It Might Be Better to Take Social Security at 66 Instead of 70. Here's Why

[vacationhopeful]

Think I should develop a website for "Arranged marriages for singles over 62" to increase their Social Security checks.

And I STILL blame the federal change in the US defined pension vesting rule from 10 years to 5 years of work which started on January 1, 1983. I was 3 months shy of a pension at an oil company ... in corporate financial systems. And I had been to all 5 owned and operated US refinaries in the prior 3 years. Their plants were running full blast.

Five year vesting was the DEATH of private pension plans ... IHMO.

The Federal, State and Local government should be MADE to FUND their pension plans, too.

 

[Patri]

I would not have been able to put in the long hours I did, and make the advancements I did if DW didn't stay home, raise the kids, and run the household. She wasn't employed, but she certainly did work hard.

You said this very well. The thought entered my mind in my post, but I couldn't articulate it.

No offence to all homemakers. I worked hard, climbed the career ladder and I was also a divorced mother for many years of that. I did not interrupt my career to raise my son but instead utilized the financial resources that I obtained from working hard and hired help along the way to help raise my son. It can be done.

You did extremely well, and it was a must choice for you. For those fortunate to have options, some do not want others raising their children. I know people who are far from well off, choosing to have the mom (occasionally the dad) stay home with the kids.
SS is complex. The intent is that no one is penniless in their old age. There are so many situations, it cannot be equal or necessarily fair to everyone. I think benefits have expanded tremendously since it was rolled out in 1935. And you can't put the cat back in the bag once it's out.

 

[klpca]

I would not have been able to put in the long hours I did, and make the advancements I did if DW didn't stay home, raise the kids, and run the household. She wasn't employed, but she certainly did work hard. I think she fully deserves the SS benefit she gets, even though it's only 50% of my benefit. On the taxes returns each year I put her occupation as domestic engineer.

On the other hand, it doesn't seem fair that Johnny Carson was married to 3 different women for at least 10 years. Each of those women were eligible to claim 50% of his SS benefit.

Art, thank you for acknowledging the contribution that your wife made to your career.

I stepped off of the corporate ladder after our second child was born but continued to work part time. This was a conscious decision - my mom worked full time+ when we were growing up. I longed for a mom who picked me up from school to go home, not staying in after school care. I hated watching the caregivers watching the clock, I hated my mom picking us up at the last possible minute. Every day. I was determined that my kids wouldn't have to do that. I worked very hard during those years - I did it for my husband, my kids, and kids whose mom's had to go to work. In addition to doing everything around the house, I probably spent a good 20 hours a week volunteering at the school, church, and scouting. Luckily my husband was a good provider, and I am thrifty so we squeaked by although we camped on vacations instead of going to Hawaii, lol.

Now that we are doing our retirement planning, I am very aware of the financial cost of that decision. My husband has 3 times the amount of retirement savings as me. His social security is about 50% higher. If we didn't have a solid marriage and if we didn't live in a community property state, these things could be very damaging to me financially. I hadn't considered that when I stopped working full time. I don't know that I would have done anything different, but the reality of what that cost me is sobering. I know of a couple who is divorcing and there's another area where a non-working spouse can lose because her contribution to the marriage is not quantifiable. (Although a good attorney can level that particular playing field).

And I agree about the multiple wives situation. You should be able to pick your favorite, lol.

 

[bluehende]

Maybe it is the old guy from a different era in me, but I look at my marriage as a partnership. My wife took a career that insured her income would be low to have the advantage of being home and raising the kids. Albeit, since it was a home day care she was far from a stay at home Mom. Every penny brought into the household was never considered mine or hers. It was our income. Why should our combined SS not be considered a partnership. We both paid into it to have a certain benefit including increases to her SS should I not be able to provide a higher income. Even if my wife never worked it would be our decision how the partnership works, but the asset known as SS should be shared. Could not a stay at home spouse call it unfair if their efforts allow their spouse to earn an income that puts them above the income to earn the maximum benefit. Just curious if you would also throw widows off of Medicare?

