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Pacific Property Transfer - Scam Artists?

lcml11

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I agree.. I doubt the AG is interested in pursuing a case over an ebay seller who is incompetent. Stupidity should be illegal, but it's not..

If this was a licensed real estate broker you could file a complaint for dereliction of duty with the state regulatory agency- but for an unlicensed entity you don't have anyone to complain to that will make a difference. This is the risk of dealing with unlicensed eBay resellers that you accept simply by placing a bid!

File a claim with ebay, file a claim with the BBB, file a credit card dispute- and insist that a corrective recording be filed. Better yet, spend a little money and have an attorney review whatever they prepare, then record it yourself to ensure you protect yourself as much as possible.

While the Berkley Group may have told you today that you don't own anything- I wouldn't count on that if the other "buyer" doesn't pay his fees. The developer cares about cash! And if it turns out you are a better target for collection than the other guy- it wouldn't surprise me for the resort to suddenly decide down the road that the recorded deed in your name makes you "liable" for unpaid assessments on your "ownership".


QUOTE=Saintsfanfl;1399571]Fwiw the Attorney General is not going to care one little bit about a clerical error on a deed. There is no crime being committed. Deed mistakes happen all the time. Ebay is also not going to care one bit as long as you get your money back. You can't even leave negative feedback since it has been over 60 days.

This is the annoying price for dealing with PCC's that have a known sloppy reputation. It's best to just get a refund and move on.
[/QUOTE]

The getting the name off the deed is the priority for the reasons articulated here.
 

topmom101

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I am reading your posts and it's like deja vu. Same situation applies to me with same seller and title company. This past January I won a bid on EBay for a TS in Aruba. The seller was Lukas Gilkey from SellTimeshares.org. The title company was Pacific Transfer, Gina Sullivan (no relation). We went thru the entire process only to find out from the resort (LaCabana) that the deed was transferred a few days prior to someone else.

Lukas expressed shock when we confronted him and claimed innocence. He explained to us that the seller must have listed their TS with multiple companies. He also promised he would find a similar week in his vast inventory and give me the same deal I had on E-Bay, but of course, I never heard from him. Repeated calls to Gina at Pacific were also never returned. I wrote letters and left countless voice mails... a month later, I gave it up.
I hope you have better luck than I had.

Mariella Sullivan
 

rickandcindy23

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Pacific Transfer is Luky987's closing company. They are inept, slow, and rude. I posted a link to an eBay ad for a Shell Points package a few days ago by Luky987. He misquoted the fees for that one by about $600. It's not a mistake on his part; it was a purposeful and egregious decision on his part. Get someone hooked, and then make them responsible for the high fees for 2013.
 

Saintsfanfl

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Pacific Transfer is Luky987's closing company. They are inept, slow, and rude. I posted a link to an eBay ad for a Shell Points package a few days ago by Luky987. He misquoted the fees for that one by about $600. It's not a mistake on his part; it was a purposeful and egregious decision on his part. Get someone hooked, and then make them responsible for the high fees for 2013.

Luky987 is another selltimeshare.org eBay seller ID. Pacific Transfer and selltimeshare.org are all one operation. I completely disagree that they misquoted the fees on purpose. They do such a high volume that it creates a lot of room for error. They move so much product they don't have anything to gain by misquoting one maintenance fee. I had one recently from them where they quoted the fee higher than what it actually was.
 
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surprised no one mentioned this: BBB. They may not have much "teeth" in terms of getting things done, but at least your issue is now public record.

TS
 

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surprised no one mentioned this: BBB. They may not have much "teeth" in terms of getting things done, but at least your issue is now public record.

TS

Yes indeed, I have filed a case with the California Attorney Generals office and a complaint with the BBB. I've also just opened a case with eBay's Security and Investigations team against the seller "selltimeshareorg". They (eBay) will be contacting me for a case history and additional info.
 
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bogey21

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Yes indeed, I have filed a case with the California Attorney Generals office and a complaint with the BBB. I've also just opened a case with eBay's Security and Investigations team against the seller "selltimeshareorg". They (eBay) will be contacting me for a case history and additional info.

I think you are spinning your wheels but I've been wrong before.

George
 

Dorian

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I think you are spinning your wheels but I've been wrong before.

George

If I weren't out money I'd have just walked away. I don't mind putting a little effort into trying to get it back, alerting the appropriate authorities, and doing what I can to warn others and may prevent someone else from getting scammed.

I hear you though.
 

csxjohn

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I'm always skeptical of companies that won't accept credit card payments. These are the kinds of things I always think will happen.

You have a purchase agreement with them. Does it spell out recourse for non performance by either party?

You have a few hundred in this so I would also do everything I could to get it back.

