New Wyndham timeshare owner within cancellation period - need some quick advice!

[Braindead]

There’s always the buy resale and pay the fee (it was stated in another thread that it was $2395 or $2495, can’t remember) to PIC a week. It all depends on if you feel VIP benefits are worth it? I’m personally looking for a small annual contract to bridge what I can’t get in RCI already.

I don’t think that paying the fee to enroll a PIC Plus is an available option.
The only option that has been confirmed for enrolling in PIC Plus is you have to buy points from Wyndham directly when enrolling your week in the program.

 

[harveyhaddixfan]

I don’t think that paying the fee to enroll a PIC Plus is an available option.
The only option that has been confirmed for enrolling in PIC Plus is you have to buy points from Wyndham directly when enrolling your week in the program.

From page 293 of the new 2018-19 directory:

Eligibility Requirements: Membership in the PIC Plus Program is available with a new vacation ownership purchase from Wyndham Vacation Resorts or to CLUB WYNDHAM Plus Members who pay the PIC Plus Membership Enrollment Fee. In order to be eligible, non-Wyndham week(s) must be: (1) affiliated with RCI and (2) not currently participating in a points-based program, including RCI Points. Members will be responsible for maintenance fees on their non- Wyndham week(s).

 

[HitchHiker71]

HitchHiker71 please rescind this deal. You should wait until you have the weeks you want to PIC at least under contract. You aren't getting any special deal that won't be offered to you again. So many of us have made subsequent developer purchases to fix something that wasn't done correctly. I can clearly see that is where you are headed.

I think I can speak for pretty much everyone here on TUG. You won't ever be sorry if you rescind, get your PIC weeks purchased and then go back and make a deal. You may even by that time have decided that it is in your best interest to purchase a larger point package than the one you are looking at now.

Thanks Jan, I am leaning in that direction and already have the rescind letter drafted just to be clear, but in the interim since it’s Sunday and I cannot send the certified mail today figured I would try and get some additional advice using certain assumptions.

My ideal at this point is to rescind, find my two PIC TS deals, and then go back and obtain 192k developer points along with the PIC deals at the same time.


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[Braindead]

From page 293 of the new 2018-19 directory:

Eligibility Requirements: Membership in the PIC Plus Program is available with a new vacation ownership purchase from Wyndham Vacation Resorts or to CLUB WYNDHAM Plus Members who pay the PIC Plus Membership Enrollment Fee. In order to be eligible, non-Wyndham week(s) must be: (1) affiliated with RCI and (2) not currently participating in a points-based program, including RCI Points. Members will be responsible for maintenance fees on their non- Wyndham week(s).

I know what the directory states but no one lately has been told that’s even an option when they ask.
By all reports you have to make a points purchase to enroll a week in the PIC Plus program

 

[Braindead]

My ideal at this point is to rescind, find my two PIC TS deals, and then go back and obtain 192k developer points along with the PIC deals at the same time.

You need to confirm that your PIC weeks can be resale before buying.
Someone claimed in another thread that you can no longer use weeks bought resale for the PIC Program
There’s been a lot of attention here lately on the PIC program.
It seems Wyndham has been responding to a lot of topics here lately and if they did indeed make the policy change to NOT allow resale weeks to be used in the PIC program wouldn’t surprise me.
Do your homework and get confirmation from Wyndham via email before buying weeks in anticipation of them being eligible for the PIC Plus program

 

[HitchHiker71]

You need to confirm that your PIC weeks can be resale before buying.
Someone claimed in another thread that you can no longer use weeks bought resale for the PIC Program
There’s been a lot of attention here lately on the PIC program.
It seems Wyndham has been responding to a lot of topics here lately and if they did indeed make the policy change to NOT allow resale weeks to be used in the PIC program wouldn’t surprise me.
Do your homework and get confirmation from Wyndham via email before buying weeks in anticipation of them being eligible for the PIC Plus program

BD I agree 100%. My salesman has offered to personally check each PIC TS before I pursue any purchase to determine eligibility. Any other recommendations on how to specifically validate PIC eligibility? Get it in writing as usual is the number one rule of course.