PS To think a complex and huge program like SS could be 100% fair to everyone is unrealistic. I have always loved the quote


" Don't let perfection be the enemy of good "

 

[talkamotta]

My husband I are both second marriages but we both work for the same company with a pension. Yeah for us. His first wife died early of breast cancer and he decided to retire at 49. He got his full pension with 30 years. I retired at 57 with a full pension. I got a divorce when I was 39. For so many years with my rental properties, 5 kids, I was always in a low tax bracket. I would have worked longer but my back was killing me, climbing ladders, working on the floor, etc. I had fallen off a roof a few years back and had 12 inch rods in my back. It was time for me to leave but I also got ssdi. Husband took SS at 62. We got married at 60 and we are now 65. We figured it would take 12 years to make up the difference between the age of 62 to 66. We both had money in a 401k that we have moved over to something very secure and wont touch until the 70.5 mark. Husband was in the guard for 28 years so he gets a small pension but we also get Tricare. And our company we retired from gives us each $2600 /year for anything medical, so our medicare premiums are paid. It makes me shake my head when these new wantabe presidential canidates say medicare for all. Insurance for senior citizens is not cheap. I do have some regrets that I forward to my children.....maximize that ROTH, they say you will be in a lower tax bracket when you get older....not true....if you did things right. My dad (depression baby) put money in the freezer, didnt pay taxes on that. Maybe that wasnt so dumb after all. But I do wished I would have put more money in non tax defferred accounts. You save alot of money and then when you want to pull it out you are taxed at the 22% doesnt seem quite right. We live off our monthly income now and seem to put money away each month. We travel quite alot but we have always been frugal and I cant see us changing our ways even if we dont necessarily need to be. We are like the book the Millionaires Next Door. I never was a financial genius, I just put money away every month, wasnt wasteful and worked very hard. I worry for my children, they wont get pensions, they will have rental properties and I made sure they had good educations and they make good money. Medical care costs will be an issue. The company I retired from provided medical care for me and my family without any premiums. They now charge premiums to their employees but its pretty cheap. They are maximizing their ROTHs but that wont be enough.

 

[talkamotta]

Art, thank you for acknowledging the contribution that your wife made to your career.

I stepped off of the corporate ladder after our second child was born but continued to work part time. This was a conscious decision - my mom worked full time+ when we were growing up. I longed for a mom who picked me up from school to go home, not staying in after school care. I hated watching the caregivers watching the clock, I hated my mom picking us up at the last possible minute. Every day. I was determined that my kids wouldn't have to do that. I worked very hard during those years - I did it for my husband, my kids, and kids whose mom's had to go to work. In addition to doing everything around the house, I probably spent a good 20 hours a week volunteering at the school, church, and scouting. Luckily my husband was a good provider, and I am thrifty so we squeaked by although we camped on vacations instead of going to Hawaii, lol.

Now that we are doing our retirement planning, I am very aware of the financial cost of that decision. My husband has 3 times the amount of retirement savings as me. His social security is about 50% higher. If we didn't have a solid marriage and if we didn't live in a community property state, these things could be very damaging to me financially. I hadn't considered that when I stopped working full time. I don't know that I would have done anything different, but the reality of what that cost me is sobering. I know of a couple who is divorcing and there's another area where a non-working spouse can lose because her contribution to the marriage is not quantifiable. (Although a good attorney can level that particular playing field).

And I agree about the multiple wives situation. You should be able to pick your favorite, lol.

I was able to stay home for a while during the time when my kids were younger. I worked hard at home than I ever did at a job. If it wasnt for my network of stay at home moms.... getting my children to the soccer games and me picking them up. Life would have been much harder for me.

 

[bluehende]

I was able to stay home for a while during the time when my kids were younger. I worked hard at home than I ever did at a job. If it wasnt for my network of stay at home moms.... getting my children to the soccer games and me picking them up. Life would have been much harder for me.

I worked in research and my wife as I said had a day care. I made 3 to 4 times her salary and there is not one day I would have traded places. She loved it. I would have had to be institutionalized.

 

[Luanne]

I am not saying the woman would not be entitled to her husband's social security IF he dies. She certainly should be. I am saying while he is collecting his, she should not be entitled to also collect an amount that is 1/2 of his as well.

