Is Owning a Marriott Timeshare Week Still Popular?

[Saintsfanfl]

I own at a place that has only had one increase in the last 10 years that was not only attributed to property tax. Even that increase was only 4%. Think about that. 4% in 10 years. That ownership aside, timeshare maintenance fees have risen way higher than hotel prices and it isn’t even close.

Most timeshares are a ticking time bomb and Marriott is no exception. Huge Marriott fan (I currently own 50+ Marriott weeks) but their methods are not sustainable long term. Rental prices are not going up nearly as fast as the maintenance fees.

 

[BocaBoy]

... and you are fooling yourself. Any drop in quality of a Marriott, Hyatt or a Westin, owners are going to cry bloody murder.

I think our big difference is that I do not believe maintenance fees need to increase at a far higher than the rate of inflation to maintain quality. My full ownership condo was able to maintain its premier quality for little or no increase in MF over the past 10 years. Marriott timeshares did that until about 10-12 years ago. We owned them for 15-20 years in much higher inflation times when their MF increases were much less than today and quality was maintained. In 2 or 3 years the MF even went down a bit.

 

[Hi I'm new here]

If someone wants to go to Hawaii package deals consisting of Air, lodging and car rental totally blow timeshares out of the water. We’ve taken package deals through major travel companies that were shockingly cheap and we stay in very nice places. Packages by far are the best Hawaiian travel value. You can mix, match pricing levels on hotels, condos, rental homes, car rental and they provide efficient, logical airline itineraries.

 

[JIMinNC]

I think our big difference is that I do not believe maintenance fees need to increase at a far higher than the rate of inflation to maintain quality. My full ownership condo was able to maintain its premier quality for little or no increase in MF over the past 10 years. Marriott timeshares did that until about 10-12 years ago. We owned them for 15-20 years in much higher inflation times when their MF increases were much less than today and quality was maintained. In 2 or 3 years the MF even went down a bit.

A full ownership condo doesn't have the same labor/healthcare costs as a timeshare due to housekeeping needs, so wouldn't a timeshare find it tougher to maintain level fees than a full ownership property? Nevertheless, your point is a good one, that MVC fee increases seem higher than they need to be. I've been reading the HGVC board a lot recently because we're working on adding a HGVC to our Marriott ownership, and I've noted that HGVC maintenance fees only seem to be rising 2% to 3% for 2018 versus generally 5% or so for MVC. That proves quality can be maintained with more reasonable increases.

 

[csodjd]

Totally agree. I used the studio example only because that was the metric that Quadmaniac had used, so I tried to be consistent. I also agree that 2BR is the sweet spot for most timeshare uses. Several months ago when we started actively evaluating buying an every other year at Maui Ocean Club, I was focused on a 1BR since our kids are in college and more or less out of the nest. But I quickly realized that a 2BR would offer more long term flexibility for not much more annual maintenance fee cost, so that's what we're focusing on acquiring now.

And, of course, at Maui, they are all lock-off units so a 2-bedroom for a week can also be a 1-bedroom for 2 weeks. Or a 1-b and a rental that can pay for or offset MF, making your 1-bedroom nearly cost-free.

 

[csodjd]

A full ownership condo doesn't have the same labor/healthcare costs as a timeshare due to housekeeping needs, so wouldn't a timeshare find it tougher to maintain level fees than a full ownership property? Nevertheless, your point is a good one, that MVC fee increases seem higher than they need to be. I've been reading the HGVC board a lot recently because we're working on adding a HGVC to our Marriott ownership, and I've noted that HGVC maintenance fees only seem to be rising 2% to 3% for 2018 versus generally 5% or so for MVC. That proves quality can be maintained with more reasonable increases.

I just got my HGVC bill for 2018, along with the budget and cover letter. Here is the breakdown for a 2-bedroom, ocean view, Lagoon Tower (8,400 points): Hawaii GE tax, $67.51, Club Dues, $170, Operating Fee, $1,126.89, Reserve Fee, $305.78, Real Estate Taxes, $171.94. Total $1842.12, representing a 1.4% increase.

 

[VacationForever]

And, of course, at Maui, they are all lock-off units so a 2-bedroom for a week can also be a 1-bedroom for 2 weeks. Or a 1-b and a rental that can pay for or offset MF, making your 1-bedroom nearly cost-free.

I believe most of the big names timeshares in Maui are all locked off into 1 BR and 1 studio and not 2 1BRs. The studios are very small. I am not familiar with HGVC timeshare in general so their property in Maui may be an exception.

