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Contract cancellation

Discussion in 'New to Timesharing? Look Here!' started by kambc, Feb 23, 2017.

  1. kambc

    kambc Guest

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    hey all, super newbie here.
    Fiancé and I purchased a timeshare from OVC in Cozumel in January.
    I am laid off as of Friday and will not be able to pay my fees. I have not yet paid a loan payment as it's due March 1. I have paid $2500 CAD for my down payment.
    OVC has told me that they can cut my price in half and that's it so far.
    Is it possible (has anyone managed) to have a cancellation agreement where I can basically walk away from it and they keep my downpayment?
    I'm basically forced to default on them as I have to attempt to pay mortgage and housing related bills first now.
    Also, should I have posted this in the Mexican timeshare section?

    You know when you wish there was the power to see into the future to avoid bad decisions....

    Any help is appreciated, thanks everyone!
     
  2. theo

    theo TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    I am genuinely sorry for your current plight. Unfortunately, you are long past the time frame in which that club contract could have been cancelled (5 days to rescind in Mexico, I believe).

    They are going to keep your down payment in any scenario. It's not clear to me from your post whether a loan was involved. If so, you might want to have at least a free initial consultation with a local attorney regarding your options and any protective measures that you might be able to initiate. The potential good news here is perhaps that OVC, just a vacation club with no actual "ownership" of anything, just a "membership", might just choose to go away on their own once you make it very clear that you are not paying them any more money.

    Whatever you do, please do not fall for any "exit / escape / relief / rescue" operation offering false hope and empty promises. Despite requiring significant upfront money, they cannot and will not actually do anything useful for you when all is said and done. Just don't go there.

    I wish you luck.
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2017
  3. Passepartout

    Passepartout TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    Basically, I'm just seconding Theo's sage advice. I think that all you can do is express to them that due to circumstances beyond your control that you are unable to pay them anything. Not half, not a quarter, zilch, NOTHING. It may take some letters, phone calls, maybe even turning you over to collection. but eventually they will give up. You won't EVER get your down payment back, so kiss it goodbye. Sorry for the expensive lesson, but honestly it wasn't worth anything if you DID pay it off, so maybe this dark cloud has a silver lining.

    Jim
     
  4. kambc

    kambc Guest

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    Yeah no worries about getting the downpayment back.
    And it's not like I hate the timeshare, I love it, but I'm a broke ass now that has to take two minimum wage jobs to scrape by til I find a good job again hah.

    In my credit card payment agreement it states
    "This authority shall remain in full force and effect until the loan balance is paid in full or OVC has received written notification from me if it's termination in such time as to afford OVC as reasonable opportunity to act on it. I have the right to cancel this authorization by written notification received by OVC at least five days prior to my next payment."

    Am I just reading that wrong or can I, in writing, cancel my payments with OVC?
    Technically they don't have my visa anymore because the bank changed my card to a rewards type after we got back from Mexico.

    Theo- it states that I have a membership, not ownership or anything like that. And the contract has mentioned "loan" so I am guessing this is one? I was told at the club that I was paying monthly to "purchase" my timeshare. Obviously I misunderstood that I was taking a loan.
    Thanks for your input already!
     
  5. vacationhopeful

    vacationhopeful TUG Review Crew: Rookie TUG Member

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    Cancel the credit card ... and don't open a new/any account with that bank (the issuer) again. Cancel the wife's credit card (if she has one with the same bank) ... you don't want to find any CC/bank account with that bank suddenly getting zapped by the 'timeshare' company.
     
  6. kambc

    kambc Guest

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    The credit card was already cancelled and it was only my credit card.
    You're saying to not use a visa through my bank now?
     
  7. vacationhopeful

    vacationhopeful TUG Review Crew: Rookie TUG Member

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    To be SAFE ... ask a bank supervisor at your local branch. You are not the FIRST or ONLY customer .. who does NOT want to be charged/zapped for a disputed charge. And that is WHY I prefer to not use my ATM card for recurring bills.. I write & mail checks when I have the money in the account.
     
  8. kambc

    kambc Guest

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    So I've found Default and Appeal Recourses- In case of default or breach by the member, of any term or condition in this membership sale-purchase contract, including, for example, that the member stopped paying any monthly instalment toward the purchase price or interests thereon immediately after the due date, and that said default continued for a period longer than 60 days, in such case, developer will have the right, after notifying the member of the pending payments toward the purchase price: to (i) terminate this membership sale-purchase contract, applying in any case all amounts paid to closure and damages, as well as the membership week, all parties being thus released of all obligations. Or (ii) demand performance of this membership sale-purchase contract and execute the promissory note to collect the total amount owed by the member.


    So (i) would be best case scenario, they keep any and all monies paid and maybe charge a fee for closing?
    And (ii) is worst case, still have to pay in full.
    Sorry for these questions, my brain is not working due to pounding the overtime in my last three days of employment.
     
  9. theo

    theo TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    There is no "ownership" of any form or flavor in a Mexican vacation club like OVC. You purchased a membership --- no more, no less.
    You also apparently agreed to some sort of "payment plan" for that "membership". That membership merely provides you with a "right to use", but the only "purchase" here was that of the paper membership itself, evidently on a monthly payment plan.

