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Marriott, Int'l BONVOY Changes Effective 9/14/19 [Merged]

BreakingAway

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This may not be new for others, but it was for us when the Marriott hotel we planned to stay would not accept Bonvoy points for the dates we wanted to stay. The hotel would accept cash only. We reserved a Marriott with points a few miles away, but it was annoying that a Marriott hotel could decide it would not accept Marriott currency (Bonvoy points) at all for the dates we wanted to reserve...only US dollars. Devaluation is one issue but opting out of accepting points at all is another problematic issue altogether in my opinion.
 

Wei339

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The Elite Marriott Rewards status bestowed upon me as a Executive MVC owner several years ago has been very rewarding and an added bonus to my ownership. Previously, I was given Gold membership which basically gave me Lounge access and now with the new Bonvoy program I am able to keep that benefit with the new Platinum Elite. The greatest benefit that I have enjoyed the most which was added after the purchase of the Starwood brand was the guaranteed late checkout at 4:00 pm. Lately with the addition of the suites nights, the Marriott Bonvoy has been even more enjoyable.

The change in the points redemption chart is worrisome but fortunately my travel times are flexible. I use this same flexibility when I am booking with destination points at MVC usually in low season and Sun-Thurs during the week when I am not using my home resort.
 

Steve Fatula

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The Elite Marriott Rewards status bestowed upon me as a Executive MVC owner several years ago has been very rewarding and an added bonus to my ownership. Previously, I was given Gold membership which basically gave me Lounge access and now with the new Bonvoy program I am able to keep that benefit with the new Platinum Elite. The greatest benefit that I have enjoyed the most which was added after the purchase of the Starwood brand was the guaranteed late checkout at 4:00 pm. Lately with the addition of the suites nights, the Marriott Bonvoy has been even more enjoyable.

The change in the points redemption chart is worrisome but fortunately my travel times are flexible. I use this same flexibility when I am booking with destination points at MVC usually in low season and Sun-Thurs during the week when I am not using my home resort.

Yep, you hit the nail on the head. Those of us retired have a little bit easier time being likely more flexible. Those that are not, much more impact. As you say, the 4PM is killer. We absolutely love that feature as you almost get another day, you can go out and do stuff, come back, and even shower before leaving. Previously, when leaving at noon or earlier, you really lost that day,
 

bogey21

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Again, it’s customary with Marriott and most companies when they get so big to do this.

So true. It is why I walked away from Marriott and Southwest Airlines both of which were once "have to have" for me...

George
 

rsackett

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Any word on how 5 and 7 night travel packages will work? They have always been tied to category not number of points, so are they unaffected?

Ray
 

CPNY

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So, what l0410z was likely speaking of, given this is the MVCI forum not SPG, is owners get certain benefits based on their ownership level in MVCI. So, if your level in mvci previously gave you gold, they gave you platinum once the levels changed, which meant you lost nothing.
Considering MVC acquired VSE, my VSE ownership gave me then SPG gold before the acquisition. Which converted to Gold Elite in the then Marriott program. Marriott gold elite had better benefits than the bonvoy Gold elite. When the bonvoy program came out, My SPG Gold through ownership dropped down a level to Bonvoy Gold Elite, by dropped down I mean did not translate to the conversion from SPG Gold to the Platinum Elite in bonvoy.

All channels other than SPG/VSE ownership
SPG Gold —> gave Marriott Gold Elite post acquisition —> gave Bonvoy Platinum Elite after bonvoy program.

SPG Gold through SPG/VSE ownership —> gave Marriott Gold Elite post acquisition —>gives Bonvoy Gold Elite now

So if ownership through MVC gave gold elite then and now gives you platinum. On the other side (VSE/SPG) that bump didn’t equate. Unless they gave the vistana 3/4/5 star elite owners platinum elite in bonvoy. That is a possibility and likely scenario I’m just not aware of.

Either way, I don’t get free breakfast anymore, and All I really care about is free breakfast lol. Who doesn’t love free food?!