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[paxsarah]

You need to confirm that your PIC weeks can be resale before buying.
Someone claimed in another thread that you can no longer use weeks bought resale for the PIC Program

I think that person on the other thread either misspoke or doesn't know what they're talking about. They have 8 posts here. I don't even know how Wyndham would know how someone purchased the non-Wyndham week they're using for PIC.

 

[Braindead]

BD I agree 100%. My salesman has offered to personally check each PIC TS before I pursue any purchase to determine eligibility. Any other recommendations on how to specifically validate PIC eligibility? Get it in writing as usual is the number one rule of course.

No other recommendations for you on validating the week is eligible. Wyndham determines the eligibility thats the only answer you need.
Recommendations for what you buy for a PIC week:
3bdr
Jan M mentioned a couple of resorts.
The best PIC week would be a week you would want for yourself and you might end up using that week some years instead of exchanging it for Wyndham points.
Pay attention to MFs. 3bdr gets 254k points at $5.00 per 1k MFs is $1,270.00. Keep MFs around $1,100 a year on your PIC week add the PIC program fee you’ll be a little under $5.00 per 1k point MF which is very good. You will find PIC weeks with lower MFs just make sure it’s a week you wouldn’t mind owning. If you look at previous PIC threads a poster posted a link to an eBay ad of 3bdrs with $700.00 annual MFs but I have no knowledge on the resort.

 

[tschwa2]

I think that person on the other thread either misspoke or doesn't know what they're talking about. They have 8 posts here. I don't even know how Wyndham would know how someone purchased the non-Wyndham week they're using for PIC.

I agree. I don't doubt a salesperson said something to this effect because the point of the PIC program wasn't for someone to buy cheap 3 br properties with low MF's as a pathway to VIP for a lot less (just a program that savvy potential owners can exploit), it was developed as a way to overcome the objection to buying that the buyer already owned a non Wyndham property and didn't want to be paying MF for multiple systems. This way already owning was a way to jump start the wyndham ownership since theoretically that buyer already paid a lot of money to buy the timeshares he/she already owned. The program doesn't have any provisions to allow or deny access based on how the potential wyndham buyer purchased the other timeshare or how much money was actually spent.

 

[Cyrus24]

The best PIC week would be a week you would want for yourself and you might end up using that week some years instead of exchanging it for Wyndham points.

I would add that HitchHiker71 may want to purchase a week in a high season for more trading power in the RCI weeks system. You do not have to PIC each resort each year, so more trading power is something to consider.

 

[Richelle]

My four bedroom was $28 on eBay. The maintenance fees are $849 (there are cheaper ones out there). I added it with a direct purchase and I get 254,000 VIP eligible points. I did this one month ago. There is no PIC enrollment fee with a new purchase. I could enroll it before it even finished transfering to me. It’s on there now. There is an exchange fee of $89. The points are symbolic unless you pay the $89 fee to convert them into points. In other words, for them to count towards VIP, it doesn’t cost you anything. If you want to use those points to make a reservation, there is an $89 for each week, every year you do it. With PIC, you do not have to pay the fee unless you want the points. You do not have to pay a fee for them to count towards VIP. You do have a Wyndham program fee you have pay on them every year which is the same fee you pay for your points. 58 cents for every 1,000 points. That’s regardless of if you covert them or not. Some people chose to use their fixed week, rather then exchange it. You can do either. I would rescind and research. Message me if you want a one on one conversation. Rescind though if you have not already. You can get Silver with PIC for fairly cheap and still get bonus points.

 

[Richelle]

No other recommendations for you on validating the week is eligible. Wyndham determines the eligibility thats the only answer you need.
Recommendations for what you buy for a PIC week:
3bdr
Jan M mentioned a couple of resorts.
The best PIC week would be a week you would want for yourself and you might end up using that week some years instead of exchanging it for Wyndham points.
Pay attention to MFs. 3bdr gets 254k points at $5.00 per 1k MFs is $1,270.00. Keep MFs around $1,100 a year on your PIC week add the PIC program fee you’ll be a little under $5.00 per 1k point MF which is very good. You will find PIC weeks with lower MFs just make sure it’s a week you wouldn’t mind owning. If you look at previous PIC threads a poster posted a link to an eBay ad of 3bdrs with $700.00 annual MFs but I have no knowledge on the resort.

