Hilton Club conversion rate 1/50 for HHoner points

[Cyberc]

Ok, so this conversation has me completely confused about the NY properties and Hilton/Residence clubs.

I'm glad I live on the west coast and prefer Hawaii. I've only been to W57th once using my HGVC points through RCI. I really don't need to go ever again.

We have stayed a few times at W57 and at the Hilton club, we do think both places are nice, but we can't justify the buy-in price. We went to an owners update last year and they offered us the Residence club in NYC. We could get 7.200 points annually for approx $27k if we traded our resale vegas property.

We have stayed at both places for 2.400 hgvc points for a week through RCI (to us thats approx $250 in MF + $219 in exchange fees)and even without the lounge access you can buy a lot of food and beer/wine for the amount saved in MF but also in the buyin price.

Everyone to his own, but I would enjoy to own in NYC but with the current prices I just can't justify it - if/when prices come down I might coinsider it again.

After reading that you are able to purchase a smaller package at either W57 or the residence club and then use all of your points 9months out it definitely has my attention.

So if Hilton would be so kind to sell me just 1 point at either place i'll dont mind over paying comparing to what others have paid for a full package. 100$ should cover it

 

[brp]

Ok, so this conversation has me completely confused about the NY properties and Hilton/Residence clubs.

I don't know the nuances of Hilton Club New York versus Residences, but I do know that W 57th (where we own) is a different beastie from either of these with its own rules. We used to own at HCNY, but that was before Residences came to be, and this was, again a different beastie.

My understanding is that W 57th <> HCNY <> Residences <> HGVC.

Now, some of these allow you into others of these with reduced windows, and some don't. There are also rules about lounge access depending upon how one gets into these places as a non-owner.

Cheers.

 

[brp]

Everyone to his own, but I would enjoy to own in NYC but with the current prices I just can't justify it - if/when prices come down I might coinsider it again.

I don't expect that they will. I don't know how current prices compare to the original, direct offering prices at release (although the salesweaels would have us believe that these have only gone up in price), but they've been pretty stable for a while now. We did buy, but expect to be able to sell at, or near, what we paid whenever we do decide to sell. But, yes, it is a sizeable initial outlay.

Cheers.

 

[brp]

Everyone to his own, but I would enjoy to own in NYC but with the current prices I just can't justify it - if/when prices come down I might coinsider it again.

I don't expect that they will. I don't know how current prices compare to the original, direct offering prices at release (although the salesweaels would have us believe that these have only gone up in price), but they've been pretty stable for a while now. We did buy, but expect to be able to sell at, or near, what we paid whenever we do decide to sell. But, yes, it is a sizeable initial outlay.

Cheers.

 

[SmithOp]

After reading that you are able to purchase a smaller package at either W57 or the residence club and then use all of your points 9months out it definitely has my attention.

So if Hilton would be so kind to sell me just 1 point at either place i'll dont mind over paying comparing to what others have paid for a full package. 100$ should cover it

IF this is true then everyone would be doing it and there just aren't enough weeks in the system to support it. All the owners trading out for 50:1 HHonors points are giving their usage to Hilton to sell for cash, so that is even less inventory for HGVC point owners. Frankly, I don't believe it, its like a ponzi scheme bound to crash.




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[CalGalTraveler]

As stated previously, the 50:1 is fixed to the unit because it is part of the home week process. This is a hard cost to HGVC because it is arms length with Hilton.

Unless I am missing something here. I am not sure why you would consider hybrid points a Ponzi scheme. HGVC points still need to be used to reserve the unit; it's simply shifting HGVC inventory points around the board and creates inventory in Vegas or Kingsland etc. because of the trade. It does not incur additional cost for HGVC.

How is this any different than people arbitraging RCI to trade back into HGVC to stretch your points?

or trading Vegas to use Hawaii?

Most people just buy NYC and newer Oahu units and don't care about the cost. Consider that despite Tug being around for 20 years, people still buy from the developer.

 

[SmithOp]

As stated previously, the 50:1 is fixed to the unit because it is part of the home week process. This is a hard cost to HGVC because it is arms length with Hilton.

Unless I am missing something here. I am not sure why you would consider hybrid points a Ponzi scheme. HGVC points still need to be used to reserve the unit; it's simply shifting HGVC inventory points around the board and creates inventory in Vegas because of the trade. It does not create additional cost for HGVC.

