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New Westin Flex

Discussion in 'Vistana Signature Experiences (formerly Starwood)' started by Markus, Dec 20, 2017.

  1. DavidnRobin

    DavidnRobin TUG Member

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    WKV (Scottsdale)
    There is a 2Bd WKV (low season) sitting on RedWeek for $900. If WKV is going into Flex (and no ROFR), wouldn't this be quickly snapped up by VSE? Or are they waiting until $0?
     
  2. okwiater

    okwiater TUG Member

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    Are there any confirmed instances of VSE purchasing weeks on the open market? I've only heard of ROFR and "upgrade" transactions.
     
  3. cdirik

    cdirik TUG Member

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    Newbie here, so sorry about this question.
    What is ROFR in this context?
     
  4. nuwermj

    nuwermj TUG Member

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    ROFR = "In its simplest term, ROFR is the concept of a resort matching a resale offer of a timeshare themselves instead of letting the interval get sold to another owner for an extremely low price."
    http://tug2.net/timeshare_advice/what_does_ROFR_mean_for_timeshares.html

    If I make an offer to buy the WKV Redweek listing and the owner accepts the offer, and if the deed contains a ROFR clause, then Vistana has the right to replace me as the buyer. They pay the same I am offering. If Vistana refuses to buy the deed, then I get it.

    In this context, Vistana needs inventory for their new Flex system. Exercising a ROFR on all or many resale market deals is one way they can obtain that inventory, and then deposit it into the Flex trust fund. After deposited into the trust, Vistana has FlexOptions it can sell.
     
  5. VacationForever

    VacationForever Tug Review Crew: Rookie TUG Member

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    ...and most of Vistana resorts do not have ROFR.
     
  6. dioxide45

    dioxide45 TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    I agree with okwiater here. I don't think Vistana goes out on the open market to purchase resale weeks. They rely on buybacks (from the HOA from foreclosure) and ROFR where applicable. I am not aware of any developer that actively goes out to buy on the secondary market other than offering buybacks to existing owners. They don't really like the middle man involved.
     
  7. Bobw

    Bobw TUG Member

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    Which Vistana resorts have ROFR?
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2018
  8. Bobw

    Bobw TUG Member

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    I just got back from Laguna Mar and went to an owner update. Here was their Adventuras offer.

    Take back my EOY 2BR Gold season
    Enroll my 2BR Ocean Front Good Season resale I purchased into the program
    Add this offer with my current 3 Star Elite to make me 5 Star Elite
    $19,500 price.

    I only go to Cancun and rent out my WORV and exchange WMH for renting. Not interseted in going to the other resorts. Been there and done them. 5 Star has no benefit to me. No pressure from the closer. Walked out in 90 minutes and got my $125 resort credit.
     
  9. VacationForever

    VacationForever Tug Review Crew: Rookie TUG Member

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    ??? You are not allowed to rent an exchange, whether it is through II or using Star Options to book.
     
  10. DavidnRobin

    DavidnRobin TUG Member

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    Directly from the VSE/VSN Reservation Confirmations:
    "Rental of units reserved using StarOptions (other than a vacation period at your Home Resort) is prohibited. Violation may result in the suspension of an Owner’s right to reserve within Vistana™ Signature Network until compliant."
     
  11. Bobw

    Bobw TUG Member

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    You are correct. I own MH so I should have been clearer. No options used, Home Resort.
    Thanks.
     
  12. controller1

    controller1 TUG Member

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    I'm not sure the math works out for this.

    If you are currently 3-Star Elite, the maximum number of StarOptions you have is 358,999 while the minimum number of StarOptions required for 5-Star Elite is 649,000. How does the above transaction qualify for at least an additional 290,001 StarOptions?
     
  13. DavidnRobin

    DavidnRobin TUG Member

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    Agree - especially giving back SOs (which had to go to 3*) - Adventuras ain’t that cheap... $19,500 for 300K+ SOs? From VSE?