    You would be wise to do anything and everything possible to make absolutely certain that card gets permanently deactivated --- and do so before those parasites can possibly make any unauthorized charges upon it. Don't even think about "closing" charges --- there is no real estate involved and nothing on which to foreclose. All that can really happen is the cancellation of your "membership", which costs them nothing.

    As far as the quoted legal mumbo jumbo goes, just firmly resolve in your mind to pay absolutely nothing further. Period, amen. In my opinion, the likelihood of Occidental Vacation Club pursuing anything more than just keeping whatever money of yours they already have and just cancelling the "membership" is pretty darn slim. After all, they are "out" absolutely nothing of any substance here --- it's basically just a paper membership. They will just wait for the next willing Gringo to come along to sell another paper membership ---and another and another. I don't know for certain, but I'd be willing to bet that OVC has no legal "presence" of any kind in the U.S. with which to facilitate any attempted collection efforts. They'll just move on --- and you should too. Pay them not one more penny.
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2017
  10. kambc

    kambc Guest

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    Thanks Theo, starting to make me feel a little better.
    I know they have collections in the states, but that may just be for American citizens. I'll wait for their reply tomorrow and see what happens. I was also given the new directors email address and told he can be a bit more help than the hotel folk.
     
  11. theo

    theo TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    It seems perhaps obvious to say this, but Mexico is a different country. The only way that OVC has any legal "reach" here in the U.S. is if they have some form of actual business presence here, thereby giving them legal standing in the U.S. to then be able take advantage of U.S. law and procedures (including as relates to collection efforts). If OVC has no legal presence here (I certainly do not claim to know), then what happened in Mexico can stay in Mexico. U.S. can't and doesn't apply or enforce U.S. law in Mexico --- and a Mexican vacation club has absolutely no "juice" here without having some U.S business or company presence here.

    Be careful about any supposed "help" that might be offered by that "new director" south of the border. Stay firm in the position that you are paying nothing more. They can extend any "help" with that fact very clearly in mind. My guess is that there will be no real "help" (other than perhaps, if you're lucky, a voluntary and immediate cancellation of your membership) once they fully absorb that the bank is now closed.
    Again, it's no skin off their nose to just cancel the paper "membership" right now if they fully understand and truly believe that they are not going to get so much as another dime from you anyhow. Good luck.
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2017
  12. CarlaS1966

    CarlaS1966 Guest

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    Is there similar advice for Vidanta? We bought their timeshare in mark and they advertised it as real estate, private residence but it is just a timeshare membership.
    We had verbal promises not a specified on the contract. Confirmation package was never received.

    We are in similar situation of not being able to pay due to a car accident and being away from work.

    Any way to get part of down payment would be a great monthly relieve on bills. We are a family if 4.

    Thank you
    Carla
     
  13. LannyPC

    LannyPC TUG Member

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    The advice most TUGgers would give to people in your situation is to look over you contract and see what would happen if you stop all payments. The likely result would be that, although you would probably face a lot of collection calls and maybe a hit on your credit score, your membership would be terminated. You would lose all the money you've sunk into this so far but at least you would not have to pay any more into MFs, etc.

    Again, check your contract carefully.
     
  14. CarlaS1966

    CarlaS1966 Guest

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    I read my contract and it days cancellation after 5 days would loose initial deposit.

    Thank for getting back to me.

    Carla
     
  15. theo

    theo TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    Verbal promises mean nothing --- it's just noise floating around in the air. Only what is expressed in writing within the four corners of the contract means anything at all, legally speaking. I don't know what that "confirmation package" you mention might be, but it's not a legal requirement and is likely little more than just marketing junk and / or a "welcome, new member" packet of some sort.

    Please don't shoot the messenger, but your down payment is gone and you are not getting any of it back. Focus now on just cutting your future losses. The 5 days to cancel was provided to to you by law (not by the kindness of the seller), but once beyond that 5 days period you no longer have any legal right to a refund of your deposit. You can however still choose to just turn around, walk away and pay them not another penny.

    You can attempt to challenge the validity of the transaction with PROFECO, but PROFECO cannot and will not help you unless you can very convincingly articulate and demonstrate serious wrongdoing (e.g., they had you sign a "waiver" of cancellation rights, or got you blotto drunk before contract execution, or something equally egregious). Lying to you with a straight face is unfortunately o.k. --- and it's ultimately your word against theirs anyhow in the absence of any supportive documentation. Unless you can somehow prevail via PROFECO, you are essentially just plain out of luck regarding your deposit. Sorry.
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2017
  16. theo

    theo TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    Are you suggesting that you actually received a refund of any monies paid --- after expiration of the applicable contract rescission period?
    I see in other posts of yours a claim to have been offered a partial refund, after expiration of rescission period. That alone is very unusual --- to say the least.
    I am asking pointedly if you actually received (never mind just reportedly being "offered") a monetary refund in hand.