How is this any different than people arbitraging RCI to trade back into HGVC to stretch your points?

or

Setting up a separate RCI account to deposit your unit and trading back into HGVC beyond the 9 month mark?

I understand the 50:1 conversion, it benefits Hilton because they can rent the week you convert for more money in NYC.

The ponzi scheme is selling a small contract and allowing you to book NYC with all your HGVC points wherever they are based. NYC is a finite supply, its not likely to expand like Vegas or Waikoloa so there isn't a lot of slack to allow unlimited booking. Look how difficult it is to book Lagoon tower at HHV.



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[CalGalTraveler]

I understand the 50:1 conversion, it benefits Hilton because they can rent the week you convert for more money in NYC.

The ponzi scheme is selling a small contract and allowing you to book NYC with all your HGVC points wherever they are based. NYC is a finite supply, its not likely to expand like Vegas or Waikoloa so there isn't a lot of slack to allow unlimited booking. Look how difficult it is to book Lagoon tower at HHV.

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It's not a free lunch. You still have to own there and pay a premium over the rest of the system for the right to do it. Many people are unwilling to buy in at that cost and there are a finite set of units to buy.

If I could buy a small contract at Grand Islander and use my other points to book during the reservation period, I would consider buying there. HGVC wins because they sell a low end unit that would be difficult to sell. Otherwise, I will continue to arbitrage my Vegas into the other Oahu properties - and they sell nothing.

It's a win for HGVC because they sell the building out faster and can move onto their next project. As long as the maintenance money is being paid, they should not care. In fact this would probably reduce the default rate on lower end units because people would be more likely to keep them which improves the stability of the HOA and stabilizes resale values. This would also encourage small ownership as a portfolio into the Residences too.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

One other reason this is not a ponzi scheme is that owners still have all rights to book their home week from 12 months to 9 months. Hybrid applies to the Resort Reservation Window (9 months to 45 days) which is similar to club reservations for but for owners at the property. People arbitrage Vegas for Hawaii during club windows all the time and compete with existing Lagoon Tower owners for reservations. Lagoon Tower owners can extend their stay during club windows using points from Vegas properties they own. So what's the difference if this is a club window just for owners? Owners can book their home week ahead of everyone else to reserve their unit if desired.

 

[hurnik]

One other reason this is not a ponzi scheme is that owners still have all rights to book their home week from 12 months to 9 months. Hybrid applies to the Resort Reservation Window (9 months to 45 days) which is similar to club reservations for but for owners at the property. People arbitrage Vegas for Hawaii during club windows all the time and compete with existing Lagoon Tower owners for reservations. Lagoon Tower owners can extend their stay during club windows using points from Vegas properties they own. So what's the difference if this is a club window just for owners? Owners can book their home week ahead of everyone else to reserve their unit if desired.

Hmmm, the club rules seem to indicate otherwise, unless I'm misreading:

Home Resort Priority
reservations are made at the resort at which a Member has an ownership interest for any number of nights in any unit type available (subject
to Member ClubPoint availability – Home Resort Priority reservations may only be made using Club Points).

Home Resort Priority reservations are only available to owners at West 57th Street by Hilton Club (also known as 57th Street Vacation Suites), The Residences by Hilton Club (also known as HC Suites) and The District by Hilton Club (also known as TD Suites). Home Resort Priority
reservations may only be made using ClubPoints associated with the specific ownership interest at that resort. Home Resort Priority reservations may be made nine (9) months (276 days) prior to the check-out date up to forty-five (45) days in advance of the check-out date for West 57th Street by Hilton Club, and up to sixty (60) days in advance of checkout at The Residences by Hilton Club and the District by Hilton Club. Home Resort Priority reservations may be offered at additional resorts in the future or during the first year that a resort is available for occupancy through the Club.

Am I reading this wrong? BTW, this is on page one of the Club Rules PDF

 

[CalGalTraveler]

Had not seen this before. FWIW...if this is limited, HGVC hurts themselves for the reasons stated above because it disincents buying premium properties from them. But as we know, HGVC is a profit making entity and can change rules like this at any time. I also still do not know if the reservation system has the sophistication to differentiate pulling an additional point from current year Vegas, other HGVC property, or borrowing from NYC next year. How does it know if I want to avoid pulling my current NYC points to trade into Hawaii this year because I want to use my NY points next year, versus using Vegas or other property? The system has issues with basics such as changing reservations. Tracking this would make my head explode.