Getting that recorded deed out of your name would be my first priority.
 

bjones9942

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Luky987 is another selltimeshare.org eBay seller ID. Pacific Transfer and selltimeshare.org are all one operation. I completely disagree that they misquoted the fees on purpose. They do such a high volume that it creates a lot of room for error. They move so much product they don't have anything to gain by misquoting one maintenance fee. I had one recently from them where they quoted the fee higher than what it actually was.

And I'll completely disagree with your premise. There are other posts that talk about selltimeshare.org's misposting of information that they refuse to correct when informed. That tells me they intend to decieve. Were it, as you say 'one maintenance fee', I might agree - but it appears this is common with them. And they have a sale to gain, not nothing as you state.
 

Dean

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Ok, I will try to keep this short....

Mid September I win an auction on eBay for 74,000 annual points at Vacation Village Parkway for $1.25.

Right out of the gate I begin having issues with the title transfer company (Pacific Transfer) where they try to charge me extra fees but I successfully deny them. Then a series of blunders on their end like errors in the contract they had to rewrite which took several weeks, people out of the office that were needed to complete my paperwork, them accusing someone from the county for messing up, etc. So finally in the beginning of November they tell me that they have everything taken care of and sent my info to Vacation Village. I patiently wait and hear nothing for a few weeks and then find out that the check they sent to Vacation Village was made out to the wrong company and had to be sent back for correction. Fast forward to early December and Pacific Transfer tells me that they sent the correct check to Vacation Village and all is finally done. Well, three days ago I start inquiring as to where my points are and was told that the property that I won was deeded into another persons name. WTH? I do have a copy of the deed that Pacific Transfer sent to me and a copy of the Docusign electronic contract that shows everything that I purchased. Vacation Village believes that they sold this property to two people (either on purpose or accident who knoes?) and because his name was deeded four days before mine in their eyes it belongs to the other person.

I am hoping that Pacific will have to come up with a way either by getting my property back by telling the other guy they made a mistake or giving me another property of at least equal value/points, including the unused 74,000 2012 points I thought I bought. I believe my deed and electronic contract showing what I bought should make them honor out agreement.

This has been a nightmare!!!! I am going to start by filing a complaint with eBay, opening a a case with the California Attorney Generals Office (where Pacific Transfer resides), and getting an attorney,

Any thoughts or suggestions would be appreciated. Thank you!
They may have done you a favor depending on how much money you're out and your specifics. The last I looked, the Orlando RCI points options were not that good in terms of points vs fees and they may prevent you from trading in to DVC if you have any thoughts on that option.
 

Dorian

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They may have done you a favor depending on how much money you're out and your specifics. The last I looked, the Orlando RCI points options were not that good in terms of points vs fees and they may prevent you from trading in to DVC if you have any thoughts on that option.

I have zero interest in Disney or the Orlando area. I use my point generally for trips like Cabo, Caribbean locations, Breckenridge, and have Ireland in my sights. I am solely interested in RCI points.

Thanks
 

Dorian

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I'm always skeptical of companies that won't accept credit card payments. These are the kinds of things I always think will happen.

You have a purchase agreement with them. Does it spell out recourse for non performance by either party?

You have a few hundred in this so I would also do everything I could to get it back.

Getting that recorded deed out of your name would be my first priority.

I will take a look at the contract and see if it specifies non-performance outcomes.

Thanks
 

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It takes people reporting when they get scammed for criminals to get caught. Maybe it is just a clerical error, but if it is something more sinister and people continue to just let them walk, they will keep on taking more people for a ride.
 

theo

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A noble thought, but...

It takes people reporting when they get scammed for criminals to get caught. Maybe it is just a clerical error, but if it is something more sinister and people continue to just let them walk, they will keep on taking more people for a ride.

Stupidity and incompetence alone do not constitute criminality (...unfortunately). A totally inept backroom "closing company" making (entirely predictable) errors is not quite a "scam" from which to get "caught".
IMnsHO, you can "report" such incompetent bozos until the cows come home, but the only "crime" here appears to be "stupidity in the daytime", for which statutory cites and penalties are difficult to pinpoint. :rolleyes:
 
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Talent312

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I disagree with my fellow posters who say this is not fraud or a criminal act.
Stupid, incompetent, perhaps... However, it is a crime to take $$ and convey nothing.
It is theft. It is a fraudulent transfer. There are statutes on the subject.

In some states, an attorney is not allowed to threaten criminal prosecution.
But you can.
 

lbjen

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Stupidity and incompetence do not constitute criminality (...unfortunately). An inept backroom "closing company" making (entirely predictable) procedural errors is not quite a "scam" from which to get "caught". You can "report" such incompetent bozos until the cows come home, but the only "crime" here appears to be "stupidity in the daytime", for which statutory cites and penalties are difficult to pinpoint. :rolleyes:

Better to let the authorities decide once they have all the info, who knows what else they have been looking at?
 

