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Bass Pro [Shops] sues Bluegreen

nuwermj

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And the saga continues.

"Bass Pro Shops is suing the company that sells timeshares from kiosks inside its stores, claiming the company engaged in 'high pressure salesmanship' and didn't pay Bass Pro enough in commission."

https://amp.news-leader.com/amp/3507150002
 

nuwermj

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Ok, it's hard to bit my tongue on this one. Is Bass Pro really surprised that Bluegreen engages in 'high pressure salesmanship'? Or is the truth more like: Bass Pro is willing to ignore 'high pressure salesmanship' so long as the commissions are acceptable?
 
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OldGuy

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Bluegreen and Johnny Morris are pretty tight with each other, with their very-nice Ridgedale, MO resorts. Have been for years.
 

bbodb1

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Ok, it's hard to bit my tong on this one. Is Bass Pro really surprised that Bluegreen engages in 'high pressure salesmanship'? Or is the true more like: Bass Pro is willing to ignore 'high pressure salesmanship' so long as the commissions are acceptable?

Oh, that sounds painful..... :p
 
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I'd imagine it's more due to blue greens high pressure sales tactics than him not getting his cut. He used to offer lifetime warranty on items bought at Bass pro no matter what. Dad has a pair of hip waders for five years that he used heavily that he literally wore out. Just walked in and swapped them out for new, no questions asked.
And it's not like the guy needs money either.
John Morris is with 6.4billion, Bass pro annual revenue is around $8 billion with 45,000 employees.
Blue greens assets are valued around $1.1 billion with 4500 employees.....

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dioxide45

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Just seems that Bluegreen wasn't paying the commission on the sales of sampler packages and only if the person bought outright.
 
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Two other thoughts. As a LEO, or just someone who watches a lot more news than I'd like to: when a person or company is "unavailable for comment", ""refuses to provide a statement", or immediately "lawyers up" it doesn't bode well for their side of the argument/issue.
Thought two: Its possible blue green has hurt the image of big cedar and or Bass pro by their actions/customer service or lack thereof and Bass pro/John Morris is trying to distance themselves from BlueGreen

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nuwermj

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Here are some related passages from the BG Annual Report suggesting an increase in defaults:

From 2017 ...
"On October 9, 2017, Bass Pro advised us that it believes the amounts paid to it as VOI [Vacation Ownership Interest] sales commissions should not have been adjusted for certain purchaser defaults. We previously informed Bass Pro that the aggregate amount of such adjustments for defaults charged back to Bass Pro between January 2008 and June 2017 totaled approximately $4.8 million. We believe these charge backs were appropriate and consistent with the terms and intent of the agreements with Bass Pro, and we are continuing to discuss the matter with Bass Pro. On October 20, 2017, in order to demonstrate our good faith, we paid this amount to Bass Pro pending a resolution of the matter in the ordinary course. We recognized the $4.8 million payment as general and administrative expense during the fourth quarter of 2017. In addition, the resolution of the matter may adversely impact our future marketing expenses."

From 2018 ...
"We have an exclusive marketing agreement with Bass Pro, a nationally-recognized retailer of fishing, marine, hunting, camping and sports gear, that provides us with the right to market and sell vacation packages at kiosks in each of Bass Pro’s retail locations. As of December 31, 2018, we sold vacation packages in 69 of Bass Pro’s stores. Bass Pro has a loyal customer base that strongly matches our core demographic. Under the agreement, we also have the right to market VOIs in Bass Pro catalogs and on its website, and to access Bass Pro’s customer database. In exchange, we compensate Bass Pro based on VOI sales generated through the program. No compensation is paid to Bass Pro under the agreement on sales made at Bluegreen/Big Cedar Vacations’ resorts. During the years ended December 31, 2018, 2017 and 2016, VOI sales to prospects and leads generated by the agreement with Bass Pro accounted for approximately 14%, 15% and 16%, respectively, of our VOI sales volume. Our marketing alliance with Bass Pro originated in 2000, has been renewed twice and currently runs through 2025.

"We have continued to meet with Bass Pro’s leadership in an effort to resolve the issues which arose between the parties in 2017 and 2018. While there is no assurance that a resolution will be reached, we remain optimistic that we will achieve a resolution of the outstanding issues. We are hopeful that the resolution will address the timing of entry into the Cabela’s stores and an extension of the parties’ agreements. If reached, the resolution may include a restructuring of the amount and timing of compensation paid to Bass Pro. In the meantime, we continue to execute our vacation package marketing strategy under our current agreement with Bass Pro. While we do not believe that any material additional amounts are due to Bass Pro, our future results would be impacted if the issues are not resolved and by any change in the compensation payable to Bass Pro or the calculation of payments or reimbursements utilized pursuant to the agreements."