Lastly, "Clubpoints associated with the specific ownership interest" is vague and can be construed several ways.

 

[ccwu]

Had not seen this before. FWIW...if this is limited, HGVC hurts themselves for the reasons stated above because it disincents buying newer properties from them. But as we know, HGVC is a profit making entity and can change rules like this at any time. I also still do not know if the reservation system has the sophistication to differentiate pulling an additional point from current year Vegas, other HGVC property, or borrowing from NYC next year. How does it know if I want to avoid pulling my current NYC points to trade into Hawaii versus using Vegas or other property? The system has issues with basics such as changing reservations. Tracking this would make my head explode.

Lastly, "Clubpoints associated with the specific ownership interest" is vague and can be construed several ways.

The system is using the oldest points first. If you cancel, it will return the point that was used in the specific cancelled reservation. You have choice only if you have bonus points. It will ask you if you want to club points or bonus point before the confirming the reservation. I have many properties. It never differentiate the points I use is from which property. It just identify it by year. I had some saved 2017 points that can not be save any more. But I used up all 2018 and half of 2019. I call the rep to find out why I have 2017 points that I can not save any more. I was told those were saved from 2016 and I just cancelled. I ask why the system did not use them first, I was told that the weeks I used in the past reservations (before I called them last week), has some 2018 and 2019 points. They could switch the points for us if the reservation with future points were still open. Now I had to make more reservations to use the saved 2016 points, or deposit in RCI or donate it.

I do learn to reserve as many as possible and try to use next year's points and not to have saved points. I am using a spreadsheet tracking the reservation with the point year now. we will make sure the older points being used first. If I cancel a reservation, I will check the year the points return. If it is older points, I will switch with the open reservation that has the newer points. we have deeds of almost equal amount from Hawaii, NYC, and Vegas. We actually used all our 2018 NYC residence club booked Hawaii next year to big island and HHV since residence is not opened yet while the points are there for 2018. So we do not have the 16800 to convert to HHoner points as the sales person strongly recommended. We plan to spends a few weeks in Hawaii (we also reserved for friends to travel with us) and a few weeks in Utah and Breckenridge skiing. We could not reserve NYC Hilton residence club since it it not open for reservation yet. We may spend a few days there when it opens (will borrow 2019 points.) I guess other new owner of NYC Hilton Residence Club would be like us having the points on book and just can not wait to use it.

 

[hurnik]

Had not seen this before. FWIW...if this is limited, HGVC hurts themselves for the reasons stated above because it disincents buying newer properties from them. But as we know, HGVC is a profit making entity and can change rules like this at any time. I also still do not know if the reservation system has the sophistication to differentiate pulling an additional point from current year Vegas, other HGVC property, or borrowing from NYC next year. How does it know if I want to avoid pulling my current NYC points to trade into Hawaii this year because I want to use my NY points next year, versus using Vegas or other property? The system has issues with basics such as changing reservations. Tracking this would make my head explode.

Lastly, "Clubpoints associated with the specific ownership interest" is vague and can be construed several ways.

I agree that the quote you quoted is vague, but did you see the other part I highlighted and underlined? That is quite specific and not vague in any way.

Actually this doesn't disincentivize at all, but actually makes it more valuable. It basically means if you buy at one of the residence clubs, you get priority with those points vs. someone like me who buys in Vegas. Since the residence club points can be used elsewhere, there's no disadvantage at all (other than the atrociously high cost, IMO--ccwu spent $131,800 for their 16,800 points. I could get close to that in Vegas for about $15k or less but of course cant' book W57 or the Residence clubs until a very short window either).

@ccwu :

Are you saying that you have actually booked using NON Residence points a "club" residence with Home Priority online?
I know you said what the sales person said, but to be quite frank, they lie all the time. I was told that I could use bonus points a certain way when I first bought and it was completely untrue. When I upgraded, I was told my MF would go down, and that was an outright lie as well. Although the only way to know for sure would be for you to book 2 years worth of Residence Club (so 16,800 points x 2 since you can borrow from next year--assuming you had no saved points) at the "long" window and then try to use your non-Club points to book at say, 9 months out. Although I think what may be happening is that you have such a large pool of Residence points (coupled with the borrowing feature) that it's not working the way you think it is (since you also had SAVED points, that tells me you're not using all the points).

