are example, buying resale weeks and bringing them through Marriott are clear examples of developer purchase not necessarily being inferior to resale. We have seen some creative newbies navigate through some of these deals with the developer and do better or equal to resale.

Plus, you don’t get any freebies with resale purchases. I’m not saying to not ever suggest rescind but it should not be an automatic response.

 

[bnoble]

Rescinding absolutely should be the automatic response. The time window for doing so is limited---and the question is often asked here near the end of that window. That's not enough time to make a rational judgement of the costs/benefits particularly because the person asking the question hasn't or can't give us enough information to help them make that decision. Plus, if after sufficient due diligence you discover that the purchase terms were favorable, you can almost certainly get them re-written.

There's an important distinction here: the advice to rescind should be automatic because of the time asymmetry. The advice to prefer a purchase on the secondary market vs. from the developer is not automatic, as you rightly point out.

 

[JIMinNC]

Rescinding absolutely should be the automatic response. The time window for doing so is limited---and the question is often asked here near the end of that window. That's not enough time to make a rational judgement of the costs/benefits particularly because the person asking the question hasn't or can't give us enough information to help them make that decision. Plus, if after sufficient due diligence you discover that the purchase terms were favorable, you can almost certainly get them re-written.

There's an important distinction here: the advice to rescind should be automatic because of the time asymmetry. The advice to prefer a purchase on the secondary market vs. from the developer is not automatic, as you rightly point out.

If the person coming here is asking a question about what they bought and is unsure if what they purchased was smart, then I agree 100% with what you say - rescind should be an automatic, or almost automatic, response.

However, what I think Carlito is referring to, is there have been a couple recent cases (and some older ones), where obviously well-informed, well-researched posters have posted about their purchase of a hybrid/bundle, or maybe a points buy to enroll post-2010 resales. Even in those cases where the poster is obviously not a newbie and has done their homework, there are sometimes those that still tend to bring out the old "rescind and buy resale argument." The bottom line is, if you want DC Points instead of weeks, have done your homework, and buy one of the hybrid-style packages that MVC sells, your net cost can be very close to the cost of buying resale points after paying the MVC $3/point activation fee.

 

[TUGBrian]

if someone is looking for help or questioning what they purchased enough to register on a timeshare forum and ask for advice....it should absolutely be an automatic response.

in fact there is no better reason I can think of for someone to rescind if they still have questions or concerns about what they signed while on vacation.

now I can agree with your comment that in some cases, a developer purchase might not be as universally bad as it is usually described on just about every new buyer post....but rescinding does not in any way shape or form prevent an owner from returning or contacting that salesperson and getting that exact same deal offered weeks or months down the road should they do their research and decide buying from a developer is right for them.

lots of folks seem to think the advice to rescind somehow translates to "timeshares suck, dont buy at all"...when in fact in almost all circumstances it is instead "you only have a few short days to legally cancel what you own, you should absolutely rescind and do your research and make an educated and informed decision before committing yourself to a significant financial investment"

 

[DaveNV]

What Brian said. ^^^

Dave

 

[Sandy VDH]

Time is your enemy. You have limited time to rescind. You likely need more time to learn than the rescission period. Once you have learned and answer questions you are always at liberty to purchase from the developer but in a more well informed position.

 

[Grammarhero]

I think it should be the automatic response. Developer purchases works in 2-5 percent of cases. Thus, rescinding should be automatic option.

 

[Steve Fatula]

One of the things I notice here is that some on this site automatically without any questions asked tell a person who bought directly from the developer to rescind. I believe we should not always be so quick to tell people to rescind without hearing the whole story or getting more information.

There are times where you can come out ahead with the developer. It’s not always the case but it does happen. This can be especially true if a large amount of points are being purchased. The hybrid bundles are example, buying resale weeks and bringing them through Marriott are clear examples of developer purchase not necessarily being inferior to resale. We have seen some creative newbies navigate through some of these deals with the developer and do better or equal to resale.

Plus, you don’t get any freebies with resale purchases. I’m not saying to not ever suggest rescind but it should not be an automatic response.

Totally agree. And minutes later a post came up from a member asking about a purchase and I said do not rescind as it made sense.