 

[dagger1]

If someone wants to go to Hawaii package deals consisting of Air, lodging and car rental totally blow timeshares out of the water. We’ve taken package deals through major travel companies that were shockingly cheap and we stay in very nice places. Packages by far are the best Hawaiian travel value. You can mix, match pricing levels on hotels, condos, rental homes, car rental and they provide efficient, logical airline itineraries.

Can you give the website where I can get a package deal: air, rental car and OV 2BR? Can’t use a hotel room, need a 2/2. And I need a full resort with all amenities, not a condo/house 2 plus blocks from the ocean. Thanks!

 

[csodjd]

I believe most of the big names timeshares in Maui are all locked off into 1 BR and 1 studio and not 2 1BRs. The studios are very small. I am not familiar with HGVC timeshare in general so their property in Maui may be an exception.

Yes, you're correct. The 2-bed locks off to a 1-bed and studio. So it can be a 1-bed for a week and a studio for a week.

Sadly, no HGVC properties in Maui.

 

[RussellSun]

If someone wants to go to Hawaii package deals consisting of Air, lodging and car rental totally blow timeshares out of the water. We’ve taken package deals through major travel companies that were shockingly cheap and we stay in very nice places. Packages by far are the best Hawaiian travel value. You can mix, match pricing levels on hotels, condos, rental homes, car rental and they provide efficient, logical airline itineraries.

I would say it depends on the quality of the package and whether you are getting a hotel room or a 2 bedroom ocean view condo-like suite in a 4-5 star resort. I did a great package when we went to 3 islands in French Polynesia a few years ago but it was very expensive because we stayed in 4.5 and 5 star huge overwater bungalows. I won’t quote the price here but it cost more then the upfront fee for many timeshares. The price per night was comparable to Hawaii, though. We went for almost 2 weeks, I believe. So we have found buying high quality time shares (4-5 star resorts) to give us a lot more space at what we consider to be a reasonable price.

 

[RussellSun]

I just got my HGVC bill for 2018, along with the budget and cover letter. Here is the breakdown for a 2-bedroom, ocean view, Lagoon Tower (8,400 points): Hawaii GE tax, $67.51, Club Dues, $170, Operating Fee, $1,126.89, Reserve Fee, $305.78, Real Estate Taxes, $171.94. Total $1842.12, representing a 1.4% increase.

Sounds good. Which Hawaii timeshare is this? Is it annual? Do they have EOY and lock offs?

BTW, just an FYI for TUG readers, Hawaii has the lowest property taxes in the nation but very high state income taxes, real estate costs, cost of living and high expenses to maintain oceanside properties from wear and tear from sea salt. I think Hawaii’s property tax is about 0.2% or so. Compare that to Houston where there is no state income tax, low cost of living and real estate is cheap but property taxes average 3-4%. You may be able to buy timeshares in cheaper states inland away from the ocean to avoid ocean wear and tear and the high cost of living in islands and coastal areas.

 

[Foggy1]

BTW, just an FYI for TUG readers, Hawaii has the lowest property taxes in the nation but very high state income taxes, real estate costs, cost of living and high expenses to maintain oceanside properties from wear and tear from sea salt. I think Hawaii’s property tax is about 0.2% or so.

From the Maui County site for Taxation:
The Tax Rate for Homeowners = $2.86/1000 which is the quoted 0.2% or so. Maui's Tax Rate for Timeshares = $15.43/1000. Not cheap They also charges Hotels and Resorts at ~ $9.50/1000.

 

[RussellSun]

From the Maui County site for Taxation:
The Tax Rate for Homeowners = $2.86/1000 which is the quoted 0.2% or so. Maui's Tax Rate for Timeshares = $15.43/1000. Not cheap They also charges Hotels and Resorts at ~ $9.50/1000.

They must have a different tax structure for timeshares because it is not real estate. But it doesn’t matter because it is such a small percentage of the MF. People get too nit picky about the components of this stuff. Maybe it would be better to not own timeshares and rent instead?

 

[davidvel]

They must have a different tax structure for timeshares because it is not real estate. But it doesn’t matter because it is such a small percentage of the MF. People get too nit picky about the components of this stuff. Maybe it would be better to not own timeshares and rent instead?

It is higher because high taxation without representation is easy.

 

[RussellSun]

It is higher because high taxation without representation is easy.

Hmm??? I am confused by your comment.

 

[davidvel]

Hmm??? I am confused by your comment.

