• The TUGBBS forums are completely free and open to the public and exist as the absolute best place for owners to get help and advice about their timeshares for more than 30 years!

    Join Tens of Thousands of other Owners just like you here to get any and all Timeshare questions answered 24 hours a day!
  • TUG started 30 years ago in October 1993 as a group of regular Timeshare owners just like you!

    Read about our 30th anniversary: Happy 30th Birthday TUG!
  • TUG has a YouTube Channel to produce weekly short informative videos on popular Timeshare topics!

    Free memberships for every 50 subscribers!

    Visit TUG on Youtube!
  • TUG has now saved timeshare owners more than $21,000,000 dollars just by finding us in time to rescind a new Timeshare purchase! A truly incredible milestone!

    Read more here: TUG saves owners more than $21 Million dollars
  • Sign up to get the TUG Newsletter for free!

    60,000+ subscribing owners! A weekly recap of the best Timeshare resort reviews and the most popular topics discussed by owners!
  • Our official "end my sales presentation early" T-shirts are available again! Also come with the option for a free membership extension with purchase to offset the cost!

    All T-shirt options here!
  • A few of the most common links here on the forums for newbies and guests!

[ 2014 ] Parents passed away

bogey21

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 8, 2005
Messages
9,455
Reaction score
4,662
Points
649
Location
Fort Worth, Texas
Don't get me wrong - I don't advocate dumping your timeshares on your kids. It is far better to implement an exit plan while you are still breathing.

Agree. This is exactly what I did starting around age 75. I went to my kids and said who wants any of these 7 Weeks. My Son wanted Orofino so I transferred it into his name. I slowly got rid of the others. Going forward they are non issues.

George
 

Rent_Share

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 10, 2005
Messages
5,091
Reaction score
3
Points
473
Location
SOCAL (562)
because the previous owner abandoned their timeshare without finding a replacement, dues-paying buyer, and all three of these exit plans leave the remaining owners with a mounting bad debt bill.

The original purchaser signed a contract and agreed to pay maintenance fees, all contracts must have an exit strategy and/or termination clause.

The seller (Developer) pitched that they were selling proportional real estate, that would have value and be inheritable, the law basis that allows for the beneficiaries of the estate to refuse the inheritance as worthless and burdensome based on the on-going maintenance fees is was in place when all timeshares were developed.

The HOA's need to approach it from an actuarial point of view, X number of units will be abandoned annually due to the death and or default of the original purchaser, and Y percentage will be assumed by the beneficiaries. A strategy to remarket the intervals or bundle 52 intervals and sell off as a wholly owned condominium to liquidate the HOA owned intervals.

Unless the executor accidentally transferred, or the beneficiary wasn't aware of the right to abandon, the maintenance fee contract is only good for the life of the last willing transferee

Lacking the ability to abandon, how many generations of beneficiaries should be expected to assume the responsibility for a mistake made by their Great, Great, Grand Parents in exchange for tickets to a tacky Luau . . .
 
Last edited:

persia

newbie
Joined
Nov 18, 2007
Messages
1,179
Reaction score
6
Points
36
Location
Carlingford, NSW
In the end it's not so much of a big deal, any competent lawyer can do the paperwork to properly abandon the timeshare and be sure the heirs aren't stuck with it. The only real cost is up to a year's worth of maintenance fees....
 

CO skier

TUG Member
Joined
Sep 18, 2012
Messages
4,116
Reaction score
2,370
Points
448
Location
Colorado
Lacking the ability to abandon, how many generations of beneficiaries should be expected to assume the responsibility for a mistake made by their Great, Great, Grand Parents in exchange for tickets to a tacky Luau . . .

Someone has to pay the maintenance fees for that mistake. You seem to be saying that because it is legal, it is OK for heirs to stick the remaining timeshare owners with the bill for the mistake, and the heirs can keep the change.

It is not fair to the heirs or the other timeshare owners when timeshare owners do not find a buyer so that their heirs or other owners are not stuck with the bill. I do not have the silver bullet answer. I do know someone who owned at a progressive timeshare that, when she could not vacation there due to medical reasons related to the altitude, the resort graciously offered to accept her deed-back with the payment of two years of maintenance fees. That seemed to be a fair solution for all parties. It gave the resort two years to resell the unit (no developer involved), and two years before the other owners would have to cover the mf if the unit did not sell in that timeframe.