While it doesn't surprise me that the Hilton IT system may not be able to distinguish, the club rules are quite specific, so it also wouldn't surprise me that IF this loophole exists, it gets closed down shortly.

Although all this is speculation since the club rules clearly state one thing, the sales person stated something else, and we don't have anyone (AFAIK) posting there that has the smallest Residence Club point package (5100 points?) AND another non-Residence club point package to test for us.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

I agree that the quote you quoted is vague, but did you see the other part I highlighted and underlined? That is quite specific and not vague in any way.

This is still vague. I guess we will agree to disagree. This is mountain out of a molehill. What's the evidence of abuse? There is plenty of availability for owners during these windows and large point purchasers have 12 month home week priority over everyone.

Perhaps this is disconcerting because owners (even small ones) can reserve more of the units and make fewer units available to Vegas/Orlando traders and RCI when club season opens? Cry me a river...even small owners paid a hefty premium for the priviledge. AND consider that these owners (both large and small) have more investment and maintenance fees in the system if they also own a Vegas/Orlando or other HGVC property.

HGVC needs to focus on the highest priority issues. Rather than this issue, perhaps the current issue of incentivizing in favor of all Vegas/Orlando ownership is a loophole? It disincents people from buying premium properties. or the issue of non-owners who book club season or trade into NYC/Hawaii etc and then rent it out. Making the IT system work properly. This is a non-issue compared to these wide-scale concerns.

Maybe it was intended, maybe not but this has positive externalities: it rewards owners who pay a premium to buy into into these properties versus trade from Vegas, Orlando or RCI. This is good for HGVC, good for owners, but bad for traders. If they try to limit this, it will only benefit the Vegas and RCI traders because it makes more units available and widens that loophole.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

The system is using the oldest points first. If you cancel, it will return the point that was used in the specific cancelled reservation. You have choice only if you have bonus points. It will ask you if you want to club points or bonus point before the confirming the reservation. I have many properties. It never differentiate the points I use is from which property. It just identify it by year.

This has been my experience as well.

@hurnik After I get points in the new year I will test with some dummy bookings to see if it works (booking/unbooking is free as a W57 owner). We have 5250 but it should allow at least 15750 (3x) to account for banking and borrowing points. I don't know how the system could differentiate what is a "banked NYC" vs "Banked Vegas/other HGVC" because it all sits in one pool.

Realistically, that is more points than we would ever use in NYC because we only book short weekend trips. We love NYC but who wants to stay that long in any city for vacation? Remember you can stay an entire week for only 3750 points gold/5250 platinum. My allotment of 15,750 banking/borrowing could buy me three weeks platinum or 4.2 weeks gold, or 2.2 weeks in a 1 bedroom using only my NYC points. That is a lot of NYC weekends. We would have to go beyond these parameters to dip into non-NYC points. This is probably why this is a non-issue and why we haven't seen abuse.

 

[ccwu]

@ccwu :

Are you saying that you have actually booked using NON Residence points a "club" residence with Home Priority online?

I just contacted the HGVC elite premier services to get the answer. He actually had to keep me hold to check with the supervisor.

1. If I converted all points as the sales person suggested, I lost my right to reserve home week and owners' club reservation. I would only reserve 44 days in advance using HGVC club points.
2. I do not have the points yet, but I could book DC Residence Club 59 days in advance starting as soon as I became owner of NYC residence club. He did not care where the points are from. He said it is NYC residence club thing, complicated... He said DC residence club is the only other residence club for now.
3. The system does not track where the points are from but track two thing - when you convert the whole package, not to exceed total points of the residence club reservation. So I can not reserve more than my total points of 16,800 on owner's club reservations. If I exceeds 16,800, I can only have 44 days window by using HGVC points (but since I am a owner, I can always use the owner's lounge.)

I think either I misunderstood the sales person, or he lied as you said. Sorry. So if I want to use owner's Club reservation to NYC, I need to cancel some Hawaii reservations for 2018. (Part of the shortage is I used 2018 in 2017)

 

[CalGalTraveler]

I just contacted the HGVC elite premier services to get the answer. He actually had to keep me hold to check with the supervisor.

