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New Wyndham timeshare owner within cancellation period - need some quick advice!

paxsarah

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Short term (upfront) costs: $6,666 (assuming you pay no closing or transfer costs)

Short term (upfront costs): $18,676

Another cost would be the return on the $12,000 you didn't spend upfront. I've tended to look at this only in the abstract if at all when looking at the break even analysis over time, until recently when we took some funds out of our investment account for a down payment on a new home, and I went back and looked at our investment returns since we first bought our resale points about 9 years ago. Obviously past performance is not an indicator of future returns, but over the nine-year period we averaged a 9% annual return and essentially doubled our account balance in that time. (This is a hands-off portfolio of several index funds with Vanguard, so nothing slick or unattainable.) Even if you assume a more modest 5% annual rate of return, it may take quite a while for the developer purchase to catch up, if ever.
 

Richelle

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Thanks everyone for your continued scenarios and advice! Learning a TON here!

At this point I think it best to provide some demographics info. DW and I are age 46 at present, three kids ages 23, 21, and 18. 23 year old daughter is done college and still living at home working full time to save money and figure out next steps for her life. 21 year old son is a rising senior in college heading into fall semester, living at home and working part time for funds and expenses. 18 year old son just graduated from high school and is taking a gap year to work full time and save money for pilot school next year while living at home.

So we are approaching empty nester stage over the next several years, hopefully by age 50. We live in the mid-Atlantic region and are within a few hours drive of NYC, D.C., and VA areas. We often take weekend getaways to the Poconos as one example.

We like the concept of TS because it promotes forced vacations on a regular schedule and will allow us a number of location options to choose from across the country since we do not yet know where our children will settle. Eventually grandkids will become a reality and we would like to be able to use our TS for extended family vacations. That is our vision, which is of course subject to change since we cannot ever predict what the future will hold.

Ideally we will have enough income in retirement to afford the MFs and be able to vacation frequently as a couple on a regular basis and at times with our adult children and grandchildren. Hope this helps provide some context to promote more specific advice!

We are looking at a 20-30 year horizon for these vacationing investments. I’m also not opposed to considering going Platinum or PR over time especially if doing so could actually allow us to help offset MF costs via renting points or weeks to others. It seems like some here are doing this already and I would like to learn more about how to do so if feasible.


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Always keep in mind that Wyndham can change the rules at anytime. The above scenerio is if nothing changes. Obviously MF always go up but I expect the low MF resorts to always remain the lower ones unless something changes. That’s the crux of it. Something always changes. I’m not saying don’t do it. I’m saying being prepared for the fact that things may change and assumptions may be thrown out the window. Maybe Wyndham decides to do away with the VIP program or changes the levels but doesn’t Grandfather anyone in this time. Maybe they decide to discontinue the PIC program. Who knows. Do what works for you now and expect that something will change. That way, you are less upset when it happens because you were expecting it.
 

HitchHiker71

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Another cost would be the return on the $12,000 you didn't spend upfront. I've tended to look at this only in the abstract if at all when looking at the break even analysis over time, until recently when we took some funds out of our investment account for a down payment on a new home, and I went back and looked at our investment returns since we first bought our resale points about 9 years ago. Obviously past performance is not an indicator of future returns, but over the nine-year period we averaged a 9% annual return and essentially doubled our account balance in that time. (This is a hands-off portfolio of several index funds with Vanguard, so nothing slick or unattainable.) Even if you assume a more modest 5% annual rate of return, it may take quite a while for the developer purchase to catch up, if ever.

There is always an opportunity cost for every transaction as you have indicated. I went to school for finance and securities analysis so I’m used to running my own spreadsheet analytics when making financial decisions. This is a big part of why I ended up deciding to rescind. I did not follow my own best practices on this purchase and ultimately didn’t feel comfortable following through as a result. DW very much wants to move forward with a TS deal, but understands we need to do so in an orderly fashion based upon solid due diligence over time. As long as we are making forward progress over the next few months I think she will be happy.


