Motives for buying from a PCC, when all PCC's do is talk people into paying money...

[rickandcindy23]

.. for a problem that doesn't necessarily exist for that resort.

People have accused those of us who buy timeshares from eBay for being hypocritcal because we don't like what PCC's say to people attending their presentations.

I can give you some good reasons why buying a timeshare from a PCC is smart, but one reason stands out as most important:

When I see timeshares on eBay for some of my own resorts, I know I can find a new owner for that week.

I can keep the PCC from deeding into a Viking Ship LLC, which will in turn cost my resort $2,500 to foreclose, plus attorney costs. For example, I have purchased five weeks from eBay in the last three years for our home resort near Breckenridge. We only kept two of those and gave the rest to current owners, or sold them for what we paid.

When I take a week at any other resort, I know I am getting a week no one wants, and as John Chase states in his tagline, which is very clever:

ADOPT A TIMESHARE! There are many owners looking for a good home for great places to enjoy!

BUY RESALE!

 

[bogey21]

A few years ago I would buy Weeks at a particular Resort for next to nothing and transfer them (for a small fee and reimbursement of my cost) to the HOA which would then find a new home for the Week in an orderly fashion. I'll bet I did this 15 or 20 times for one Resort within a 24 month period.

George

 

[easyrider]

How many contracts does a resort have to eat before they figure out that if they just charged a small fee for an owner to return the week the resort would be ahead in the long run ??? A contract deed back program makes sence to many.

 

[rickandcindy23]

I keep seeing prime summer weeks at Foxrun, but VRI does not provide a resale newsletter for owners to advertise to other owners, or I would take those free weeks and turn them over quickly.

I got rid of all of my unwanted Foxrun weeks by selling most, not just giving them away, but it took some time, and I was in the black when I was done, because I paid quite a bit for some, and I got some free.

I buy some others that I know would be hard to sell or give away, because I got them just about free, and some have free 2012 use, for example. It helps the ownership of any resort to have a new owner for a week, rather than have the week deeded to some LLC.

 

[rickandcindy23]

How many contracts does a resort have to eat before they figure out that if they just charged a small fee for an owner to return the week the resort would be ahead in the long run ??? A contract deed back program makes sence to many.

We had a long conversation about this in an earlier thread, but owners first need to ask to deed back. But a PCC gets them first, then gives them a hard sale on their company and tells these owners that the resort will not take the weeks back. That's a lie for many resorts, because they absolutely will take weeks back, as long as the owner pays fees for a year or two ahead of time.

Plus, it's not the management that has to "eat" anything. It's the owners at the resort. So if you have a resort you love, and you want to dictate what policy the resort will have, then you need to get on the board. If TUG members were on the board of every resort, we would wiser, better resorts. The one thing I cannot understand is how people here can talk about how policy should be, but they don't want to do anything about it themselves.

Resorts managed by Marriott, Starwood, Diamond, Wyndham, and all of the other biggies, well they just don't care about the owners. They make sure actual owners cannot get on the board, and if they happen to allow an owner on the board, that owner has very little say.

 

[rrlongwell]

How many contracts does a resort have to eat before they figure out that if they just charged a small fee for an owner to return the week the resort would be ahead in the long run ??? A contract deed back program makes sence to many.

Some do not charge a fee, they just take them back if Maintance Fees have become a problem. In other words, they are not getting paid. I have been told by a couple of resorts that they just turn over the use rights to Wyndham to rent for them if they are a Wyndham related resort. One Wyndham related resort told me they just keep the good weeks and rent them themselves and turn the ones they do not want to rent over to Wyndham to re-sell.

 

[Ridewithme38]

Resorts managed by Marriott, Starwood, Diamond, Wyndham, and all of the other biggies, well they just don't care about the owners. They make sure actual owners cannot get on the board, and if they happen to allow an owner on the board, that owner has very little say.

Bluegreen & HGVC are exempt?