I just want to add, it would be best to chose a gold crown resort, especially if it’s a location you’d want to travel to. No one wants to own a dump.

 

[tschwa2]

I just want to add, it would be best to chose a gold crown resort, especially if it’s a location you’d want to travel to. No one wants to own a dump.

and a dump with MF's that are too low to adequately maintain the property is more likely to either have a future Special assessment for refurbs and delayed maintenance or risk losing RCI affiliation. If a resort loses RCI affiliation the PIC contract is void.

 

[HitchHiker71]

My four bedroom was $28 on eBay. The maintenance fees are $849 (there are cheaper ones out there). I added it with a direct purchase and I get 254,000 VIP eligible points. I did this one month ago. There is no PIC enrollment fee with a new purchase. I could enroll it before it even finished transfering to me. It’s on there now. There is an exchange fee of $89. The points are symbolic unless you pay the $89 fee to convert them into points. In other words, for them to count towards VIP, it doesn’t cost you anything. If you want to use those points to make a reservation, there is an $89 for each week, every year you do it. With PIC, you do not have to pay the fee unless you want the points. You do not have to pay a fee for them to count towards VIP. You do have a Wyndham program fee you have pay on them every year which is the same fee you pay for your points. 58 cents for every 1,000 points. That’s regardless of if you covert them or not. Some people chose to use their fixed week, rather then exchange it. You can do either. I would rescind and research. Message me if you want a one on one conversation. Rescind though if you have not already. You can get Silver with PIC for fairly cheap and still get bonus points.

What direct developer purchase did you make along with your PIC? How many points and what was your dollar/1000 points price paid? Feel free to PM me if you would rather not share details like this on the public forums. Thanks so much for posting this info!


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[Richelle]

What direct developer purchase did you make along with your PIC? How many points and what was your dollar/1000 points price paid? Feel free to PM me if you would rather not share details like this on the public forums. Thanks so much for posting this info!


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I replied to your PM. I bought National Harbor points which have less of a discount then CWA. If you are looking for cheap, go with CWA. The telesales May have a contract that they are looking to unload that will be cheaper. Those are usually higher MF resorts so be careful.


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[Jan M.]

I replied to your PM. I bought National Harbor points which have less of a discount then CWA. If you are looking for cheap, go with CWA. The telesales May have a contract that they are looking to unload that will be cheaper. Those are usually higher MF resorts so be careful.


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As I, Ron and OP have pointed out it is important to look at the maintenance fees vs the purchase price. Some people like CWA for the booking window they get for the inventory that is in CWA, some people say they are able to get the reservations they want with no problems with the CWS deeded points at resorts that have lower maintenance fees and some people have a mix of both that they feel covers all the bases for their needs.

If you own a say million points or more in CWA or at high maintenance fee resort then the higher maintenance fees really add up and quickly. If you own say 300,000 or less points and got a cheap, cheap deal then it would likely take so many years for the higher maintenance fees to add up that it wouldn't be a big factor. My rule of thumb is that if a higher purchase price to get lower maintenance fees can be recovered in 5 years or less in what you will save over that time period on the lower maintenance fees then it is the better deal and a no brainer for anyone. If there were other factors to be considered, like ARP at a resort that I would want every year at a peak time, then even 6 or 7 years could be something I would have to think long and hard to decide if it was worth it to me. Depending on the person's age, how many points they own, their experience with timeshares, Wyndham in particular, some people are even comfortable with up to 10 years to recover the additional money spent to have lower maintenance fees. To me it boils down to having the knowledge you need to be an informed buyer and make the best choice for you.

My other rule of thumb is that it is better to have larger point deeds or contracts. The program fees are lower. It never seems to take long before you discover you will want and need more points if you buy a smaller point deed or contract. And imo more people want the larger point deeds and contracts making it easier to get rid of them down the road. You will see a number of people posting about re-doing their portfolios of what they own. They are often getting rid of the smaller point or higher maintenance fee deeds or contracts. This can be an excellent opportunity for another newbie like they once were to pick up something for very little money, gain experience with how the system works and what their needs will be.