And elsewhere in the 2018 report ...
"Commencing in 2015, it came to our attention that our collection efforts with respect to our VOI [Vacation Ownership Interest] notes receivable were being impacted by a then emerging, industry-wide trend involving the receipt of 'cease and desist' letters from exit firms and their attorneys purporting to represent certain VOI owners. Following receipt of these letters, we are unable to contact the owners unless allowed by law. We believe these exit firms have encouraged such owners to become delinquent and ultimately default on their obligations and that such actions and our inability to contact the owners are a primary contributor to the increase in our annual default rates. Our average annual default rates have increased from 6.9% in 2015 to 8.4% in 2018. We also estimate that approximately 14.4% of the total delinquencies on our VOI notes receivable as of December 31, 2018 related to VOI notes receivable subject to this issue."
 

matt0o

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I was in a presentation last weekend at a wilderness club resort and they mentioned this to me at the beginning of the presentation which I thought was odd. will something like this have the potential to make any changes to the current bass pro/Bluegreen resorts. these are my resorts I weekend at frequently because of im an hour away from all of them.
 

nuwermj

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I was in a presentation last weekend at a wilderness club resort and they mentioned this to me at the beginning of the presentation which I thought was odd. will something like this have the potential to make any changes to the current bass pro/Bluegreen resorts. these are my resorts I weekend at frequently because of im an hour away from all of them.

The deeds that back your points are owned by the Bluegreen Vacation Club trust. All the Wildness Club deeds will remain in the trust and members will share common access to those use-rights.
 

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OldGuy

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Some people learn the hard way not to take on Johnny.

I'm close to this, and could say more, but I'm close to this, so can't say more.

:cool:
 

dioxide45

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Some people learn the hard way not to take on Johnny.

I'm close to this, and could say more, but I'm close to this, so can't say more.

:cool:
Are you Johnny Morris?:eek:
 

IFeelScrewed

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Here are some related passages from the BG Annual Report suggesting an increase in defaults:

From 2017 ...
"On October 9, 2017, Bass Pro advised us that it believes the amounts paid to it as VOI [Vacation Ownership Interest] sales commissions should not have been adjusted for certain purchaser defaults. We previously informed Bass Pro that the aggregate amount of such adjustments for defaults charged back to Bass Pro between January 2008 and June 2017 totaled approximately $4.8 million. We believe these charge backs were appropriate and consistent with the terms and intent of the agreements with Bass Pro, and we are continuing to discuss the matter with Bass Pro. On October 20, 2017, in order to demonstrate our good faith, we paid this amount to Bass Pro pending a resolution of the matter in the ordinary course. We recognized the $4.8 million payment as general and administrative expense during the fourth quarter of 2017. In addition, the resolution of the matter may adversely impact our future marketing expenses."

From 2018 ...
"We have an exclusive marketing agreement with Bass Pro, a nationally-recognized retailer of fishing, marine, hunting, camping and sports gear, that provides us with the right to market and sell vacation packages at kiosks in each of Bass Pro’s retail locations. As of December 31, 2018, we sold vacation packages in 69 of Bass Pro’s stores. Bass Pro has a loyal customer base that strongly matches our core demographic. Under the agreement, we also have the right to market VOIs in Bass Pro catalogs and on its website, and to access Bass Pro’s customer database. In exchange, we compensate Bass Pro based on VOI sales generated through the program. No compensation is paid to Bass Pro under the agreement on sales made at Bluegreen/Big Cedar Vacations’ resorts. During the years ended December 31, 2018, 2017 and 2016, VOI sales to prospects and leads generated by the agreement with Bass Pro accounted for approximately 14%, 15% and 16%, respectively, of our VOI sales volume. Our marketing alliance with Bass Pro originated in 2000, has been renewed twice and currently runs through 2025.

"We have continued to meet with Bass Pro’s leadership in an effort to resolve the issues which arose between the parties in 2017 and 2018. While there is no assurance that a resolution will be reached, we remain optimistic that we will achieve a resolution of the outstanding issues. We are hopeful that the resolution will address the timing of entry into the Cabela’s stores and an extension of the parties’ agreements. If reached, the resolution may include a restructuring of the amount and timing of compensation paid to Bass Pro. In the meantime, we continue to execute our vacation package marketing strategy under our current agreement with Bass Pro. While we do not believe that any material additional amounts are due to Bass Pro, our future results would be impacted if the issues are not resolved and by any change in the compensation payable to Bass Pro or the calculation of payments or reimbursements utilized pursuant to the agreements."

And elsewhere in the 2018 report ...
"Commencing in 2015, it came to our attention that our collection efforts with respect to our VOI [Vacation Ownership Interest] notes receivable were being impacted by a then emerging, industry-wide trend involving the receipt of 'cease and desist' letters from exit firms and their attorneys purporting to represent certain VOI owners. Following receipt of these letters, we are unable to contact the owners unless allowed by law. We believe these exit firms have encouraged such owners to become delinquent and ultimately default on their obligations and that such actions and our inability to contact the owners are a primary contributor to the increase in our annual default rates. Our average annual default rates have increased from 6.9% in 2015 to 8.4% in 2018. We also estimate that approximately 14.4% of the total delinquencies on our VOI notes receivable as of December 31, 2018 related to VOI notes receivable subject to this issue."
Do you have a copy of this report? The "access Bass Pro’s customer database" I think it is very concerning for Bass Pro customers
 

rickandcindy23

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Do you have a copy of this report? The "access Bass Pro’s customer database" I think it is very concerning for Bass Pro customers
This is a very old post.
 

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Looks like they paid up.

 

IFeelScrewed

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This is a very old post.
I know, but if anyone had a copy, and it was looked into that it was true. I'm sure some Bass Pro customers wouldn't like their info being shared with a timeshare company and would put Bass Pro in a hot spot again about being partners with BlueGreen
 
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