 

[presley]

One of my HOAs just sent a newsletter yesterday. It had the following information in it:

We have heard from some of our Owners that certain transfer companies are
offering to transfer legal ownership of an Owner’s timeshare in exchange for
payment of upfront fees and execution of a power of attorney to complete the
transfer. Owners receiving such offers may wish to consult with an attorney
to confirm that a transfer of ownership and the corresponding maintenance
fee obligation will occur as represented and any resulting sale or rental
will be honored.
Similarly, if a marketer should ever offer an Owner the option to ‘trade in’
her or his timeshare in exchange for monetary credit against a new purchase,
the Owner may wish to obtain comfort that the transfer of ownership (of the
traded timeshare) and corresponding maintenance fee obligation will take
place as promised.
Grand Pacific Resort Management values its Owners and supports efforts by the
American Resort Development Association Resort Owners’ Coalition (ARDAROC) to help timeshare Owners navigate through the secondary market. While
some entities are legitimate resellers or rental agents of timeshare inventory,
others are not. For additional information, Owners may wish to consult
with their resort or visit ARDA-ROC’s Timeshare Resale Resource Center at
www.ardaroc.org/roc/resource-library.


It was nice information. Too bad they didn't offer the option to turn the weeks back over to the resort for the same fee.

 

[ronparise]

.. for a problem that doesn't necessarily exist for that resort.

People have accused those of us who buy timeshares from eBay for being hypocritcal because we don't like what PCC's say to people attending their presentations.

I can give you some good reasons why buying a timeshare from a PCC is smart, but one reason stands out as most important:

When I see timeshares on eBay for some of my own resorts, I know I can find a new owner for that week.

I can keep the PCC from deeding into a Viking Ship LLC, which will in turn cost my resort $2,500 to foreclose, plus attorney costs. For example, I have purchased five weeks from eBay in the last three years for our home resort near Breckenridge. We only kept two of those and gave the rest to current owners, or sold them for what we paid.

When I take a week at any other resort, I know I am getting a week no one wants, and as John Chase states in his tagline, which is very clever:

ADOPT A TIMESHARE! There are many owners looking for a good home for great places to enjoy!

BUY RESALE!

Glad to see you are coming over to the "dark side" PCCs do provide a necessary service

 

[ace2000]

Glad to see you are coming over to the "dark side" PCCs do provide a necessary service

Amen. I think it's time to stop bashing the PCCs, especially if you're on the other side purchasing them. That is hypocrisy in my book.

A few years ago, some on TUG were advocating abolishing them completely.

 

[rickandcindy23]

Amen. I think it's time to stop bashing the PCCs, especially if you're on the other side purchasing them. That is hypocrisy in my book.

A few years ago, some on TUG were advocating abolishing them completely.

I cannot abide the lies they say at the PCC presentations. It's still lying to make a buck, so they are just as bad as the timeshare salespeople.

They do not differentiate the timeshare who will take deeds back, even though they KNOW who will take a timeshare back, because in some cases, they take your $3-4K to relieve an owner of the "burden," then they call the resort and say, "Our company has three timeshares and would like you to pay us $500 each, or we will abandon them to an LLC and never pay a dime."
True story, as it has happened at three resorts in which I own. How dishonest is that?

They don't differentiate which timeshares are going to be easy to sell, either. They know what will make a few bucks on eBay, and they know what will make a lot of $$$ on eBay, too. But do they say to that elderly couple, "Yes, you own a great week at a Marriott in the California Desert, Platinum season, you can definitely sell that on eBay!" No. They take the money and run, and then they sell it on eBay for a lot of money.

The economy seems like it would slow these people down, and it has somewhat, but maybe the lower number of weeks on eBay means these companies are just putting the junk into LLC's.

 

[amycurl]

but maybe the lower number of weeks on eBay means these companies are just putting the junk into LLC's.

Or maybe they've figured out they can use the same high-pressured sales practices as developers and get money from unsuspecting tourists for those weeks, too...without a recission period to boot.

 

[rrlongwell]

Bluegreen & HGVC are exempt?

