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In Superstar Cities The Rich Get Richer

Discussion in 'TUG Lounge' started by TravelTime, Nov 8, 2018.

  1. TravelTime

    TravelTime TUG Member

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    New York and Washington are leaving the rest of the country behind. Companies like Amazon explain why.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/11/07/...Homepage&action=click&module=&pgtype=Homepage

    In the end, even Amazon has behaved according to this rule: In the modern tech economy, cities that already have wealth, opportunity, highly educated workers and high salaries will just keep attracting more of them.

    Of all its options across North America, the company appears to have narrowed its sights to New York and suburban Washington for a huge expansion of high-paying tech jobs. The 11th-hour decision to split its “second headquarters,” as Amazon is expected to announce shortly, makes the pattern only more glaring.

    A small number of rich and internationally connected cities keep increasing their economic advantages — and as a result, the inequality widens between them and everywhere else.

    Because of the pull of “superstar” cities, economists and policymakers fear what will happen elsewhere if the winners keep winning while many smaller communities are left behind. It’s possible Amazon executives genuinely believed a year ago that they might find a more surprising home (many observers are not so charitable). But, ultimately, the superstar magnet pulls them, too.
     
  2. chapjim

    chapjim TUG Member

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    "Suburban Washington" turns out to be a development called Crystal City in Arlington, adjacent to Reagan National Airport and across I-395 from the Pentagon and extending for a couple of miles south along US Route 1.

    I haven't heard an exact location but there is a mostly undeveloped lot adjacent to Army-Navy drive between Eads and Fern Streets. https://www.google.com/maps/@38.8635685,-77.0562044,698m/data=!3m1!1e3

    I've wondered for years how that lot managed to remain vacant.

    Apartments and condos have a very high occupancy rate and prices will go even higher than they are now. Crystal City has no single family homes.

    Edit: I should add that Crystal City is hardly a new development. I first came here in 1981 and it wasn't new then. However, it has grown steadily. Crystal Drive, which has office buildings, condos/apartments, restaurant, and shops, was a gravel construction road the first time I came here. I've worked here since 1985.

    Crystal City, Pentagon City and Pentagon Row add up to a pretty large neighborhood.

    There was a minor panic when the entire Naval Material establishment (NAVAIR, NAVSEA, NAVSUP, and NAVELEX/SPAWAR) moved out because "the rent was too damn high!" Then again when the Patent & Trademark Bureau left. No worries. Crystal City has lots of restaurants and shops, two shopping centers (Pentagon City and Potomac Yard, a strip shopping center a bit south on US Route 1), two Metro rail stations (three if you count the Pentagon), an airport, and the Pentagon (think $$$$$) within walking distance of a lot of it. I doubt we'll ever see tumbleweeds in Crystal City.
     
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2018
  3. Patri

    Patri Tug Review Crew: Rookie TUG Member

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    If this bothers the rest of America, stop buying from Amazon.
     
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  4. chapjim

    chapjim TUG Member

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    If people are upset that Amazon chose Arlington, VA over Steubenville, OH, they should buy from WalMart, WalMart.com, or Family Dollar. But don't blame Amazon for locating in a place that meets its requirements.

    As it turns out, the occupancy rate in office space in Crystal City is not terribly high -- something like 80%. So, it's conceivable that Amazon could occupy vacant space and consolidate as other leases expire.

    Not long ago, the landlord completely gutted two office buildings that were occupied by the Naval Air Systems Command until 1997 and then by the National Guard Bureau. And I mean gutted -- you could see through the buildings. Nothing but floors and pillars.

    Your - possessive. You're - you are. Yer - either/both.
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2018 at 5:25 PM
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  5. bizaro86

    bizaro86 TUG Member

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    In the last century, farm labor became hugely surplus, and people migrated to cities.

    In this century, it appears that trend is expanding to small towns and cities becoming unsustainable, and people migrating largely into global cities.
     
  6. plpgma

    plpgma TUG Member

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    Hmmm...It does seems to send a foreboding signal to rural America, doesn't it?! I happen to live in the DC metro area and, while I've enjoyed my property values rise, I must be humble and admit that I bought at a time when the values were more normal (albeit were still higher than the non-DC metro areas). Aside from the foreboding future that such trends seem to signaling, another personal downside is that my own kids are beginning to find it difficult to find affordable real estate that isn't well over an hour northwest of the city. This lament, of course, is trivial compared to areas in rural America losing the opportunity for mass job creation.
     
  7. TravelTime

    TravelTime TUG Member

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    While this sounds sad, I realized that the places the article calls “city” was not considered to be city just 20 years ago. Amazon is going into Long Island and suburban Virginia. I don’t know about Virginia, but I know New York. Long Island is not the city, or at least it was not in the recent past. As population explodes, the concept of a “city” is expanding to include regional areas that are huge geographically. This is helping the suburbs and rural areas since areas previously considered to be suburbs are now considered to be part of the city and rural areas are now suburbs. Or you can look at it the other way. Our beautiful countryside is being urbanized.
     
    Last edited: Nov 8, 2018
  8. heathpack

    heathpack Tug Review Crew: Rookie TUG Member

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    They are going into Long Island City, which in Queens, one of the five boroughs of NYC. Queens has been part of NYC since 1898, way longer than 20 years.

    Two of the five boroughs of NYC are on Long Island- Queens and Brooklyn. This has been an urban area for a really long time. My Dad was born in Brooklyn in 1929 and grew up in Brooklyn and Queens. He grew up “in the city” and then when he got married “moved out onto the island” (ie Long Island). Even though the whole time he lived geographically on Long Island, there’s a clear distinction between “city” and “island” for people who are native to the NY Metro area.
     