After posting this I went on vistana and it said owners get Bonvoy Gold. Didn’t list any levels for elite members to get platinum. If that is the case then VSE owners got the screw, since Old Marriott Gold Elite was better than Bonvoy Gold Elite.
 
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Steve Fatula

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Either way, I don’t get free breakfast anymore, and All I really care about is free breakfast lol. Who doesn’t love free food?!

After posting this I went on vistana and it said owners get Bonvoy Gold. Didn’t list any levels for elite members to get platinum. If that is the case then VSE owners got the screw, since Old Marriott Gold Elite was better than Bonvoy Gold Elite.

I am not disagreeing with you. Was just saying this is an MVCI forum, so for us, we got a bump up and didn't lose anything. Maybe that will all change for you guys once the integration gets completed many years from now.

I like the late checkout immensely! Also like the lounge access, we literally ate in the lunge for a week and never spent a dime eating out at one hotel, they had a lot of food. That actually paid the hotel bill, you could say the hotel was free. It was pretty nice to get a hotel benefit for a timeshare ownership.
 

BigMac

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Any word on how 5 and 7 night travel packages will work? They have always been tied to category not number of points, so are they unaffected?

Ray
Here is your answer from the Frequent Miler. To sum it up they say that the new travel packages - which are not that great - get slightly better if you can book at peak times. The question still remains can one book free nights during peak times.

https://frequentmiler.boardingarea.com/marriott-travel-packages-in-a-peak-world-good-value
 

jerseyfinn

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Agree that it's frustrating when any rewards program devalues points. But MVC timeshare and Marriott hotel programs are no different than airlines or any other business or even govt that raise costs or decrease benefits in this regard. ( it's gonna take me years to say Bonvoy, so i'm unapologetic when I say 'Marriott' or "mail man" or "mankind" :shrug:. )

We MVC folks gain a leg up as our TS stays count as nights in the hotel reward program ( it wasn't always so ). TS ownership is a long-term slog/commitment over years. I don't know the present demographic of what % of we MVC folks go back to late 90s and up to 2007 before the recession brings paradigm change to the character & function of MVC versus % of owners who come in shortly before or after 2007 as well all transition to MVC life with DC points & enrolled weeks. In any case, THAT's the real Marriott TS Rubicon. Multiple week owners who have been at it for 15 years or more get hit by devaluation like everyone else, but those who enrolled their weeks gain additional ways to strategize. Indeed a contrast exists for more recent members who come in through the DC points door, but time and strategy still exist & function.

Marriott continues to digest this Starwood merger & this means changes. Some of the changes will not be positive, but they do indeed reflect the process of expansion and consolidation. All we can do as MVC owners & hotel reward members is to read the fine print and figure out how to strategize into the future. Every year you put behind you means more nights/stays that count towards different lifetime elite status levels that do accrue some value or at the very lest convenient perks. Like anything, additional size creates more complexity as folks bring different expectations as we're all pushed into the Bonvoy future. The Advance Points rewards program was an in-house perk/favor that grows more impossible for Marriott to reconcile as business size scales up. Can any brand continue to allow award reservations without enough award points to cover the stay? Answer is yes if you're short of points, but no if you've got the points but no award nights for the dates you want because some of the inventory is held as a courtesy. I'm not knocking those who take advantage of the Advance program, but I do suggest that size and complexity play a big part in some of these changes.

All I can say is to travel safe and enjoy the MVC product & above all, to read the fine print and learn to strategize.

We ourselves have changed our strategy since our early years of MVC ownership. We continue to link Marriott hotel stays sometimes doing a paid night before/after an MVC stay to gain a day or make the journey easier. This SOP the brought us gold and then platinum hotel status combined with our MVC stays. Today we're lifetime platinum/ titanium & this with senior discounts for us makes Marriott life rewarding even when they devalue points etc. It requires time and patience. Understandably frustrating at times if you're in your 40s/50s as life is indeed hectic & MVC travel a temporary escape valve from work pressures. But time flies with destination travel and the long game is about patience and strategy until one day you realize you've moved up the elites ladder as retirement is on your horizon. We too have had our Marriot moments, but overall we remember years of travels & hotel nights that cost money, but we do accrue status that remains functional and above all memories of those travels.