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  14. Bobw

    Bobw TUG Member

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    Math aside making me 5 star was part of th
     
  15. Bobw

    Bobw TUG Member

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    Their offer. They were taking my 2br ocean front resale which had no SO and bringing it Into the Adventuras system now giving me additional SO. Just as if I had bought it from Starwood. If the math isn’t there they were using 5 star as an incentive to close I guess as they said I was close based on my ownership. Since I don’t care about Elite status I didn’t do the math. I just wanted to get out and collect my $125. If they fudge it is their company. I’m just trying to tell you all my experience.
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2018
  16. iqmavin

    iqmavin TUG Member

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    It seems to me that since Vistana merged w Marriott they've diluted the value of their options and are restricting access to non-owners. Still too soon to tell but I sat through one of those repackage deals and almost bought because the Rep was so easy going. Note I Almost bought. Thank you all you tigers' for keeping it real.
     
  17. DeniseM

    DeniseM Moderator

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    Vistana and Marriott have not merged...

    Sent from my SM-T560NU using Tapatalk
     
  18. DavidnRobin

    DavidnRobin TUG Member

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    So... you are buying/getting enough SOs to get from 3* to 5* (290,000 plus - more likely more) for ~$20K - is that correct? Even after trading back OF resale.
    What is "my 2br ocean front' mean? What resort? Resale SOs at V resorts can't be used for VSN, but they do have SOs associated with them.
    Your details are too light in description... but, you are claiming getting a lot of SOs for only ~$20K.
     
  19. bizaro86

    bizaro86 TUG Member

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    I took that to me they offered to requal a 148k 2 bedroom ocean 'front' at LagunaMar, plus traded in a eoy gold lagunamar for credit toward the new Aventura flex.
     
  20. hawaii gal

    hawaii gal Guest

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    Just received a pitch for flex while at Kierland. Own OF (Kaanapali north) and OV (Kaanapali south). Will not sell OF, but thinking of turning OV into Flex because we have never been able to get to SW US properties during winter months cause can't get in. My gut tells me that 'giving up' the deeded owner status at Hawaii to join a larger pool of folks trying to get in is not a good idea. Also, now concerned that as FLEX pool grows that OWNERS pool of units will diminish and we won't get good unit location despite calling 12 months in advance. NEED feedback from others before I make a decision!
     
  21. hawaii gal

    hawaii gal Guest

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    I just posted at the very end of this thread concerns about converting an every year OV at Kaanapali South to Flex that would cost more in initial offer AND MF's. Would very much like feedback.
     
  22. vacationtime1

    vacationtime1 TUG Member

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    Go with your gut.

    My initial reaction when I heard that Vistana was asking for people to relinquish their WKORV deeds and accept FlexOptions in their place was how much Vistana was paying them to accept a lesser class of ownership (and one without any resale value).
     
  23. hawaii gal

    hawaii gal Guest

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    They were quite insistent that the new flex option was in fact deeded. But based on your comment, I would lose any resale value? That all by itself is enough not to do this. Can't help but wonder as well, that if they can convince enough owners to do this, that the pool of original deeded owners will shrink so much that we lose any leverage at all.
     
  24. dioxide45

    dioxide45 TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    Flex is a deeded interest in a real estate trust. You don't own a week and don't have any home resort priority. As for the loss of resale value, it is because Flex is voluntary VSN. Meaning the StarOptions don't transfer on resale, so they are not as desirable to own. That may change if the weeks in the trust pool get better and booking in trust is easier. The problem is if you own a resale Westin Flex, you can't book Sheraton properties with points. If you own Sheraton Flex resale, you can't book Westin properties with StarOptions.
     
  25. hawaii gal

    hawaii gal Guest

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    Really appreciating these comments. If anyone has additional points of view on why...or why not... sell/convert my yearly OV WKORV to flex; it would be helpful.
     

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