1. If I converted all points as the sales person suggested, I lost my right to reserve home week and owners' club reservation. I would only reserve 44 days in advance using HGVC club points.
2. I do not have the points yet, but I could book DC Residence Club 59 days in advance starting as soon as I became owner of NYC residence club. He did not care where the points are from. He said it is NYC residence club thing, complicated... He said DC residence club is the only other residence club for now.
3. The system does not track where the points are from but track two thing - when you convert the whole package, not to exceed total points of the residence club reservation. So I can not reserve more than my total points of 16,800 on owner's club reservations. If I exceeds 16,800, I can only have 44 days window by using HGVC points (but since I am a owner, I can always use the owner's lounge.)

I think either I misunderstood the sales person, or he lied as you said. Sorry. So if I want to use owner's Club reservation to NYC, I need to cancel some Hawaii reservations for 2018. (Part of the shortage is I used 2018 in 2017)

Thank you @ccwu for sharing how the residences work.

Wouldn't you have at least 54,000 points (16,800 x3) because of banking and borrowing? (or at least 33,600 2018 + 2019 points borrowed because opens next year.)

What does "converting" mean?

 

[hurnik]

Thank you @ccwu for sharing how the residences work.

Wouldn't you have at least 54,000 points (16,800 x3) because of banking and borrowing? (or at least 33,600 2018 + 2019 points borrowed because opens next year.)

What does "converting" mean?

I think maybe he(?) means converting the HGVC points to Hhonors points?

 

[hurnik]

This has been my experience as well.

@hurnik After I get points in the new year I will test with some dummy bookings to see if it works (booking/unbooking costs me nothing as a W57 owner). We have 5250 but it should allow at least 15750 (3x) to account for banking and borrowing points. I don't know how the system could differentiate what is a "banked NYC" vs "Banked Vegas/other HGVC" because it all sits in one pool.

Realistically, that is more points than we would ever use in NYC because we only book short weekend trips. We love NYC but who wants to stay that long in any city for vacation? Remember you can stay an entire week for only 3750 points gold/5250 platinum. My allotment of 15,750 banking/borrowing could buy me three weeks platinum or 4.2 weeks gold, or 2.2 weeks in a 1 bedroom using only my NYC points. That is a lot of NYC weekends. We would have to go beyond these parameters to dip into non-NYC points. This is probably why this is a non-issue and why we haven't seen abuse.

Yeah, I'd have to say it's all very confusing, but after looking at the club rules it begins to make more sense (to me anyway).

And I'd say (just a hunch) that not too many people own multiples of W57th, Residence, and "regular" HGVC, so it's probably not something that's come up.

Plus Residence is really new so there's probably no resales yet (again, just guessing, haven't fact-checked yet).

One the one hand, if HGVC will be using the Residence club model for DC (OK, we know this), Chicago, etc. I'd say then, that IF you could buy the lowest point one of those and combine with your regular (Vegas, Orlando, etc.) HGVC points and then use the total pool to book at the year Priority Window for all Residence Clubs, that'd be really sweet. (Been wanting to go to DC and Chicago).

Probably things will get fleshed out more as they put more of these on the market. In the meantime, when I'm ready for DC, there's a snowballs chance I'd be able to get a full week at the 44 day window, so it'd be a cheaper to do a VRBO (found a nice one really close with decent rental pricing). Had been hoping I could use the 9-month window, but alas. (although I understand given the cost of DC to put a timeshare there).

 

[CalGalTraveler]

And I'd say (just a hunch) that not too many people own multiples of W57th, Residence, and "regular" HGVC, so it's probably not something that's come up.

Plus Residence is really new so there's probably no resales yet (again, just guessing, haven't fact-checked yet).

One the one hand, if HGVC will be using the Residence club model for DC (OK, we know this), Chicago, etc. I'd say then, that IF you could buy the lowest point one of those and combine with your regular (Vegas, Orlando, etc.) HGVC points and then use the total pool to book at the year Priority Window for all Residence Clubs, that'd be really sweet. (Been wanting to go to DC and Chicago).

Probably things will get fleshed out more as they put more of these on the market. In the meantime, when I'm ready for DC, there's a snowballs chance I'd be able to get a full week at the 44 day window, so it'd be a cheaper to do a VRBO (found a nice one really close with decent rental pricing). Had been hoping I could use the 9-month window, but alas. (although I understand given the cost of DC to put a timeshare there).

I agree. It would be nice if a Grand Islander and DC owner could weigh in on how it works for them. We are visiting DC next year on a VIP package (yes you can reserve 9 months in advance) and will report back.