Just so you all don't think we're now old farts :eek:, we're 65 & 4 years retired and still figuring things MVC & travel out. Honestly speaking, we're more frustrated with how airlines have changed the flying paradigm. Marriott gave us a few bumps these past years. but we're on auto pilot with Marriott despite the changes.

Once again, travel safe.
 

CPNY

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I am not disagreeing with you. Was just saying this is an MVCI forum, so for us, we got a bump up and didn't lose anything. Maybe that will all change for you guys once the integration gets completed many years from now.

I like the late checkout immensely! Also like the lounge access, we literally ate in the lunge for a week and never spent a dime eating out at one hotel, they had a lot of food. That actually paid the hotel bill, you could say the hotel was free. It was pretty nice to get a hotel benefit for a timeshare ownership.
Exactly, so to all of those who say “we lost nothing” is wrong. Sad reality that’s business. Nothing is like it used to be and these points programs are generally devalued constantly. It makes owning a points based vacation ownership scary. That too can be devalued. Maybe not overnight but it can absolutely go down little by little over the years.
 

cubigbird

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Exactly, so to all of those who say “we lost nothing” is wrong. Sad reality that’s business. Nothing is like it used to be and these points programs are generally devalued constantly. It makes owning a points based vacation ownership scary. That too can be devalued. Maybe not overnight but it can absolutely go down little by little over the years.

^^^^THIS^^^^

This is exactly why I will always own weeks at my ownerships. I fear the same. TS Points programs are ripe for the picking for devaluation. When the first TS company does it, others will follow. No matter the devaluation, with weeks ownership, I still have my increments of weeks and nothing is lost.
 

CPNY

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^^^^THIS^^^^

This is exactly why I will always own weeks at my ownerships. I fear the same. TS Points programs are ripe for the picking for devaluation. When the first TS company does it, others will follow. No matter the devaluation, with weeks ownership, I still have my increments of weeks and nothing is lost.
I agree it’s why I’ve tried to stay away. I own weeks/points with vistana in that we have star options assigned to our ownerships. Even here on Tug people grumble about “Orlando shouldn’t be worth as much as Hawaii” etc. in the CCRs is states “the management can change the star options designations at any time for any reason, points must always equal at least one week of use” etc.

I wouldn’t be surprised if MVC decides to actually do that. Especially considering they are selling flex ownerships. Hopefully it doesn’t happen but it absolutely can and most likely will at some point.
 

controller1

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After posting this I went on vistana and it said owners get Bonvoy Gold. Didn’t list any levels for elite members to get platinum. If that is the case then VSE owners got the screw, since Old Marriott Gold Elite was better than Bonvoy Gold Elite.

Vistana 5-Star Elite members receive Bonvoy Platinum status. You can find this on your Vistana Dashboard under Ownership 101. There is a section on Elite ownership.
 

Steve Fatula

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Exactly, so to all of those who say “we lost nothing” is wrong. Sad reality that’s business. Nothing is like it used to be and these points programs are generally devalued constantly. It makes owning a points based vacation ownership scary. That too can be devalued. Maybe not overnight but it can absolutely go down little by little over the years.

We have a lot of non MVCI owners making various claims about MVCI lately, even though they are not familiar with MVCI ownerships.

Actually, I don't think they can be changed, I believe it's part of the legal doc, someone else can confirm where that wording is found, I believe they can change an individual weeks points assignment, as long as the total for the year does not change. Probably you need to open a new thread, all these discussions have been going off topic lately.

But no, this is the MVCI forum, and, nothing did change for the members of this forum as far as levels. So, no, people in the MVCi forum are not wrong. The issue here is we have a lot of non MVCI owners coming in these forums now with the acquisition, though the programs are not merged yet and may never even be.