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Richelle

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There is always an opportunity cost for every transaction as you have indicated. I went to school for finance and securities analysis so I’m used to running my own spreadsheet analytics when making financial decisions. This is a big part of why I ended up deciding to rescind. I did not follow my own best practices on this purchase and ultimately didn’t feel comfortable following through as a result. DW very much wants to move forward with a TS deal, but understands we need to do so in an orderly fashion based upon solid due diligence over time. As long as we are making forward progress over the next few months I think she will be happy.


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your marriage sounds like mine. My husband is more methodical and while I do take some time to think, I don't always see as much as i should at first. It works out nicely because he keeps me reigned in, and i keep him from getting stuck. Seriously, he goes to taco bell twice a week, and he STILL takes five minutes to examine the menu to decide what he wants. I maybe go every couple of months, and I've made my choice within the first 30 seconds of being there. lol
 

HitchHiker71

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Always keep in mind that Wyndham can change the rules at anytime. The above scenerio is if nothing changes. Obviously MF always go up but I expect the low MF resorts to always remain the lower ones unless something changes. That’s the crux of it. Something always changes. I’m not saying don’t do it. I’m saying being prepared for the fact that things may change and assumptions may be thrown out the window. Maybe Wyndham decides to do away with the VIP program or changes the levels but doesn’t Grandfather anyone in this time. Maybe they decide to discontinue the PIC program. Who knows. Do what works for you now and expect that something will change. That way, you are less upset when it happens because you were expecting it.

Understood and agreed. There are no guarantees in life, and the contracts indicate the same. That said, I would be surprised if Wyndham simply did away with VIP programs altogether. I’m not sure of the subset of owners that are VIP status as a percentage of overall owners, but I would think this subset is among the most loyal and satisfied Wyndham owners.

Wyndham would be foolish to endanger such a large, loyal and influential subset of their owner base. Sure, anything is possible, but it’s unlikely the program itself would be disbanded at least in my view. Changes? Sure thing, probably all designed to get current owners to buy more developer points at the end of the day. I would imagine a fair amount of Wyndham revenue is sourced from developer point purchases after all.


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Cyrus24

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As long as we are making forward progress over the next few months I think she will be happy.
Happy Wife, Happy Life. Given all that you've learned so far, I'd go straight for Gold. 2 PIC's and ARP points, so many vacation possibilities!!! This said, I went resale (after a test run with Discovery) before going for Gold. Happy Analyzing!!!
 

HitchHiker71

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your marriage sounds like mine. My husband is more methodical and while I do take some time to think, I don't always see as much as i should at first. It works out nicely because he keeps me reigned in, and i keep him from getting stuck. Seriously, he goes to taco bell twice a week, and he STILL takes five minutes to examine the menu to decide what he wants. I maybe go every couple of months, and I've made my choice within the first 30 seconds of being there. lol

Yes that pretty much sums it up. I would add that I’m more introverted and am a future oriented thinker/planner sometimes prone to analysis paralysis (INTJ). DW is a bit more extroverted and is a present oriented feeler/empathic/fun type person sometimes prone to impulse purchases (ESFJ). Makes for a fun marriage sometimes! We do complement each other fairly well and strike a good balance overall at least when we are in alignment. When we aren’t in alignment...well that’s when the fun really starts!


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HitchHiker71

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Happy Wife, Happy Life. Given all that you've learned so far, I'd go straight for Gold. 2 PIC's and ARP points, so many vacation possibilities!!! This said, I went resale (after a test run with Discovery) before going for Gold. Happy Analyzing!!!

Discovery option, this is the second time I’ve heard about this item. Is this like a sampler package? We bought a sampler package from BG earlier this year and are already booked for a five day excursion at The Fountains in Orlando in Jan 2019.


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Cyrus24

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Discovery is a sampler Package, yes. Great option, no long term commitment. Discovery generally gives you some VIP benefits and a fair number of points. If you buy developer points while 'discovering', they credit you the cost of the Package. If you don't buy developer, you've still been able to enjoy Wyndham properties, offsetting some of that Discovery Package cost. No one has mentioned it, but, perhaps the Telesales people would sell you a Discovery Package. Something else to think about.
 