Always remember that Wyndham is constantly getting more inventory. If you want a larger point deed or contract or a deed at a resort with maintenance fees under a certain amount, keep calling. Ask your contact person to call or email you if they see what you are looking for. Make sure you are prepared to move on the right deal immediately when they contact you and let your contact person know that you will do just that.

 

[HitchHiker71]

I replied to your PM. I bought National Harbor points which have less of a discount then CWA. If you are looking for cheap, go with CWA. The telesales May have a contract that they are looking to unload that will be cheaper. Those are usually higher MF resorts so be careful.


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Got it. Why did you choose National Harbor? I’ve attended several conferences there over the years and we are looking to stay at the Wyndham resort there as one of our first bookings once we become owners post rescind.

I’ve got the letter printed out along with a copy of the 1st and last page of the contract and will be going to the post office today to send via certified priority mail!


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[Braindead]

As I, Ron and OP have pointed out it is important to look at the maintenance fees vs the purchase price. Some people like CWA for the booking window they get for the inventory that is in CWA, some people say they are able to get the reservations they want with no problems with the CWS deeded points at resorts that have lower maintenance fees and some people have a mix of both that they feel covers all the bases for their needs.

If you own a say million points or more in CWA or at high maintenance fee resort then the higher maintenance fees really add up and quickly. If you own say 300,000 or less points and got a cheap, cheap deal then it would likely take so many years for the higher maintenance fees to add up that it wouldn't be a big factor. My rule of thumb is that if a higher purchase price to get lower maintenance fees can be recovered in 5 years or less in what you will save over that time period on the lower maintenance fees then it is the better deal and a no brainer for anyone. If there were other factors to be considered, like ARP at a resort that I would want every year at a peak time, then even 6 or 7 years could be something I would have to think long and hard to decide if it was worth it to me. Depending on the person's age, how many points they own, their experience with timeshares, Wyndham in particular, some people are even comfortable with up to 10 years to recover the additional money spent to have lower maintenance fees. To me it boils down to having the knowledge you need to be an informed buyer and make the best choice for you.

My other rule of thumb is that it is better to have larger point deeds or contracts. The program fees are lower. It never seems to take long before you discover you will want and need more points if you buy a smaller point deed or contract. And imo more people want the larger point deeds and contracts making it easier to get rid of them down the road. You will see a number of people posting about re-doing their portfolios of what they own. They are often getting rid of the smaller point or higher maintenance fee deeds or contracts. This can be an excellent opportunity for another newbie like they once were to pick up something for very little money, gain experience with how the system works and what their needs will be.

Always remember that Wyndham is constantly getting more inventory. If you want a larger point deed or contract or a deed at a resort with maintenance fees under a certain amount, keep calling. Ask your contact person to call or email you if they see what you are looking for. Make sure you are prepared to move on the right deal immediately when they contact you and let your contact person know that you will do just that.

Got it. Why did you choose National Harbor? I’ve attended several conferences there over the years and we are looking to stay at the Wyndham resort there as one of our first bookings once we become owners post rescind.

I’ve got the letter printed out along with a copy of the 1st and last page of the contract and will be going to the post office today to send via certified priority mail!


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I’m going to chime in here. Jan M makes an excellent point on upfront purchase price versus MF cost.

MFs on a low MF resale contracts will usually pay for themselves in 5 years or less:
If you buy a low MF contract for $10.00 per 1k points that has yearly MFs $2.00 less per 1k points than a free contract.
That purchase paid for itself in 5 years and will be more valuable and easier to dispose of if you want out someday.

On a direct purchase from Wyndham:
Buy a CWA contract for $145 per 1k points.
Buy a National Harbor or other low MF contract for $200 per 1k points
Now your break even is over 25 years and that’s even figuring 0% interest on your $

My recommendation is if your going to buy from Wyndham buy CWA
If your buying resale buy low MF. Unless you just have to have ARP at a certain resort.