For me, I would presume answers found in the MVCI section are in general meant for MVCI owners. We don't know what does or does not apply to non MVCI owners. I know I do not. This is adding confusion.
 

controller1

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We have a lot of non MVCI owners making various claims about MVCI lately, even though they are not familiar with MVCI ownerships.

Actually, I don't think they can be changed, I believe it's part of the legal doc, someone else can confirm where that wording is found, I believe they can change an individual weeks points assignment, as long as the total for the year does not change. Probably you need to open a new thread, all these discussions have been going off topic lately.

But no, this is the MVCI forum, and, nothing did change for the members of this forum as far as levels. So, no, people in the MVCi forum are not wrong. The issue here is we have a lot of non MVCI owners coming in these forums now with the acquisition, though the programs are not merged yet and may never even be.

For me, I would presume answers found in the MVCI section are in general meant for MVCI owners. We don't know what does or does not apply to non MVCI owners. I know I do not. This is adding confusion.

Hopefully, I did not make anything confusing as I did not make a claim about MVCI as I'm not an owner. I was trying to correct something posted in this thread pertaining to Vistana. Should I not post?
 

CalGalTraveler

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So far Bonvoy Gold has been a zero. At the Ritz Kapalua we asked for upgrade - zilch. In fact the check-in rep blurted out, "Oh you are here on points..." aka "He** no we don't give upgrades to freeloaders on points no matter whether you are elite."...so much for "Aloha, welcome and thank you for your loyalty."

Requested early check-in, they did nothing. We asked for 2PM check-out which is a gold benefit, they hemmed and hawed and finally after reminding them we are gold elite they gave us 1 hour more to 11:00 AM. Wow...very disappointing. Doesn't seem worth the spend on our SPG Card to get Bonvoy Gold status.

#Bonvoyed Gold
 
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CalGalTraveler

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Question. My spouse has Gold Elite via his Bonvoy Brilliant Card. If I reserve a room in my name and add his name to the room, do we get Gold Elite benefits? I may forgo the spend to get Gold for me and just leverage his card if possible. Perhaps another property would give us 2PM check-out but I don't want to spend $30k again to find that we are treated like dirt.
 

Steve Fatula

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Question. My spouse has Gold Elite via his Bonvoy Brilliant Card. If I reserve a room in my name and add his name to the room, do we get Gold Elite benefits? I may forgo the spend to get Gold for me and just leverage his card if possible. Perhaps another property would give us 2PM check-out but I don't want to spend $30k again to find that we are treated like dirt.

I am sorry you keep feeling you are being treated like dirt, my experience is the polar opposite. But no matter, that doesn't help you of course!

But here's something we did last week that was curious. My wife qualifies for the senior rate. So, for the first time we reserved the senior rate and used HER name on the ressie, but MY Bonvoy number. I thought this would kick out somewhere. We did indeed get our titanium benefits including the 1000 bonus points, and, we did get the senior rate too. What I don't know is if this is standard procedure or just blind luck. Seems like this is the essence of your question.

This was at a Townplace, and we did get 4PM checkout as advertised as always (for us). Even used the EV charger.

I'll add this was our first Townplace stay, and it was very good. I like the property since it includes a full fridge, a cooktop, etc. It's kind of a timeshare lockoff.
 
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Mr. Vker

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Here is your answer from the Frequent Miler. To sum it up they say that the new travel packages - which are not that great - get slightly better if you can book at peak times. The question still remains can one book free nights during peak times.

https://frequentmiler.boardingarea.com/marriott-travel-packages-in-a-peak-world-good-value

Has Marriott confirmed this? If so great, but it looks like the article assumes a TP cert will apply to peak nights too-without confirmation from Marriott.
 

Mr. Vker

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I am sorry you keep feeling you are being treated like dirt, my experience is the polar opposite. But no matter, that doesn't help you of course!