Foreclosures, Viking Ships and disclaimed inheritances involve costs in addition to the delinquent maintenance fees. Too many HOA stupidly refuse to accept any deed-backs to offer their aging owners a dignified exit plan, so these owners have only foreclosure, Viking Ships or let-my-heirs-deal-with-it exit plans.



The law allows an individual beneficiary to "disclaim" an asset being left to them under the terms of a will or trust. Normally, unless specifically stated in the will or trust to the contrary, the devise then passes to the next person in line assuming the original beneficiary had died. (that is the assumption made). As a non-attorney, but experienced estate planner, this is an issue that has recently been brought up for discussion among myself and some pretty bright estate planning attorneys. If we had the chance to plan this "before" the death of the owner, we would isolate the timeshare in the estate as the "Only" asset and have all other asset titled in a Revocable Trust prior to the death of the time share owner. The will would then leave the time share to the children and after death, the owners (children) would all "disclaim" the time share. At this point, the executor would then advise the probate court that no one took the timeshare and that there is no money "in the probate estate" to pay fees of any kind, including transfer fees. The executor would then advise the management company of the situation and basically tell them that the estate is deadlocked and there is no owner to take the time share nor monies to pay any fee. Our conclusion (our best guess) was that if the management company continues to refused to take back the time share, then simply leave the estate open forever (No additional probate fees to the best of my knowledge) At some point, it was our collective opinion that the management company would give in if for no other reason then to try to resell the unit.

Is it just me, or does this sound exactly like the Viking Ship model; i.e., put the timeshare in an asset-less legal entity, then let it sink when the time comes? In the end, the other timeshare owners are stuck with the mf bill, just like with the Viking Ships.

Maybe this should be called the Viking Yacht model.
 
Last edited:

Rent_Share

TUG Member
Joined
Jun 10, 2005
Messages
5,091
Reaction score
3
Points
473
Location
SOCAL (562)
The law is quite clear, (and in place before condominium deeds or timeshare deeds, were ever imagined) you cannot be forced to accept ANY inheritance, much less one with an ongoing contractual obligation and debt dies with the decedent.

The HOA's needs to have a remarketing strategy
 

CO skier

TUG Member
Joined
Sep 18, 2012
Messages
4,116
Reaction score
2,370
Points
448
Location
Colorado
The HOA's needs to have a remarketing strategy

Yes, because whether by foreclosure, Viking Ships, or disclaimed inheritances these abandoned weeks are headed their way and they have no way to avoid them.
 

persia

newbie
Joined
Nov 18, 2007
Messages
1,179
Reaction score
6
Points
36
Location
Carlingford, NSW
You can't force people who may not have even been born yet to be saddled with debt that they had no hand in creating. People's mistakes die with them. Otherwise people would be willing their bad debts to their enemies as a final revenge from the grave. Sometimes dead people have all the luck ;) :banana:

Someone has to pay the maintenance fees for that mistake. You seem to be saying that because it is legal, it is OK for heirs to stick the remaining timeshare owners with the bill for the mistake, and the heirs can keep the change.

It is not fair to the heirs or the other timeshare owners when timeshare owners do not find a buyer so that their heirs or other owners are not stuck with the bill. I do not have the silver bullet answer. I do know someone who owned at a progressive timeshare that, when she could not vacation there due to medical reasons related to the altitude, the resort graciously offered to accept her deed-back with the payment of two years of maintenance fees. That seemed to be a fair solution for all parties. It gave the resort two years to resell the unit (no developer involved), and two years before the other owners would have to cover the mf if the unit did not sell in that timeframe.

Foreclosures, Viking Ships and disclaimed inheritances involve costs in addition to the delinquent maintenance fees. Too many HOA stupidly refuse to accept any deed-backs to offer their aging owners a dignified exit plan, so these owners have only foreclosure, Viking Ships or let-my-heirs-deal-with-it exit plans.





