Hyatt Waived ROFR!!!

[TravelTime]

While I agree completely with your explanation of Marriott's motives and correct identification of their preferred stakeholders (shareholders always receive priority over their customers), I can easily explain why there may be resentment against Marriott or--in this forum--Hyatt. When the developers attempt to change the system from what was originally sold to buyers and thereby reduce the value of the original purchase equation, there is plenty of room for resentment. Hyatt owners don't resent Marriott, but there is a lot of mistrust that's been created over the past year or so since Hyatt introduced the Hyatt Points Program. It's a blatant ripoff of the points buyers and potentially affects the fixed week owners although, thankfully, the Points Program has been so wildly unsuccessful that the small population of Points owners have not been able to substantially affect the legacy owners from securing what they already own.

Ultimately, of course, corporations must walk the tightrope between keeping their customers happy while generating attractive earnings for their shareholders. When customers feel the corporation is juicing earnings on their backs by reducing the value of the product and/or too aggressively increasing pricing, that's when resentment builds.

Every Hyatt owner's sentiment is personal and individual to them, but my own snese from reading these Boards is that Hyatt legacy owners are very cautious right now with Hyatt management. Resentment is too strong a word for it. Watchful would be more accurate.

Yes, I did not mean Marriott specifically. It was inclusive of all the reputable American timeshare companies. I own Marriott and Westin so I tend to read those posts the most. I might be an optimist but I believe Marriott and other high quality hotel brands are trying to balance customer satisfaction with shareholder value. The thing is that sometimes I read emotionally charged accusations against Marriott, Hyatt and Vistana. I do not believe they are trying to rip us off. I expect things will change and evolve but since I bought resale at great prices, I am okay with that. I have factored in my initial investment and maintenance fees and assume MFs will go up and benefits associated with various levels will change. All the travel companies are constantly changing the number of points it takes to book. At least MVC, DVC and probably the others do not change the number of points at existing resorts.

Sometimes they even improve things for existing owners with grandfathering. Hyatt recently upgraded many Key West week owners to Platinum status, giving them more points. That seems like a huge win for the existing owners.

I think the MFs are a bargain for the room size, views and quality I can get compared to hotels. I still stay at hotels sometimes and pay cash. It is more expensive per night than my MFs for just a small hotel room.

Thank you TUG for showing us how to buy resale. I feel worse for people who bought retail because they lose 75% of their upfront fee as soon as the sign and leave. But even many who have bought timeshares retail seem happy if they know how to use their programs.

 

[Kal]

Many owners hold the corporation in low regard because their sales personnel flat out lie to prospective timeshare buyers. We all understand corporate profit needs, but when you look at the details of the maintenance fees, the management line items are unreasonable and gouge the owners.

As an example, a resort needs to upgrade their units. They increase the maintenance fees to cover that upgrade cost. And behold, that increment to the MF never goes away. So the owner is gouged forever.

 

[TravelTime]

Then why do timeshare owners just get out if they feel gouged and taken advantage of?

 

[WalnutBaron]

Then why do timeshare owners just get out if they feel gouged and taken advantage of?

Some do. As Kal has often pointed out here, Hyatt owners (and owners in other systems as well) have to separate the actual ownership experience (which is generally good to great) from the experience of confronting the sales force (which is generally bad to horrific). As an owner of two fixed weeks (at Pinon Pointe in Sedona and Highlands Inn in Carmel) in Hyatt, I can tell you that I am a very happy owner. Hyatt properties are first class in every respect, well-maintained, beautifully manicured, and ultimately relaxing. Hyatt has done a great job of holding down maintenance fee increases so that ownership is affordable as long as you buy resale. Resale owners have nearly all rights that retail owners have, with the main exception being that resale owners cannot convert points to World Of Hyatt hotel points, which is a lousy value in any case--and therefore no big deal not to have.

If I were a Points owner, however, I would have a whole different opinion. The value equation is much different, the costs are much higher, and the resale value is virtually zero.

Bottom line: if you're thinking of buying into Hyatt (which is a very good system), I'd encourage it--as long as you buy a fixed Platinum or Diamond week at a location you will enjoy and can visit regularly. From other posts you've left, I see that you're from the Bay Area--meaning Carmel might be a really good option for you. Why focus on Platinum or Diamond? Because even though the initial buy-in is more expensive than Gold or Silver, you're getting access at peak demand seasons and paying the same maintenance fees as the Gold and Silver owners.

 

[ivywag]

I have an opportunity to buy a week 25 (late June) 1BR with ocean view at Highlands Inn from a friend. It is Platinum season so would receive 2,000 points if we wanted to use it for an internal exchange. I understand MF's are around $1,250 plus property tax. We have visited the resort in the past as we used to live in the San Jose area, but aren't sure we would want to stay there for a full week.

I have heard that Highlands Inn may not be a favored resort unless you like to use your week there, because the MF's are relatively high. I would appreciate insights on that point. Also, what price do you think would clear ROFR considering the earlier posts and what the market currently bares?

Thanks.

Mike

June Gloom! We don't mind and curl up by the fireplace, but if you want views they are often only of the fog that time of year!

 

[mjm1]

June Gloom! We don't mind and curl up by the fireplace, but if you want views they are often only of the fog that time of year!

Agreed. We used to live in San Jose and I grew up in Half Moon Bay, so we are aware of the June gloom effect. Southern CA has that as well.

Carmel and the Monterey peninsula are beautiful, and even more so when the sun is out. The color of the water along the 17 mile drive when it is sunny is stunning.

Best regards.