Richelle

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Discovery is a sampler Package, yes. Great option, no long term commitment. Discovery generally gives you some VIP benefits and a fair number of points. If you buy developer points while 'discovering', they credit you the cost of the Package. If you don't buy developer, you've still been able to enjoy Wyndham properties, offsetting some of that Discovery Package cost. No one has mentioned it, but, perhaps the Telesales people would sell you a Discovery Package. Something else to think about.


Correction: Telesales does not sell it. I agree Discovery is a great way to sample it and the money you spend on it, can go towards a retail purchase if you go that route. The no commitment part I think is the best part about it, because if someone finds out timesharing is not right for them, they can walk away without having to find a buyer and pay MF while waiting for the transfer to happen. There are only two drawbacks to it, that I can think of. One, you are limited to the resorts you can go to. Not all resorts are participating resorts, however, you do have a lot of options. Second, you don’t get to make your reservations online. You have to call. You can log into the website and see reservations you have made, but you cannot make them online. You also do not to experience the frustrations of not getting what you want, or the website crashing on you. Neither have happened often for me, because I plan far out and know a bit about computers. If it’s web maintenance, they usually tell you ahead of time. Usually.

I think I heard that you are required to sit through a meeting with a sales rep, but I’m not sure.

The package cost around $4k.
 
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Richelle

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Cyrus24

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I think I heard that you are required to sit through a meeting with a sales rep, but I’m not sure. I think if you used a telesales rep, you can do it over the phone, so a resort sales person isn’t patching their client.
I sat through a presentation back when I signed up for Discovery, that was a few years back. Telesales seems to be the easy way to go. No BS and it's all recorded. More options for HitchHiker71 to consider.
 

wjappraise

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I’m not sure of the subset of owners that are VIP status as a percentage of overall owners, but I would think this subset is among the most loyal and satisfied Wyndham owners.

Wyndham would be foolish to endanger such a large, loyal and influential subset of their owner base.

I agree with your assertion that VIP programs will not likely be disbanded.

However, from my perspective Wyndham does not treat its VIP owners with much more than open contempt. Two years, well over 100 Platinum VIP owners had their accounts suspended due to ineptitude from the Wyndham IT department. Several owners had bloated points balances and as a result, everyone with an amount over the contract balances was suspended. Some had valid reasons for such bloated accounts, others did not. Mine was bloated for a combination of reasons, and I had reported this to Wyndham no less than three times. The suspension lasted some nine months, and never really was completely resolved, although some owners were paid to surrender their contracts. The incredible lack of common courtesy or regular communication/updates was appalling.

Then, in May of 2017, the new website and new rules of engagement were enacted. The rules were designed to minimize the VIP features that had become de facto rights of ownership, as claimed by salesman in their pitches. I do not begrudge Wyndham from adjusting its rules to better fit the intent of the VIP benefits vs. the actual benefits used (such as cancel, rebook, upgrade). However, I do begrudge Wyndham for rolling out a clearly deficient website that is still rife with problems and glitches 14 months after its inauguration. I also begrudge Wyndham for its clear intention to move Extra Holidays into the position to siphon off prime reservations even before the ten month time frame (see Clearwater beach listing on EH).

While there was clearly a need to better manage the "wild west" that the old reservation system had become, certainly there could have been a better way than foist the piece of crap website on us without proper beta testing.

From my vantage point, Wyndham does a fantastic job of analyzing the needs and desires of potential buyers, and seeking to fill those needs and desires, even if facts are bruised along the way. Once the purchase is made, however, the concerns for the existing owner are relegated to a very low priority. Wyndham would be better served to treat its existing owners as potential buyers. . . .

Just one man's opinion.
 

skotrla

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There is always an opportunity cost for every transaction as you have indicated. I went to school for finance and securities analysis so I’m used to running my own spreadsheet analytics when making financial decisions. This is a big part of why I ended up deciding to rescind. I did not follow my own best practices on this purchase and ultimately didn’t feel comfortable following through as a result. DW very much wants to move forward with a TS deal, but understands we need to do so in an orderly fashion based upon solid due diligence over time. As long as we are making forward progress over the next few months I think she will be happy.