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  9. TravelTime

    TravelTime TUG Member

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    Yes I know. I was born in Long Island and lived in Brooklyn and Manhattan. Went to grad school at Columbia. I should have said Long Island City to avoid confusion. In my experience, Long Island City is not the City. It was always an outsider. Queens is still inferior in the hierarchy. Brooklyn has moved way up in the hierarchy. Twenty years ago the five Burroughs were a major urban area but they were NOT the City and they were considered a suburb of Manhattan. A lot has changed in the past 20 years. That was my point. Cities are expanding their definition now.

    I live in the Silicon Valley now. Twenty years ago, San Francisco was the star. Now people are perfectly happy living in the greater Bay Area as the region has expanded into a mega region. Many people completely avoid San Francisco due to the congestion. The population of the city of San Jose way exceeds the city of Sam Francisco.

    I am sure the same trends are happening in Los Angeles. People says they live in LA but most likely, they live in a suburb.
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2018
  10. heathpack

    heathpack Tug Review Crew: Rookie TUG Member

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    Ok. Except that Long Island City, being a part of Queens, one of the five boroughs of NYC is literally in NYC and has been for well over 100 years!
     
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  11. TravelTime

    TravelTime TUG Member

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    The problem with the definition of New York City is that people do not know the difference between Manhattan and New York City. They hear NYC and they think Manhattan.

    The Bronx is part of NYC but I doubt anyone thinks of that!

    I understand what you are saying. In the olden days, Manhattan was “the City” and the other Burroughs were often thought of as suburbs of “the City” even though they are all technically part of NYC. I still have friends in Manhattan who think this way.

    I remember in 1989 or so when Citibank moved a major headquarters to Long Island City and my classmates were freaked out about having to go across the river to work there. It was considered the boondocks back then.
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2018
  12. am1

    am1 TUG Member

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    "Born on Long Island." Not in. Queens and the rest (maybe not SI) are part of the city. At least for people living on Long Island.
     
  13. mpumilia

    mpumilia TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    I'm a New Yorker. Born in the Bronx but at 3 years old moved to what was then a rural area (Rockland County)- played on farms and in apple orchards and in the woods. Now it is a suburb.

    My husband was born in Manhattan and grew up in Brooklyn. We now live in what is a rural area and the area could really use some good jobs - even if in the cities that are just a half hour to an hour from here.

    To me- Long Island is like one big flat concrete city with the population and traffic to match.
     
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  14. Ralph Sir Edward

    Ralph Sir Edward TUG Member

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    The rich get richer. . .

    I guess it depends on your definition of rich. You can only measure living between cities by the concept of Purchase Price Parity (PPP). In other words, what will your money buy you?

    Example: I have a niece, who bought a house near Pleasanton, California. It cost her $875,000 (frame farmhouse, built in 1928, around 1700 sq ft). I have a house in Plano, Texas (brick exterior, built in 1982, around 2300 sq ft). It would sell for around $300,000 today.

    She makes $150K, I make $85K. She pays higher Federal taxes (higher bracket), state income taxes (none in Texas), and higher property taxes. Question. Who is more affluent (richer)?
     
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  15. TravelTime

    TravelTime TUG Member

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    Why do you say SI is not part of NYC?
     
  16. am1

    am1 TUG Member

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    Not part of the "city". Yes it is one of the 5.
     
  17. SmithOp

    SmithOp TUG Member

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    Ho hum, nothing new here that history has not already proven. Textile production was the start of the industrial revolution over 200 years ago and people started to move to where the jobs were, cities grew, its what they do.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
     
  18. TravelTime

    TravelTime TUG Member

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    Okay, got it now.
     
  19. mpumilia

    mpumilia TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    In NY there is a movement that wants to separate the NYC metropolitan area (downstate) from upstate NY and make upstate a new state called "New Amsterdam" or whatever. In this scenario downstate would be a District, like Washington DC is.
     
  20. MabelP

    MabelP TUG Member

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    Perfectly said for those who live in the Bay Area. Thank you.
     
  21. bluehende

    bluehende TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    I cannot believe NYC would give up any senatorial representation and voting rights in the house.
     
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  22. bizaro86

    bizaro86 TUG Member

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    Yeah, NYC won't give up its right to vote for Senator, I very much doubt they could get approval to split (and therefore get 2 more senators for NY State)
     
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  23. SmithOp

    SmithOp TUG Member

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    Its all talk, same thing out here, been talking for years about splitting up California. The Senate system is ridiculous, only two for the high population states yet North and South Dakota get 2 each. Those two should be merged.


    Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
     
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  24. DaveNW

    DaveNW TUG Review Crew: Expert TUG Member

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    I think people need to consider what Amazon will be doing in the area with their facility, and what they need in an employment force: They need fast turnaround for orders, close access to a major airport, and ready availability of a high number of semi-tech-savvy people who are willing to work hard and fast, for a questionable wage. Both of those cities will provide that.

    Expecting Amazon to open a major hub in an unincorporated rural area in the midwest isn't practical, nor would it fit their growing model for same-day deliveries. That is not to say they couldn't open a hub in the midwest in the future, but at this time, being in/near a major urban area on the east coast makes more sense. Flights out of Reagan go all over the eastern half of the country with great frequency.

    But what do I know? Depending on who you ask - not much. ;)

    Dave
     
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  25. bizaro86

    bizaro86 TUG Member

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    I don't think anyone thought an unincorporated rural area had a chance, but somewhere like Dallas or Atlanta met all the requirements easily as well, with a much lower cost of living.
     
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