Sorry, I mis-read (or didn't read thoroughly) your first statement.

 

[am1]

What about for people who choose not to work for pay but both parents stay at home to look after the children? Or single parents who have to stay at home? Maybe anyone should be able to pay into social security regardless if they work or not. That seems the fairest of them all.

The current system seems to offer a better ROI for married couple where one does not work.

 

[DancingWaters]

In my situation, because I have a small pension I can only have PART of my husbands social security.
I can’t have 100 percent of my pension and 100 percent of social security. Women with other types of jobs can have ALL their pension and get ALL of their social security......hmmmm

 

[VacationForever]

In my situation, because I have a small pension I can only have PART of my husbands social security.
I can’t have 100 percent of my pension and 100 percent of social security. Women with other types of jobs can have ALL their pension and get ALL of their social security......hmmmm

This is a good explanation as to why there is WEP and GPO. It seems pretty fair to me.

https://www.aarp.org/retirement/soc...s/what-is-the-windfall-elimination-provision/

https://www.aarp.org/retirement/social-security/questions-answers/pension-social-security-spouse/

 

[WinniWoman]

In my situation, because I have a small pension I can only have PART of my husbands social security.
I can’t have 100 percent of my pension and 100 percent of social security. Women with other types of jobs can have ALL their pension and get ALL of their social security......hmmmm

Deleted. As vacationforever posted above.

 

[Snazzylass]

No offence to all homemakers. I worked hard, climbed the career ladder and I was also a divorced mother for many years of that. I did not interrupt my career to raise my son but instead utilized the financial resources that I obtained from working hard and hired help along the way to help raise my son. It can be done.

Yes, but SHOULD it be done? Yeah, I did it too, but I never wanted to be a poster child for single moms. And, I don't really mean to call you out. Actually, I'm a little surprised that the OP even thought of the idea of non-working spouses should not receive SSI. The thought never occurred to me.

Get married. Have kids. And, have choices! That's the American way! My daughter-in-law is just graduating and about to start her career as a teacher. I'm super stinkin' proud of her. Still, I hope that she can stay home full-time with their future kiddos one day. My other daughter-in-law is blessed to not need to work. I enjoy working. I tried to figure out a way to stay home with my babes but it wasn't in the cards. And, my FA says I'll be just fine! I've been told that for years.

So, yeah, it's possible but I'm still 100% behind someone keeping the home fires burning So, if a woman makes the sacrifice for her family, yes! You earned your SSI. SSI is not just a retirement program. It is disability and for the benefit of those who depend on your paycheck. It's been a big, big help to a lot of people over the years.

 

[VacationForever]

Yes, but SHOULD it be done? Yeah, I did it too, but I never wanted to be a poster child for single moms. And, I don't really mean to call you out.

Call me out all that you want. I have always wanted a career and my circle of friends are all similar. I do not have any close friends who have chosen to be a homemaker over work. We are all proud of our career achievements, which are also what we identify ourselves with. In fact I was terrified to retire because it meant I would lose my identity. We could well afford to retire years ago but giving up my work was hard. My sister has 3 kids with her husband and she is also very successful in both work and as a mother. Her kids, 2 boys and a girl, were all in the gifted program in school. They graduated from university in the Math and Science field and they now all have successful careers.

People make choices and being a stay at home mother was one that I would never have chosen. Again, no offence to those who choose to be a stay at home mother. It is just not for me.

 

[bbodb1]

Call me out all that you want. I have always wanted a career and my circle of friends are all similar. I do not have any close friends who have chosen to be a homemaker over work. We are all proud of our career achievements, which are also what we identify ourselves with. In fact I was terrified to retire because it meant I would lose my identity. We could well afford to retire years ago but giving up my work was hard. My sister has 3 kids with her husband and she is also very successful in both work and as a mother. Her kids, 2 boys and a girl, were all in the gifted program in school. They graduated from university in the Math and Science field and they now all have successful careers.

People make choices and being a stay at home mother was one that I would never have chosen. Again, no offence to those who choose to be a stay at home mother. It is just not for me.