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Here's a spreadsheet I put together last week on resale vs. PIC.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1_4coq6UCfqPVyE1A3bOA9zRSgQEi-I1m

-Scott
 

Braindead

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Lets examine first option. Both are not bad, but just wanted to throw in yet a few more points to consider. If we compare apples to apples, we have to assume you are getting equal amount of points on either ebay or retail. So two PICs plus minimum purchase is 606,000 points. We are going to assume national harbor since the rate is low. A 1.29 million point contract went for $10k. So approximately $11 per 1,000 points give or take. So a 606,000 point contract would run you about $6,666, and you do not get VIP. Maintenance fees would be $2,860 a year of $238.36 a month based on the current $4.72 per 1k points.

Short term (upfront) costs: $6,666 (assuming you pay no closing or transfer costs)
Long term costs: $2,860 per year in maintenance fees (not including future years increases)

10 year cost (not including MF increases): $35,266


Second option:


98,000 point National Harbor contract that retails at $190 per 1k points. That would cost you $18,620 retail. Maintenance fees $462.56 per year or 38.54 per month based on a rate of $4.72 per 1,000 points.

Then lets say you do, what i did, but twice. Buy (2) three bedrooms for $28 each. Total $56. Maintenance fees for both, plus the Wyndham program fee $1,992 a year or $166 a month for 508,000 points. If you want to compare apples to apples on maintenance fees, the maintenance fee rate for those 508,000 pic points is $3.92 per 1k points.

Short term (upfront costs): $18,676
Long term costs: 2,454.56 (not including maintenance increases)

10 year cost: $39,346

Not a huge price difference in the long term. We are not accounting for the VIP benefits of Silver. Some say Silver is worthless, others say VIP in general is worthless. Only you can put a dollar amount on the VIP benefits. Will you actually use them and will it be worth the extra $4k? At the 20 year mark, the cost of resale becomes more then retail so:

Resale 20 year cost: $57,200
Retail 20 year cost: $49,091

If you have your time share for 20 years, the $4k difference goes away and you actually save money by going retail IF you do PIC. If you go straight points, resale is always cheaper.

As Brainddead said, if you are elderly, never buy from Wyndham. It will be harder for you to get 20 years, then someone who is in their 30's and 40's
You can enroll the picks with a CWA purchase also. I personally would do that because of the difference in Wyndham pricing. It also opens up ARP at a lot of resorts if you ever happen to need it in the future. I would still buy CWA on Wyndham purchases and add the low MFs with the PICs and resale purchases if you want more points after you reach the VIP level your trying to obtain
 

Richelle

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Here's a spreadsheet I put together last week on resale vs. PIC.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1_4coq6UCfqPVyE1A3bOA9zRSgQEi-I1m

-Scott

Couple Questions:

1. What resort are you using for MF comparison? Those don't look like the MF for CWA points which is 5.77 per 1k.
2. Why does the resale side have 637k points and the other only 557k? I'm sure there is a good reason, i just don't know what it is.
3. Why is there no guest fees on the retail side? Non-VIP gets two per year. Silver gets 5. What assumptions are made here? If you are accounting for the extra three GC fees Silver has, then that would be $295-$387 depending on where you get them. If you are doing an average of the two (129+99)/2= 114. The extra three would be $336. I am not sure sure where you are getting you $396 number.

Also, new info came about after my original post.

1. Price increased for minimum package to $12,900. That's before negotiations, so you'll likely get it for less, but it should be noted so no one gets sticker shock. That's CWA pricing. There may be a contract with higher MF or at a less popular resort that is cheaper. For a small package, the higher MF will not matter, but i wouldn't go with a resort that is not popular. If Ovations will not take it back, you will have to find a buyer for that contract and you'll likely have to give it away and pay all fees. CWA might be worth the extra money simply because you can give it back. You would probably lose money trying to sell a package that small.

2. Turns out it is 49,000 per PIC week. The telesales rep I have was misinformed. So two PICs would require a 98k purchase. Last I heard, a 105k CWA package was going for around $16k before negotiations. This will undoubtedly change your numbers, but you still make out good in the long run.
 

