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Owner Update / Sales Presentation in Maui - 6/3/2019

Discussion in 'Marriott Vacation Club' started by StevenTing, Jun 3, 2019.

  1. StevenTing

    StevenTing TUG Member

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    This one went a little differently. Instead of being a hard sell, the SP asked me lots of questions. I think he looked at my portfolio and was trying to figure out how to pitch me. He asked me to tell him about my Maui resale purchases and my points resale purposes. I walked him through my resale calculator as well. He did a lot of, “now let’s assume you were in my position, what would you tell a prospective buyer?” A lot of questions along that line. I ended up doing most of the talking during the meeting.

    I didn’t really learn anything new during this meeting but here are a few tidbits.

    Price went up to $14.10 as of 10/30/2018. Current price is now $14.26
    They are offering a 25% discount on the purchase of 3000+ points because of their 35th anniversary.
    They still offer bundles/hybrid purchases but says they will stop once the integration with the other brands are complete.

    Supposedly Chairman will go up to 25,000 points. I told them there was no incentive to buy up to Chairman. The value isn’t there. They harped on it 4-5 times but could not give me an answer on value.

    I was shown an old 2013/2014 document that showed percentage of rooms booked with points. Lowest was 44%. And highest I saw was 92% at Marco Island.

    And that was it.
     
    PamMo likes this.
  2. GregT

    GregT TUG Member TUG Member

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    Marriott: Maui Ocean Club Lahaina Villas (3BRx5), Ko Olina, Shadow Ridge II, Willow Ridge, DC Points HGVC: HHV Lagoon, Flamingo, Sea World, I-Drive, Starwood Bella (x4), SDO, Aulani, Worldmark
    Steven, that's interesting, but not compelling. I am a little skeptical of the point reservation comment, but believe Marco Island because it was only briefly sold as weeks -- so I would expect mostly point reservations. Very interesting about other properties, but hard to believe.

    I also don't think that Chairman is worth that much -- will be interesting to see what they do when they roll out the Marriott/Vistana overlay (someday....). Thanks for posting this!

    Best,

    Greg
     
  3. bazzap

    bazzap Tug Review Crew: Rookie TUG Member

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    15,000 to 25,000 points would certainly be quite a hike @ $14.26 per point before discount, so an extra $142,600 for Chairman’s Club level!
    I certainly do hope they will Grandfather in existing owners at this level?
     
  4. vacationtime1

    vacationtime1 Tug Review Crew: Rookie TUG Member

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    Marriott will have to raise the entry level for Chairman's Club if/when it permits Vistana owners to enroll units and elect points -- and 25,000 is not an unreasonable number.

    But were his lips moving?
     
  5. TravelTime

    TravelTime TUG Member

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    I assume if they raise Chairman’s Club level to 25K, they have a plan to differentiate it from Presidential level. My biggest issue with Chairman’s Club at a 15k or 25k Points per year would be there are not enough good ways to use that many points per year. They need to come up with compelling offers to use DPs for things other than MVC resorts. They need to make DP offers for cruises, villas, hotels and tours competitively priced using DPs. Right now, it can cost $3000+ to use DPs for non-MVC travel. I would rather save DPs for staying at the timeshares and not putting them to other uses unless the price in DPs is at least the same as paying direct.
     
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2019
  6. bazzap

    bazzap Tug Review Crew: Rookie TUG Member

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    I am not too familiar with the Vistana offering, do we believe that the level of investment and the likely resulting points allocation could result in a significant number of owners coming in at this level.
    I would be surprised if even the number of MVC owners at this level is more than just a percentage point or two?
     
  7. mjm1

    mjm1 TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    Marriott: Desert Springs Villas I, Ko Olina (EOY), Maui Ocean Club- Lahaina Villas, Newport Coast Villas, Destination Club Points;
    Westin Kierland Villas- Annual & EOY
    This is the first I have heard of raising Chairman to 25k points. A salesperson told us that they would create a new level above Chairman, which would start at 20k points. Of course, he was trying to get us to buy more points.

    With regard to the impact of enabling Vistana owners to enroll in a layover program, I can’t imagine that the percentage of Vistana owners at the 3*, 4*, and 5* elite levels is much different than MVC owners at Executive, Presidential, and Chairman levels. Assuming a similar level of enrollment of Vistana owners at each level the resulting combined percentage of owners at each MVC level shouldn’t change the overall percentages that much. IIRC MVC has said in the past that Chairman would always be the top 5% of owners.

    As we know, this is all speculation. Perhaps a year of waiting to see what they unveil.

    Best regards.