 

[SueDonJ]

Absolutely, if someone says they're within the rescission period and they don't appear to know what they've bought or what else might be available to them, then "rescind while you can" is always the right answer.

But I've also seen the recent threads that Carlito's talking about, where people knew what they were buying but had specific questions about how best to now use it. In one case especially, the person is STILL being belittled for buying a direct-purchase Marriott hybrid package even now that the rescission period is over.

So sure, advice to rescind is generally good advice. But the questions from new buyers aren't always about the purchase itself, and we're no help at all if we ignore the fact that sometimes buyers actually do know what they're buying but they just need some help using it.

 

[Steve Fatula]

But I've also seen the recent threads that Carlito's talking about, where people knew what they were buying but had specific questions about how best to now use it. In one case especially, the person is STILL being belittled for buying a direct-purchase Marriott hybrid package even now that the rescission period is over.

.

Yes, and I find this absolutely ridiculous.

 

[Passepartout]

If they are questioning their purchase, why not recommend rescission so they can study, and make an INFORMED decision? If it turns out that after taking the time without the pressure of a commissioned sales person breathing down their neck, that the retail 'deal' is for them, it'll always be available. If Not, and the rescission period has passed, they are out tens of thousands of dollars.

It's no contest!

Jim

 

[csalter2]

All I’m trying to say is before you hit the rescind button to at least ask a question to know what you’re telling them to rescind. It doesn’t take any time to ask a question regarding their purchase or even their potential purchase. I’ve read don’t purchase from the developer to potential buyers. It’s always good to hear both offers. On more than one occasion once the developer went through their spiels of trying to convince buyers to pay retail prices, I’ve seen them come down to earth once they realize you’re aware of the resale market. I’ve seen that not only with myself but with in laws with whom I’ve attended their sales presentations. They recognize there is competition, but they prey on the uniformed. Those of us who consider ourselves informed and feel that resale is the ONLY WAY ALL THE TIME are also potentially prey to our own biases. Just a thought. NO ONE SIZE FITS ALL, ALL OF THE TIME.

 

[TUGBrian]

can someone explain to me what is lost by rescinding? I often wonder if I am missing something?

how exactly does rescinding hurt the consumer in any way shape form or fashion? if you rescinded, and took a few weeks to research your decision then decided it was indeed right for you, the salesman would likely do everything short of knock on the front door of your house to get you to resign that original sales contract if you expressed interest in it.

 

[Steve Fatula]

can someone explain to me what is lost by rescinding? I often wonder if I am missing something?

how exactly does rescinding hurt the consumer in any way shape form or fashion? if you rescinded, and took a few weeks to research your decision then decided it was indeed right for you, the salesman would likely do everything short of knock on the front door of your house to get you to resign that original sales contract if you expressed interest in it.

Sure, and you are missing what the OP is asking. Let's use your example, you rescinded, did all that, and re-purchased. Now you post on TUG about the deal, and guess what happens.....

Same thing. You are an idiot for buying. Reference the thread SueDonJ is referring to.

 

[SueDonJ]

can someone explain to me what is lost by rescinding? I often wonder if I am missing something?

how exactly does rescinding hurt the consumer in any way shape form or fashion? if you rescinded, and took a few weeks to research your decision then decided it was indeed right for you, the salesman would likely do everything short of knock on the front door of your house to get you to resign that original sales contract if you expressed interest in it.

Nothing is lost by rescinding! But consider, nobody here is saying that rescission shouldn't be recommended when a person doesn't appear to know that there are other options out there!

What Carlito is talking about, I think, are the few recent threads where people posted something like, "I just bought XYZ direct. I know I could have bought ABC resale and use II to get XYZ, I know I could have bought DEF and rented it out using the cash to get XYZ, I know somebody else might have chosen any other resale option to get what they wanted ... but I wanted the easiest way to get XYZ without exchanging/renting, and I wanted the extras from the developer that somebody else might not want. So ... given that I own what I want and I bought it from the developer even knowing the other options, now I want to know how to best use it. What is my reservation window, what do I have to do, where on the website do I find ... etc?" and instead of getting answers to their questions, they got RESCIND NOW in eight different languages. That makes no sense and gives no consideration to the poster's obvious knowledge. That's what we're talking about here.