Richelle

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You can enroll the picks with a CWA purchase also. I personally would do that because of the difference in Wyndham pricing. It also opens up ARP at a lot of resorts if you ever happen to need it in the future. I would still buy CWA on Wyndham purchases and add the low MFs with the PICs and resale purchases if you want more points after you reach the VIP level your trying to obtain


Rewrote for CWA. 10 yesr price difference goes from $4,000 to $1,800.

Based on 606,000 (two PICS and minimum retail purchase)

A 511,000 CWA contract went for $2,495 on ebay yesterday, so based on that, the retail rate is $4.88 per $1k resale.

Short term (upfront) costs: $2957.28 (assuming you pay no closing or transfer costs)
Long term costs: $3496.62 per year in maintenance fees based on $5.77 per 1k (not including future years increases)

10 year cost (not including MF increases): $37,923.48


Second option:


98,000 point CWA contract that retails at $145 per 1k points. That would cost you $14,210 retail. Maintenance fees $565.46 per year or 47.12 per month based on a rate of $5.77 per 1,000 points.

Then lets say you do, what i did, but twice. Buy (2) three bedrooms for $28 each. Total $56. Maintenance fees for both, plus the Wyndham program fee $1,992 a year or $166 a month for 508,000 points. If you want to compare apples to apples on maintenance fees, the maintenance fee rate for those 508,000 pic points is $3.92 per 1k points.

Short term (upfront costs): $14,210
Long term costs: $2,557.46 (not including maintenance increases)

10 year cost: $39,784

Not a huge price difference in the long term. We are not accounting for the VIP benefits of Silver. Some say Silver is worthless, others say VIP in general is worthless. Only you can put a dollar amount on the VIP benefits. Will you actually use them, and will it be worth the extra $1,800? At the 20 year mark, the cost of resale becomes more then retail so:

Resale 20 year cost: $72,889.68
Retail 20 year cost: $65,359.20

If you have your time share for 20 years, the $1,800 difference goes away and you actually save money by going retail IF you do PIC. If you go straight points, resale is always cheaper.

As Brainddead said, if you are elderly, never buy from Wyndham. It will be harder for you to get 20 years, then someone who is in their 30's and 40's
 

Richelle

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I agree with your assertion that VIP programs will not likely be disbanded.

However, from my perspective Wyndham does not treat its VIP owners with much more than open contempt. Two years, well over 100 Platinum VIP owners had their accounts suspended due to ineptitude from the Wyndham IT department. Several owners had bloated points balances and as a result, everyone with an amount over the contract balances was suspended. Some had valid reasons for such bloated accounts, others did not. Mine was bloated for a combination of reasons, and I had reported this to Wyndham no less than three times. The suspension lasted some nine months, and never really was completely resolved, although some owners were paid to surrender their contracts. The incredible lack of common courtesy or regular communication/updates was appalling.

Then, in May of 2017, the new website and new rules of engagement were enacted. The rules were designed to minimize the VIP features that had become de facto rights of ownership, as claimed by salesman in their pitches. I do not begrudge Wyndham from adjusting its rules to better fit the intent of the VIP benefits vs. the actual benefits used (such as cancel, rebook, upgrade). However, I do begrudge Wyndham for rolling out a clearly deficient website that is still rife with problems and glitches 14 months after its inauguration. I also begrudge Wyndham for its clear intention to move Extra Holidays into the position to siphon off prime reservations even before the ten month time frame (see Clearwater beach listing on EH).

While there was clearly a need to better manage the "wild west" that the old reservation system had become, certainly there could have been a better way than foist the piece of crap website on us without proper beta testing.

From my vantage point, Wyndham does a fantastic job of analyzing the needs and desires of potential buyers, and seeking to fill those needs and desires, even if facts are bruised along the way. Once the purchase is made, however, the concerns for the existing owner are relegated to a very low priority. Wyndham would be better served to treat its existing owners as potential buyers. . . .

Just one man's opinion.