@VacationForever

I have not read all of this thread, but in passing through this morning I saw the bolded quote.
Read in a certain light, that is a very sad statement (when work defines a person). Might you elaborate a bit more on what you mean here?

 

[Snazzylass]

Agreed! Just sayin' we need not tell those who make other choices what they should do too.

I am very successful in the business world but not all are wired like us. I can't say my boys would have been better off if I could have stayed home. I don't think that at all. But that's not true for all kids.

My own parents promoted the myth to my brothers that their wives should work. It is utter garbage. And they always held up my sister and I with our bad marriages as an example. On the other hand, I have a couple of male friends who married well and became "house husbands" while their wives' careers flourished. Now they can enjoy their golden years together after successfully raising their kids. Do what works for you and your marriage

 

[DancingWaters]

I agree my job defined me as a person. I was a stay at home mom til my youngest was in fourth grade. Then I got a job in a school, went to college to be a teacher and loved all of it. I guess after years of taking care of the house and kids I was ready for something else. I found getting away from everybody needing my help, since I didn’t work, was refreshing! Atleast, I was getting paid for helping someone. I loved my classroom, students and coworkers. I loved learning myself!! I was valued, and quite successful. I was a part of a group of people that worked together to create educated young people. We poured our lives into the kids. Unfortunately, that doesn’t seem to happen when you stay home. When I retired I regretted that decision because I missed the daily self worth and common thread with the staff. I regret I didn't get more years in for retirement, though my husband said he’s glad I was home to raise the kids. My pension is only for 20 years, so I miss the big money. So I am disappointed I didn’t start teaching sooner, I’m 65 now, I was getting too old to continue. It was a dream that ended too soon. I do still work part time in a school and substitute teach. About 20-25 hours a week. Our kids turned out very successful!! So, I guess I was a good teacher at home too!

 

[rickandcindy23]

I felt so sorry for my real mother-in-law, the one that raised my husband. She died at 71 in 1997. She never made much money and social security was not good to her. She was not married long enough to get Rick's dad's social security. They didn't get married until well after the first two boys were born (long story).

She was a beautiful soul, a hard-working woman whose husband left her with three boys to raise with a $60 monthly stipend to do it. As her husband moved on with another woman, literally married her two days after their divorce was final, she struggled to make ends meet and dealt with depression. She had horrible self-esteem and never worked a good job, until she was well over 50.

She did house cleaning and picked up odd jobs, cleaned nursing homes, etc. She was a hard worker.

She didn't drive until Rick taught her. She was 56, when he taught her to drive. She bought a small car, a Chevy Vega, used, and she found new independence as a driver. She started babysitting for a family that was very generous and when their kids got older, the mother got her a job at the Montesorri school the kids attended. She suddenly made $10K a year and was ecstatic. This was about 1984.

Too bad she was so bad at driving her car. She literally drove the wrong way on Speer Blvd downtown. I don't know how she turned there, but people stopped and allowed her to make a u-turn. She stopped driving downtown, which was good. She just drove to the grocery store and church after that.

 

[VacationForever]

@VacationForever

I have not read all of this thread, but in passing through this morning I saw the bolded quote.
Read in a certain light, that is a very sad statement (when work defines a person). Might you elaborate a bit more on what you mean here?

Nothing sad about it at all. Women are no different from men, where we thrive on our achievements. Whether you look at politicians, CEOs etc... everyone in those positions is proud of their career achievements - men and women. I was very successful at work and even worked expatriate assignments managing IT for the company and through it all, my son came with me and attended international schools. My work and travel broadened our horizon. I travelled internationally for work and he came along on some of them. He spent time in Beijing, London and Hong Kong and has fond memories of all the cities he got to visit.

 

[Talent312]

I spent 30 years doing one thing. I guess that defined me.
But after I retired 2 years ago, I re-defined myself, in a way that I find quite enjoyable.

 

[bogey21]

I would not have been able to put in the long hours I did, and make the advancements I did if DW didn't stay home, raise the kids, and run the household. She wasn't employed, but she certainly did work hard..