Timeshare owners don't live in Hawaii, so they can't vote for keeping taxes low or against those who raise them.

 

[RussellSun]

Timeshare owners don't live in Hawaii, so they can't vote for keeping taxes low or against those who raise them.

In my opinion, timeshares are a Vacation product, not a real estate product. So the locals should be the ones deciding how they want hotels and resorts to benefit the local economy.

 

[garyk01]

Just doing a survey. Is owning a Marriott timeshare week still popular? Are Marriott weeks still in demand by timeshare owners? Even though maintenance fees are going up, are owners still okay with owning Marriott weeks? We just bought a 2 bedroom lockoff for a very low upfront fee and we feel it is a good deal compared to the cost of renting a small hotel room for a week in the same location. Plus we can deposit the studio and get one week for almost free elsewhere. If you buy where you want to use, like Hawaii, it seems like an excellent deal because one week in a 2 bedroom rents for $5000-$8000 per week with an ocean view, I believe.

i owned at Sands of Kahana Maui Hi . they have the largest 3 bedroom units on the island. over 2000 square feet plus two balconies. I sold both of them this year to another owner there, due to the parents who traveled with us say the flights are getting to long for them. two of us no longer can pay for a large unit as fees were $2100 a week 2017 and 2018-2022 are $2600 a week due to the land lease being paid off in the next 10 years. the place rents for $395 to $595 a week from the resort.

important thing about time shares is buy them if you can use them, factor in all costs , purchase price, Maintence fees, trading fees, membership fees to trade, and how long you might use it for in years before you get too old to travel . do the math and see if renting is better or buying on resale. I just sold all my weeks in palm springs CA (had 8 RED )back to the resort as they wanted them to re sell them as points . I took a big lose doing this however my Maintence fees are $0 with them now and I can rent where I like now and not be confined to the one resort . I kept one week at another resort in the area and sold the other one I owned there as well. this allows me to still trade into other places if need be as I have a long term trading membership with SFX and RTX exchanges.

 

[Foggy1]

They must have a different tax structure for timeshares because it is not real estate. But it doesn’t matter because it is such a small percentage of the MF. People get too nit picky about the components of this stuff. Maybe it would be better to not own timeshares and rent instead?

Maui's Real Property tax rates ($/1000 of assessed valuation) effective July 1, 2017:
A. Residential - $5.54
B. Apartment - $6.32
C. Commercial - $7.28
D. Industrial - $7.49
E. Agricultural - $6.01
F. Conservation - $6.37
G. Hotel Resort - $9.37
H. Time Share - $15.43
I. Homeowner - $2.86
J. Commercialized Residential - $4.56

Yes, they have several tax rates and the County people do their best to soak the transients/tourists.

 

[mauiredweek]

Just doing a survey. Is owning a Marriott timeshare week still popular? Are Marriott weeks still in demand by timeshare owners? Even though maintenance fees are going up, are owners still okay with owning Marriott weeks? We just bought a 2 bedroom lockoff for a very low upfront fee and we feel it is a good deal compared to the cost of renting a small hotel room for a week in the same location. Plus we can deposit the studio and get one week for almost free elsewhere. If you buy where you want to use, like Hawaii, it seems like an excellent deal because one week in a 2 bedroom rents for $5000-$8000 per week with an ocean view, I believe.

Yes. Marriott is one of the best ownership's and I do agree that the best way to get them is resale.

 

[mauiredweek]

Just doing a survey. Is owning a Marriott timeshare week still popular? Are Marriott weeks still in demand by timeshare owners? Even though maintenance fees are going up, are owners still okay with owning Marriott weeks? We just bought a 2 bedroom lockoff for a very low upfront fee and we feel it is a good deal compared to the cost of renting a small hotel room for a week in the same location. Plus we can deposit the studio and get one week for almost free elsewhere. If you buy where you want to use, like Hawaii, it seems like an excellent deal because one week in a 2 bedroom rents for $5000-$8000 per week with an ocean view, I believe.

YES, the annual fee is reasonable compared to what a rental would cost, and if you have a 2 BR you can split it and rent that half. Marriott is one of the best programs out there.

 

[RussellSun]

Maui's Real Property tax rates ($/1000 of assessed valuation) effective July 1, 2017:
A. Residential - $5.54
B. Apartment - $6.32
C. Commercial - $7.28
D. Industrial - $7.49
E. Agricultural - $6.01
F. Conservation - $6.37
G. Hotel Resort - $9.37
H. Time Share - $15.43
I. Homeowner - $2.86
J. Commercialized Residential - $4.56

Yes, they have several tax rates and the County people do their best to soak the transients/tourists.