Living on the west coast a 45 day window (or even a 60 day window) is worthless to me. Cannot get economical plane flights and not enough time to plan vacations. Trading RCI only works for a week at a time and a crapshoot on dates. Hard to plan with school schedules. This seems like a benefit for locals who have flexible schedules and don't mind visiting during low season or mid-week and don't mind staying in the low end studios (max. 2 people) without lounge access - aka middle seat basic economy.

We would never buy a bigger NYC package because we don't visit enough to justify the premium. Small package works best because we can reserve long weekends, New Years, Thanksgiving, business trips (with open season), and reserve larger and nicer units (even Penthouse) on relatively short notice with just studio plus points. Although we have many reasons to visit NYC (business/shows/sights/food/European layover), I see no reason to visit DC more than once in a blue moon with family to see the monuments and Smithsonian.

I too look forward to seeing how Residences plays out. Maybe SF.

 

[ccwu]

Thank you @ccwu for sharing how the residences work.

Wouldn't you have at least 54,000 points (16,800 x3) because of banking and borrowing? (or at least 33,600 2018 + 2019 points borrowed because opens next year.)

What does "converting" mean?

Thank you @ccwu for sharing how the residences work.

Wouldn't you have at least 54,000 points (16,800 x3) because of banking and borrowing? (or at least 33,600 2018 + 2019 points borrowed because opens next year.)

What does "converting" mean?

Yes we have at least 54k annually.
I always trying to used future points. We used 2017 points in 2016, and 2018 points in 2016. but when in the end of year, when we cancel a reservation not realize it was saved points from 2016 and that was a little problematic. You always have three years on your account to use on the system. Next year, we will have 2010. I used up to 70K for Hawaii next year. Share with family and friends. They reimburse my maintenance fee.
Convert - converting the 16,800 to hhonor points. We have millions of hhoners points even we used it. HHoner points is growing since we paid maintenance fee and purchasing from Hilton with Amex surpass card. We plan to go to French Polynesian next year while going to Hawaii. Our Hilton Honer points will not go far in Hilton French Polynesian.

 

[ccwu]

Hi
I just want to report that Hilton signed the waiver of my purchase of Hilton Club a few days ago. It took a month from purchase to them signing waiver.
I am happy.

 

[CalGalTraveler]

Congratulations on your purchase @ccwu. This will significantly reduce your cost per point. What are maintenance fees for your NYC units?

 

[JohnPaul]

One the one hand, if HGVC will be using the Residence club model for DC (OK, we know this), Chicago, etc. I'd say then, that IF you could buy the lowest point one of those and combine with your regular (Vegas, Orlando, etc.) HGVC points and then use the total pool to book at the year Priority Window for all Residence Clubs, that'd be really sweet. (Been wanting to go to DC and Chicago).

FWIW the Hilton Club (DC and the Residences so far) model only allows 15 more days advance reservation than anyone else. In other words, since I own at The Residences, I can book DC at 60 days instead of 45 and vice versa. It does not allow me to book a year out or even nine months at a Hilton Club I don't own.

 

[ccwu]

FWIW the Hilton Club (DC and the Residences so far) model only allows 15 more days advance reservation than anyone else. In other words, since I own at The Residences, I can book DC at 60 days instead of 45 and vice versa. It does not allow me to book a year out or even nine months at a Hilton Club I don't own.

Correct. Hilton club is different than Residence Club or 57th Street. It only allows

Congratulations on your purchase @ccwu. This will significantly reduce your cost per point. What are maintenance fees for your NYC units?

owner of Hilton Club to book Hilton club. So that is the advantage of being owner. There is no competition. I could book last minutes if I decide to visit NYC. The reservation is only opened to member of Hilton Club. Non Hilton club member can get to there by sale presentation offer, RCI exchange only. Residence club member can book 57th street like any other HGVC member that only have 45 days window. Residence club member can book other residence club in 60 days window. member of residence club can book home resort 1 year for your home week, or 60 days to 9 months with club reservation. once it opens to other members, the availability will shrink. 57th street may book residence club as other HGVC member in 45 days window. It is reciprocal since Residence club member can not book 57th street until 45 days window. Also only residence club member has privilege to use lounge in any residence club just like owner of 57th street are the only one can use 57th street lounge. Hilton Club member can use their point to reserve any HGVC properties, if they want. (by doing that, they provide inventory for Hilton GVC to offer member for special offer for price and presentation)