That account freeze was totally ludicrous. I do not know of any company that would have handled that issue so poorly. I understand mega renters were causing all kinds of problems, and undoubtedly are the reason behind some of the changes, but there were plenty of non-mega renters who go caught up in that net. It was like they did a mass freeze at the same time. Ideally, you handle a subset of accounts at a time. Not all at once. I get it could have been affecting their bottom line, but so does screwing over (as you said) some of their most loyal and satisfied. I couldn't believe how long that lasted. Part of me thinks it had a lot of to with lack of training and personnel to handle the audits. Then they had the constant discussions among leadership on how to handle a particular scenario as it came up. I think it was poorly planned and implemented.

I am hoping some heads rolled over that website. At my company, the definitely would have. There are a lot of checks and balances at my company that keep things like that from happening. If they are not already looking into it, they should look into DevOps as well as replacing whoever gave the finally OK for the site to roll out, or at least who told that person it was OK to roll out.

How do we know that they are siphoning off prime reservations of timeshare inventory that is owned by owners and not inventory owned by Wyndham themselves? Just curious as to if you have any insight on that.


I think if they keep taking away benefits and advantages of VIP, it's going to be a lot harder to sell. Sure, the sales guys can lie about it, but they can only go so far. The publications they hand out list the benefits. If the sales guys say they get free upgrades, but it's not listed in the hand out, that will be spotted a lot easier then some fine print. If there is no VIP program, they are going to have to replace it with something, otherwise the big purchasers are going to go with a timeshare system that has a VIP program or better benefits. Lets hope they come up with something to make the VIP people happy. Maybe allow two discounted reservations at the 10 month window, in addition to the unlimited discounts in the express window. If I could get an automatic 50% off a reservation at 10 months, i may seriously consider going Platinum.
 

HitchHiker71

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Rewrote for CWA. 10 yesr price difference goes from $4,000 to $1,800.

Based on 606,000 (two PICS and minimum retail purchase)

A 511,000 CWA contract went for $2,495 on ebay yesterday, so based on that, the retail rate is $4.88 per $1k resale.

Short term (upfront) costs: $2957.28 (assuming you pay no closing or transfer costs)
Long term costs: $3496.62 per year in maintenance fees based on $5.77 per 1k (not including future years increases)

10 year cost (not including MF increases): $37,923.48


Second option:


98,000 point CWA contract that retails at $145 per 1k points. That would cost you $14,210 retail. Maintenance fees $565.46 per year or 47.12 per month based on a rate of $5.77 per 1,000 points.

Then lets say you do, what i did, but twice. Buy (2) three bedrooms for $28 each. Total $56. Maintenance fees for both, plus the Wyndham program fee $1,992 a year or $166 a month for 508,000 points. If you want to compare apples to apples on maintenance fees, the maintenance fee rate for those 508,000 pic points is $3.92 per 1k points.

Short term (upfront costs): $14,210
Long term costs: $2,557.46 (not including maintenance increases)

10 year cost: $39,784

Not a huge price difference in the long term. We are not accounting for the VIP benefits of Silver. Some say Silver is worthless, others say VIP in general is worthless. Only you can put a dollar amount on the VIP benefits. Will you actually use them, and will it be worth the extra $1,800? At the 20 year mark, the cost of resale becomes more then retail so:

Resale 20 year cost: $72,889.68
Retail 20 year cost: $65,359.20

If you have your time share for 20 years, the $1,800 difference goes away and you actually save money by going retail IF you do PIC. If you go straight points, resale is always cheaper.

As Brainddead said, if you are elderly, never buy from Wyndham. It will be harder for you to get 20 years, then someone who is in their 30's and 40's

Can you re-run with 700k points total instead of 606k? Assume a 192k point purchase and 508k PIC property points for VIP Gold. I will be creating a spreadsheet myself over this coming weekend as well. Tuggers are awesome!


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bendadin

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Did you reach out to that seller on here who has one of your PICs that you need? She told me that she still has it
 

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Can you re-run with 700k points total instead of 606k? Assume a 192k point purchase and 508k PIC property points for VIP Gold. I will be creating a spreadsheet myself over this coming weekend as well. Tuggers are awesome!
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Here's a spreadsheet I put together last week on resale vs. PIC.