 

[HitchHiker71]

Ok just finished up at the post office sending certified mail with return receipt requested post marked today. The letter will be delivered to the physical address listed in the contract on Thursday of this week. Would have been Wednesday except for the July 4 holiday. Will keep you all posted on status of rescind!


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[HitchHiker71]

I’m going to chime in here. Jan M makes an excellent point on upfront purchase price versus MF cost.

MFs on a low MF resale contracts will usually pay for themselves in 5 years or less:
If you buy a low MF contract for $10.00 per 1k points that has yearly MFs $2.00 less per 1k points than a free contract.
That purchase paid for itself in 5 years and will be more valuable and easier to dispose of if you want out someday.

On a direct purchase from Wyndham:
Buy a CWA contract for $145 per 1k points.
Buy a National Harbor or other low MF contract for $200 per 1k points
Now your break even is over 25 years and that’s even figuring 0% interest on your $

My recommendation is if your going to buy from Wyndham buy CWA
If your buying resale buy low MF. Unless you just have to have ARP at a certain resort.

Got it, great advice! Lots to work on as I await response to rescission letter.

One decision point on a path forward I’m grappling with is whether it’s better to simply pick up one or two larger points resale contracts with lower MFs and simply start using the points system and then, at a later point, after actually proving out our usage of the Wyndham system, consider a developer purchase for VIP status. Bypass the whole PIC option for now and just use points.

Then again, we could pick up two PIC units for 508k points and we would already qualify for VIP Silver straight out of the gate. But we would have to purchase a minimum of 98k points (59k for each PIC week) which would still require roughly 20k up front for the developer points.

Decisions decisions...


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[Richelle]

Got it. Why did you choose National Harbor? I’ve attended several conferences there over the years and we are looking to stay at the Wyndham resort there as one of our first bookings once we become owners post rescind.

I’ve got the letter printed out along with a copy of the 1st and last page of the contract and will be going to the post office today to send via certified priority mail!


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Two main reasons. First, National Harbor has lower mf. I have a large enough contract where the MF difference between high and low MF resorts starts to make a difference. The new purchase and PIC addition has lowered my maintenance fees by $758 a year or $63 a month. I originally had 182k patriots place, 308k Branson and 210k PIC. 700k total, but 308k were resale so only grandfather silver. Now i have 292k National Harbor, one pic worth 154 and a second worth 254. I am dumping the Branson contract. I still have 700k points but all count towards VIP and I save $63 a month in maintenance fees. I had to buy more points to make that happen though. The savings on MF alone would take over 20 years to recoup that upfront cost assuming the gap remained the same. However, I switched because upfront costs are short term and the lodging fees help with the ROI as well. MF costs are long term. If I run into a financial bind down the road, I will be glad I have lower fees. Hopefully that financial bind wont last long, because then I would have to dump the timeshare. That brings me to a second reason I chose national Harbor. Ovations would take it back in a heart beat because it's so popular for the low fees. I could not say the same for Patriots Place or Branson. CWA should have that benefit too. There is never a guarantee, but they will take CWA over some old resort that no one goes to, or has high fees. If I decide to sell national harbor, I'd get more for it then CWA. At least so long as the fees are lower then the majority of the resorts. Of course, I'd never get back what I spent. I might get a few grand for it, and I could probably get the buyer to pay the closing and transfer fees. Even if I paid 6 months worth of fees while waiting for the transfer to complete, I'd still walk away with a couple grand. Far cry from what I spent on it, but I have options. Ovations if i need to dump it fast, or ebay if i want to make a little bit off of it.