Mike

 

[AJCts411]

Yes, I did not mean Marriott specifically. It was inclusive of all the reputable American timeshare companies. I own Marriott and Westin so I tend to read those posts the most. I might be an optimist but I believe Marriott and other high quality hotel brands are trying to balance customer satisfaction with shareholder value. The thing is that sometimes I read emotionally charged accusations against Marriott, Hyatt and Vistana. I do not believe they are trying to rip us off. I expect things will change and evolve but since I bought resale at great prices, I am okay with that. I have factored in my initial investment and maintenance fees and assume MFs will go up and benefits associated with various levels will change. All the travel companies are constantly changing the number of points it takes to book. At least MVC, DVC and probably the others do not change the number of points at existing resorts.

Sometimes they even improve things for existing owners with grandfathering. Hyatt recently upgraded many Key West week owners to Platinum status, giving them more points. That seems like a huge win for the existing owners.

I think the MFs are a bargain for the room size, views and quality I can get compared to hotels. I still stay at hotels sometimes and pay cash. It is more expensive per night than my MFs for just a small hotel room.

Thank you TUG for showing us how to buy resale. I feel worse for people who bought retail because they lose 75% of their upfront fee as soon as the sign and leave. But even many who have bought timeshares retail seem happy if they know how to use their programs.

IMO. specifically to Key West, the maintenance fees are far less than renting. The rent in an old town key west B&B or smaller property for a larger one bed room is about 150% that of maintenance fees at Hyatt Sunset (and the hotels...$$$) And that is comparing to my two bedroom unit vs a one bed studio. So I agree maintenance fees are a bargain in KW.
I also had a week (gold) past ROFR at Sunset, which i thought would not of had a chance, the owner just wanted out. And I do watch resales adds and they are noticeably climbing in the Old Town area of KW, since this Marriott announcement, not sure that is connected.

I have to wonder, what is going on in the exchange world, and points at both Hyatt and Marriott. The high cost of purchases and points. Is it a bloated corporation or greed that drives the costs up? How does one justify 10's of thousands of dollars for a point system or a fixed week that the market says is worth 25% of what you paid, or even zero?

If one were to pay say 20K for enough points for ( or even a one week deed), theoretically in a sense, a unit must be worth nearly 1M including gross margins? Then add maintenance fees? I think that's were the "points" systems by never ending increases, will fail no matter what they call it, and fact is Tug is educating the people of the market value of TS's.

Just my perspective, own 2 weeks in KW, and use various other methods to rent (II, AIRBnB, home away, direct, tour operators) vacations in the Caribbean, and other USA destinations with very good success.

Great site! Exceptional knowledge!

 

[WalnutBaron]

Some do. As Kal has often pointed out here, Hyatt owners (and owners in other systems as well) have to separate the actual ownership experience (which is generally good to great) from the experience of confronting the sales force (which is generally bad to horrific). As an owner of two fixed weeks (at Pinon Pointe in Sedona and Highlands Inn in Carmel) in Hyatt, I can tell you that I am a very happy owner. Hyatt properties are first class in every respect, well-maintained, beautifully manicured, and ultimately relaxing. Hyatt has done a great job of holding down maintenance fee increases so that ownership is affordable as long as you buy resale. Resale owners have nearly all rights that retail owners have, with the main exception being that resale owners cannot convert points to World Of Hyatt hotel points, which is a lousy value in any case--and therefore no big deal not to have.

If I were a Points owner, however, I would have a whole different opinion. The value equation is much different, the costs are much higher, and the resale value is virtually zero.

Bottom line: if you're thinking of buying into Hyatt (which is a very good system), I'd encourage it--as long as you buy a fixed Platinum or Diamond week at a location you will enjoy and can visit regularly. From other posts you've left, I see that you're from the Bay Area--meaning Carmel might be a really good option for you. Why focus on Platinum or Diamond? Because even though the initial buy-in is more expensive than Gold or Silver, you're getting access at peak demand seasons and paying the same maintenance fees as the Gold and Silver owners.

As if to back up the point that timeshare ownership is a MUCH different experience from dealing with timeshare salespeople (or "sales weasels", as we affectionately refer to them here on TUG), I commend to fellow TUGgers this article, published today, from The Timeshare Guru's blog. It does a great job of exposing the lies and deception used by the weasels--in this case, at Hyatt Wild Oak Ranch.

 

[bdurstta]

Nice to hear ROFR aren't happening as much these days...we had one go through last year for Carmel Highlands and I was happy over that. However...yes...all the changes in the Hyatt program. I don't like the fact that they are "selling point small packages for $13K" just to get you into the points program (I would have JUMPED at it if they had charged about $1500 or so like Marriott did a few years ago to convert).

There are many changes coming down the pike...lots of changes...but for the time being...I own where I like to go (Carmel)!

 

[Sapper]

As if to back up the point that timeshare ownership is a MUCH different experience from dealing with timeshare salespeople (or "sales weasels", as we affectionately refer to them here on TUG), I commend to fellow TUGgers this article, published today, from The Timeshare Guru's blog. It does a great job of exposing the lies and deception used by the weasels--in this case, at Hyatt Wild Oak Ranch.

The last time we went to Wild Oak, the sales lady literally chased after us trying to get us to attend an “owners update”. After reading that article, I wonder if the sales push there has become worse. Sad to see Hyatt stoop to this point.

 

[Tucsonadventurer]

As if to back up the point that timeshare ownership is a MUCH different experience from dealing with timeshare salespeople (or "sales weasels", as we affectionately refer to them here on TUG), I commend to fellow TUGgers this article, published today, from The Timeshare Guru's blog. It does a great job of exposing the lies and deception used by the weasels--in this case, at Hyatt Wild Oak Ranch.

It is a great article that captures the experience well. It is humorous but sadly is accurate