    Mike
     
    vacationtime1 and bazzap like this.
  8. DannyTS

    DannyTS TUG Member

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    Who knows what their data shows? I am sure there are many that own both Vistana and Marriot, maybe they think now it would be too easy for them to qualify for chairman. Let's not forget, these loyalty programs are designed to motivate people to buy more rather than trully to reward owners for their loyalty
     
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  9. davidvel

    davidvel TUG Member

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    Steven, what was your incentive?
     
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  10. taffy19

    taffy19 TUG Member

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    We did a Marriott update when we were there this spring. The salesman showed us this chart and I asked if I could take a picture of it. These are the official price increases since the beginning.

    [​IMG]
     
  11. taffy19

    taffy19 TUG Member

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    They offered us 250 points. This time it was my husband who wanted to listen to the spiel.
     
  12. StevenTing

    StevenTing TUG Member

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    My meeting incentive was 20k MRP or 250 Destination points. I took the MRP.
     
  13. csalter2

    csalter2 TUG Member

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    Boy, even nine years later $9.20 per point doesn’t seem like a deal.
     
  14. VacationForever

    VacationForever Tug Review Crew: Rookie TUG Member

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    I just came back from NCV. 35K MRPs, 600 DP or $250 Amex card. I picked 35K MRPs. The salesperson said she does not get commission as her full time job is an "educator", i.e. give classes. She said based on the notes from prior salespeople, she decided that I would learn nothing from salespeople but she wanted to try to convince me to buy up to Chairman's Club level. She also said that they are looking at a model where salespeople no longer works on commission and that they also want to get away from giving incentives to guests to attend the "owners' update" in the present format. Instead they are looking at holding these sales presentations in conference rooms.

    She had no information regarding possible integration across Vistana, Hyatt and MVC. However, she was certain that Chairman's Club benefits would be improved with higher points requirements and existing Chairman's Club owners would be grandfathered in. Since we were still in the amnesty period where you could enroll a resale week with purchase of 3000 points, she suggested that we purchase 3000 points with a closing of 6 months to 1 year out so that we could purchase a resale week and be enrolled as part of the deal.

    The most interesting part of the owners update was an "alpha" system which she showed me. MVC invested $50M into a new MVC application system and it was impressive. MVC staff are testing the platform. Essentially, it is a system that combines MVC and Marriott hotels all into one. You choose a destination and it will show you all accommodation options, which incorporates MVC and Marriott chain of hotels, with the associated MVC DC points required to book the stay. It also showed cruises and various points requirements on a calendar format.

    In the end I told her that we would be better off buying resale points if we decide to move to Chairman's Club since we really only needed 3000 more points to get us there. She was one unhappy camper when we told her that.
     
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2019
    frank808 and 1Kflyerguy like this.
  15. Sicnarf

    Sicnarf TUG Member

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    I just did one yesterday at Kauai Beach Club. They showed me how they can reduce the price to about $5.3 per point by bundling two 3000-points resales @$9k each and 4000 VCPs @$35k after discounts and other incentives (20%, 12k VCPs, $2k Marriott stay credit, $2k encore credit).
    I thought the price was pretty attractive but since Im am VSE 5* Elite already and don't really need more points, I passed. I want to wait and see what the acquisition will bring as I want to be at Chairman's level.
     
  16. chileaquiles

    chileaquiles TUG Member

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    Does sound like a good deal. What would have been the maintenance fees on that?

    Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
     
  17. csalter2

    csalter2 TUG Member

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    The problem with this deal in my opinion is the annual maintenance fees. That’s $5800 @ .58 per point. I don’t know why this is considered a HYBRID since it an all points sale. The only hybrid about it is that it’s a combination of RESALE points and developer points. The advantage of the hybrid DEVELOPER POINTS and a RESALE WEEK is that you could get a little lower maintenance fee per point based on the resale week you purchase. The higher the point value of the resale week, the lower the maintenance fee per point. The best hybrid deals seem to be those in which you can get two weeks. One developer week from Spain, Aruba or St. Kits or Asian Pacific and then one resale week. Weeks maintenance fees can be cheaper especially if you have two high Destination Club point value weeks. You can have maintenance fees under .40 per point depending on the number of points and maintenance fees. Just something to consider.
     
    tahoe likes this.
  18. StevenTing

    StevenTing TUG Member

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    You’d actually be at $7.10 per point. You still have the Initiation fee on this resale points which brings it up to $18k each. Not $9k each.
     
  19. csalter2

    csalter2 TUG Member

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    I have a question? Are the 3,000 point resales at 9K each to which you refer resale weeks that elect into 3000 DC points or are they just plain 3000 point resales? Please clarify.

    Thanks!
     