But here's something we did last week that was curious. My wife qualifies for the senior rate. So, for the first time we reserved the senior rate and used HER name on the ressie, but MY Bonvoy number. I thought this would kick out somewhere. We did indeed get our titanium benefits including the 1000 bonus points, and, we did get the senior rate too. What I don't know is if this is standard procedure or just blind luck. Seems like this is the essence of your question.

This was at a Townplace, and we did get 4PM checkout as advertised as always (for us). Even used the EV charger.

I'll add this was our first Townplace stay, and it was very good. I like the property since it includes a full fridge, a cooktop, etc. It's kind of a timeshare lockoff.

This is actually against the Terms of the program. The guests Bonvoy number must be on the reservation. I think you got lucky getting the benefits.
 

Steve Fatula

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Has Marriott confirmed this? If so great, but it looks like the article assumes a TP cert will apply to peak nights too-without confirmation from Marriott.

If indeed this is true, which does make sense as it's less calls and hassle for them, then packages can still have some decent value when used in peak season or week pricing. Will be interesting to see!
 

SueDonJ

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Exactly, so to all of those who say “we lost nothing” is wrong. Sad reality that’s business. Nothing is like it used to be and these points programs are generally devalued constantly. It makes owning a points based vacation ownership scary. That too can be devalued. Maybe not overnight but it can absolutely go down little by little over the years.

I think there's a vast difference between points-based timeshare products and points-based reward/loyalty programs. The timeshare companies are severely constrained by the legalities that prevent them from devaluing points-based-intervals in the same or similar manner to the multitude of ways that the hotel companies are legally able to devalue, and even cease, any affiliations with reward programs.

Think of it in terms of what you used to have available to you when Vistana was under the Starwood umbrella - your timeshare-related StarOptions did not work the same as your SPG points. That difference exists with Marriott products, too - the DC Points timeshare product (whether purchased or from enrolled Weeks) is definitely not subject to the same kind of devaluations that will happen with Bonvoy points.

We have a lot of non MVCI owners making various claims about MVCI lately, even though they are not familiar with MVCI ownerships.

Actually, I don't think they can be changed, I believe it's part of the legal doc, someone else can confirm where that wording is found, I believe they can change an individual weeks points assignment, as long as the total for the year does not change. Probably you need to open a new thread, all these discussions have been going off topic lately.

But no, this is the MVCI forum, and, nothing did change for the members of this forum as far as levels. So, no, people in the MVCi forum are not wrong. The issue here is we have a lot of non MVCI owners coming in these forums now with the acquisition, though the programs are not merged yet and may never even be.

For me, I would presume answers found in the MVCI section are in general meant for MVCI owners. We don't know what does or does not apply to non MVCI owners. I know I do not. This is adding confusion.

I agree. It is. The best we can do while all of us Marriott/Vistana/Hyatt people try to figure out what the MVW acquisition of Vistana and Hyatt might come to mean is, realize that the expertise of all existing owners is what will help us all eventually learn what we need to know to get the best usage out of what we each own. :)
 

Steve Fatula

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I guess I'd just like to see Vistana discussion in the Vistana forum for the most part. And people visiting here to just understand that answers here are from MVCI owners and apply to MVCI, not Vistana necessarily. It doesn't make the answer wrong! But call me grumpy.
 

SueDonJ

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Hopefully, I did not make anything confusing as I did not make a claim about MVCI as I'm not an owner. I was trying to correct something posted in this thread pertaining to Vistana. Should I not post?

Speaking as a participant, please don't stop posting. The more information that all of us learn about each of the products/programs, the better able we'll be to dissect whatever integration is eventually offered by Marriott following the Vistana/Hyatt acquisition. :)

Speaking as a moderator, I think all of the participants need to realize that some posts have been reported because they're causing confusion, they're not helpful, they're too biased, they're outright hostile, etc. We mods can't just ignore the reports and we're trying as best we can to keep the threads focused and the content contained. It's expected that there will be some cross-posting and some unfamiliar TUGgers participating in forums where you wouldn't usually find them. Patience is appreciated, anybody is welcome to contribute what they know or ask questions about what they don't. :)
 
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