I not only agree with this but walked the walk. I had one of those 24/7 jobs and out of necessity my ex-wife (20 years younger than me) was in the same position. When we got divorced after over 20 years being married she was 45 and I was 65. Although not an attorney I handled my own divorce. Her hot shot attorney defiantly told me she should get $3,500 a month from my pension. I politely told her she was nuts. I insisted that she get $5,000 per month and a 50% Survivor Annuity if I die first which is likely. That was 19 years ago. Do the math $5,000 x 12 x 19 to date and probably another 20 years of the same as she is only 64 today. I felt then, and still feel today, that she earned every penny of it...Any wonder why we are still great friends...

George

 

[geekette]

@VacationForever

I have not read all of this thread, but in passing through this morning I saw the bolded quote.
Read in a certain light, that is a very sad statement (when work defines a person). Might you elaborate a bit more on what you mean here?

This is extremely common. not at all a new concept. But women didn't used to get to have that, it used to be reserved for men.

Note that most people that meet you ask what you do for a living. Some people get to do exactly what they want and are completely fulfilled. I got to have that. Far from sad, I got to make a difference in the world and keep on learning.

I find that in many cases, what one chooses to do for pay aligns very well with their talents and personalities. It is only sad when that is not the case, when one works a job that eats their soul.

 

[Patri]

Far from sad, I got to make a difference in the world and keep on learning.

Every job makes a difference in the world.

 

[WinniWoman]

I never felt my job defined me at all. I did it well as that was where my talents were, however humble. I needed the money and I did what I had to do. I was well liked and a good and reliable and loyal employee.

But I always felt the "real" me was separate from it and it was just a job. Then again I am an introvert, though most people would beg to differ when they meet me. I am more of a spiritual type and I know for certain that I am who I am inside- not what I do for a living out in the world to make money. I am not competitive at all either.

My mom loved to work and she took great pride and loved the attention she got from work. She always talked about work, also, which made me and my dad nuts. I never could understand it. To me, it was irrelevant in the big scheme of things.

But one thing she always said to me was not to stress about work (although she most certainly did!) because "...in the end they won't even know your name..."' and that stuck with me- that as much as she loved it- even SHE knew it really did not matter in the end.

I try to get this across to my brother as well, who most definitely defines himself by his career and reputation. He can retire but still has not.

Also, when people ask me what I would want to do in retirement to "make a difference" I tell them I already did all that- I worked in health care and I did enough and have no need to do anymore. Now I am just me and I just live.

 

[bluehende]

I never felt my job defined me at all. I did it well as that was where my talents were, however humble. I needed the money and I did what I had to do. I was well liked and a good and reliable and loyal employee.

But I always felt the "real" me was separate from it and it was just a job. Then again I am an introvert, though most people would beg to differ when they meet me. I am more of a spiritual type and I know for certain that I am who I am inside- not what I do for a living out in the world to make money. I am not competitive at all either.

My mom loved to work and she took great pride and loved the attention she got from work. She always talked about work, also, which made me and my dad nuts. I never could understand it. To me, it was irrelevant in the big scheme of things.

But one thing she always said to me was not to stress about work (although she most certainly did!) because "...in the end they won't even know your name..."' and that stuck with me- that as much as she loved it- even SHE knew it really did not matter in the end.

I try to get this across to my brother as well, who most definitely defines himself by his career and reputation. He can retire but still has not.

Also, when people ask me what I would want to do in retirement to "make a difference" I tell them I already did all that- I worked in health care and I did enough and have no need to do anymore. Now I am just me and I just live.

I would hope that any one aspect or event in my life would not define me. I was a research biochemist that worked in a group that actually increased food production world wide. My ego allows me to believe I did good work. It provided the world with more food, my company with a ton of profits, and me with a good living. Having said that I still think the most important "work" I ever did was volunteering in youth organizations. I was a scout leader and coach for many years. Over the years I have had significant contact with over 600 children. I meet many of these kids later in life that remember specific interactions. It is very humbling. I hope my leagacy is as a smart guy that worked hard and was a good role model for a lot of kids that had little to no male role models.