For a newbie, they can get a small package, so they can enroll in PIC, but I don't know what the smallest national harbor contract they will sell is. It's pretty costly points wise to stay at National Harbor, so they may make you get a larger contract then 49,000. The telesales person would be able to answer that better. What i was saying about CWA is, if you are looking for a cheap way to get started, CWA contracts are fairly cheap. Since it's going to be a small package, go CWA. The MF difference between national harbor and CWA on a 100,000 point contract is about $105 a year or $8.75 a month. A 100k national harbor contract would run about $190 per 1k points through telesales. That's $19,000. The most recent price point I've heard for CWA is $140 per 1k ponts. So $14,000 for a 100,000 point contract. Is saving 8.75 a month worth the extra $5k? That's up to you. To Jan's point, the larger contract you get, the bigger the difference is, and a lower MF contract starts to be worth it, but for the long term. Bigger contracts mean bigger upfront costs. Short term, CWA is still cheaper. A million point CWA contract would cost about $140,000. A million point National harbor is about $190,000. MF savings per month would be $87.5 a month. Is $50k worth that? Only you can say what is good for you. You might be like me and care about long term over short term. I know I can afford to buy a new contract now. I don't know if i would be able to afford Branson five years from now. You might be like others who care about upfront costs. I look at both. If I was only doing a small package, i would have gone CWA because it doesn't make a big difference. Since i got a larger one, i went with the one that will cost me less in the long term. I am not worried about 8.75 a month. I care more about $63 a month.

 

[Braindead]

One decision point on a path forward I’m grappling with is whether it’s better to simply pick up one or two larger points resale contracts with lower MFs and simply start using the points system and then, at a later point, after actually proving out our usage of the Wyndham system, consider a developer purchase for VIP status. Bypass the whole PIC option for now and just use points.

Resale first and try the Wyndham product is the path I and others have taken.
Then we found we liked the Wyndham product and learned a lot here for a year or more.
Then bought from Wyndham as an informed buyer to achieve VIP levels.
I will also add if your elderly and have no children or grandkids that want your ownership someday NEVER buy from Wyndham. Resale is the only option you should consider.

CWA is a good product if you have kids - grandkids in school for the ARP at over 70 resorts.

 

[Richelle]

Got it, great advice! Lots to work on as I await response to rescission letter.

One decision point on a path forward I’m grappling with is whether it’s better to simply pick up one or two larger points resale contracts with lower MFs and simply start using the points system and then, at a later point, after actually proving out our usage of the Wyndham system, consider a developer purchase for VIP status. Bypass the whole PIC option for now and just use points.

Then again, we could pick up two PIC units for 508k points and we would already qualify for VIP Silver straight out of the gate. But we would have to purchase a minimum of 98k points (59k for each PIC week) which would still require roughly 20k up front for the developer points.


Decisions decisions...


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Lets examine first option. Both are not bad, but just wanted to throw in yet a few more points to consider. If we compare apples to apples, we have to assume you are getting equal amount of points on either ebay or retail. So two PICs plus minimum purchase is 606,000 points. We are going to assume national harbor since the rate is low. A 1.29 million point contract went for $10k. So approximately $11 per 1,000 points give or take. So a 606,000 point contract would run you about $6,666, and you do not get VIP. Maintenance fees would be $2,860 a year of $238.36 a month based on the current $4.72 per 1k points.

Short term (upfront) costs: $6,666 (assuming you pay no closing or transfer costs)
Long term costs: $2,860 per year in maintenance fees (not including future years increases)

10 year cost (not including MF increases): $35,266


Second option:


98,000 point National Harbor contract that retails at $190 per 1k points. That would cost you $18,620 retail. Maintenance fees $462.56 per year or 38.54 per month based on a rate of $4.72 per 1,000 points.

Then lets say you do, what i did, but twice. Buy (2) three bedrooms for $28 each. Total $56. Maintenance fees for both, plus the Wyndham program fee $1,992 a year or $166 a month for 508,000 points. If you want to compare apples to apples on maintenance fees, the maintenance fee rate for those 508,000 pic points is $3.92 per 1k points.

Short term (upfront costs): $18,676
Long term costs: 2,454.56 (not including maintenance increases)

10 year cost: $39,346

Not a huge price difference in the long term. We are not accounting for the VIP benefits of Silver. Some say Silver is worthless, others say VIP in general is worthless. Only you can put a dollar amount on the VIP benefits. Will you actually use them and will it be worth the extra $4k? At the 20 year mark, the cost of resale becomes more then retail so:

Resale 20 year cost: $57,200
Retail 20 year cost: $49,091

If you have your time share for 20 years, the $4k difference goes away and you actually save money by going retail IF you do PIC. If you go straight points, resale is always cheaper.