Not sure with Bluegreen. I have first hand knowledge of a case where a husband and wife both passed on. Under the terms of the contract, the timeshare went to the surving husband who then subsequently passed on. Bluegreen then tried to go after one of the children of the wife for the maintance fees, even though there was no legal basis to do so. By far worse then Wyndham.

 

[am1]

A PCC can sell on ebay easily an individual will have a much harder time if they also have considered using a PCC. These are owners who probably overpaid for their timeshare and do not get good annual value of it. How do you expect them to be able to sell a timeshare? It can be easier to just pay the fee and be done with it. Yes a few thousand dollars is a lot of money to "waste" but not when compared to most retail purchases.

 

[Mel]

One of my HOAs just sent a newsletter yesterday. It had the following information in it:

We have heard from some of our Owners that certain transfer companies are
offering to transfer legal ownership of an Owner’s timeshare in exchange for
payment of upfront fees and execution of a power of attorney to complete the
transfer. Owners receiving such offers may wish to consult with an attorney
to confirm that a transfer of ownership and the corresponding maintenance
fee obligation will occur as represented and any resulting sale or rental
will be honored...

It was nice information. Too bad they didn't offer the option to turn the weeks back over to the resort for the same fee.

The whole point of the letter is to warn the owners that there may not in fact be a transfer of ownership. If that is the case (which is unfortunately common), and there is no transfer, then they are not getting rid of their obligation. Perhaps the resort should offer to take their money and run, too (I'm sure some feel like the resort already does).

The same applies to the marketing companies. Have you ever considered trading in your week at a developer presentation? Have you seen the paperwork they give you? They tell you they will give you "credit" toward your new week, but it's contingent upon the sale of your original week, which they do not guarantee - they set you up with their favorite reseller, who attempts to sell your week. If your week doesn't sell, you have to come up with the money - if it doesn't sell for what they promised as your credit (plus the fee to the reseller), you don't get the full amount of that credit.

Yes, it would be nice if the "resort" would offer to take weeks back for the same price, but they may not be in a position to do so - and they're certainly not likely to make that offer in a letter to the entire membership. Do you want your HOA to concentrate on maintaining your resort, or trying to sell a whole slew of weeks all over again? Remember there are costs associated with reselling, and in some areas they may be required by law to use a broker, or will have to register as a developer, which they are not.

 

[ronparise]

Do you want your HOA to concentrate on maintaining your resort, or trying to sell a whole slew of weeks all over again? Remember there are costs associated with reselling, and in some areas they may be required by law to use a broker, or will have to register as a developer, which they are not.

Of course I want my HOA to maintain the resort, but they cant do that without money. So they need to make sure that every week is owned by someone that will pay their fees....We all know that there will be some turnover. Good resort management will take steps to see that that turnover can be done quickly and efficiently, so that their income is not interrupted

That means a sales and rental department ought to be part of every well run resort

 

[rickandcindy23]

So they need to make sure that every week is owned by someone that will pay their fees....We all know that there will be some turnover. Good resort management will take steps to see that that turnover can be done quickly and efficiently, so that their income is not interrupted

With older resorts, this is not easy. And closing the resort down as a timeshare for Twin Rivers was not easy because most of the remaining owners didn't want any of the things offered by the two TUG members:
1. A week in another unit (all are fixed)
2. Small amount of cash
3. Here is your way out.

 

[Ridewithme38]

With older resorts, this is not easy. And closing the resort down as a timeshare for Twin Rivers was not easy because most of the remaining owners didn't want any of the things offered by the two TUG members:
1. A week in another unit (all are fixed)
2. Small amount of cash
3. Here is your way out.

rick and/or cindy,

Was there a thread about this when it happened? I'd love to read a history of it when it happened. Its extremely interesting to me and i don't expect you to post it all again

 

[rickandcindy23]

Ride, no thread on TUG. This was all done discreetly, and I was somewhat aware of what was going on, but I believe these two guys set up a LLC and abandoned many of the weeks. I am not sure of it, but I did see an LLC under their names on the Colorado government website. Since both resorts knew the guys well, they could easily hang for it, and maybe that is why neither ever posts here anymore. I don't know.