  20. Dean

    Dean TUG Member

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    Also look at the fees for the 2 resale weeks. You might be better off by bundling just resale weeks for non US options like Aruba, St. Kitts or Spain combined with a single better resale week and foregoing the Trust points altogether. Price up front likely similar but better weeks and likely much lower dues. Or possibly buying a resale week or 2 (or even more) and enrolling with a purchase later assuming the program comes around again as it has the last few years. You might be able to get where you want to be much cheaper and have much lower fees. The $$$ levels to enroll non qualified weeks buying weeks that work are much less, roughly 80%. So (a guesss) way you added a 3 BR Grand Chateau Platinum and bought a 2 BR Platinum Gardenview Aruba week, you'd be much better off. Lots of options when you start looking at it that way and you get to pick options/weeks that are more desirable for you.
     
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  21. dougp26364

    dougp26364 TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    Those would be two deed weeks, each enrolled and worth 3,000 points each. Chances are they would have MF’s in the neighborhood of $1,300 to $1,500, depending on what resort the deeds are located.
     
  22. csalter2

    csalter2 TUG Member

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    I wasn’t sure based upon what was written. Thanks! Hey, do you still own with Diamond?
     
  23. Sicnarf

    Sicnarf TUG Member

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    Resale weeks @ Ocean Pointe that elect into DC points. HOA is $1650.
     
  24. Dean

    Dean TUG Member

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    I personally would not do silver at OP unless I wanted to use the week(s) a large part of the time. One redeeming value about silver there is it's likely the only resort where silver makes sense to me mainly as a trading option. I don't know how many points you need to get to the next level but I do know there are likely better and/or cheaper ways to get there than this. See if you can't get a non US week and a resale week that's better and get it done with 2 weeks rather than 2 lower weeks plus the points. You should be able to cut your costs long term significantly and even if the up front cost were a little more or the same, you could be a LOT better off. You should likely talk to one of the locations that can do this without a points purchase. You can likely get your up front costs under $50K and your dues per point around 40¢ pp and end up with much better options. Maybe Carlito could remind us all the numbers of the various options he looked at for his purchase. IIRC it was Ocean point combined with ? St. Kitts at one point and ended up being a CA desert resort as the resale portion maybe Platinum? My recent purchase was more of a conversion of a number of existing weeks than where you are currently.

    Basically I'd look at how many points you need and where you might like to own to use as well as the dues and DC points received. Where do you like to go routinely (multiple weeks and or 2 or more locations) that you might use the week part of the time rather than take points or trade it?
     
  25. csalter2

    csalter2 TUG Member

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    Yes, as Dean stated I bought a week a two bedroom platinum at Aruba Surf Club for about $35,000 and a resale at Ocean Pointe which was for $18,000. I was looking to maximize my time and the points for the lowest maintenance fees possible. What appealed to me with those two properties was that they were lock off units, in platinum season in desirable locations which is great for trade power and to rent when you wanted, and maximum points election. I was able to get 9450 points. I looked at it from the standpoint from a points perspective, so if I were to buy resale points, I would have had to find a seller in the 2.50 range and then pay the $3.00 per point fee. I would have had to pay a higher maintenance fee for the points if I had just points. So with the maintenance fees for Aruba at $1870 and Ocean Pointe at $1735, the maintenance fee per point was .38 cents. That’s .20 per point LESS than Marriott’s Destination Club points maintenance fees per point. That is a HUGE SAVING. I have already been able to rent my lock off sides for a great price, as well as the Marriott Deposit into Interval International. I received 400,000 Bonvoy points with which some which I am going to use for my Australia trip. So in my first year, I will recover close to $10,00 of my upfront cost.

    In your situation, you have to buy two resales which means two maintenance fees for the units and another maintenance fee for the DC/VCP points which are at .58 per point.

    I would recommend to determine what you are willing to pay and then look for the maximum points you can get for properties that YOU like and meet the criteria you want. I was looking at quality of resort and ultimate flexibility. Marriott let me choose whatever I wanted. At first they tried to sell me a week at St. Kitts, then it was the typical bundle of points and St. Kitts. Then it was St. Kitts and another resale week but the points for the resale week could not exceed the point conversion of the St. Kitts week. Then it was St. Kitts and I could choose any resale week even if it was for more than the St. Kitts week. I selected Ocean Pointe as my resale week. It was very desirable and good for over 5000 points. I coupled that with Aruba because I did not like St. Kitts as it was in the hurricane zone and it seemed to be not as accessible to get to as Aruba and it was difficult to sell. So they brought the Aruba price down and we had a deal. My Aruba week elects to 4075 points. I would have bought a 3 bedroom but they did not have any at the time.

    My suggestion is to do whatever possible to keep your maintenance fees as low as possible because they will only go up. Also, get places that YOU will want to stay.
     

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