As Brainddead said, if you are elderly, never buy from Wyndham. It will be harder for you to get 20 years, then someone who is in their 30's and 40's

 

[HitchHiker71]

Lets examine first option. Both are not bad, but just wanted to throw in yet a few more points to consider. If we compare apples to apples, we have to assume you are getting equal amount of points on either ebay or retail. So two PICs plus minimum purchase is 606,000 points. We are going to assume national harbor since the rate is low. A 1.29 million point contract went for $10k. So approximately $11 per 1,000 points give or take. So a 606,000 point contract would run you about $6,666, and you do not get VIP. Maintenance fees would be $2,860 a year of $238.36 a month based on the current $4.72 per 1k points.

Short term (upfront) costs: $6,666 (assuming you pay no closing or transfer costs)
Long term costs: $2,860 per year in maintenance fees (not including future years increases)

10 year cost (not including MF increases): $35,266


Second option:


98,000 point National Harbor contract that retails at $190 per 1k points. That would cost you $18,620 retail. Maintenance fees $462.56 per year or 38.54 per month based on a rate of $4.72 per 1,000 points.

Then lets say you do, what i did, but twice. Buy (2) three bedrooms for $28 each. Total $56. Maintenance fees for both, plus the Wyndham program fee $1,992 a year or $166 a month for 508,000 points. If you want to compare apples to apples on maintenance fees, the maintenance fee rate for those 508,000 pic points is $3.92 per 1k points.

Short term (upfront costs): $18,676
Long term costs: 2,454.56 (not including maintenance increases)

10 year cost: $39,346

Not a huge price difference in the long term. We are not accounting for the VIP benefits of Silver. Some say Silver is worthless, others say VIP in general is worthless. Only you can put a dollar amount on the VIP benefits. Will you actually use them and will it be worth the extra $4k? At the 20 year mark, the cost of resale becomes more then retail so:

Resale 20 year cost: $57,200
Retail 20 year cost: $49,091

If you have your time share for 20 years, the $4k difference goes away and you actually save money by going retail IF you do PIC. If you go straight points, resale is always cheaper.

As Brainddead said, if you are elderly, never buy from Wyndham. It will be harder for you to get 20 years, then someone who is in their 30's and 40's

Thanks everyone for your continued scenarios and advice! Learning a TON here!

At this point I think it best to provide some demographics info. DW and I are age 46 at present, three kids ages 23, 21, and 18. 23 year old daughter is done college and still living at home working full time to save money and figure out next steps for her life. 21 year old son is a rising senior in college heading into fall semester, living at home and working part time for funds and expenses. 18 year old son just graduated from high school and is taking a gap year to work full time and save money for pilot school next year while living at home.

So we are approaching empty nester stage over the next several years, hopefully by age 50. We live in the mid-Atlantic region and are within a few hours drive of NYC, D.C., and VA areas. We often take weekend getaways to the Poconos as one example.

We like the concept of TS because it promotes forced vacations on a regular schedule and will allow us a number of location options to choose from across the country since we do not yet know where our children will settle. Eventually grandkids will become a reality and we would like to be able to use our TS for extended family vacations. That is our vision, which is of course subject to change since we cannot ever predict what the future will hold.

Ideally we will have enough income in retirement to afford the MFs and be able to vacation frequently as a couple on a regular basis and at times with our adult children and grandchildren. Hope this helps provide some context to promote more specific advice!

We are looking at a 20-30 year horizon for these vacationing investments. I’m also not opposed to considering going Platinum or PR over time especially if doing so could actually allow us to help offset MF costs via renting points or weeks to others. It seems like some here are doing this already and I would like to learn more about how to do so if feasible.


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[Richelle]

There’s always the buy resale and pay the fee (it was stated in another thread that it was $2395 or $2495, can’t remember) to PIC a week. It all depends on if you feel VIP benefits are worth it? I’m personally looking for a small annual contract to bridge what I can’t get in RCI already.

It was me that posted the picture from the contract, but I also said I was told by multiple people that the only way you can enroll a PIC is with a new purchase. They could not tell me why that’s in there.