    Anyone can get "out" of a Mexican "club membership" by simply ceasing to pay their fees, soon enough resulting in termination of the "membership".
    However, outside of the 5 days rescission period in Mexico, I've never actually heard of any instance in which anyone actually received any money back.
    Are you now claiming otherwise? Please, do tell...:shrug:
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2017
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  17. slakad

    slakad Guest

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    Hi Theo,

    Yes thats exactly what I am saying, a little bit of reading about on the internet can let you know exactly where to hit them, though i dont want to be too optimistic as my money is still awaiting return, But they have accepted what i have said and asked for my bank details. i will keep all informed.
     
  18. theo

    theo TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    We will all be very interested here to see if you ever ultimately receive any money back (you would certainly be among the very first). As discussed elsewhere, if you give out any "bank account" info, please make sure it's info for a new, stand alone account in which there is little or no other money and one which you can (and should) close out immediately after the alleged imminent funds are received and "cleared".

    I do not believe that you will ever see any money returned to you. Quite frankly, I smell a rat here somewhere, but will be delighted to be entirely mistaken.
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2017
  19. slakad

    slakad Guest

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    We will see, sounds very genuine so far,
     
  20. Jaclyn

    Jaclyn Guest

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    Hi, I was wondering what your outcome was? I'm in a similar situation as yours but haven't made any payments yet to them and it's been 2 weeks since signing that stupid contract. I emailed the OVC for cancellation and once they called me for further details it was hell to stop their lies. I contacted the credit company and they told me they will hold that transaction and dispute my claim for 30 days. But is it possible to just cancel that credit card with a processing transaction attached to it? And how long did it take for you to cancel your membership?
     
  21. Danica

    Danica Guest

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    Hi--I'm in a similar situation. I got the Timeshare Liquidators (TLC resorts w/ Advantage Program) in Vegas last June 24. I paid the downpayment and first installment. Have not received the info on resorts yet but already having buyers remorse checking out the Advantage Program (I just got access to the site yesterday). I'm now beyond the rescission period and don't know what to do to cancel the contract. At this point, I'm probably okay with losing the deposit (I'll consider that an expensive life lesson) but would really like to get out of the contract. Looked into some companies that said they will help cancel the timeshare but at this point, I feel like I can't trust any of these people. Do I have any chance to get out of this?
     
  22. Passepartout

    Passepartout TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    At this point, there is probably nothing- short of bankruptcy or default and foreclosure that will 'get you out' of this contract. DO NOT sign up with anyone you pay an upfront fee to. Those are all scams. No law firm or amount of pixie dust will magically make a valid contract disappear. Sorry. But you are in good company here. About half of TUGgers bought their first TS from the developer. So stick around and learn to use what you bought.

    Jim
     
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  23. Danica

    Danica Guest

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    Jim: Thank you for your honest advice! I actually talked to a real estate lawyer this morning. He was surprisingly frank about his fees ($325/hr) and told me that the first thing he would do is just write a letter to TLC (which would cost around $1k), but he is pretty certain they will deny it claiming the contract was signed in Nevada and I would have to get a Nevada lawyer. I realized then that maybe it would be better to cut my losses and just pay my contract in full (~$5700) to avoid having them earn more money from me (@ 19% interest!). But before I do that, I'm going to check out Legal Action Workshop company in Glendale, CA which is a flat fee law firm. I doubt they will be able to help me get out of my contract, but maybe they can help me understand anything else in the contract I need to be aware of. Another lawyer reached out to me as well, but I have not talked to. His name is Mitchell Sussman (timesharelegalaction). His message to me sounds too good to be true saying his work is 100% guaranteed. I find it hard to believe any lawyer would do that. But he has a clean record and said the total fee he would charge me for this case is $1495 (flat fee pending more information from me--which is weird, because then it wouldn't be flat fee anymore right?). Has anyone in this group ever heard of him?

    Also, when you say "half of TUGgers bought their first TS from the developer", are you referring to TLC as well? I thought these guys are more like brokers? Sorry--I'm such a newbie at this.
     
  24. TUGBrian

    TUGBrian Administrator

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    anyone trying to extract money from you is going to offer a "guarantee"...otherwise youd be less likely to fall for the pitch.
     
  25. theo

    theo TUG Review Crew: Veteran TUG Member

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    I'll first reiterate my personal belief that NO attorney, no matter how capable or energetic, possesses any "magic beans" or "secret processes" by which to magically extricate someone from a legally binding contractual obligation, most certainly including a voluntarily assumed loan debt. None. Period. The End.

    To answer your specific question above, Mitchell Sussman is an attorney in California. I watched a videotaped interview with him in the not too distant past that I had inadvertently stumbled upon while doing some timeshare related "research". My own impression (perhaps mistaken) was that Mr. Sussman apparently believes that there are "loopholes" in California law that he believes himself able to somehow exploit on behalf of owners of timeshares in California. Whether his assertion has any merit or substance I certainly do not claim to know. Whether or not he professes to have similar "strategies" for timeshare ownerships in other states I also do not claim to know. However, he made no references to possessing any magic beans or secret elixirs during the interview.
     
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2017
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