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1_4coq6UCfqPVyE1A3bOA9zRSgQEi-I1m

-Scott

You can download the Spreadsheet to Google Sheets and edit it for the numbers you want to use. It is set to AutoCalculate. Downloading will save a lot of time.
 

Richelle

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You can download the Spreadsheet to Google Sheets and edit it for the numbers you want to use. It is set to AutoCalculate. Downloading will save a lot of time.

Did you see my questions for your spreadsheet?
 

Cyrus24

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Did you see my questions for your spreadsheet?
Not my spreadsheet. I just downloaded it and made some adjustments on my own. The questions you had asked were valid and those were the types of adjustments needed to be made.
 

HitchHiker71

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You can download the Spreadsheet to Google Sheets and edit it for the numbers you want to use. It is set to AutoCalculate. Downloading will save a lot of time.

Yep that’s on the agenda for this weekend.


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Richelle

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Can you re-run with 700k points total instead of 606k? Assume a 192k point purchase and 508k PIC property points for VIP Gold. I will be creating a spreadsheet myself over this coming weekend as well. Tuggers are awesome!


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I wasn't sure about the spreadsheet, so i went ahead and rewrote what i had. In this case, Resale wins...I just thought of something else. Resales prices for CWA and some other contracts will likely start to creep up, because Ovations is taking CWA back, and people are using it as a quick out. Why pay six months of maintenance fees while waiting for the transfer, when you can give it back and be done with it in less then two months? In some cases you get three years worth of points as well. This will likely lower the amount of CWA contracts available in the resale market. The demand for CWA will out weigh supply, and prices will increase. How much, no one knows. The same can be said for retail prices going up. If people are having a hard time getting them on the secondary market, Wyndham can start increasing their prices as well. So these prices could change and completely change the outcome, or it could remain the same.

Rewrote for 700,000 CWA. 10 year price difference is $15,032 in Resale's favor

Based on 700,000 (two PICS and 192,000 points)

A 511,000 CWA contract went for $2,495 on ebay yesterday, so based on that, the retail rate is $4.88 per $1k resale.

Short term (upfront) costs: $3,416 (assuming you pay no closing or transfer costs)
Long term costs: $4039 per year in maintenance fees based on $5.77 per 1k (not including future years increases)

10 year cost (not including MF increases): $43,806


Second option:


192,000 point CWA contract that retails at $145 per 1k points. That would cost you $27,840 retail. Maintenance fees $1,107.84 per year or 92.32 per month based on a rate of $5.77 per 1,000 points.

Then lets say you do, what i did, but twice. Buy (2) three bedrooms for $28 each. Total $56. Maintenance fees for both, plus the Wyndham program fee $1,992 a year or $166 a month for 508,000 points. If you want to compare apples to apples on maintenance fees, the maintenance fee rate for those 508,000 pic points is $3.92 per 1k points.

Short term (upfront costs): $27,840
Long term costs: $3,099.84 (not including maintenance increases)

10 year cost: $58,838

Not a huge price difference in the long term. We are not accounting for the VIP benefits of Silver. Some say Silver is worthless, others say VIP in general is worthless. Only you can put a dollar amount on the VIP benefits. Will you actually use them, and will it be worth the extra $1,800? At the 20 year mark, the cost of resale becomes more then retail so:

Resale 20 year cost: $84,196
Retail 20 year cost: $89,836

If you have your time share for 20 years, the $5,640 difference in resale's favor IF you do PIC. In this scenario resale is cheaper, but again does not account for the added benefits of 35% discount, upgrades (before silver), unlimited reservation transactions, unlimited housekeeping credits (all VIP), extra guest confirmations, as well as the benefits that only hold perceived value:

ability to reserve specific rooms
extended time to deposit points to future years
RARP advantage
Maragritaville
Complimentry Perks by Wyndham
Ability to ARP more times a year
RCI Instant Search and Book Feature
Worldwide External Exchange Deposit Unit Size Upgrades
Early checkin
mid-week clean and tidy
dedicated phone line
dedicated check-in line
Annual cruise
 
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