Is it just me, or does this sound exactly like the Viking Ship model; i.e., put the timeshare in an asset-less legal entity, then let it sink when the time comes? In the end, the other timeshare owners are stuck with the mf bill, just like with the Viking Ships.

Maybe this should be called the Viking Yacht model.
 

flindberg

TUG Member
Joined
Oct 21, 2014
Messages
94
Reaction score
35
Points
128
Resorts Owned
Wyndham Bali Hai
Wyndham Ka Eo Kai
Actually, if you want the ownership and your parents have a VIP status ... you can keep the status (as long as the number of points you take keep you at that level) ... it is written in the Member's Directory in the "VIP Benefits" section. NO POINTS NEEDED TO BE BROUGHT to do that....

Sales weasels will always tell you, "to do anything with Wyndham, you need to BUY MORE POINTS". Just remember these words, "If their lips are moving, they are lying".
Hoping someone will see this as it is a much older thread... Any insight is welcome!
My mother passed recently leaving her VIP TS in a trust. My siblings want nothing to do with it. I am interested in having the points (one UDI contract and two converted float weeks). How much time do I have to decide what I want to do with the contracts? I have had POA for these for the past two years as my mother needed help managing reservations.
 

Passepartout

TUG Review Crew: Veteran
TUG Member
Joined
Feb 10, 2007
Messages
28,501
Reaction score
17,264
Points
1,299
Location
Twin Falls, Eye-Duh-Hoe
Hoping someone will see this as it is a much older thread... Any insight is welcome!
My mother passed recently leaving her VIP TS in a trust. My siblings want nothing to do with it. I am interested in having the points (one UDI contract and two converted float weeks). How much time do I have to decide what I want to do with the contracts? I have had POA for these for the past two years as my mother needed help managing reservations.
It ALL depends on what the trust SAYS, and who the trustee is. End of free legal advice.

Jim
 

flindberg

TUG Member
Joined
Oct 21, 2014
Messages
94
Reaction score
35
Points
128
Resorts Owned
Wyndham Bali Hai
Wyndham Ka Eo Kai
It ALL depends on what the trust SAYS, and who the trustee is. End of free legal advice.

Jim
Thank you for the 'free legal' advice :)
My sibling is executor. My sibling told me to transfer the deeds/contracts into my name in order to "get the damn thing out" of the trust. I'm not sure yet if I want to take it on as MF's total ~$2500/yr. Do you know if one or the other is more complicated? I mean UDI or Converted Points Float Week?
Thanks...
 

Passepartout

TUG Review Crew: Veteran
TUG Member
Joined
Feb 10, 2007
Messages
28,501
Reaction score
17,264
Points
1,299
Location
Twin Falls, Eye-Duh-Hoe
Thank you for the 'free legal' advice :)
My sibling is executor. My sibling told me to transfer the deeds/contracts into my name in order to "get the damn thing out" of the trust. I'm not sure yet if I want to take it on as MF's total ~$2500/yr. Do you know if one or the other is more complicated? I mean UDI or Converted Points Float Week?
Thanks...
Many TUGgers use www.LTTransfers.com to do transfers. They are TUGgers and charge very reasonable fees. They can tell you all about it.

Jim
 

macmanrider

TUG Member
Joined
Aug 11, 2017
Messages
104
Reaction score
39
Points
138
Resorts Owned
Costa Sur PV Mexico
Thank you for the 'free legal' advice :)
My sibling is executor. My sibling told me to transfer the deeds/contracts into my name in order to "get the damn thing out" of the trust. I'm not sure yet if I want to take it on as MF's total ~$2500/yr. Do you know if one or the other is more complicated? I mean UDI or Converted Points Float Week?
Thanks...
That's to high of m/f for me I have 2 fixed weeks at Costa Sur in PV Mexico m/f were $1100 for 2 weeks and I have a odd week in lake Tahoe $620 with GPR. I can buy into rci points if I want to go somewhere else. Take your time do your research make sure it's a resort you want to use. Ours in Tahoe is close to us 1.3/4 hr drive and because we are owners we can use the day use. And we are right on the lake so we go on hot days. To cool off .
 
Top