Saintsfanfl

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I disagree with my fellow posters who say this is not fraud or a criminal act.
Stupid, incompetent, perhaps... However, it is a crime to take $$ and convey nothing.
It is theft. It is a fraudulent transfer. There are statutes on the subject.

In some states, an attorney is not allowed to threaten criminal prosecution.
But you can.

Somehow I don't think a free closing timeshare for $1.25 where the original seller "sold" it again constitutes fraud by the closing company. You have to realize here that the sales paperwork does not show a sale by this eBay seller. It is an agreement between the original seller and the buyer. If there is fraud it is by the original seller. The closing company recorded the deed and sent the transfer paperwork. The OP can correct me if I am wrong but there is no actual contract between the buyer and the eBay seller.
 

Beefnot

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Somehow I don't think a free closing timeshare for $1.25 where the original seller "sold" it again constitutes fraud by the closing company. You have to realize here that the sales paperwork does not show a sale by this eBay seller. It is an agreement between the original seller and the buyer. If there is fraud it is by the original seller. The closing company recorded the deed and sent the transfer paperwork. The OP can correct me if I am wrong but there is no actual contract between the buyer and the eBay seller.

So the OP is only out $1.25? Either just walk away, or request the $1.25 refund and then walk away. And then pick another one up off ebay from a reputable seller. VV@P units are on ebay all the time. And you may even get a better deal than $1.25.
 
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csxjohn

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So the OP is only out $1.25? Either just walk away, or request the $1.25 refund and then walk away. And then pick another one up off ebay from a reputable seller. VV@P units are on ebay all the time. And you may even get a better deal than $1.25.

Last week I was able to pull up the OP's auction and it was not free closing. I think it was between $200 and $300 sunk so I would consider this fraud if the money is not returned.

The ad is no longer available on eBay for viewing.
 

Beefnot

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Last week I was able to pull up the OP's auction and it was not free closing. I think it was between $200 and $300 sunk so I would consider this fraud if the money is not returned.

The ad is no longer available on eBay for viewing.

Oh wow. Then regardless of how incomeptent the seller was, if the seller does not refund monies paid to the closing company (which in all likelihood is themselves in some form or fashion) as restitution for their incompetence, then that's a problem.
 

Saintsfanfl

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Last week I was able to pull up the OP's auction and it was not free closing. I think it was between $200 and $300 sunk so I would consider this fraud if the money is not returned.

The ad is no longer available on eBay for viewing.

I agree completely that any closing costs paid should be refunded if the transfer was not completed. It is not fraud by the closing company if the original seller agreed to sell the property to two parties. The closing company is also not legally obligated to provide an alternative property. This would be a courtesy gesture. They should be legally obligated to provide a refund, however, SellTimeShare.org's terms are very buyer unfriendly so this legal obligation on closing fees is murky. For example, the deed was in fact recorded, so do they have a legal obligation to eat the recording fee? It is obvious they canot keep a transfer fee because no transfer occurred.

If someone chooses to enter a purchase agreement with an ebay seller where the terms are unfavorable, they are accepting the risk of these types of things happening. It is the nature of the beast in buying a discount timeshare from an ebay PCC.
 
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rrsafety

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Last week I was able to pull up the OP's auction and it was not free closing. I think it was between $200 and $300 sunk so I would consider this fraud if the money is not returned.

The ad is no longer available on eBay for viewing.

After all this discussion about $1.25, is it possible the OP failed to mention the $300? :shrug:
 

csxjohn

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... I've lost money and I can't even get a response to rectify the situation.

... From my perspective they've taken my money, messed up, and are just hoping I'll forget about it and go away. This is why I will open a case with the CA Atty Generals office. It's criminal/fraud from where I am sitting.

Thanks for the info by the way

If I weren't out money I'd have just walked away. I don't mind putting a little effort into trying to get it back, alerting the appropriate authorities, and doing what I can to warn others and may prevent someone else from getting scammed.

I hear you though.

After all this discussion about $1.25, is it possible the OP failed to mention the $300? :shrug:

The OP did not mention the amount specifically but after stating that they don't have all that much free time, this effort would not have been put forth for the $1.25.

They are out the closing costs and they have a deed in their name that could come back to haunt them if the current recognized owner defaults on MFs.

It would have been much clearer if they had mentioned the amount they are out from the beginning.
 

Beefnot

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The OP did not mention the amount specifically but after stating that they don't have all that much free time, this effort would not have been put forth for the $1.25.

They are out the closing costs and they have a deed in their name that could come back to haunt them if the current recognized owner defaults on MFs.

It would have been much clearer if they had mentioned the amount they are out from the beginning.

The deed is only in their name if it was recorded with the county. Otherwise, it may have been simply a draft that was prepared for review by the buyer, but never filed wi the county. This could be checked with the county for a fee I believe, something like $20.
 
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