Every so often these kinds of posts/responses happen in multiple threads at the same time. I get Carlito's frustration but this will pass just like every other time has.

 

[Steve Fatula]

Exactly

 

[JIMinNC]

can someone explain to me what is lost by rescinding? I often wonder if I am missing something?

how exactly does rescinding hurt the consumer in any way shape form or fashion? if you rescinded, and took a few weeks to research your decision then decided it was indeed right for you, the salesman would likely do everything short of knock on the front door of your house to get you to resign that original sales contract if you expressed interest in it.

Brian,

What Carlito, Steve, Susan, and I are talking about is not the newbie who comes on TUG with buyer's remorse and clearly doesn't understand what they bought. That buyer should rescind and research.

What we're talking about is knowledgeable, informed buyers who did their research, but understand the products and bought a specific package from the developer that was competitive with resale. It may be rare in most timeshare systems, but in the Marriott system, if you want DC Points instead of weeks, buying a hybrid package from MVC often/usually comes out about the same price as fully-costed resale points (after paying MVC's activation fees).

It happened to me in 2014 when we bought our initial MVC ownership in a hybrid package from MVC. Our cost was $6.98/point, almost exactly what it would have cost for external resale pure trust points. Several folks basically told me I should "rescind immediately and buy resale weeks; never buy from a developer. You paid too much," even though I spent months on TUG researching the MVC system, hybrid packages, resale points, etc. I knew exactly what I was buying, but I was still told "RESCIND!!"

 

[TUGBrian]

I dont disagree with your comments/concerns about this specific example. I doubt folks have anything but other owners best interest in mind.

there are far worse things someone can be accused of than making a mistake while trying to save a fellow timeshare owner a buck!

 

[controller1]

. . .
I doubt folks have anything but other owners best interest in mind.
. . .

This statement causes me to doubt your doubt!

. . .

But I've also seen the recent threads that Carlito's talking about, where people knew what they were buying but had specific questions about how best to now use it. In one case especially, the person is STILL being belittled for buying a direct-purchase Marriott hybrid package even now that the rescission period is over.

 

[csalter2]

can someone explain to me what is lost by rescinding? I often wonder if I am missing something?

how exactly does rescinding hurt the consumer in any way shape form or fashion? if you rescinded, and took a few weeks to research your decision then decided it was indeed right for you, the salesman would likely do everything short of knock on the front door of your house to get you to resign that original sales contract if you expressed interest in it.

If you’ve got a deer in the headlights and they haven’t a clue, they couldn’t even express what they have or done within their sales presentation, I recommend rescind too. However, that’s not the case for everyone.

 

[dioxide45]

If the person coming here is asking a question about what they bought and is unsure if what they purchased was smart, then I agree 100% with what you say - rescind should be an automatic, or almost automatic, response.

However, what I think Carlito is referring to, is there have been a couple recent cases (and some older ones), where obviously well-informed, well-researched posters have posted about their purchase of a hybrid/bundle, or maybe a points buy to enroll post-2010 resales. Even in those cases where the poster is obviously not a newbie and has done their homework, there are sometimes those that still tend to bring out the old "rescind and buy resale argument." The bottom line is, if you want DC Points instead of weeks, have done your homework, and buy one of the hybrid-style packages that MVC sells, your net cost can be very close to the cost of buying resale points after paying the MVC $3/point activation fee.

Fair, but I can probably count on one hand the number of instances that I have seen here were this applied...

 

[JIMinNC]

Fair, but I can probably count on one hand the number of instances that I have seen here were this applied...

Off the top, can think of enough to take up more than one hand, maybe getting close to two hands...and I'm still thinking. I might get to my toes yet!

 

[csalter2]

Fair, but I can probably count on one hand the number of instances that I have seen here were this applied...

It’s happening more frequently where people who are knowledgeable owners are buying from Marriott for good reasons for them.

 

[bnoble]

There are a number of people doing the same with Wyndham with a blended purchase plus PIC. Not for me, but it works for some people based on how they personally value the perks and extras.

 

[OldGuy]

rescind