All places dependent on tourism do this. It’s normal. This is how Florida survives given they have no state income tax. The Caribbean does the same thing too.

 

[RussellSun]

YES, the annual fee is reasonable compared to what a rental would cost, and if you have a 2 BR you can split it and rent that half. Marriott is one of the best programs out there.

]

In the past 12 years, the cheapest I have paid for a one week rental in any island in Hawaii was $3400 for a studio. I have paid much more for hotel rooms in Hawaii. $2200 for a 2 bedroom with a full kitchen and an ocean view in Hawaii sounds like paradise to me. I think this is why Marriott is raising MFs. They know they can rent these units out for a lot more themselves if owners do not want to pay the MFs anymore. Remember, most people do not know TUG and Redweek exist and do not like renting from owners on VRBO or places like that. It feels too risky. Most people rent through Expedia or the hotels themselves. I used to only rent through reputable booking companies and not direct from owners before. A Marriott 2 bedroom with ocean view in Expedia rents for $8300 including tax on Expedia in the summer. Aulani next door rents for a lot more for a smaller size 2 bedroom. I think they rent for $400 more than the 2 bedroom Marriotts per night because they are Disney.

 

[csodjd]

Sounds good. Which Hawaii timeshare is this? Is it annual? Do they have EOY and lock offs?

Lagoon Tower, Hilton Hawaiian Village. Annual, platinum year (which means all year except two weeks of Xmas/New Year). No lock offs.

One thing nice with Hilton/Lagoon Tower is August is a big holiday time in Japan and demand for rooms at the Lagoon Tower from Japanese visitors is very high, meaning excellent rental opportunity/value at that time as a "fail safe." If I can't use my TS in, say, 2018, I just book my 2-bed OV room for August, and there's no problem renting it for a multiple of the MF. (For instance, right now there is nothing available for August 2018, and July asking price is $4000/wk. on Redbook.)

Marriott Maui is similar, but the margin between MF and rental is smaller due to the higher MF.

 

[Ralph Sir Edward]

There are a lot of ways to compare values, as many as there are people. Let me give a list of questions.

Is there a "must have" island?
Is there a "must have" view?
Is oceanfront a "must have, or a "don't care", or even "no way, Jose'"?
Are you a trader, or a own-for-use person?
If you are a trader, is a lock-off a necessity?
Are you willing to rent from individuals?
Do you need "prime time", or are you "shoulder season" person?
How fancy of a pool do you require?
Are you a "restaurant" person, or "cook in the kitchen" person?
How much are you willing to spend, with continually inflating MF's for your vacation?
Do you have to have a "Big Name" seal of approval for your timeshare?
High rise or low rise?

And this just scratches the surface. Depending on how you answer these questions, you set the value, the "apple", for your comparison. Also, in doing so, you are setting the parameters for your comparisons. I'll use myself as an example.

Is there a "must have" island? YES - Big Island
Is there a "must have" view? NO
Is oceanfront a "must have, or a "don't care", or even "no way, Jose'"? NO WAY JOSE'
Are you a trader, or a own-for-use person? OWN FOR USE
If you are a trader, is a lock-off a necessity? NO
Are you willing to rent from individuals? YES
Do you need "prime time", or are you "shoulder season" person? PRIME TIME
How fancy of a pool do you require? NOT FANCY
Are you a "restaurant" person, or "cook in the kitchen" person? COOK IN THE KITCHEN
How much are you willing to spend, with continually inflating MF's for your vacation? LOW to MEDIUM PRICE
Do you have to have a "Big Name" seal of approval for your timeshare? YES
High rise or low rise? LOW RISE

So, for me. . . The main "Big Name" on the BI is HGVC. Their quality is comparable to Marriott (I've owned both). Of the HGVC properties, Bay Club is comfortable and spacious, but lacking the fancy amenities of a "super resort". It also lacks the price of the "super resort". I am not a trader, so lock-offs and trading value are meaningless to me. No particular view, but then again, I don't care about views, anyways. Current MF price for a top floor (of 3 floors), between $1500 and $1600 a week. I can afford 3 weeks a year, at that price. (In January to February, in a block, thank you. . . And by the way, the total purchase cost for 3 weeks odd and 1 week even (still working on the even weeks) has been about $5700, funded by selling 2 weeks back to Marriott, for $5300.)

Your choices will define you. . .